Exception from Irish

(-Nathan-)

Hello all

Like most of this country, I'm absolutely brutal at Irish. I'm in 6th year and me and my parents agree that there is no point in me continuing to study the subject. Am I aloud to drop Irish by giving written permission to the school from my parents to do so or do I have to apply for an exemption? I was born in England but lived here most my life.

EDIT : In regards to Irish and college, I do not require Irish for the course I wish to pursue (nor the college).

spurious

If you've lived here most of your life and do not have special needs of some sort, you are not exempt.
Just don't go into the exam is one option.

I've friends who were born in other countries who've lived here all their lives and taken Irish since they've come here who've managed to get an exemption this year. I don't think it's exactly advertised that you can do that, because obviously they want people to take it.

Lucky little...:P

elmoslattery

spurious wrote: »

If you've lived here most of your life and do not have special needs of some sort, you are not exempt.
Just don't go into the exam is one option.

Dont not go into the exam.......some courses require a pass...i think...

if your not counting it for points then just try and pass.

whatdoicare

If your parents are backing you then maybe they should go in and have a chat with the principal- you never know what your options are unless you ask.

Herbal Deity

What university do you want to go to?

Squeeonline

I had an exemption but thats because I "completed primary education outside of the ROI"

unknown13

good luck because I tried to get one and it was absolutely impossible even if you have special needs the chances of getting one is low.

if you passed junior cert irish then tough luck because you will not get one regardless of special needs [my case].

also it is a requirement for NUI's that you passed Ordinary or Higher irish. Have you looked at the Foundation paper

implausible

You will only get an exemption if you were in another country up until 11 (I think, not sure) or if you have a psychological report showing that you are unable to do a language.

If you're brutal at it, do foundation. You'll pass it.

You can't just get an exemption because you're brutal at it.

(-Nathan-)

Thanks for the replies! I've read them all.

Just to clarify:
*The course I wish to pursue does not require Irish.
*My parents are backing me

Is there any way to apply to the Department for an exception without having to have to go through the Principle first? (as she would be very difficult to persuade...)

I want to use the Irish class as a study class to focus on my top six subjects. Foundation Irish is a waste of 40mins a day.

unknown13

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

Is there any way to apply to the Department for and Exception without having to have to go through the Principle first? (as she would be very difficult to persuade...)

absolutely no chance because i believe the principal has to sign every application for reasonable accommodation for the junior and leaving cert and that would be a similar application

(-Nathan-)

unknown13 wrote: »

absolutely no chance because i believe the principal has to sign every application for reasonable accommodation for the junior and leaving cert and that would be a similar application

Damn it. Looks like I'm going to have to go rebel... and pull out King Lear and W.B Yeats every Irish class..

Herbal Deity

I think you're acting a little childish. 40 minutes a day where you have to sit through a class you've no interest in is hardly going to be detrimental to your LC.

As far as I know, you have to do Irish classes by law, unless you have an exemption, and I don't think it's up to your school to decide that.

Being born in England you might have a chance, I'm not familiar with the exact criteria to be granted an exemption.

(-Nathan-)

Herbal Deity wrote: »

I think you're acting a little childish. 40 minutes a day where you have to sit through a class you've no interest in is hardly going to be detrimental to your LC.

As far as I know, you have to do Irish classes by law, unless you have an exemption, and I don't think it's up to your school to decide that.

Being born in England you might have a chance, I'm not familiar with the exact criteria to be granted an exemption.

It may seem childish, but boy you should see this class. This teacher has no control over the class. Desk slamming and paper balls are a regular occurrence. The teacher assumes that by sticking up notes on the projector and texting for the rest of the class will get us a pass at LC. I know it's ultimately up to us, but there is no will to teach and maintain discipline in the class.. and so, there is no will to learn.

Irish is useless and that 40mins a day would do great in improve my English, Biology, History ect.

implausible

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

This teacher has no control over the class. Desk slamming and paper balls are a regular occurrence. The teacher assumes that by sticking up notes on the projector and texting for the rest of the class will get us a pass at LC. I know it's ultimately up to us, but there is no will to teach and maintain discipline in the class.. and so, there is no will to learn.

Oh, so you're not brutal at it, you're in a disruptive class, that's different. Have you tried actually looking at the notes and doing some work?

Are the other students looking for exemptions?

(-Nathan-)

deemark wrote: »

Oh, so you're not brutal at it, you're in a disruptive class, that's different. Have you tried actually looking at the notes and doing some work?

Are the other students looking for exemptions?

No I am pathetic at Irish also. I don't even know how to say hello!

None of the other students are looking for exemptions. However, most of the class is highly critical of the teacher... (to her face, seriously) and some attempt to try study other subjects in the class (but fail after 5 mins).. I guess if I did get an exemption the rest of the class would follow.

figs86

Be careful - while your specific course may not require it, matriculation into any NUI college (UCD, UCC, UCG, NUIM, NCAD, RCSI etc) requires Irish in general

You must present an exemption granted by the Department of Education

See below and www.nui.ie for more details

''In what circumstances can a student claim exemption from Irish?

A:In the following circumstances
(i) if you were born outside the Republic of Ireland
(ii) if your last three years of second level education were outside Ireland
(iii) if your primary education up to the age of 11 years was outside Ireland
Students covered by (ii) and (iii) above will normally have been granted a DES from Irish at school. They need to inform NUI of this so that they can also be granted an exemption by NUI. If this applies to you, you will need to forward a copy of the Department of Education exemption granted by your school. The application must be accompanied by a Declaration from the Head of your School. There is a special form for this which you can get from NUI or download from the NUI website www.nui.ie.
Wait until you have received your CAO application number and include this when contacting NUI. Special exemptions (See questions 15 and 16).''

implausible

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

No I am pathetic at Irish also. I don't even know how to say hello!

(snip)
I guess if I did get an exemption the rest of the class would follow.

The rest of the class would not follow! Do you think the DES hand out exemptions willy-nilly to people who don't like Irish, when there are people who are genuinely entitled to an exemption?

Either get grinds to pass OL or do FL and use the time to concentrate on your other subjects.

(-Nathan-)

deemark wrote: »

The rest of the class would not follow! Do you think the DES hand out exemptions willy-nilly to people who don't like Irish, when there are people who are genuinely entitled to an exemption?

Either get grinds to pass OL or do FL and use the time to concentrate on your other subjects.

What I meant to say was attempt to follow. The rest of the class wouldn't fit the criteria. (Though I don't even think at this stage I do either). I guess a written excuse from my parents or defying the teacher will be my only options if I can't become legally exempt. I'm not wasting anymore time on Irish. I'm going to use the time to study other subjects.

Fad

School probably wont/shouldn't let you.

Being awful at Irish isn't an excuse to get out of a mandatory. You can just not turn up on the day though.

Example; I'm not very good at English, I would have loved to have dropped it last year and take the 5 free classes a week, do you think I even entertained the idea for a second?

Think about it, if one student who doesn't care about Irish, drops it, what are the other students going to think? Do you think they will feel compelled to continue the subject. This idea isn't supposed to make you reconsider your opinion on the subject, but this is how the school probably will react.

implausible

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

What I meant to say was attempt to follow. The rest of the class wouldn't fit the criteria. (Though I don't even think at this stage I do either). I guess a written excuse from my parents or defying the teacher will be my only options if I can't become legally exempt. I'm not wasting anymore time on Irish. I'm going to use the time to study other subjects.

You don't fit the criteria.

If you read my post, you'd see I'm telling you not to waste your time on Irish. Do FL, it'll use up very little of your time. At least that way you won't have a dodgy-looking LC results sheet because you didn't turn up for your exam.

gaeilgebeo

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

What I meant to say was attempt to follow. The rest of the class wouldn't fit the criteria. (Though I don't even think at this stage I do either). I guess a written excuse from my parents or defying the teacher will be my only options if I can't become legally exempt. I'm not wasting anymore time on Irish. I'm going to use the time to study other subjects.

I'm an irish teacher and I think your attitude STINKS. If you're that brutal at Irish, do foundation level. I'm sure you can tick a few boxes! Grow up!

(-Nathan-)

gaeilgebeo wrote: »

I'm an irish teacher and I think your attitude STINKS. If you're that brutal at Irish, do foundation level. I'm sure you can tick a few boxes! Grow up!

Lol! Your most likely my Irish teacher. Foundation is a waste of time, no points.

unknown13

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

Lol! Your most likely my Irish teacher. Foundation is a waste of time, no points.

A1 - 20
A2 - 15
B1 - 10
B2 - 5
B3 or below - 0

implausible

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

Lol! Your most likely my Irish teacher. Foundation is a waste of time, no points.

I think you'll find that ALL Irish teachers and a majority of other subject teachers would agree with gaeilgbeo.

There is always one who spends the time whining about having to do Irish, saying that s/he is going to get an exemption, but who ultimately sits the exam with the rest. If you spent the time doing some study, you'd have a hope. If you are so useless at it, you'd be doing FL, but obviously you think it is beneath you and would prefer to whinge about it and try to avoid it rather than just sit the exam.

In life, you will have to do things you don't want to, without your parents there to bail you out or to try and circumvent the system. Having the maturity to accept that some things have to be done and getting on with it will stand to you.

Piste

Ok aso we've established you can't get an exemption, that leaves two options left: sit Irish or don't sit Irish. Bear in mind that either way you'll be registered for the exam. So it seems to be a question of having an NG on your LC for not turning up, and consequently not getting into college, or having scraped a pass at ordinary level (Do most college courses even accept foundation level?)

It seems like your best bet is to do OL Irsh, but do the bear minimum to scrape a pass. Look for the oral and aural for marks, by watching TG4 and listening to radio na life or radio na gaeltachta you can become good at these sections and mop up the marks you'd miss in other sections due to having a lazy teacher. For the written part just learn the basics of your poetry and prose. With only a small effort you can easily pass ordinary level Irish. It shouldn't be that much hassle really!

randylonghorn

gaeilgebeo wrote: »

I'm an irish teacher and I think your attitude STINKS.

And that attitude, especially from a self-professed teacher, is unlikely to change his mind, or even open it to the possibility that he might be wrong.

TJJP

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

It may seem childish, but boy you should see this class. This teacher has no control over the class. Desk slamming and paper balls are a regular occurrence. The teacher assumes that by sticking up notes on the projector and texting for the rest of the class will get us a pass at LC. I know it's ultimately up to us, but there is no will to teach and maintain discipline in the class.. and so, there is no will to learn.

Irish is useless and that 40mins a day would do great in improve my English, Biology, History ect.

Seems like a pretty 'grown up' post to me. This is a description of the environment, not a statement of 'guilt'.

gaeilgebeo wrote: »

I'm an irish teacher and I think your attitude STINKS. If you're that brutal at Irish, do foundation level. I'm sure you can tick a few boxes! Grow up!

Seems a rather trite response.

OP doesn't seem all that clued-out, any chance of a constructive comment? OP is in sixth-year, what are the best options now? It's a little late to try and undo any damage at this stage?

spurious

You won't get an NG on your results sheet for not turning up.
If you do not turn up to any element of the Irish (including the oral) there will be no mention of Irish on your results at all.

The invigilator will look for you on the day, but only examinations for which you have completed a component will appear on your results.

MathsManiac

There are two different issues regarding exemption from Irish. One is whether you need it for college and the other is the obligation to study it at school. It is worth pointing out that NUI is more generous than the DES regarding granting exemptions.

Post #17 by Figs86 above is worth noting. Since you said at the start that you were born in England, this means you can get an exemption from NUI matriculation requirement, under criterion (i).

The DES is a different matter. In order to be a properly registered senior cycle student in a recognised school, you must be following a suitable programme of study in Irish. This does not mean that you are obliged to sit an exam in it. It does mean, however, that (unless you are granted an exemption) the school must ensure that you study Irish if they want to include you in their count of students for the purposes of funding from the Department (capitation grant & teacher salaries).

Bottom line: if you don't satisfy the DES exemption criteria, the DES won't pay for your education unless you study Irish. Since I assume your school has sufficient integrity that it will not collaborate in defrauding the Department, it is unlikely that they will let you stop attending Irish class.

**Timbuk2**

(-Nathan-) wrote: »

I was born in England but lived here most my life.

figs86 wrote: »

''In what circumstances can a student claim exemption from Irish?

A:In the following circumstances
(i) if you were born outside the Republic of Ireland
(ii) if your last three years of second level education were outside Ireland
(iii) if your primary education up to the age of 11 years was outside Ireland

Sorry to butt in, but is it not the case that the OP does meet the cirumstances necessary to claim an exemption?

Edit: Just saw the post above mine - that clears it up.