ristrictor cert from the north/uk

Timmaay

Hi, I've been looking at getting a 400 cbr/fzr/zxr etc, and an only on my provis, so would need it restricted. I've seen a few 400s up north that come with a restrictor cert, can I use the same cert down here or do I have to shell out another 200 or so to get another cert?

n.catenthusiast

Well without having any legal expertise whatsover I'd say any cert is grand so long as its legit.

The law doesn't (to the best of my knowledge) mention anything about a cert-it just says the bike has to be at a certain power/ power to weight ratio.


Cert is just the way in which you prove the bike was ok in the event of a crash/Garda query.

If anyone has an issue with the providence of the cert I'd a thought that's their problem, or burden of proof.

So long as bike genuinely is restricted your laughing.

traco

If the bike is restricted and you have the cert you are fine with the legal side as far as I know.

However the insurance companies will not recognise it, no idea why but I enquired about a factory restricted UK bike and they would not acknowledge the restriction - treated it as full power.

It was for that reason that I bought a non restricted bike and am fitting an afetrmarket restricter - worked out cheaper as Irish original factory restricted model commanded higer prices when compared to non restricted models and I wasn't seeing a huge insurance saving.

honeybadger

good question ,,arent restriction certs put in the original owners name who put the restrictors in??/,if the cert isnt in ur name is your bike restricted

Hotblack Desiato

Restriction certs aren't worth a damn, they're not a legal document, there is no requirement in law to have one. If your insurance company accepts a piece of paper from some randomer* as 'proof' that your bike is restricted, then more fool them, but it's of no use otherwise.

* As if anyone can't fake up a bike shop letterhead, or get someone who works in a bike shop to do up a letter for them.

traco

Aren't factory ones listed on the decleration of conformity of the bike supplied by the manufacturer listing the power output of the machine. Recent cage has all the power outputs on it so assume the same is there for the bikes.

This is the issue as far as I know with UK bikes, I think they come in full power and the importers restrict them in the UK, the UK insurance companies will accept that but the insurance companies here will only accept it if its linked back to the original factory documentation.

Phone your insurer and ask them but when I asked I was told they would not accept any UK restriction.

Legal aspect is all to do with your licence being valid or not, if its restricted then your licence is not valid for a bike with power output above the restriction. If this were not the case then anyone with a cage licence could get the M class and buy whatever bike they wanted without ever bothering with any tests.

Timmaay

This all seems to be such a grey area! Anyway, I managed to inherit a nice '89 gpz500, so no need to worry about a ristrictor from the north.

However the bike knocks out 60bhp (or did 20yrs ago at least ), so I'm going to have to get this ristricted. I know fi international supply offical kits, but do I really need one or could I install my own throttle stop or something, and get the bike dyno'd? Assuming I have any issues with accidents/gardai, would that be good enough? Anyone know how much a dyno run costs anyway?

Hotblack Desiato

traco wrote: »

Aren't factory ones listed on the decleration of conformity of the bike supplied by the manufacturer listing the power output of the machine.

If it came from the factory restricted, it should be.

But then again, any factory restricted bike is un-restrictable (in principle - the cost ranges from free to thousands) so even that piece of paper proves nothing.

Legal aspect is all to do with your licence being valid or not, if its restricted then your licence is not valid for a bike with power output above the restriction. If this were not the case then anyone with a cage licence could get the M class and buy whatever bike they wanted without ever bothering with any tests.

Yes, the licence is only valid on machines within its limits - the point is that having a piece of paper does not prove that your bike is actually within the power limit.

A1 and M licences have cc limits - registration cert shows your moped is 49cc but you fitted a sneaky big bore kit - no longer Class M (same thing is available for some 125s) so the legality can only be proven or disproven by measuring what is actually fitted to the bike.

traco

ninja900 wrote: »

If it came from the factory restricted, it should be.

But then again, any factory restricted bike is un-restrictable (in principle - the cost ranges from free to thousands) so even that piece of paper proves nothing.




Yes, the licence is only valid on machines within its limits - the point is that having a piece of paper does not prove that your bike is actually within the power limit.

A1 and M licences have cc limits - registration cert shows your moped is 49cc but you fitted a sneaky big bore kit - no longer Class M (same thing is available for some 125s) so the legality can only be proven or disproven by measuring what is actually fitted to the bike.

All true, the piece of paper is worthless till you need it. If you are unlucky to come off, hurt someone and the bike is impouned and investigated then that piece of paper is very important. If its fake then the insurance company can walk away and you'll be on your own for costs damages etc. I imagine with the letters being sent out from Quinn to customers that this will become a bigger issue in future.

If the paper is genuine and the restrictor is still physically on the Bike (didn't fall off or the engine spit it out) then you have full insurance. In the event that they found something still not correct with the power output you could take a case against the restrictor manuifacturer as a major part of the cost of the kit would the product liabaility insurance cover that they would have to have in place to cover such a product.

Hotblack Desiato

How does anyone prove a restriction cert is a fake or not? It's not a legal document, not in a standard form, not watermarked, no holograms or security features. Just a piece of paper, issued by any Joe Randomer in any bike shop. Means nothing. And not all learner legal bikes need to be restricted in the first place, so no cert for them.

The only way anyone can prove a bike is legal or not is to dyno it. But because of the power-to-weight exception in Irish law, and that the method of weighing the bike is not defined, it would be very difficult to prove that your bike is not legal.

traco

You could indeed get something from Joe Bloggs thats not worth the paper is written on but as far as I know there are only a handful of legally legitimate aftermarket restrictors out there.

Each is serial numbered, linked to the registered fitter and the bike owner with the engine and frame number which can be verified by contacting the manufacturer on their database.

In my opinion its worth the €250 euro for peace of mind, I paid to have one fitted, have supporting documentation and don't have to worry about being legal or not. I am still paying insurance for a full power machine but all my documentation is there and correct and in the event of a legal case I am covered.

If anyone wants to ride on a restricted license unrestricted then off with them but we'll end up paying on increased premiums over time.