Are Liverpool ( and Rafa ) done? *Haters Gonna Hate

Mr.Nice Guy

Question for the Liverpool fans on here. I'd like to know whether, with the benefit of hindsight, you wish Benitez had not put pen to paper on that long-term contract some months back?

It seems like this has tied the club's hands in a big way and it would seem the long contract was mainly given on an expectation of success.

Would it be fair to say upon reflection that this was a mistake, or are you of the view that it was better to tie him down at that time under the circumstances?

mayordenis

starbelgrade wrote: »

I'm sick of hearing the BS about Rafa not having the money to spend on players - in his 5 year tenure, he has spent €224 million on players, bought a stupid amount of them & only a handful were of any use.

His problem is that he doesn't invest in quality.

OK, he's recieved €109 million in fees, but that's still a net spend of €115 million. In the same period, Ferguson's net spend was €104 million, so you simply CAN'T blame a lack of funds for his failures.

Blame what you like, but NOT lack of funding for transfers.

So, I will exlude 4 & 5 in my answer as they are pointless criteria & go for Ottmar Hitzfeld, Otto Rehhagel (as a short term gap filler) or Avram Grant (budget option).

You're actually not looking at the complete picture.
Sure 230 odd million is alot of money,
but in dribs and drabs with leaks and holes all over the squad.

If had it all in one lump sum he could of bought just quality but he didn't, he had no real choice a lot of the time but to buy bargain basement.

He doesn't Invest in Quality?

Torres
Reina
Mascherano
Johnson
Agger
Skrtel

in a few weeks time I'll be confident we can add Aquilani to that list.

Do you understand that Alex Ferguson (and credit to him) had assembled an incredible squad for the better part of 15 years before Rafa came to liverpool?

So he was just adding little bits to the squad whereas rafa had an overhaul on his hands.

And I think everyone will say that Ronaldo's incredible fee very much massages the figure for utd there.

flahavaj

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Question for the Liverpool fans on here. I'd like to know whether, with the benefit of hindsight, you wish Benitez had not put pen to paper on that long-term contract some months back?

It seems like this has tied the club's hands in a big way and it would seem the long contract was mainly given on an expectation of success.

Would it be fair to say upon reflection that this was a mistake, or are you of the view that it was better to tie him down at that time under the circumstances?

Aye, in many ways he now has them by the balls and given their perilous financial position hes virtually unsackable. It'd cost them upwards of 20 million to pay off his contract if they sacked him, money they simply don't have. Cute hoor Rafa.:pac:

mayordenis

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Question for the Liverpool fans on here. I'd like to know whether, with the benefit of hindsight, you wish Benitez had not put pen to paper on that long-term contract some months back?

It seems like this has tied the club's hands in a big way and it would seem the long contract was mainly given on an expectation of success.

Would it be fair to say upon reflection that this was a mistake, or are you of the view that it was better to tie him down at that time under the circumstances?

For me I'm delighted he's signed on long term,
We are so incredibly unstable off the pitch the idea of switching managers mid season scares the **** out of me.

UnitedIrishman

flahavaj wrote: »

Hows that working out for Milan especially and Juve?:pac:;)

Ok, it's not going well for them at the minute. Marcello Lippi was given the job at Juventus after spending years in the lower divisions before winning 1 Uefa Cup with Napoli. Hardly a proven track record? Fabio Capello didn't manage anywhere before becoming Milan manager in 1991. Wenger came from obscurity in the 90's.

You don't have to be a world beater. But by the looks of things Liverpool fans are looking for a manager that has won 8 CL titles, 10 Leagues and 6 FA Cups that will do the job for a pittance and will only sign players on a free - and go on to win everything. :rolleyes:

You have to take a gamble every now and then instead of slowly but surely allowing everything slip. Now I'm not saying that's the case at Liverpool but just stating that it's the case for every club. As I've said before Rafa has done a good job but sometimes change is needed.

starbelgrade

whatawaster wrote: »

His net spend in 6 summers is 85 million, or 14 million a year.
Less than Martin O'Neill in 4 years. Less than Spurs in that time. Less than City and Chelsea. Not much more than Sunderland.
The net spend was slightly less than Ferguson's in the same period until they sold Ronaldo

Villa, Spurs, City & Sunderland have all spent more than the Pool, but where has it got them? With the exception of Chelsea, money doesn't gurantee you trophies. One thing that differentiates Utd from all these clubs is that they have an excellent youth academy which regularly brings up players into the 1st team squad with great success. When was the last time Liverpool did that?

whatawaster

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Question for the Liverpool fans on here. I'd like to know whether, with the benefit of hindsight, you wish Benitez had not put pen to paper on that long-term contract some months back?

It seems like this has tied the club's hands in a big way and it would seem the long contract was mainly given on an expectation of success.

Would it be fair to say upon reflection that this was a mistake, or are you of the view that it was better to tie him down at that time under the circumstances?

i don't think it's fair to say a 4/5 year term hasn't been a success only a dozen game into the first season of it. I think everyone knows there's still a lot wrong at the club.

mayordenis

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Ok, it's not going well for them at the minute. Marcello Lippi was given the job at Juventus after spending years in the lower divisions before winning 1 Uefa Cup with Napoli. Hardly a proven track record? Fabio Capello didn't manage anywhere before becoming Milan manager in 1991. Wenger came from obscurity in the 90's.

You don't have to be a world beater. But by the looks of things Liverpool fans are looking for a manager that has won 8 CL titles, 10 Leagues and 6 FA Cups that will do the job for a pittance and will only sign players on a free - and go on to win everything. :rolleyes:

You have to take a gamble every now and then instead of slowly but surely allowing everything slip.

I think we have a mentality (rightly or wrongly) that we stick by managers, I'm not saying nobody else does, but bar Arsenal and United there's not many team about in recent history who stick by managers like we do, and of course in that time Arsenal and United have had pretty great success.

We're not used to it, it's normal we'd be hesitant.

So you say "hey leds give Aidy Boothroyd a shot" well you know he has a great record in the lower leagues but if we are getting rid (crazily imo) of someone we consider world class we don't particularily want someone who we don't see as a really major world class manager.

whatawaster

starbelgrade wrote: »

Villa, Spurs, City & Sunderland have all spent more than the Pool, but where has it got them? With the exception of Chelsea, money doesn't gurantee you trophies. One thing that differentiates Utd from all these clubs is that they have an excellent youth academy which regularly brings up players into the 1st team squad with great success. When was the last time Liverpool did that?

Who's the last excellent youth player brought with great success into the Chelsea team?
How many of Spurs' squad are academy graduates - not too many i'd say.

Liverpool's academy hasn't been Rafa's responsibility until this season.
If those club's academies were as good as you say then they wouldn't need to spend so much.

Martin Kelly looks like breaking through from the academy.
There are plenty more i've high hopes for, both Local/English and overseas - Pacheco, Amoo, Bouzanis, Ecclestone, Dalla Valle. I don't think expecting at least 2/3 of them to make it is misplaced.

Edit: misunderstood your post. I see you were referring to United.
Their academy by the way doesn't negate their need to spend 30m on Rooney, Ferdinand or Berbatov.

starbelgrade

mayordenis wrote: »

Do you understand that Alex Ferguson (and credit to him) had assembled an incredible squad for the better part of 15 years before Rafa came to liverpool?

So he was just adding little bits to the squad whereas rafa had an overhaul on his hands.

Perhaps he shouldn't have overhauled the squad so much then - when he took over, he inherited a team that won the Champions League & with all his tinkering, they haven't won a major trophy since.

CCCP^

starbelgrade wrote: »

Villa, Spurs, City & Sunderland have all spent more than the Pool, but where has it got them? With the exception of Chelsea, money doesn't gurantee you trophies. One thing that differentiates Utd from all these clubs is that they have an excellent youth academy which regularly brings up players into the 1st team squad with great success. When was the last time Liverpool did that?

When is the last time United did that?

whatawaster

starbelgrade wrote: »

Perhaps he shouldn't have overhauled the squad so much then - when he took over, he inherited a team that won the Champions League & with all his tinkering, they haven't won a major trophy since.

that squad won the champions league because of some superb tactical and organisational work from Rafa, performances among the best i've ever seen from Carragher and Gerrard, not to mention huge contributions from Rafa signings Garcia and Alonso.

By the way that Houllier squad fetched a total of around 45 million in total transfer fees. Our squad now would fetch over 200m

starbelgrade

whatawaster wrote: »

Who's the last excellent youth player brought with great success into the Chelsea team?
How many of Spurs' squad are academy graduates - not too many i'd say.

If those club's academies were as good as you say then they wouldn't need to spend so much.

Either you didn't read what I said, or you didn't understand it - I never said that any of those clubs had good acadamies & I never said that they brought through any excellent youth players.

mayordenis

whatawaster wrote: »

Who's the last excellent youth player brought with great success into the Chelsea team?
How many of Spurs' squad are academy graduates - not too many i'd say.

Liverpool's academy hasn't been Rafa's responsibility until this season.
If those club's academies were as good as you say then they wouldn't need to spend so much.

Martin Kelly looks like breaking through from the academy.
There are plenty more i've high hopes for, both Local/English and overseas - Pacheco, Amoo, Bouzanis, Ecclestone, Dalla Valle. I don't think expecting at least 2/3 of them to make it is misplaced.

In fairness Insua joined under rafa at 18 - now a first team regular.
Martin Kelly, looks to have a great chance, Ayala's had some appearances looking assured.

Spearing, Plessis, Derby have all filled in somewhat well when needed.

If Nemeth wasn't on Loan and injured last season would of been sniffing about.

El zhar broke into the squad last season too.

Bouzanis, Pacheco, Delle Valle, Mavinga, Buchtmann all have huge potential.

Rafa for me has put in place a system that simply wasn't there when he arrived, that will mean over the coming years squad players will be coming from youth, and some first teams and even the odd potential world star.

UnitedIrishman

mayordenis wrote: »

I think we have a mentality (rightly or wrongly) that we stick by managers, I'm not saying nobody else does, but bar Arsenal and United there's not many team about in recent history who stick by managers like we do, and of course in that time Arsenal and United have had pretty great success.

We're not used to it, it's normal we'd be hesitant.

So you say "hey leds give Aidy Boothroyd a shot" well you know he has a great record in the lower leagues but if we are getting rid (crazily imo) of someone we consider world class we don't particularily want someone who we don't see as a really major world class manager.

Yeah I know what you mean about the mentality of giving managers a chance. In fairness it does keep a club a lot more stable - look at Spurs and the problems they have.

And I understand about replacing a world class manager with someone that isn't in that bracket, but a lot of appointing a manager that hasn't done it at the top is having good management in the boardroom to see what he has in him. Obviously Barca saw something in Guardiola and it proved to be a great appointment. Same with Capello and Lippi as I've said before. At the minute god knows what the yanks in charge at Liverpool would do.

So I guess there are two sides to it in that respect.

whatawaster

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Yeah I know what you mean about the mentality of giving managers a chance. In fairness it does keep a club a lot more stable - look at Spurs and the problems they have.

And I understand about replacing a world class manager with someone that isn't in that bracket, but a lot of appointing a manager that hasn't done it at the top is having good management in the boardroom to see what he has in him. Obviously Barca saw something in Guardiola and it proved to be a great appointment. Same with Capello and Lippi as I've said before. At the minute god knows what the yanks in charge at Liverpool would do.

So I guess there are two sides to it in that respect.

In fairness to Guardiola, who has done a great job - he had Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, Henry, Eto'o to work with.

UnitedIrishman

CCCP^ wrote: »

When is the last time United did that?

Out of our squad at the minute these players all came through the youth ranks:

J O'Shea
W Brown
Fabio [signed as a youngster for a pittance - just like the likes of Pacheco etc]
Rafael [see above]
D Gibson
J Evans
F Macheda [signed as a 17-y-old]
D Wellbeck

All of whom have played numerous games this year, whilst O'Shea/Brown/Evans are regulars.

Then there's the older guys I won't get into

starbelgrade

CCCP^ wrote: »

When is the last time United did that?

Wes Brown, Danny Welbeck, Jonny Evans, Darren Fletcher & Kiko Macheda come to mind.

mayordenis

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Yeah I know what you mean about the mentality of giving managers a chance. In fairness it does keep a club a lot more stable - look at Spurs and the problems they have.

And I understand about replacing a world class manager with someone that isn't in that bracket, but a lot of appointing a manager that hasn't done it at the top is having good management in the boardroom to see what he has in him. Obviously Barca saw something in Guardiola and it proved to be a great appointment. Same with Capello and Lippi as I've said before. At the minute god knows what the yanks in charge at Liverpool would do.

So I guess there are two sides to it in that respect.

Absolutely you know (again saying this as someone who is a total supporter of Rafa) if he were to leave I would love so much to be proved wrong and to see say someone like Barnes (loljoke) but you know what I mean a pep guardiola, Didi Hamann or Hyypia in a few years time, even how Zola has moved into management would be something I would love us to take a punt on.

Right now nobody springs to mind, and I think (not you) too many are being short sighted.

The saying is you can only judge a horse by it's last race.

Taking that at it's literal meaning you sack a manager after every defeat, but where does it stop? Does having an incerible record (which he did our highest amount of wins in his first 200 league games I think) and then having a really ****ty (and they are ****ty) 8 games mean you get the sack?

I don't know, I can't answer that but my gut says we need to keep him, but my gut is also hungry.

UnitedIrishman

whatawaster wrote: »

In fairness to Guardiola, who has done a great job - he had Messi, Iniesta, Xavi, Henry, Eto'o to work with.

Oh yeah, no doubting that. He still had to make massive decisions coming in to get of Ronaldinho and to set his team up the way he did. Rijkaard had the same group of players and couldn't win the title the two years before. Sometimes a different perspective can change things - whether you are experienced or not.

flahavaj

CCCP^ wrote: »

When is the last time United did that?

Wellbeck, Macheda, Johnny Evans, Rafael da Silva, Fabio da Silva would be the latest crop to feature in the first team squad on a regular basis. (I realise some of those were signed from other clubs as teenagers but they're as legitimate examples as guys like Ayala and Pacheco that are being given in the thread and have passed though the youth system to some extent).

Other former youth players in the United squad currently:Neville, Giggs, Scholes, Browne, O' Shea, Fletcher.

The Academy at United is alive and well. There are several other prospects on the fringes that I'm sure Boggles et al will be only too happy to inform you of.

starbelgrade

whatawaster wrote: »

By the way that Houllier squad fetched a total of around 45 million in total transfer fees. Our squad now would fetch over 200m

And that proves what exactly?

Jack Bauer999

[QUOTE=mayordenis;62856032]
Does having an incerible record (which he did our highest amount of wins in his first 200 league games I think) and then having a really ****ty (and they are ****ty) 8 games mean you get the sack?

QUOTE]


dress it up as much as you want but at the end of the day and into his 6th year at the club the only silverware to rafa's name is an FA cup and a champions league wn with the previous managers squad.
amount if games won, coming second in the league, reinna's golden gloves etc mean noting if there's no silverware to back it up.

UnitedIrishman

mayordenis wrote: »

Absolutely you know (again saying this as someone who is a total supporter of Rafa) if he were to leave I would love so much to be proved wrong and to see say someone like Barnes (loljoke) but you know what I mean a pep guardiola, Didi Hamann or Hyypia in a few years time, even how Zola has moved into management would be something I would love us to take a punt on.

Right now nobody springs to mind, and I think (not you) too many are being short sighted.

The saying is you can only judge a horse by it's last race.

Taking that at it's literal meaning you sack a manager after every defeat, but where does it stop? Does having an incerible record (which he did our highest amount of wins in his first 200 league games I think) and then having a really ****ty (and they are ****ty) 8 games mean you get the sack?

I don't know, I can't answer that but my gut says we need to keep him, but my gut is also hungry.

Exactly. As I said, the real point Liverpool fans/board (well.. the board are clowns so..) will have to take stock is at the end of the season and say "have we improved on where we were 2-3 years ago at this point". If I was a Liverpool fan (god forbid..joke) then I wouldn't be looking for his head either.

It just seems, and this is an objective view, that things are a little stale at the minute. Change can always come from the inside but its getting hard to see where that will come from.

CCCP^

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Out of our squad at the minute these players all came through the youth ranks:

J O'Shea
W Brown
Fabio [signed as a youngster for a pittance - just like the likes of Pacheco etc]
Rafael [see above]
D Gibson
J Evans
F Macheda [signed as a 17-y-old]
D Wellbeck

All of whom have played numerous games this year, whilst O'Shea/Brown/Evans are regulars.

Then there's the older guys I won't get into

Now, how many of those were bought from other teams? O'Shea, Brown, Gibson and Evans can be considered very much Academy talent apart from brief times spent at other teams, which is really all part of the growing process. Fabio, Rafael, Macheda no.

Compare those to the last crop of United academy players - Beckham, Scholes, Butt, the Neville brothers. Those former players are good but still have a long way to go compared to the former.

UnitedIrishman

CCCP^ wrote: »

Now, how many of those were bought from other teams? O'Shea, Brown, Gibson and Evans can be considered very much Academy talent apart from brief times spent at other teams, which is really all part of the growing process. Fabio, Rafael, Macheda no.

Compare those to the last crop of United academy players - Beckham, Scholes, Butt, the Neville brothers. Those former players are good but still have a long way to go compared to the former.

I still don't get your point though? O'Shea, Fletch (almost forgot him), Brown, Gibson and Evans have several hundred appearances between them. They're massive part of our squad.

As regards the others - All teams buy players at 15/16/17 from the continent and elsewhere to bring into their academy. Liverpool have Pacheco, Valle, Nemeth, who are all from other sides. The question was whether Liverpool had players coming through the ranks and the answer is that they haven't had. Things are looking brighter of course but there hasn't been anything for years.

flahavaj

In fairness the group that produced the likes of Scholes, Becks, Butt,the Nevilles etc all at the one time was a pure freak of nature. The chances of that many players being produced that would go on to play for England and have long careers where they were considered amongst the world's best only happens once in a blue moon. In the meantime the acedemy has still produced a steady supply of players that have become vital members of the United squad over the years.

Bubs101

whatawaster wrote: »

i've asked this time and time again and i've yet to get a satisfactory answer:

Could someone put forward someone as a possible replacement for Rafa, who meets the following criterium:

1. Would be a realistic appointment
2. Would be affordable
3. Has a proven track record of winning major trophies
4. Has a proven track record of winning trophies on a very limited budget
5. You think it's likely they'll turn Liverpool into title challengers/winners on that budget.

Someone give me a name.

Hiddink/Capello/Ferguson/Wenger are all out on point 1.
Mourinho on 2.
O'Neill certainly doesn't come in under number 5 or imo on 3 or 4 either

Whatever you think about whether Rafa fulfulls 5, unless you are sure his replacement will there is Zero point in getting rid. Essentially paying off millions in the hope that his successor will be a miracle worker (very unlikely)

Anyone got some names?

Roberto Mancini.

He's realistic.
Available for free having cancelled his contract with Inter
Won 3 Serie A titles and you can only beat what's infront of you
Won the Coppa Italia with Fiorentina when they were poor and Lazio when they were pretty much bankrupt and even got them into the CL in his last year there
He could do it. There's no guarantees obviously but he has won 3 league titles and has done very well when he'd been faced with no money before hand

flahavaj

Bubs101 wrote: »

Roberto Mancini.

He's realistic.
Available for free having cancelled his contract with Inter
Won 3 Serie A titles and you can only beat what's infront of you
Won the Coppa Italia with Fiorentina when they were poor and Lazio when they were pretty much bankrupt and even got them into the CL in his last year there
He could do it. There's no guarantees obviously but he has won 3 league titles and has done very well when he'd been faced with no money before hand

Bit crap in Europe though.

Bubs101

flahavaj wrote: »

Bit crap in Europe though.

Ah sure he won two cup winners cup medals and got to a Champions League Final as a player.

mayordenis

In fairness that's probably the most plausible suggestion I've seen.

flahavaj

Bubs101 wrote: »

Ah sure he won two cup winners cup medals and got to a Champions League Final as a player.

Jesus in that case Giggsy (11 Prems and 2 Chmps Leagues and numerous FA Cups) is gonna be one hell of a manager!;):pac:

Bubs101

Seriously though, people look far too much into the lack of success with Inter in Europe when they look at his career. He's won trophies with every club he's managed and won the league every year he was at a club in a position to do so and he had no money for the first few years of his management. He underperformed in one competition, that's it and it's not exactly like his successor or predecessor set Europe alight with that club.

Genuinely think he's a better manager then Rafa. He's never done **** at a club whereas Rafa did a few times early on and he's proven himself to be very good at domestic competitions whereas Rafa seemed to have struck lightening at Valencia and since and before then floundered in the league

SlickRic

well done Bubs.

i think that's the first decent option i've seen if rafa were to get the sack in the near future.

i still don't think he should mind you. as mayordenis said, i'd be wary of being gun happy with someone whose had a great 200 games in general, and a cr*p 8 game run.

sacking would still be premature for me.

Bubs101

SlickRic wrote: »

well done Bubs.

i think that's the first decent option i've seen if rafa were to get the sack in the near future.

i still don't think he should mind you. as mayordenis said, i'd be wary of being gun happy with someone whose had a great 200 games in general, and a cr*p 8 game run.

sacking would still be premature for me.

He hasn't had a great 200 games though really. The same year he won the Champions League he shouldn't have got in the competition and he has never made a decent attempt at the league.

Mancini had some insanely good league record at Inter where he won like 15 games in a row in his second season and in his third season he went unbeaten for more than half the year. He also signed some amazing players. Maicon, Julio Cesar, Ibra and Esteban Cambiasso are some of Inter's best players in memory and Maicon and Cesar are in the top 3 in their position

I think Liverpool should really look at their future and especially at Man City. Rafa nearly lost them their Champions League place when there was no real long term danger on the top 4. Now there is and Rafa is the last man I'd trust in the league to secure a top 4 place

starbelgrade

Bubs101 wrote: »

I think Liverpool should really look at their future

I think Liverpool should also look at their past - they haven't won the league since 1991 & in the 18 seasons since then, they've been in the top 4 twelve times & in 2nd position only twice.

For a club with such a brilliant history, they have only won 2 major trophies in 2 decades. Rafa may, or may not be the cause of their current problems, but the deep seated roots go way beyond that.

Wasn't the first of Mancini's 3 in a row a default after Juve were stripped of the title? I know it counts on paper but he never had to deal with the pressures of going to the wire. And the second was a one horse race with teams either in Serie B or docked so many points that it would be impossible to compete. Even last year I think Inter are still riding that tide. I mean they picked up the key available players from Juve's Championship winning side and then rode the coattails for 2 years. I'm not saying Mancini isn't a competent manager, I just have a bit of an issue with his "3 in a row" being used in any way to prove that he's a good manager

kida

Prufrock wrote: »

Theres no point in sacking Rafa when he has that much time left on his contract. £20 mill to make him leave? Thats a lot of cash to throw down the drain.

But the main thing is to rest Torres. Let him get back to 100% and don't risk the long term health of your best striker for short term gain. If hes injured then he's injured and the other lads in your squad, reguardless of quality, will have to try and do the job.

apparently it would only cost 5M to sack him

daveyboy_1ie

starbelgrade wrote: »

For a club with such a brilliant history, they have only won 2 major trophies in 2 decades.

FA Cup in 1992, 2001 & 2006
League Cup in 1995, 2001 & 2003
Champions League in 2005
Uefa Cup in 2001

Not as succesful as they would want to be but a lot more succesful than 2 major trophies in two decades and am not counting Charity Shields (2001 & 2006) or Uefa Super Cups (2001 & 2005). By any other club this would not be a bad run, just compared to the previous two decades it pales into comparison.

Also it does not help when your biggest rivals have had their most succesful two decades in that same time period.

Boggles

kida wrote: »

apparently it would only cost 5M to sack him

Heard that too, he could also do the honourable thing and resign.

Ultimately it has cost alot more than 5m already not sacking him and could cost a hell of alot more if they stick with him.

kida

Boggles wrote: »

Heard that too, he could also do the honourable thing and resign.

Ultimately it has cost alot more than 5m already not sacking him and could cost a hell of alot more if they stick with him.

Apparently it is to do with the employability of him.
And if true, I expect the americans to act quickly and try and save the season. I expect they were waiting for their fate in the CL to be sealed whic it is as good as now.

daveyboy_1ie

Honestly lads, you would want him sacked when there are two important games coming up? At the moment you need stability. If he fails to qualify for the next round of CL then the question might be asked but for the time being you need to get behind him and support your team.

If you let him go the club will be in turmoil and have little chance of qualifying. Also, you have to bear in mind that many of the teams stars (except Gerrard) will lose their allegiance and will want to go too at the end of the season. Masch & Torres will be gone before you know it and try and get new stars in with a club in financial dificulties, and the better players gone.

Boggles

daveyboy_1ie wrote: »

Honestly lads, you would want him sacked when there are two important games coming up? At the moment you need stability. If he fails to qualify for the next round of CL then the question might be asked but for the time being you need to get behind him and support your team.

If you let him go the club will be in turmoil and have little chance of qualifying. Also, you have to bear in mind that many of the teams stars (except Gerrard) will lose their allegiance and will want to go too at the end of the season. Masch & Torres will be gone before you know it and try and get new stars in with a club in financial dificulties, and the better players gone.

I rose the point he should have went before the United match.

Masch allegiance. Haha!!! :pac:

kida

daveyboy_1ie wrote: »

Honestly lads, you would want him sacked when there are two important games coming up? At the moment you need stability. If he fails to qualify for the next round of CL then the question might be asked but for the time being you need to get behind him and support your team.

If you let him go the club will be in turmoil and have little chance of qualifying. Also, you have to bear in mind that many of the teams stars (except Gerrard) will lose their allegiance and will want to go too at the end of the season. Masch & Torres will be gone before you know it and try and get new stars in with a club in financial dificulties, and the better players gone.

They have to finish top 4 now to safeguard the future of the club and in the owners eyes to safeguard their investment so don't be surprised if they feel the need to get rid of him. Mascherano will be gone next summer regardless perhaps in January if he kicks up enough.

Headshot

I hope he doesnt leave anyway

Spud83

Headshot wrote: »

I hope he doesnt leave anyway

I'm guessing because you are a United fan and believe he will never win Liverpool the league?

Handsome Bob

I don't want him to go, but I fear that 6 points are paramount against B'ham and M'City in order to save himself. Only a winning streak will take the pressure off, no point beating B'ham if we falter against City.

Berti Vogts

Headshot wrote: »

I hope he doesnt leave anyway

Still rolling on the floor laughing at United fans with their "hilarious" comments about wanting Benitez to stay.

Talk about Benitez getting sacked is absolutely ridiculous. Lets not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

whatawaster

Headshot wrote: »

I hope he doesnt leave anyway

Can I ask why?

Is it because you assume anyone half-competent who comes in will be able to win the league with no money to spend?

The Muppet

Whether he goes or stays depends on the yanks true feelings about him. If they see him as a manager that will move the club forward he will stay. If on the other hand they have been biding their time since the Klinsman incident for the right time to get rid of him he will go and go soon. Opinion amoung the general liverpool fans is divided if results improve, those wavering may get fully behind him again and make it difficult for them to get rid. If he is going to be sacked I'd say it will be before the new year, He's aleady recieved the vote of confidence from the owners.

I don't care wheter he stays or goes. He's very good in some aspects of his management and and very poor in others IMO as I said previously a flawed genius.