Are Liverpool ( and Rafa ) done? *Haters Gonna Hate

Killme00

Q1: How long has Rafa been manager of LFC?
Q2: What has he won in that time?
Q3: How long did it take Sir Alex to make Utd champions?
Q4: What did Sir Alex win in that time?

ergo visa vi sensationalist bullcrap

mayordenis

flahavaj wrote: »

I thought you could have put more effort into the second half of that list to be honest Alan, it looks like you lost interest halfway through. Otherwise well done.

bit harsh when the second half of the list was all youth.

Pepe LeFrits

Benitez is an outstanding manager.

If he didn't manage Man United's most bitter rivals I'd find it strange to see certain United fans criticising Rafa's abilities simply because he hasn't managed to eclipse a Man United team managed by a man who those same United fans would probably say is the greatest manager of all time.

One can make the claim that the endless circling of the arguments about Benitez is based on facts but in the end its mostly just based on club lines.

flahavaj

LOL, my last post was totally tongue in cheek lads, take it aisy.

ntlbell

Killme00 wrote: »

Q1: How long has Rafa been manager of LFC?
Q2: What has he won in that time?
Q3: How long did it take Sir Alex to make Utd champions?
Q4: What did Sir Alex win in that time?

ergo visa vi sensationalist bullcrap

what has another manager got to do with it, if you wish to discuss alex's amazing success start another thread

Killme00

ntlbell wrote: »

what has another manager got to do with it, if you wish to discuss alex's amazing success start another thread

All arguments boil down to Liverpool vs Utd anyway and as Liverpool are trying to overhaul Utd then it seems prudent to compare the managers in such fashion.

ergo visa vi if i want to spout bullcrap in this bullcrap thread i will

ntlbell

Killme00 wrote: »

All arguments boil down to Liverpool vs Utd anyway and as Liverpool are trying to overhaul Utd then it seems prudent to compare the managers in such fashion.

ergo visa vi if i want to spout bullcrap in this bullcrap thread i will

murhino did it in one year?

Killme00

ntlbell wrote: »

murhino did it in one year?

but he's the special one

_blank_

Vis-à-vis

Bubs101

ntlbell wrote: »

murhino did it in one year?

Most of that was done by Ranieri the year before. had he not gone insane in that last 20 minutes against Monaco we probably would have won the Champion's league that year and he only didn't win the Premiership that year because the best team in the history of the league arrived that year

Killme00

Des wrote: »

Vis-à-vis

Well done on missing the point

Mr Alan

Killme00 wrote: »

but he's the special one

i believe he's refering to himself as jesus now :eek:

Killme00

Mr Alan wrote: »

i believe he's refering to himself as jesus now :eek:

he's better looking than jesus

The Muppet

I see alan Hansen has joined the list of bitter ex liverpool players talking out of their *******.

Hey Mr Al, how much in total did the players in the list of under 5 million cost?

ntlbell

Bubs101 wrote: »

Most of that was done by Ranieri the year before. had he not gone insane in that last 20 minutes against Monaco we probably would have won the Champion's league that year and he only didn't win the Premiership that year because the best team in the history of the league arrived that year

all right, can someone give me a ball park figure for how many years rafa can go without winning a league before someone say something negative about him?

alex ferguson came to united in a different era of football

if anything it should be easier today to overthrow than ever before with the money around and the import of quality players from all over the world.

it's impossible to compare and pretty pointless

FHACT

Mr Alan

ntlbell wrote: »

all right, can someone give me a ball park figure for how many years rafa can go without winning a league before someone say something negative about him?

17.

The Muppet

ntlbell wrote: »

all right, can someone give me a ball park figure for how many years rafa can go without winning a league before someone say something negative about him?

alex ferguson came to united in a different era of football

if anything it should be easier today to overthrow than ever before with the money around and the import of quality players from all over the world.

it's impossible to compare and pretty pointless

FHACT

Maybe there is a comparison to be made though. After five years Fergie had a youth setup in place that was to go on and dominate the premiership for the next decade. Giggs, Scholes the Nevilles, Beckham Butt etc. That souce has never dried up with players still coming through to teh first team. Brown O Shea, Fletcher Wellbeck to name a few over the years.

Does Rafa have five of six players who are just about to burst onto the scenen and dominate in the same manner?

Killme00

Mr Alan wrote: »

17.

+/- 10

ntlbell

Mr Alan wrote: »

17.

my clock shows time up

5th year.

Killme00

ntlbell wrote: »

if anything it should be easier today to overthrow than ever before with the money around and the import of quality players from all over the world

i agree with you here


How long are we going to give the next Utd manager to win the league? Ignore, Morinho should win the league in six months at Utd

givyjoe81

kryogen wrote: »

not the most helpful reply in fairness, why bother replying at all if you have such contempt for the question, comments like this is only flame the situation. whats the point like?

To answer the OP, Liverpool were always going to be longshots for the premier league this season due to a lack of strength in depth, same as every season! but they are not out of the league yet this year, a win for them next week and everyone will be tipping them for the title again

As usual the knee jerk reactions of people come out after a match, but look at it objectively, are they too far behind in the title race to win the league at this point?

of course not, but they need to learn how to win games, and actually play well, without Gerrard.....They have not performed well again today and while teams like united and chelsea can often peform poorly and get the result, Liverpool just dont it consistently

they were doing it last year and thats what got them close. they need to find a way to do it again

Excuses only go so far in football and it will ultimately be the owners of liverpool who decide when it is the end for rafa, or maybe he himself will walk away, but things would have to get pretty bad on the pitch for that to happen imo

Unfortunately, no amount of 'learning' can make up for an unacceptable amount of average players. Really i feared for us before the season started. Absolutely no strength in depth, and poor, never mind average players throughout the starting eleven. Insua, Lucas and even Spearing (who is never going to be a top class player) in the team. Writing is on the wall, poor squad overall and four defeats already whenever they have come up against remotely decent opposition.

I said it elsewhere at the start, this is all coming up Leeds, i can see Benitez getting shafted and us finishing outside the top four and its dark from there. The club is in serious financial trouble, despite what the owners may claim, they recently had to re-finance the loans, (in other words they couldnt afford to pay it) and no champions league next year may mean forced player sales.

Killme00

givyjoe81 wrote: »

they recently had to re-finance the loans, (in other words they couldnt afford to pay it)

?

fkt

The Sparrow wrote: »

And unlike Liverpool, Utd have good strikers who can fill in when Rooney or Berbatov are not playing.

Erm, who?

givyjoe81

Killme00 wrote: »

?

Like myself, in financial trouble, i asked my bank nicely to spread the payments over a longer term as i couldnt afford to continue paying at the current level!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/liverpool/article6854596.ece
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/sep/24/liverpool-owners-loans

Paul Tergat

Killme00 wrote: »

i agree with you here


How long are we going to give the next Utd manager to win the league? Ignore, Morinho should win the league in six months at Utd

Plus the next UTD manager is likely to have a pretty amazing foundation in place. Fergie will make sure when he leaves us that all is in place

mayordenis

ntlbell wrote: »

my clock shows time up

5th year.

That must be a cool ****ing clock, any pics? sounds cool, man your cool, your posts are cool and awesome win.

ntlbell

mayordenis wrote: »

That must be a cool ****ing clock, any pics? sounds cool, man your cool, your posts are cool and awesome win.

?

The Muppet

Rafa Benitez wrote:

Don't forget Liverpool has less money than Manchester United, Chelsea, Arsenal and now Manchester City."

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_5638012,00.html

Arsenal:eek: Ah now delusional isn't the word for it.

The pressure must be mounting. I'm surprised he's turning to the old excuses considering they have already been rubbished by his own bosses.

K-9

The Muppet wrote: »

they have already been rubbished by his own bosses.

By rubbish claims.

SlickRic

The Muppet wrote: »

Arsenal:eek: Ah now delusional isn't the word for it.

how? even if it's a bad excuse, it's true.

Arsene Wenger is a freak of nature in terms of finding talent. i'm the first to admit Rafa can't come close to him in that regard; sure nobody really can. plus he has money if he wants it; he just won't sacrifice the club being profitable.

as i say, freak of nature in the era of modern football.

i don't like it as an excuse for our start, because in no world should we lose the amount of games we have already. but at the same time he's right, we're pretty broke.

The Muppet wrote: »

I'm surprised he's turning to the old excuses considering they have already been rubbished by his own bosses.

do you really want to go down this particular road again? i'm pretty sure nobody else does.

Handsome Bob

These arguments are like a circle that just keep going around and around, with neither side willing to accept each side's "facts" on the issue and break the circle. Seriously, and I'm appealing to my fellow Liverpool fans, how many of you have had the same argument on multiple occasions with certain posters? And have they ever budged on their opinions regardless of the "facts" you throw at them? I'm guessing the answer is no, so ignore them. I have no time anymore for certain individuals on here and don't acknowledge their opinions, y'all should do the same, it'll make you a lot happier.

builttospill

I'll repeat what I said earlier to a friend who's a Liverpool fan and agreed with me:

A few weeks ago I was watching a Liverpool match with a few other friends who are fans and I said to them that I didn't think Torres would last much longer at Liverpool cos he's too good for them. They looked at me like I was a cnut and thought I was joking to start a bit of trouble. I genuinely cringe when I see Liverpool playing gash while Torres shakes his head at their limitations. It's different with Gerrard cos he is Liverpool through and through. He has seen it all and it's in his blood. It's his family. Torres however thought he was going to the greatest team in the world and I'd say now he's having serious doubts. Not to say that Gerrard doesn't have these doubts. It's just that Gerrard has been around through thick and thin and probably always knew in his heart that it was never going to be easy. Torres I reckon was given a bit of a false impression before going there, possibly based on their Champions league success in '05. Maybe I'm leaving myself open to an outpouring of scorn from Liverpool fans but there's my 2 cents.

podge018

a waste of typing that was.

builttospill

podge018 wrote: »

a waste of typing that was.

Liverpool fan?

Boggles

LZ5by5 wrote: »

These arguments are like a circle that just keep going around and around, with neither side willing to accept each side's "facts" on the issue and break the circle. Seriously, and I'm appealing to my Liverpool fans, how many of you have had the same argument on multiple occasions with certain posters? And have they ever budged on their opinions regardless of the "facts" you throw at them? I'm guessing the answer is no, so ignore them. I have no time anymore for certain individuals on here and don't acknowledge their opinions, y'all should do the same, it'll make you a lot happier.

Handsome Bob

Thanks for highlight a missing word for me.

Melion

www.irishkop.com

Sensible discussion with real reds who actually know what they are talking about. I highly recommend it over this continuous argument with just ends with "My c0ck is bigger than yours"

The Muppet

SlickRic wrote: »

how? even if it's a bad excuse, it's true.

Arsene Wenger is a freak of nature in terms of finding talent. i'm the first to admit Rafa can't come close to him in that regard; sure nobody really can. plus he has money if he wants it; he just won't sacrifice the club being profitable.

as i say, freak of nature in the era of modern football.

i don't like it as an excuse for our start, because in no world should we lose the amount of games we have already. but at the same time he's right, we're pretty broke.

Arsenal have spent very little since they built their stadium. For Rafa to moan about havin less money than Wenger for transfers smacks of sour grapes. Arsenals nett spend this summer was around minus £30 million net, He just leaves himself open to ridicule by making such blatanly false claims.

Headshot

Melion wrote: »

www.irishkop.com

Sensible discussion with real reds who actually know what they are talking about. I highly recommend it over this continuous argument with just ends with "My c0ck is bigger than yours"

so why are you posting here ?

Melion

Just came in for a look. That ok with you?

SlickRic

The Muppet wrote: »

Arsenal have spent very little since they built their stadium. For Rafa to moan about havin less money than Wenger for transfers smacks of sour grapes. Arsenals nett spend this summer was around minus £30 million net, He just leaves himself open to ridicule by making such blatanly false claims.

fair enough.

he didn't lie though. they have more money.

he leaves himself open to an unwelcome comparison to Wenger, which isn't smart, but he's telling the truth.

Bandit12

builttospill wrote: »

I'll repeat what I said earlier to a friend who's a Liverpool fan and agreed with me:

A few weeks ago I was watching a Liverpool match with a few other friends who are fans and I said to them that I didn't think Torres would last much longer at Liverpool cos he's too good for them. They looked at me like I was a cnut and thought I was joking to start a bit of trouble. I genuinely cringe when I see Liverpool playing gash while Torres shakes his head at their limitations. It's different with Gerrard cos he is Liverpool through and through. He has seen it all and it's in his blood. It's his family. Torres however thought he was going to the greatest team in the world and I'd say now he's having serious doubts. Not to say that Gerrard doesn't have these doubts. It's just that Gerrard has been around through thick and thin and probably always knew in his heart that it was never going to be easy. Torres I reckon was given a bit of a false impression before going there, possibly based on their Champions league success in '05. Maybe I'm leaving myself open to an outpouring of scorn from Liverpool fans but there's my 2 cents.

Wow just wow. What a waste of my time that was.

The Muppet

SlickRic wrote: »

fair enough.

he didn't lie though. they have more money.

he leaves himself open to an unwelcome comparison to Wenger, which isn't smart, but he's telling the truth.

I can agree to differ with you on that, none of us knows which club has the most cash at their disposal.

Handsome Bob

Bandit12 wrote: »

Wow just wow. What a waste of my time that was.

I think every group of lads has one tbh. :pac:

Bandit12

Melion wrote: »

www.irishkop.com

Sensible discussion with real reds who actually know what they are talking about. I highly recommend it over this continuous argument with just ends with "My c0ck is bigger than yours"

Agreed. Signed up there last season on Irishkop and they are a great bunch. You can actually talk about the club issues etc without a bunch of goons coming on the forum to spoil it.

builttospill

Bandit12 wrote: »

Wow just wow. What a waste of my time that was.

Another Liverpool fan I presume? Will someone substantiate these claims with a good counter argument instead of an ignorant rebuttal?

Bandit12

builttospill wrote: »

Another Liverpool fan I presume? Will someone substantiate these claims with a good counter argument instead of an ignorant rebuttal?

So your saying that what you posted was a good arguement. Sweet jesus. Good night lads :rolleyes:

kryogen

so out of interest?

is irishkop really that good!?!

i mean, is it like a bunch of pool fans sharing almost identical opinions and never having to deal with criticism while they stroke each other off??

Vampireskiss

Bandit12 wrote: »

Agreed. Signed up there last season on Irishkop and they are a great bunch. You can actually talk about the club issues etc without a bunch of goons coming on the forum to spoil it.

Misery likes company

builttospill

Bandit12 wrote: »

So your saying that what you posted was a good arguement. Sweet jesus. Good night lads :rolleyes:

Eh no,

I asked for a good counter argument which I still haven't got. Just another ignorant rebuttal. Hmmmmm...

Also I'm obviously up against a load of Liverpool fans in here. Silly me.