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Liverpool V Manchester United Sunday 26th oct 2009 2.00pm (Mod note - #967)

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,905 ✭✭✭✭Handsome Bob


    Quite amusing reading Vidic get slaughtered by Pool fans when deep down we all know they'd love him in their team. :cool:

    Definitely, I'd love him in place of Carra because he's on the way out, in spite of today's result. But I wouldn't sacrifice Agger or Skrtel for him.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    LZ5by5 wrote: »
    I don't think I'm overreacting, whether you like it or not saying your team was ****e does suggests that you believe the result would have been in your favour had Man U played better. And as I outlined earlier, I don't believe you played ****e, Man U constantly threatened, especially after the first goal

    United were rubbish, man. Only VDS and Valencia can say that they had good games today, the rest were at best below-par. Berbatov, Carrick, Scholes, Evra and Vidic in particular played as poorly as I've ever seen them play.
    Wasn't really having a go at Pro F, that's why I only highlighted one line from his whole post. It represented what many pundits will be saying tomorrow and I think it's very unfair.

    You said yourself "I don't mean to have a go, but....." Which to me kinda implies you were doing exactly that.
    I really spent the whole of last week bemoaning my team? Shocking, here's me thinking I only made one negative post in the Liverpool superthread after Lyon beat us. :eek:

    Tongue in cheek comment given your earlier post in the Superthread about how fickle you are re: Liverpool.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,365 ✭✭✭✭rossie1977


    p_larkin99 wrote: »
    Now i know you're excited but we played to our ability and didnt get lucky is just a pathetic thing to say.

    utd are playing exactly how liverpool were this time last year


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,975 ✭✭✭nkay1985


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    personally, i dont think Utd were any worse than they have been the majority of this season so far.
    john47832 wrote: »
    very true - laws of averages states that luck will run out at some time, today they played to their ability and didnt get lucky


    I think both of these comments show about as much class as a united fan coming on here and saying we deserved the win and only lost because of the referee. That's what I'd equate it to.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,772 ✭✭✭✭Paul Tergat


    rossie1977 wrote: »
    utd are playing exactly how liverpool were this time last year

    I'm not sure I know what you are getting at here mate in relation to what I said?


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,956 ✭✭✭CHD


    p_larkin99 wrote: »
    bit of class mate please. they deserved it.
    Are you the manager of United fans here or something?

    Let them be foolish imo.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    watever about johns comment, my comment is not even comparable, and has been agreed with by Utd fans here since i said it!?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,772 ✭✭✭✭Paul Tergat


    CHD wrote: »
    Are you the manager of United fans here or something?

    Let them be foolish imo.

    Obviously not but its pretty embarrasing and reflects badly on my club.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    watever about johns comment, my comment is not even comparable, and has been agreed with by Utd fans here since i said it!?

    Twas a fair point, anyone whos watched United this season would know thay've been mediocre for much of the season. Anytime they've played a half decent team they've struggled.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    nkay1985 wrote: »
    I think both of these comments show about as much class as a united fan coming on here and saying we deserved the win and only lost because of the referee. That's what I'd equate it to.

    No need to be irate dude - just because yiz lost and were completely outplayed - no need to come on here and be bitter about it

    grow a pair of steel ones and take it like a man


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  • Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    Kag.....i know you're here......

    say it........

    Oh I am sir :)

    Very drunk at this moment in time. Going to 92 to fall over while singing about Nando tbh


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    p_larkin99 wrote: »
    Obviously not but its pretty embarrasing and reflects badly on my club.

    I wouldn't worry that much about it lad, you'll give yourself a coroanary if you try and tell off every United fan that acts the twat on here. Thats a fulltime job in itself.:pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,772 ✭✭✭✭Paul Tergat


    flahavaj wrote: »
    I wouldn't worry that much about it lad, you'll give yourself a coroanary if you try and tell off every United fan that acts the twat on here. Thats a fulltime job in itself.:pac:

    Aye I know. Drink will ease the pain though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    Oh I am sir :)

    Very drunk at this moment in time. Going to 92 to fall over while singing about Nando tbh

    and Lucas?????


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,905 ✭✭✭✭Handsome Bob


    flahavaj wrote: »
    United were rubbish, man. Only VDS and Valencia can say that they had good games today, the rest were at best below-par. Berbatov, Carrick, Scholes, Evra and Vidic in particular played as poorly as I've ever seen them play.

    I don't think we're going to agree here. Do you honestly deny that Man U as a unit put immense pressure on Liverpool?

    You said yourself "I don't mean to have a go, but....." Which to me kinda implies you were doing exactly that.

    Exactly, I didn't mean to have a go at him. If I was having a go at him I wouldn't have bothered putting in that line. It was a general beef.
    Tongue in cheek comment given your earlier post in the Superthread about how fickle you are re: Liverpool.

    I know that. For context, I'm a bit self-righteous when it comes to criticising Liverpool. It's hard to explain to be honest. :P


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Honestly, and Id like to hear examples of of the opposite but personally I didnt think Rio and Vidic were terrorised by Torres at all today. I actually thought Torres was a bit flat and the two centre halfs did very well against him?

    Besides the goal obvioulsy, but even then, it was Yossi's ball that gave Torres the advantage over Rio.

    I actually thought Vidic and Rio had decent games all round.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    flahavaj wrote: »
    Twas a fair point, anyone whos watched United this season would know thay've been mediocre for much of the season. Anytime they've played a half decent team they've struggled.

    and have won most games - why?? they have been very lucky up until now

    i fully agree with your point


  • Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    and Lucas?????

    He did well, was just saying on FB to Will.

    Pigs will fly next ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 452 ✭✭Jimmyboss


    jonny24ie wrote: »
    I have to agree with you there. United have been stuttering through the season so far and really need to sort there act out. They are nothing on the united of old that dominated games from start to finish.

    Liverpool deserved their win today. The hassled for the ball all over the pitch.

    Agree with both of the above, Utd's midfield does not inspire confidence,just look at the CF final......they probably have the weakest midfield of the Top 4, it's an indictment on Ferguson that he hasn't dealt adequately with that situation; Giggs and Scholes past their best, Valencia not Manu quality, Carrick needs 20+ yards of free space to do anything, and then mostly passes either sideways or backwards......it's actually surprising that they're challenging for anything this season imho.......


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Jesus P, shut up.

    Trying to be holier than though makes you come across just as bad as the bitter United fans.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,399 ✭✭✭✭Thanx 4 The Fish


    Honestly, and Id like to hear examples of of the opposite but personally I didnt think Rio and Vidic were terrorised by Torres at all today. I actually thought Torres was a bit flat and the two centre halfs did very well against him?

    Besides the goal obvioulsy, but even then, it was Yossi's ball that gave Torres the advantage over Rio.

    I actually thought Vidic and Rio had decent games all round.

    Are you serious, Torres had it all to do even though the ball was a good one. He outpaced Ferdinand, outmuscled him and ultimately undone him.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    john47832 wrote: »
    and have won most games - why?? they have been very lucky up until now

    i fully agree with your point

    Not necessarily lucky though. United can play poorly and beat a lot of the lesser teams comfortably. Having a guy like Rooney in outstanding form helps. Also the team's legendary never say die spirit can carry them through a lot. Saying they're "lucky" is far too simplistic an outlook to have.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,116 ✭✭✭✭RasTa


    john47832 wrote: »
    and have won most games - why?? they have been very lucky up until now

    i fully agree with your point

    So is football is down to luck now or something? How exactly have we being lucky?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,418 ✭✭✭curry-muff


    thegen wrote: »
    Lost me there:rolleyes:

    You tried to defend the decision to not send off carragher by saying it was consistent which was laughable.

    Ive said it before and dont intend to say it again, Liverpool deserved their win, fair play, but it would have been more interesting if the game had a better ref :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    I actually thought Torres was a bit flat and the two centre halfs did very well against him?

    they are quite visibly scared of coming up against him, as in evidence by the way they panic when he is around, hoofing the ball out of play, misplacing passes etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    thought the ref was meh today.

    didnt favour either side though tbh.....Carrra should have gone, but Vidic should have got a straight red. Kuyt should have also had a peno. blew up for a lot of finnicky little fouls over the course of the game against both sides.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    LZ5by5 wrote: »
    I don't think we're going to agree here. Do you honestly deny that Man U as a unit put immense pressure on Liverpool?

    Without going around in circles, I don't think they did. How many clear cut chances did they make apart from Valencia hitting the bar? How many times did they give the ball away needlessly? The game may have been close and nerve wracking for Liverpool fan watching, but the reality is United played well below their capabilities and several players had shockers. To be honest I can't believe thats even being debated.

    Anyhow as you say we're not gonna agree on this, so no point in flogging a dead horse.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Are you serious, Torres had it all to do even though the ball was a good one. He outpaced Ferdinand, outmuscled him and ultimately undone him.

    Yeah, but because of the ball Torres was between it and Rio so it made all those things you listed easier. Im not taking away from Torres, he IS a fantastic player just overall today I didnt think he had a good day.
    Mr Alan wrote: »
    they are quite visibly scared of coming up against him, as in evidence by the way they panic when he is around, hoofing the ball out of play, misplacing passes etc.

    Scared? Thats a bit much. Wary maybe, but any centre half partnership would be given his class.

    By your logic though, Carra was scared of Rooney today. He hoofed the ball away and misplaced passes too.

    I didnt see Torres really get one up on Vidic today at all. Rio, yes with the goal, but not Vida.

    Show me evidence to the contrary and Ill happily admit Im wrong though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,772 ✭✭✭✭Paul Tergat


    Jesus P, shut up.

    Trying to be holier than though makes you come across just as bad as the bitter United fans.

    lol, sure thing lad


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    thought the ref was meh today.

    didnt favour either side though tbh.....Carrra should have gone, but Vidic should have got a straight red. Kuyt should have also had a peno. blew up for a lot of finnicky little fouls over the course of the game against both sides.

    Giggs should have had a peno. Lucas should have been yellowed for persistant fouling.

    Like I keep saying, Liverpool thoroughly deserved their victory but lets at least try and get all the facts out in the open.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    RasTa wrote: »
    So is football is down to luck now or something? How exactly have we being lucky?

    they have got 7 points this season due to referees allowing extra added on time


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,524 ✭✭✭joe123


    Dont care about pity bitter United fans. All I want to say is....this is a great day :D

    Fantastic goal from torres and the pass from benny. Whole team played well. Good times.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,399 ✭✭✭✭Thanx 4 The Fish


    Giggs should have had a peno. Lucas should have been yellowed for persistant fouling.

    Like I keep saying, Liverpool thoroughly deserved their victory but lets at least try and get all the facts out in the open.

    Kuyt deserved a pen then too by your reckonings but I have not seen you mention that yet. Or a yellow for Vidic for fouling a keeper on the kickout, trying to prevent a quick ball. That would have had him off after the next yellow (which would have been his second) and with a lot more time left in the game.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    Giggs should have had a peno. Lucas should have been yellowed for persistant fouling.

    Like I keep saying, Liverpool thoroughly deserved their victory but lets at least try and get all the facts out in the open.

    giggs?
    no he shouldnt

    Lucas was lucky not to get a yellow by the end.


  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 9,648 Mod ✭✭✭✭mayordenis


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    giggs?
    no he shouldnt

    Lucas was lucky not to get a yellow by the end.

    Lucas at times was incredibly unlucky, made some fantastic challenges that were deemed fouls, like definately several good tackles.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    exactly, seems to happen a lot with him denis. think he might have a bit of a rep with refs.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    john47832 wrote: »
    they have got 7 points this season due to referees allowing extra added on time

    Which matches?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Kuyt deserved a pen then too by your reckonings but I have not seen you mention that yet. Or a yellow for Vidic for fouling a keeper on the kickout, trying to prevent a quick ball. That would have had him off after the next yellow (which would have been his second) and with a lot more time left in the game.

    I didnt mention it because it was in Als post already, I was just adding things I thought he missed. Vida, no one gets a yellow for that, ever. Kuyt
    had a reasonable shout but it was 50/50.
    Mr Alan wrote: »
    giggs?
    no he shouldnt

    Lucas was lucky not to get a yellow by the end.

    Agger shouldered Giggs in the back in the penalty box when he was going to collect the ball. Much more clear cut than the Kuyt one to be fair.

    I agree with the Lucas thing, he wasnt maicious or anything but he was persistant.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,312 ✭✭✭✭citytillidie


    I didnt mention it because it was in Als post already, I was just adding things I thought he missed. Vida, no one gets a yellow for that, ever. Kuyt
    had a reasonable shout but it was 50/50.



    Agger shouldered Giggs in the back in the penalty box when he was going to collect the ball. Much more clear cut than the Kuyt one to be fair.

    I agree with the Lucas thing, he wasnt maicious or anything but he was persistant.

    So your saying you would have been happy if it was given if it had of been Vidic on Torres

    ******



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    So your saying you would have been happy if it was given if it had of been Vidic on Torres

    What? Im not following?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,312 ✭✭✭✭citytillidie


    What? Im not following?

    Would you have been happy if a pen was giving to Liverpool for a simalar challenge between Giggs and Agger in the Utd box?

    ******



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Would you have been happy if a pen was giving to Liverpool for a simalar challenge between Giggs and Agger in the Utd box?

    Well yeah, and Im sure you have some vid to show a similar challenge and thats fine.

    All I was doing was adding to Als "the referee was meh" post, when its quite clear the ref was terrible.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,369 ✭✭✭✭SlickRic


    well well well.

    that was a turn up for the books, and i'm both delighted and a smidgen shocked.

    Liverpool outfought and outplayed utd all over the pitch, and it was refreshing to see. utd can have no complaints, and from my brief scouring of this thread so far, i have to say, there have been few.

    again, refreshing to see.

    Lucas needs a special mention. how he remained unbooked is beyond me. honestly. but he was a credit to himself and the club. to get the amount of stick he gets, and to turn up for big game after big game and give performances deserves praise. there are often time he doesn't show up in the not-so-big ones, but today, he was easily the best midfielder on the pitch. he tackled, hassled, passed sensibly (even forwards sometimes!!), and linked with Benayoun and Torres effectively. should have also had a goal.

    how masch or Carra stayed on the field, due to consistent fouling is, again beyond me. both were immense regardless.

    Torres' influence cannot be underestimated, especially in today's game. the amount of fouls he drew, the amount of balls he won in the air, the amount of balls he held up, the fearlessness with which he sought to run at Utd was absolutely central to today. he didn't give them a moment's rest. and his goal oozed quality. the man is a living legend.

    benayoun, once again, was outstanding too. such an awesomely natural footballer. he makes Gerrard not as essential as Torres. that's testament enough.

    n'gog disappeared a bit when he came on, but he took his goal admirably well. he must have been sh*tting himself in anticipation.

    aurelio's importance to the team also shouldn't be lost on anyone. his expertise at the dead ball, and his genuine quality on the ball are invaluable, especially in games like this.

    the ref had a shocker. Vidic's persistent fouling could also have been brought into question. and yes, Torres seems to have managed to put the frighteners into him after last season. unreal how vidic seems so hesitant to back himself anymore, and more and more resorts to fouls. he's better than that.

    fergie must take a lot of the blame for the toothlessness of the Utd performance. i thought, pre-kickoff, that Anderson has to be an automatic start; for his energy if nothing else. i'll be honest, once i saw scholes and carrick was the CM partnership i relaxed a bit. though they can obviously play a bit, i just assumed they'd be hassled out of it, and so it proved.

    Masch and Lucas must take a lot of credit for that too obviously.

    Rooney and Berba showed some neat touches, especially at the end of the first half, but in the second half it just petered out. Carra and Agger had them pocketed, and it was refreshing to see glimpses of their partnership's form of a couple of seasons ago. skrtel may struggle to get back in the team. (don't you dare play the 3 of them Rafa!).

    regarding all the furore about Liverpool, i will say this;

    this result and performance only papers over cracks that were all too obvious before this game, and well documented.

    we need to kick on; because there is still something wrong in terms of how we use the ball (not really seen today), and in terms of back up for Torres. if Torres doesn't play, we simply do not have, as promising as N'Gog has looked, someone who can do what he does. and the way he plays is vital to how we relieve pressure and get at teams.

    Lucas also needs to continuously show the bravery, tenacity, simplicity and incisiveness of today in order to supplement the arrival of Aquilani in the team.

    let's revel in this victory, as it was a welcome result and performance, but let's not let Rafa and the team off the hook long-term yet. there is still a long way to go for me.

    that being said....

    YNWA. :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,312 ✭✭✭✭citytillidie


    Well yeah, and Im sure you have some vid to show a similar challenge and thats fine.

    All I was doing was adding to Als "the referee was meh" post, when its quite clear the ref was terrible.

    I dont have a Video but i go on reactions like would i have been upset if that decison was giving against my team. It would have been a very soft pen and harsh if giving against any team

    ******



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,235 ✭✭✭✭flahavaj


    SlickRic wrote: »
    well well well.

    that was a turn up for the books, and i'm both delighted and a smidgen shocked.

    Liverpool outfought and outplayed utd all over the pitch, and it was refreshing to see. utd can have no complaints, and from my brief scouring of this thread so far, i have to say, there have been few.

    again, refreshing to see.

    Lucas needs a special mention. how he remained unbooked is beyond me. honestly. but he was a credit to himself and the club. to get the amount of stick he gets, and to turn up for big game after big game and give performances deserves praise. there are often time he doesn't show up in the not-so-big ones, but today, he was easily the best midfielder on the pitch. he tackled, hassled, passed sensibly (even forwards sometimes!!), and linked with Benayoun and Torres effectively. should have also had a goal.

    how masch or Carra stayed on the field, due to consistent fouling is, again beyond me. both were immense regardless.

    Torres' influence cannot be underestimated, especially in today's game. the amount of fouls he drew, the amount of balls he won in the air, the amount of balls he held up, the fearlessness with which he sought to run at Utd was absolutely central to today. he didn't give them a moment's rest. and his goal oozed quality. the man is a living legend.

    benayoun, once again, was outstanding too. such an awesomely natural footballer. he makes Gerrard not as essential as Torres. that's testament enough.

    n'gog disappeared a bit when he came on, but he took his goal admirably well. he must have been sh*tting himself in anticipation.

    aurelio's importance to the team also shouldn't be lost on anyone. his expertise at the dead ball, and his genuine quality on the ball are invaluable, especially in games like this.

    the ref had a shocker. Vidic's persistent fouling could also have been brought into question. and yes, Torres seems to have managed to put the frighteners into him after last season. unreal how vidic seems so hesitant to back himself anymore, and more and more resorts to fouls. he's better than that.

    fergie must take a lot of the blame for the toothlessness of the Utd performance. i thought, pre-kickoff, that Anderson has to be an automatic start; for his energy if nothing else. i'll be honest, once i saw scholes and carrick was the CM partnership i relaxed a bit. though they can obviously play a bit, i just assumed they'd be hassled out of it, and so it proved.

    Masch and Lucas must take a lot of credit for that too obviously.

    Rooney and Berba showed some neat touches, especially at the end of the first half, but in the second half it just petered out. Carra and Agger had them pocketed, and it was refreshing to see glimpses of their partnership's form of a couple of seasons ago. skrtel may struggle to get back in the team. (don't you dare play the 3 of them Rafa!).

    regarding all the furore about Liverpool, i will say this;

    this result and performance only papers over cracks that were all too obvious before this game, and well documented.

    we need to kick on; because there is still something wrong in terms of how we use the ball (not really seen today), and in terms of back up for Torres. if Torres doesn't play, we simply do not have, as promising as N'Gog has looked, someone who can do what he does. and the way he plays is vital to how we relieve pressure and get at teams.

    Lucas also needs to continuously show the bravery, tenacity, simplicity and incisiveness of today in order to supplement the arrival of Aquilani in the team.

    let's revel in this victory, as it was a welcome result and performance, but let's not let Rafa and the team off the hook long-term yet. there is still a long way to go for me.

    that being said....

    YNWA. :D

    I did tell you.:).............:(


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    I dont have a Video but i go on reactions like would i have been upset if that decison was giving against my team. It would have been a very soft pen and harsh if giving against any team

    Yeah but what you think is irrelevant. He shouldered Giggs in the back, in the penalty box. Penalty. Ref didnt give it for whatever reason, and I accept that.

    Kuyts, like Im sure you will argue, could have been given too, but it was much less of a pen that Giggs, both of them were grappling.

    Anyway, all I was trying to do was show that the ref wasnt just "meh", he was pretty attrocious (not that it would have mattered a whole lot anyway).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,369 ✭✭✭✭SlickRic


    flahavaj wrote: »
    I did tell you.:).............:(

    ha ha, you did man.

    when your team's been playing like ours had been i was never going to believe you too quick though ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 690 ✭✭✭givyjoe81


    No, we're champions until May, I'll forgive you though because it has been twenty odd years since Liverpool won it so you might have forgotten that.;)

    Oh boo hoo.. Actually what i meant was, shadow of the team you were last season, a la no tevez or ronaldo. Incidentally so are we. But we shall see come may, which i would wager neither side will be anywhere near the title.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 88,972 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Soccer Sunday is on now (RTE2) then MOTD2 is on at 10pm, BBC2
    Two hours of quality tv.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,910 ✭✭✭✭whatawaster


    mike65 wrote: »
    Soccer Sunday is on now (RTE2) then MOTD2 is on at 10pm, BBC2
    Two hours of quality tv.

    and Ronnie's on!


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