GAA Draw 2010 LIVE on RTE 2 8:25pm Tonight

patmac

The disparages again in provincial football.
Limerick only have to beat a Division 4 side Clare or Waterford to reach a Provincial Final. Ditto Roscommon only London and Leitrim. Whereas Armagh will have to beat 2 Division one sides just to make a semi-final.
Still wouldn't scrap the provincial championships just maybe balance them up a bit move say Westmeath and Donegal to Connacht, Wexford to Munster. It's been done in hurling so why not football?

Deise Tom

soccymonster wrote: »

high contenders, not yet imo.
But they definetly have a chance of beating waterford.

In Munster, everyone has a chance of beating everyone else. Thats what makes Munster hurling so special.

dartbhoy

Some Waterford fans seem to think it's only a formality that they'll beat Clare but they seem to have short memories,it's only 18 months ago that Clare beat them by 9 points in the Munster championship and they were the closest team to Tipp in this year's championship.

Mossy Monk

Orizio wrote: »

Who will Tipp be playing in the Munster semi then Mossy?

Beat Cork and they play Limerick.

Mossy Monk

dartbhoy wrote: »

Some Waterford fans seem to think it's only a formality that they'll beat Clare but they seem to have short memories,it's only 18 months ago that Clare beat them by 9 points in the Munster championship and they were the closest team to Tipp in this year's championship.

Not his again. One or two people are saying walkover so you should be saying very few Waterford fans.

suitcasepink

dartbhoy wrote: »

Some Waterford fans seem to think it's only a formality that they'll beat Clare but they seem to have short memories,it's only 18 months ago that Clare beat them by 9 points in the Munster championship and they were the closest team to Tipp in this year's championship.

But some posters seem to forget how we were missing around 5 of our usual starters and also going through a rough patch. Alot has changed since then, for better or worse.

But I agree anything could happen. Maybe it will be a Clare, Limerick final.:pac:

soccymonster

deise_girl wrote: »

But I agree anything could happen. Maybe it will be a Clare, Limerick final.:pac:

Is that pac smiley suppose to indicate laughing, ms deise? .
and yes, that could likely happen.. . *fingers crossed*

Deise Tom

dartbhoy wrote: »

Some Waterford fans seem to think it's only a formality that they'll beat Clare but they seem to have short memories,it's only 18 months ago that Clare beat them by 9 points in the Munster championship and they were the closest team to Tipp in this year's championship.

No true Waterford G.A.A. fan will know that Clare or any other team in Munster is a formality.

Deise Tom

deise_girl wrote: »

But some posters seem to forget how we were missing around 5 of our usual starters and also going through a rough patch. Alot has changed since then, for better or worse.

:pac:

True, Very true

suitcasepink

soccymonster wrote: »

Is that pac smiley suppose to indicate laughing, ms deise? .
and yes, that could likely happen.. . *fingers crossed*

Wher'd this ms business come out of at all?? :P
Anyhow ms Soccy I s'pose, I mean I really don't think it will happen but as I was saying to you before weirder things have happend in the gaa!

sparkydee

soccymonster wrote: »

Is that pac smiley suppose to indicate laughing, ms deise? .
and yes, that could likely happen.. . *fingers crossed*

But very unlikely. You can't write off tipp, cork and waterford...but it is a distant possibility:)

dartbhoy

Deise Tom wrote: »

No true Waterford G.A.A. fan will know that Clare or any other team in Munster is a formality.

I work with Waterford lads and most of them reckon it'll be a close call but 2 of them were blowing about a handy run to the final! I know full damn well true Waterford GAA fans will not take Clare as a formality. The future of both teams looks bright,the Munster U 21 hurling final this year was 1 of the best games of the year with some great individual displays on both sides.

rossie1977

patmac wrote: »

The disparages again in provincial football.
Limerick only have to beat a Division 4 side Clare or Waterford to reach a Provincial Final. Ditto Roscommon only London and Leitrim. Whereas Armagh will have to beat 2 Division one sides just to make a semi-final.

disparages??

wait a second, sligo a division 4 team last year went down to kerry and were seconds away from knocking them out of this years championship and kerry wiped the floor with the division one teams they faced

the league doesn't mean jack, you cannot take matches on face value, armagh were knocked out by wexford two years ago.......

grenache

jordainius wrote: »

What a ridiculous post....

By your logic only Kilkenny, Cork and Tipperary fans should bother turning up. And only about 5 or 6 football counties should bother turning up.

Pretty much. I was like yourself up to last year. Then i realised what had been blatantly apparent since the mid 90s, we simply do not have the quality needed to pose a major challenge. The county board has failed miserably to develop the most basic skills in our hurlers such as striking, fielding and finding a man in space.

This panel of players reached the 2007 All-Ireland final purely on merit.

And have reverted back to true form since...

And in that final, Limerick were caught napping in the first 10 minutes. But after that they acquitted themselves quite well. From the 10th minute, Limerick scored 1-15, and Kilkenny scored 0-17. In the second half of that match Ollie Moran scored a goal which brought Limerick within touching distance. O'Shaughnessy had two glorious goal chances after that, and had one of those gone in there would only have been 2 odd points in it at the time. In which case, anything could have happened. (For the record, I believe think Kilkenny would have probably still won)

If the goals had not gone past Murray in the opening 10 mins they would have done so at some stage of the game. The second half was only like a training match for KK. You're deluding yourself if you think Limerick could ever have won that match

The players are there. Problem is there aren't many natural scoring forwards, but that has always been an issue for Limerick. But there is still plenty there to work with.

If the players are there, why have Limerick 1 All Ireland in 70 years? Outside of an aging Mark Foley, Brian Geary & erratic Niall Moran, what genuinely talented players do we have? And please dont mention Andrew O' Shaughnessy!

Unfortunately some of our fans have unrealistic expectations of Limerick hurling.

You seem to be one of them.

Browney7

Delighted with the draw from a Limerick Perspective.

Beat Clare/Waterford in the football and we have a home Munster final to try and avenge the last few years of heartbreak.

As for the hurling, I like Grenache say every year I won't bother wasting my time with them but I inevitably do. It's the worst Limerick team for years but if they are any sort of hurlers they will want to do themselves justice after the hiding they got in Croker in August. Don't forget they were well in that game for the first 10 minutes until the Croom contingent of Lucey and Riordan gave Tipp 3 goals for free. We do however need 5 new scoring forwards which are an endangered species in the county.

grenache

Browney7 wrote: »

Delighted with the draw from a Limerick Perspective.

Beat Clare/Waterford in the football and we have a home Munster final to try and avenge the last few years of heartbreak.

As for the hurling, I like Grenache say every year I won't bother wasting my time with them but I inevitably do. It's the worst Limerick team for years but if they are any sort of hurlers they will want to do themselves justice after the hiding they got in Croker in August. Don't forget they were well in that game for the first 10 minutes until the Croom contingent of Lucey and Riordan gave Tipp 3 goals for free. We do however need 5 new scoring forwards which are an endangered species in the county.

Nice little dig there Browney An Adare or Bruff man i'm guessing?!

Deise Tom

dartbhoy wrote: »

I work with Waterford lads and most of them reckon it'll be a close call but 2 of them were blowing about a handy run to the final! I know full damn well true Waterford GAA fans will not take Clare as a formality. The future of both teams looks bright,the Munster U 21 hurling final this year was 1 of the best games of the year with some great individual displays on both sides.

I hope fans of both teams do not expect success to come their way because they had good under 21/minor teams in 2009. There is a big step up to senior level, and because you have success at underage level, it does not mean it will carry forward to senior. Just ask Limerick. Both counties still have a lot more work to do.

Deise Tom

grenache wrote: »

The county board has failed miserably to develop the most basic skills in our hurlers such as striking, fielding and finding a man in space.

I think a lot of counties are failing in their duties. We have all these coaching officers etc but alot of them right throughout the country are a joke. There is all these manuals coming out of Croke Park and forms with them in which you tick a few boxes. The manual is read and the boxes are ticked and some think everything is done. The basic skills of hurling and football are not taught and until they are, we are going no place.

Deise Tom

Browney7 wrote: »

Delighted with the draw from a Limerick Perspective.

Beat Clare/Waterford in the football and we have a home Munster final to try and avenge the last few years of heartbreak.

As for the hurling, I like Grenache say every year I won't bother wasting my time with them but I inevitably do. It's the worst Limerick team for years but if they are any sort of hurlers they will want to do themselves justice after the hiding they got in Croker in August. Don't forget they were well in that game for the first 10 minutes until the Croom contingent of Lucey and Riordan gave Tipp 3 goals for free. We do however need 5 new scoring forwards which are an endangered species in the county.

Do some in Limerick think beating Clare and Waterford in football is just a formality.

Browney7

grenache wrote: »

Nice little dig there Browney An Adare or Bruff man i'm guessing?!

You might have to guess again there Grenache. Sandwiched in between Patrickswell and Croom and you get your answer.

As for Clare/Waterford a formality DeiseTom, Limerick hammer no-one and get hammered by no-one as evidence by our performance against Clare down in Ennis this year. We struggled down there make no mistake but we never looked like losing. Havn't seen Waterford play so I can't comment on them but if we can't have some bit of confidence about beating them we have no business playing football really.

grenache

Browney7 wrote: »

You might have to guess again there Grenache. Sandwiched in between Patrickswell and Croom and you get your answer.

As for Clare/Waterford a formality DeiseTom, Limerick hammer no-one and get hammered by no-one as evidence by our performance against Clare down in Ennis this year. We struggled down there make no mistake but we never looked like losing. Havn't seen Waterford play so I can't comment on them but if we can't have some bit of confidence about beating them we have no business playing football really.

Agreed on that. Although i do think Clare/Waterford is a potential banana skin. Neither team can be taken lightly. That said, although we only played proper football for maybe ten mins against Clare in Ennis last June, we never really looked like losing the match. Clare did boss that game at midfield for a good period of the first half. Scoring forwards is their problem. Waterford certainly gave Cork plenty of headaches in the first half of this summers championship game in Fraher Field. It took a strong second half performance from Cork to see them off and even then the scoreline was a little flattering to them in the end, given how Waterford had competed in general play. So Limerick wont be taking either team for granted. I'm certainly not looking past the semi final, and i hope the players aren't either.

Hammer Archer

Not a bad draw for Meath but a lot can happen in the 8 months or so til we start.
We haven't been in a Leinster Final since we won it in 2001 and we haven't even been past the quarter final stage since Laois hockeyed us in 2004 Leinster semi final.
We should be aiming to win Leinster in all fairness. Getting to the AI semi finals twice in 3 years was great but we need to win some silverware. The only victories we've had recently were 2 O' Byrne Cups and a Division 2 league title.

jordainius

grenache wrote: »

Pretty much. I was like yourself up to last year. Then i realised what had been blatantly apparent since the mid 90s, we simply do not have the quality needed to pose a major challenge. The county board has failed miserably to develop the most basic skills in our hurlers such as striking, fielding and finding a man in space.

You were never like me. You obviously go to games expecting them to deliver every time. I go because I love hurling and want to offer my support.

And have reverted back to true form since...

Its just not that simple. They are not as bad as they have seemed. The 2008 Clare game was as a result of freak weather and some bad tactical decisions. Also, the management made other mistakes such as taking the Clare game for granted, too often they spoke of the Munster final before they had even started the semi final.

In the Clare game, after winning the toss, they elected to play against the wind. Mistake. They also brought Donnacha Sheehan back as a 3rd midfielder. Bigger mistake, he's the smallest man on the panel and not a midfielder in a million years.

They lost the run of themselves after 2007, and were brought back down to earth in 2008. Bennis out, McCarthy in. Which meant that this year was only ever going to be a year of transition. To expect success this year was unrealistic.

There is more to what happened in the Tipp match this year than meets the eye. The tactics deployed on the day (most notably the use of Brian Geary) was not a management decision. There was a players meeting in Killarney the week before the match where certain players took a few decisions into their own hands.

I want Justin to stay on, but he needs to start laying down the law about stuff like that.

If the goals had not gone past Murray in the opening 10 mins they would have done so at some stage of the game. The second half was only like a training match for KK. You're deluding yourself if you think Limerick could ever have won that match

You're deluding yourself if you thought they couldn't possibly have won that match. There is always a chance. Read over my post again. What I said still stands. It took them too long to get up to speed in that game. Three quarters of the fans that day were Limerick fans, and the roar they got when they ran out on to the pitch was massive. Some of the younger players have said that it got to them. It was obvious from the warm up that some of the players let it get to them, a lot of mis/hit passes and so on.

They froze, and by the time they got going, they were 8 or 9 points down. There wasn't a lot in it for the rest of that match, Kilkenny always seemed to respond well to Limerick's scores, but as we have seen in the last few years, Kilkenny don't rest up and take it easy on teams once they get ahead. If Limerick were that bad they would have lost by about 20 points, but they didn't. They lost by 7.

And as you know I said that I still believe Kilkenny had won. But Limerick did have 2 great goal chances in that second half. Thats a fact. And its also a fact that had either of them gone in it would have brought Limerick back into it. Goals change games whether you like to admit it or not.

If the players are there, why have Limerick 1 All Ireland in 70 years? Outside of an aging Mark Foley, Brian Geary & erratic Niall Moran, what genuinely talented players do we have? And please dont mention Andrew O' Shaughnessy!

6 National hurling leagues and 7 Munster titles in those years too. Have you heard of the counties Cork, Tipperary and Kilkenny? It just so happens that they have always had more hurlers than us, and as such they have won the vast majority of silverware going in the history of hurling. It took you a very long time to figure out that Limerick aren't a regular winner of silverware. You may judge us by the standards of what we acheived in the 1930's but I know better.

As for players; Damien Reale, top class corner back. Lucey can be a good full back, apart from the Tipp game this year he did well. Seamus Hickey would get his place on any team in the country, classy hurler comfortable in possession, still young. Donal O'Grady, one of the country's better midfielders. Gavin O'Mahony, could become a vital part of the team as a freetaker. Showed his capabilities against Dublin. Brian Geary, strong as an ox, holds the middle well. James Ryan works hard, showed potential this year. Paudie McNamara and David Breen showed potential. Andrew O'Shaughnessy is a confidence player, sadly he is lacking it right now. Probably due to fans who take every opportunity to criticise him, like yourself.

I don't like Brian Murray but bad players don't win All-Stars. Paul Browne is still only 19/20, he is a good player. Niall Moran needs to show more consistency, but he's not a bad hurler at all. Graham Mulcahy isn't 20 yet, Bryan O'Sullivan actually managed to put in a good performance once he came on against Tipp. Other players not on the panel this year include Conor Fitzgerald who has had awful luck with injury in recent years but always gets a few scores when he played with Limerick. Kevin Ryan and young Downes had good years for Na Piarsaigh. Doon have a young corner forward (Ryan) who could be given a chance on the panel. I could go on and on by naming various players I watched in club games this year.

Whether you like it or not there is potential there to work with. Unlike you I thinkthey should be given a chance rather than they be dismissed because we've had 2 bad years.

Also, every Limerick fan would have accepted reaching an All-Ireland semi final at the start of the year if it was offered to them. The semi was a disaster, but at least we got there.

You seem to be one of them.

Wait, let me get this straight, you're trying to say I'm the one with the unrealistic expectations?? Well if I'm still supporting them and you're saying you'll never waste your money to go see them again, then I'm afraid you are the one with the unrealistic expectations because they quite obviously haven't fullfilled your expectations whereas they generally seem to do as I expect.... So it would seem that my expectations are quite realistic...

Please by all means stay away from all future Limerick games, you will not be missed. And the next time we get to a major final, be that a Munster or All-Ireland, please don't go as you will be denying a genuine fan the opportunity to support our county.

And I don't care if we never win any All-Ireland in my lifetime, those guys spend hundreds of hours each year training, doing laps, doing weights, sticking to diets, spending time away from their families and taking time off work and a whole world of sacrifices, they do this so they can represent my county at a sport I love. For that they will always have my support. So I'll continue following them thank you very much.

jordainius

Deise Tom wrote: »

Do some in Limerick think beating Clare and Waterford in football is just a formality.

Sadly yes, some idiots do! But then there are those of us who feel that Clare and Waterford will be delighted to be in the side of the draw which doesn't contain Kerry and Cork!

grenache

jordainius wrote: »

You were never like me. You obviously go to games expecting them to deliver every time. I go because I love hurling and want to offer my support.

Not including silly qualifier games against Antrim, Laois, Kerry and Offaly, Limerick won 6 championship games this decade. How could i expect them to win every time?! What i do expect is a minimum standard of hurling, which has been seen only one summer in the last 13 years. Supporters deserve better, especially as we see ourselves as primarily a hurling county.

jordainius wrote: »

Its just not that simple. They are not as bad as they have seemed. The 2008 Clare game was as a result of freak weather and some bad tactical decisions. Also, the management made other mistakes such as taking the Clare game for granted, too often they spoke of the Munster final before they had even started the semi final.

In the Clare game, after winning the toss, they elected to play against the wind. Mistake. They also brought Donnacha Sheehan back as a 3rd midfielder. Bigger mistake, he's the smallest man on the panel and not a midfielder in a million years..

I'll agree with you on Sheehan, I couldn't remember him touching the ball once in that game. Pat Laffan had a field day at corner back for Clare, clearing ball after ball. But you can't go blaming the weather!! Its the same for both teams.

There is more to what happened in the Tipp match this year than meets the eye. The tactics deployed on the day (most notably the use of Brian Geary) was not a management decision. There was a players meeting in Killarney the week before the match where certain players took a few decisions into their own hands.

Even if Limerick had the right tactics, Tipp still would have trounced us. Mainly due to shocking individual mistakes i.e. Stephen Lucey for first Tipp goal.

You're deluding yourself if you thought they couldn't possibly have won that match. There is always a chance. Read over my post again. What I said still stands. It took them too long to get up to speed in that game. Three quarters of the fans that day were Limerick fans, and the roar they got when they ran out on to the pitch was massive. Some of the younger players have said that it got to them. It was obvious from the warm up that some of the players let it get to them, a lot of mis/hit passes and so on.

They froze, and by the time they got going, they were 8 or 9 points down. There wasn't a lot in it for the rest of that match, Kilkenny always seemed to respond well to Limerick's scores, but as we have seen in the last few years, Kilkenny don't rest up and take it easy on teams once they get ahead. If Limerick were that bad they would have lost by about 20 points, but they didn't. They lost by 7.

And as you know I said that I still believe Kilkenny had won. But Limerick did have 2 great goal chances in that second half. Thats a fact. And its also a fact that had either of them gone in it would have brought Limerick back into it. Goals change games whether you like to admit it or not.

So bascially the gist of what you're saying is that Limerick were good enough to beat Kilkenny?? :pac:

6 National hurling leagues and 7 Munster titles in those years too. Have you heard of the counties Cork, Tipperary and Kilkenny? It just so happens that they have always had more hurlers than us, and as such they have won the vast majority of silverware going in the history of hurling. It took you a very long time to figure out that Limerick aren't a regular winner of silverware. You may judge us by the standards of what we acheived in the 1930's but I know better.

You know better, of course you do. Who said i was judging us by 1930s standards? What i would like to see is just a smidgen of skill and talent from Limerick hurlers, instead of the usual, hit and hope mentality that currently prevails. Offaly have far less hurlers than us, they've won 4 All Irelands and numerous Leinsters in the last 28 years.

As for players; Damien Reale, top class corner back. Lucey can be a good full back, apart from the Tipp game this year he did well.

Damien Reale might be fast, but top class he is certainly not! Limerick fans seem to put him up on a pedistall, he's been destroyed every time he played Tipp, from Seamus Butler and Lar Corbett in 07 to Noel McGrath this year. And Lucey, jesus, coming out with the ball and head down, charging like a hereford bull out a gate. He's as much a liability as anything. Remember the Clare match last year, when these two clowns ran into each other for the Clare Goal? Pretty much sums up the both of them, Laurel and fcking Hardy!

Seamus Hickey would get his place on any team in the country, classy hurler comfortable in possession, still young. Donal O'Grady, one of the country's better midfielders. Gavin O'Mahony, could become a vital part of the team as a freetaker. Showed his capabilities against Dublin. Brian Geary, strong as an ox, holds the middle well. James Ryan works hard, showed potential this year. Paudie McNamara and David Breen showed potential. Andrew O'Shaughnessy is a confidence player, sadly he is lacking it right now. Probably due to fans who take every opportunity to criticise him, like yourself.

I don't like Brian Murray but bad players don't win All-Stars. Paul Browne is still only 19/20, he is a good player. Niall Moran needs to show more consistency, but he's not a bad hurler at all. Graham Mulcahy isn't 20 yet, Bryan O'Sullivan actually managed to put in a good performance once he came on against Tipp. Other players not on the panel this year include Conor Fitzgerald who has had awful luck with injury in recent years but always gets a few scores when he played with Limerick. Kevin Ryan and young Downes had good years for Na Piarsaigh. Doon have a young corner forward (Ryan) who could be given a chance on the panel. I could go on and on by naming various players I watched in club games this year.

I'll agree with you on Hickey and O'Mahony, probably the only good players we have coming up, along with James Ryan and Bryan O'Sullivan. The latter is prone to injury a lot though which isn't much good to anyone! Dodge falls asleep for one half of every match. Dave Breen needed 4 chances to score 1 point against Laois, and couldn't even muster one point in the county final. Tells you everything you need to know. Paudie Mac had two good games, against Wexford (who are a fading force like Limerick) and an inexperienced Dublin side. When it mattered the most against Tipp, he didn't touch the ball once, Maher didn't give him even a sniff. Don't get me started on Shaughnessy!! He's been rubbish for Kilmallock all year and ditto last year, 2007 was the only year he actually hurled at senior county level. I would not recognise him as the same player i saw winning u-21 after u-21 for Kilmallock. And don't start blaming ''message board people'' like me for his demise, he's responsible for that, and no one else! Ryan and Downes couldn't do it in the club final either, what hope for them against Tipp or Cork! Infact, seeing the likes of Bruree, Garryspillane and Na Piarsaigh get to county finals in the last few years , wi the former two winning them, says a lot about how weak club hurling in Limerick is. Only Adare buck the trend. The rest are fairly pathetic. Looking good in a Limerick club semi final is one thing, going out and playing Munster Championship hurling is something completely different!

Whether you like it or not there is potential there to work with. Unlike you I thinkthey should be given a chance rather than they be dismissed because we've had 2 bad years.

No, there is potential in Clare, and Waterford and Dublin. There is scraps from the table in Limerick. Just the 2 bad years? If you do your sums i think you'll find it a bit more than 2

Also, every Limerick fan would have accepted reaching an All-Ireland semi final at the start of the year if it was offered to them. The semi was a disaster, but at least we got there.

By beating Laois and Dublin. Whop-ee-dooo, lets crack open the champagne! Oh wait, we were beaten by 24 points in the semi. Not much point in getting there if you're only going to be embarrassed is there?

Wait, let me get this straight, you're trying to say I'm the one with the unrealistic expectations?? Well if I'm still supporting them and you're saying you'll never waste your money to go see them again, then I'm afraid you are the one with the unrealistic expectations because they quite obviously haven't fullfilled your expectations whereas they generally seem to do as I expect.... So it would seem that my expectations are quite realistic...

Expecting to win a match is unrealistic, well forgive me father matthew!

Please by all means stay away from all future Limerick games, you will not be missed. And the next time we get to a major final, be that a Munster or All-Ireland, please don't go as you will be denying a genuine fan the opportunity to support our county

You'll be waiting a good while for that to happen. Unless Cork and Tipp decide to go on strike, and you never know with those Cork boys

And I don't care if we never win any All-Ireland in my lifetime, those guys spend hundreds of hours each year training, doing laps, doing weights, sticking to diets, spending time away from their families and taking time off work and a whole world of sacrifices, they do this so they can represent my county at a sport I love. For that they will always have my support. So I'll continue following them thank you very much.

You're a sucker for punishment!

jordainius

Ah feck it! I'm not going to go mad quoting with this reply because we're only going to end up going around in circles.

Regarding the Kilkenny match, we could have won it. Definitely. The better team doesn't always win, I'm guessing you are from Adare? (From your "Location"?) Well Adare have pulled a few games out of the bag in the last 2 years that they were most definitely not the better team in. (Western Gaels last year, Murroe-Boher this year).

I think that either way Kilkenny would have had enough, but Limerick could still have won it all the same. We all know what happened in the 1994 final, better team for 65 minutes, and then Offaly hit one hell of a purple patch.

At the Clare game it was Lucey and O'Dwyer who ran into each other! That was a freak game, Limerick played the better hurling but they made some suicidal errors. One of Pat Vaughans clearances (the man who was left loose in their defence) made it all the way into the net.

Look it, this has not been a good decade for Limerick hurling. I'm not denying that, but there are a lot of reasons why this has been so! I'm sure you know them all too well yourself. Things haven't been done in the right way. Players who have been a bad influence have been tolerated, the under 21's 3 in a row team was filled with individuals who came in to the senior team feeling they had nothing to prove.

We don't have the best 30 players in the country, we very rarely have and we very rarely will. But we do have a decent pool of players to work with. We have 3 or 4 players who would get on any team in the country and we have plenty other players to work with. Calling them pathetic is harsh and unfair in all fairness!! A lot of them are young and can be worked with and could become important players. At the same time a lot of players wont fulfill their potential but giving up on them completely will get us nowhere!

You have some harsh things to say about some of the players but be fair on them! No player goes out with the intention of playing bad and if they are the best we have then so long as they give 100% I won't complain about them.

If a player doenn't give 100% then thats a completely different matter, criticise all you want! I can forgive a player for having limited ability as long as he tries his hardest.

At the start of the week a lot of players were cut from the panel. O'Shaughnessy, Niall Moran and Stephen Lucey, Donie Ryan and a few others. I won't go in to the exact reasons for all but some were seen as a bad influence, some were dropped because they were "moaning" all the time, and one individual, a person on the bench against Tipp took off his boots at half time and said "There's no way I'm going out there". He has been shown the door.

Things will be different next year. The management have taken action against indiscipline and want to have 30 players pulling together next year. We may not win anything next year but this is a step in the right direction.

Look it, you are disillusioned with it all and I can see where you are coming from.

But as we both can see very clearly I don't exactly agree with you. I don't exactly live and die by my "faith" in the team but I enjoy following the team. It brings more bad days than good but the joy a good day brings makes it worth it for me, even if they have been rare this decade.

But I love the game and I am passionate about it which is why I launched to Limerick's defence and started this little war with you! But I think we both get each other's views at this stage so I think we should round this up sooner than later because it will only go around in circles.

Apologies for the odd rash statement I made against you in previous posts!

Browney7

I'm staring to think this board needs a Limerick Hurling/Football discussion thread. God knows there's plenty to talk about in fairness.

panda100

Im pleased with Limerick football draw as it does seem pretty likely we'll get a home Munster final.
Have to admit Im not that optimistic though. Mickey Neds still at the helm, which means same training and tactics which got us in to Division 4 last year. I cant see this being a good year for Limerick football.

Deise Tom

panda100 wrote: »

Im pleased with Limerick football draw as it does seem pretty likely we'll get a home Munster final.
Have to admit Im not that optimistic though. Mickey Neds still at the helm, which means same training and tactics which got us in to Division 4 last year. I cant see this being a good year for Limerick football.

Same tatics and training also that got you to a Munster Final and nearly beat what people were calling the best Cork team in a good few years.

panda100

Deise Tom wrote: »

Same tatics and training also that got you to a Munster Final and nearly beat what people were calling the best Cork team in a good few years.

Nearly beat being the operative words. We 'nearly beat' every team wether its Cork in Pair ui Chaoimh or Meath in Portlaoise.
I don't know wether Mickey Ned has what it takes to make the Limerick footballers an actual winning team,I hope Im proved wrong though.

premierstone

panda100 wrote: »

Nearly beat being the operative words. We 'nearly beat' every team wether its Cork in Pair ui Chaoimh or Meath in Portlaoise.
I don't know wether Mickey Ned has what it takes to make the Limerick footballers an actual winning team,I hope Im proved wrong though.

You either have a very deluded opinion of where Limerick stand in the foootball world or you simply have a dislike for Mickey Ned, because on the face of it looking in from the outside Limerick football is boxing well above its weight at the moment and Mickey Ned is the key to this.

Deise Tom

panda100 wrote: »

Nearly beat being the operative words. We 'nearly beat' every team wether its Cork in Pair ui Chaoimh or Meath in Portlaoise.
I don't know wether Mickey Ned has what it takes to make the Limerick footballers an actual winning team,I hope Im proved wrong though.

Maybe Limerick might be getting beaten in some of the bigger games to play, but they are alot closer to the bigger teams than alot of other teams, who would love to run the bigger teams closer than they do.

Deise Tom

premierstone wrote: »

You either have a very deluded opinion of where Limerick stand in the foootball world or you simply have a dislike for Mickey Ned, because on the face of it looking in from the outside Limerick football is boxing well above its weight at the moment and Mickey Ned is the key to this.

I second that, and i know that Limerick also have some very good footballers coming through. I have seen them a few times in recent years in the Jim Power under 14 tournament and Limerick have players that are as good as what Cork and Kerry have. If these players can come on another big then Limerick have a bright future. They might not win an All-Ireland but only one team can do this each year, and people should be happy if the team is progressing, no matter who is over it.

The_Kew_Tour

Limerick if they get there mindset in the positive frame of mind I dont think there is any reason why they cant get to 1/4 finals and place in Croke Park next year.

They have decent draw should get to Munster Final and I think maybe this time they might catch one of the two big guns in Munster.

Orizio

premierstone wrote: »

You either have a very deluded opinion of where Limerick stand in the foootball world or you simply have a dislike for Mickey Ned, because on the face of it looking in from the outside Limerick football is boxing well above its weight at the moment and Mickey Ned is the key to this.

Lets not discount the possibility that you're wrong now PS.

premierstone

Orizio wrote: »

Lets not discount the possibility that you're wrong now PS.

Now your just been silly

Deise Tom

adrian280582 wrote: »

Limerick if they get there mindset in the positive frame of mind I dont think there is any reason why they cant get to 1/4 finals and place in Croke Park next year.

They have decent draw should get to Munster Final and I think maybe this time they might catch one of the two big guns in Munster.

The same would apply to Clare and Waterford. A little more difficult for Tipperary.

grenache

jordainius wrote: »

I'm guessing you are from Adare? (From your "Location"?) Well Adare have pulled a few games out of the bag in the last 2 years that they were most definitely not the better team in. (Western Gaels last year, Murroe-Boher this year).

You'd guess wrong then. If i was from Adare, my location would be just 'Adare'. If you know your geography you'll know where i'm from. And yes Adare have been lucky in recent times, especially against Murroe. But it says a lot about a team when they can play badly in a semi and still hit 15 scores, and keep their best performance of the year for the final. Three years in a row, they have played their best hurling in the final.

At the Clare game it was Lucey and O'Dwyer who ran into each other! That was a freak game, Limerick played the better hurling but they made some suicidal errors. One of Pat Vaughans clearances (the man who was left loose in their defence) made it all the way into the net.

Nearly 100% sure it was Reale and Lucey who ran into each other, but i'll double check that on the dvd tonight. Yes it Pat Vaughan and not Pat Laffan that i ment.

The_Kew_Tour

Deise Tom wrote: »

The same would apply to Clare and Waterford. A little more difficult for Tipperary.

Well as they say there no sure thing but i would be shocked if Clare or Waterford get even close to Limerick.

panda100

premierstone wrote: »

You either have a very deluded opinion of where Limerick stand in the foootball world or you simply have a dislike for Mickey Ned, because on the face of it looking in from the outside Limerick football is boxing well above its weight at the moment and Mickey Ned is the key to this.

I actually like Mickey Ned a lot,hes a lovely man but im not going to overstate his impact on the Limerick football team. We were a decent team well before Mickey Ned came on the team.
Back in 2003 we were undoubtly the second best team in Munster, we reached a NFL division 2 final, and in 2004 we held Kerry to a draw in the Munster final.
Believe me I am no big fan of Liam Kearns as he kept my brother on the bench for years but I can see that he built the squad we have today.


I think on this track record we are not boxing above our weight, we fully deserve to be one of the top football teams in Munster. We have some top quality players but we have to start winning matches, something which Mickey Ned hasn't done much of.

premierstone

panda100 wrote: »

I actually like Mickey Ned a lot,hes a lovely man but im not going to overstate his impact on the Limerick football team. We were a decent team well before Mickey Ned came on the team.
Back in 2003 we were undoubtly the second best team in Munster, we reached a NFL division 2 final, and in 2004 we held Kerry to a draw in the Munster final.
Believe me I am no big fan of Liam Kearns as he kept my brother on the bench for years but I can see that he built the squad we have today.


I think on this track record we are not boxing above our weight, we fully deserve to be one of the top football teams in Munster. We have some top quality players but we have to start winning matches, something which Mickey Ned hasn't done much of.

Yes you are one of the top teams in munster, the top three, and if a season where you beat Tipp(a Div.2 team) and Clare and run the all ireland finalists to a point and the semi-finalists to a point and were very unlucky in both defeats is a reason to call for a change of management then your a hard supporter to please

And without trying to belittle what Laim Kearns achieved Cork football was a mess at the time and that is how Limerick were able to establish themselves as the second team and if you want to be completely consistent he didnt actually win anything either at senior level with Limerick.

Deise Tom

adrian280582 wrote: »

Well as they say there no sure thing but i would be shocked if Clare or Waterford get even close to Limerick.

I can guarantee you that football in Waterford is alot better than most people think. We have some brilliant footballers in the likes of Shane Walsh, Thomas and Maurice O'Gorman, Mick Ahearne, Ger Power, Gary Hurney, Liam Lawlor, Liam Ó Lionáin, Brian Wall, Eddie Rockett, Sean Ó Hare, Patrick Hurney etc, and if they were all to play on the one team, they would give most teams a tough game.

grenache

Premier, i've a lot of time for you on here, you're quite knowledgable on most things, but you're off the mark with regards to Mickey Ned. I'm with panda on this one. Very few football people in the county wish to see Mickey Ned continue in his role. Instead of real progress, it could be argued that we have actually gone backwards. Certainly in terms of the league, going from Division 2 to Division 4 is a total disaster. Losing to big teams by a point here and a point there just isn't acceptable anymore. It might have been 5 years ago under Liam Kearns when this team was first moulded, but not now. How many near misses do Limerick have to have before Mickey Ned gets the boot. Everyone knows the reason behind our recent improvement is down to Donie Buckley. Before he was brought in on board last summer, we were going nowhere. His training methods have totally transformed our fortunes. And i dont believe its fair to say we're punching above our weight. Look at some of our players, John Galvin, Stephen Lavin, Stephen Kelly, Johnny MaCarthy, these guys would walk onto most teams. So instead of Mickey Ned coming out with more ''low expectation'' comments this year, perhaps he might look at the bigger picture and realise it is time to come out of Cork and Kerry's shadow and actually lay down a marker by winning something!

The_Kew_Tour

Deise Tom wrote: »

I can guarantee you that football in Waterford is alot better than most people think. We have some brilliant footballers in the likes of Shane Walsh, Thomas and Maurice O'Gorman, Mick Ahearne, Ger Power, Gary Hurney, Liam Lawlor, Liam Ó Lionáin, Brian Wall, Eddie Rockett, Sean Ó Hare, Patrick Hurney etc, and if they were all to play on the one team, they would give most teams a tough game.

O I know your rught but the point is will they all play next year on same filed

Not much good having players if there not on same side really

Deise Tom

adrian280582 wrote: »

O I know your rught but the point is will they all play next year on same filed

Not much good having players if there not on same side really

I am sure they all will, if the county board main officers stand up to the so called Senior hurling manager we have and to tell him that if players want to play both codes they have to. For too long the Waterford County Bord are very week and will NOT stand up to any hurling selector. I prefer hurling myself, but a few years back for two years got involved with the minor footballers in the back room team and what went on was a total disgrace, and in my view the same is still happening.

grenache

Deise Tom wrote: »

I am sure they all will, if the county board main officers stand up to the so called Senior hurling manager we have and to tell him that if players want to play both codes they have to. For too long the Waterford County Bord are very week and will NOT stand up to any hurling selector. I prefer hurling myself, but a few years back for two years got involved with the minor footballers in the back room team and what went on was a total disgrace, and in my view the same is still happening.

Its the same in every county Tom, where one code is the dominant one. It will take a break through at senior intercounty level for Waterford's footballers to be given proper respect. I know you won the Munster U-21 title a couple of years back, but the senior team now has to start performing. Otherwise you can expect the footballers to continue to be given second class treatment by the county board. It was like that for years in Limerick, the footballers didn't even get a warm shower after training, things were so bad. It wasn't until the late 90s/early 00s when our u-21s made the breakthrough and our seniors starting rising up the divisions, that Limerick footballers got parity of treatment with the hurlers.