The Public Sector is sick

ChewChew

I'm 26 and work in the public sector and yeah, another pay cut is really going to mess me up! I have been refused a mortgage twice and the banks have both said to me 'potential paycuts' are looming. Try again next year if things approve!

I am paying into a pension that I am never going to see. I am paying a levy on that invisible pension and lets say for example I am paying in €100 a fortnight into my pension. . . I am then paying €130 into the pension levy. . . so straight off there is €230 a fortnight that I will never get back.

I don't want their pension. Take it off me. save yourself there mister government BUT when I took up employment with the HSE. . . . I was contractually binded into starting a pension!

I also have no real idea how our sick leave works tbh. this year so far I have only taken 1.5 days leave and that was this week due to a chest infection! I've been working in the public sector for almost 4 years now and this was the first time I ever went sick!

I probably should have taken another day but I knew my work was suffering so I wrapped up well and went into the office to a desk full of work to be done! No one else could do my work because we are seriously short staffed So it's a no win situation!

johnathan woss

ChewChew wrote: »

I am paying into a pension that I am never going to see. I am paying a levy on that invisible pension and lets say for example I am paying in €100 a fortnight into my pension. . . I am then paying €130 into the pension levy. . . so straight off there is €230 a fortnight that I will never get back.

At last someone else that sees this !

jimmmy

ChewChew wrote: »

I am paying into a pension that I am never going to see. I am paying a levy on that invisible pension and lets say for example I am paying in €100 a fortnight into my pension. . I am then paying €130 into the pension levy. . . so straight off there is €230 a fortnight that I will never get back.

You are lucky if you are able to pay 230 a fortnight in to a pension. Many in the private sector cannot. Many who did have seen it wiped out.

Your best bet is to try to get the government to avoid going bankrupt so one day they can pay your pension. The best way to achieve that is look for the govt to reduce wages by 40% to the average EC public sector wage. Whats good enough in the rest of the EC should be good enough for you.

tallaght01

jimmmy wrote: »

You are lucky if you are able to pay 230 a fortnight in to a pension. Many in the private sector cannot. Many who did have seen it wiped out.

Your best bet is to try to get the government to avoid going bankrupt so one day they can pay your pension. The best way to achieve that is look for the govt to reduce wages by 40% to the average EC public sector wage. Whats good enough in the rest of the EC should be good enough for you.

Why not make everyone pay equally, depending on how much they earn. Put up taxes across the board?

johnathan woss

Jimmmy what's your job ?

Do you work ?

ChewChew

jimmmy wrote: »

You are lucky if you are able to pay 230 a fortnight in to a pension. Many in the private sector cannot. Many who did have seen it wiped out.

Your best bet is to try to get the government to avoid going bankrupt so one day they can pay your pension. The best way to achieve that is look for the govt to reduce wages by 40% to the average EC public sector wage. Whats good enough in the rest of the EC should be good enough for you.

I'm not paying €230 a fortnight into my pension. . . so you might want to re-read my post there! I am paying €100 into a PENSION that I will never see and ON TOP OF THAT. . I am paying €130 into a pension LEVY that I most certainly will never see!

What I would rather do is not participate in the government pension at all, and go elsewhere for a pension!

jimmmy

ChewChew wrote: »

I'm not paying €230 a fortnight into my pension. . . so you might want to re-read my post there! I am paying €100 into a PENSION that I will never see and ON TOP OF THAT. . I am paying €130 into a pension LEVY that I most certainly will never see!

What makes you think you will not see it ? Does it make you angry to see your money going to pay the public servants who are now retired. The policeman ( hardly the sharpest blade in the pack ) who left school in 1979 and who now is retired with a pension pot worth over a million euro ?

ChewChew wrote: »

What I would rather do is not participate in the government pension at all, and go elsewhere for a pension!

Great, tell your bosses and the ps unions that. I would agree with you, you should not have to pay the levy. It would save the government a fortune if it did not collect the levy + pay public service pensions.

Nodin

jimmmy wrote: »

Your best bet is to try to get the government to avoid going bankrupt so one day they can pay your pension. The best way to achieve that is look for the govt to reduce wages by 40% to the average EC public sector wage. Whats good enough in the rest of the EC should be good enough for you.

....totally ignoring the vastly different sets of circumstances that prevail across the EU.

johnathan woss

Do you work Jimmmy ?

SkepticOne

tallaght01 wrote: »

Why not make everyone pay equally, depending on how much they earn. Put up taxes across the board?

The main reason for not doing this, imo, (although it is probably what our weak government will end raising taxes) is that the private sector, from which taxes are extracted to pay for public services, will be further depressed by higher taxes. It won't lead to greater tax revenue but further redundancies and pay cuts.

TheInquisitor

tallaght01 wrote: »

1 r 2 weeks of sick leave per year is a reasonable average (and don't forget we'e talking about an average, which is a figure of dubious relevance when the sectors are very different sizes).

1 to 2 weeks sickness a year? Do you have cancer or aids or something? I can't remember the last time i was sick because its been years. A hangover does not count as being sick. Not wanting to get up does not count as being sick . The sniffles does not count as being sick. When you physicly cannot get out of bed without blowing chunks out either end then you are sick.

ChewChew

jimmmy wrote: »

What makes you think you will not see it ? Does it make you angry to see your money going to pay the public servants who are now retired. The policeman ( hardly the sharpest blade in the pack ) who left school in 1979 and who now is retired with a pension pot worth over a million euro ?

No that doesn't make me angry at all. I wasn't even thought of in 1979 so no, things like that don't make me angry.

jimmmy wrote: »

Great, tell your bosses and the ps unions that. I would agree with you, you should not have to pay the levy. It would save the government a fortune if it did not collect the levy + pay public service pensions.

You clearly don't want to read peoples full posts and only want to say what you think people should hear? Had you read my first post you would not have said this because I origionally said this:

ChewChew wrote: »

when I took up employment with the HSE. . . . I was contractually binded into starting a pension!

ChewChew

TheInquisitor wrote: »

1 to 2 weeks sickness a year? Do you have cancer or aids or something? I can't remember the last time i was sick because its been years. A hangover does not count as being sick. Not wanting to get up does not count as being sick . The sniffles does not count as being sick. When you physicly cannot get out of bed without blowing chunks out either end then you are sick.

and cancer or aids only last 1 or 2 weeks? cop on will ya!

rugbyman

tallaght01 wrote: »

Is only direct cash into your hand "pay".

What about payment in kind? How come we're taxed on non cash payments?

From what I can see as an outsider:

*public sector have all taken paycuts, regardless of how efficient they are.

* private sector have only taken paycuts if they're not efficient enough to maintain profitability.

*We need paycuts across the board to A) decrease expenditure and bring costs down.

* The public sector will, rightly, be taking a cut in the net budget, despite some union posturing.

* The private sector would rather the most vulnerable in society on the social welfare take a cut to drive prices down and to decrease expenditure.

* The private sector who work in any profitable sector will play no part in the above.

Just wanted to get all that straight, as no one in oz believes me lol.

What type of people in OZ do you converse with. Why can they not understand? All of your points are correct except the second last, which i think is written tongue in cheek.
regards ,Rugbyman

glaston

tallaght01 wrote: »

But this issue is a lot more simple than it seems. The public sector get treated fairly when it comes to sick leave. The private sector do not.

1 r 2 weeks of sick leave per year is a reasonable average (and don't forget we'e talking about an average, which is a figure of dubious relevance when the sectors are very different sizes).

The problem is the public sector take their sick leave until they're better. The private sector are often chasing the dollar, so they don't. They just bring their flu into the office, nd further decrease their colleagues' productivity.

Absolute and utter nonsense.
1 r 2 weeks of sick leave per year is a reasonable average???
On what planet?

Every time somebody doesnt bother to get off their ass because of some minor ailment it means a work collague has to absorb their job.

I'd love to work where you do and be able to afford such a blase attitude of people not coming to work.

jimmmy

If we got the HSE down to one or 2 weeks a year it would be a lot better than the 19 days they currently take ( about a month ).

rugbyman

ChewChew wrote: »

I'm 26 and work in the public sector and yeah, another pay cut is really going to mess me up! I have been refused a mortgage twice and the banks have both said to me 'potential paycuts' are looming. Try again next year if things approve!

I am paying into a pension that I am never going to see. I am paying a levy on that invisible pension and lets say for example I am paying in €100 a fortnight into my pension. . . I am then paying €130 into the pension levy. . . so straight off there is €230 a fortnight that I will never get back.

I don't want their pension. Take it off me. save yourself there mister government BUT when I took up employment with the HSE. . . . I was contractually binded into starting a pension!

I also have no real idea how our sick leave works tbh. this year so far I have only taken 1.5 days leave and that was this week due to a chest infection! I've been working in the public sector for almost 4 years now and this was the first time I ever went sick!

I probably should have taken another day but I knew my work was suffering so I wrapped up well and went into the office to a desk full of work to be done! No one else could do my work because we are seriously short staffed So it's a no win situation!

Chew Chew, you are young ,and sound ok. the fact you were turned down by mortgage twice may yet,or even now have been a windfall for you.
re your dislike of the pension situation, which my personal belief is the governments money going in , it was never yours, to put in or withhold, why not position yourself to jump ship and use your undoubted talents in the private sector and then choose your pension. you are young , your feet are hardly yet stuck to the floor, and i doubt the malaise has taken over. Clearly you should stay put, until you secure a position, then off you go.

Regards ,Rugbyman

p.s. i think you have already been asked, why do you think you will never see your pension?

regards ,

Kimbot

I'm a civil servant. In the last 3 years I have 1 day uncertified sick leave and I have 5 days certified sick leave for when I had a seizure on the job and was rushed to hospital.

There are plenty who abuse sick leave but please don't tar everyone with the same brush on this one.

tallaght01

TheInquisitor wrote: »

1 to 2 weeks sickness a year? Do you have cancer or aids or something? .

I have had the bulk of 2 weeks already. I've been in hospital twice with an irregular heartbeat, and I've had a flu.

2 weeks wouldn't unusual. A flu and a tummy bug would do most of that. You're working on averages, so the easily crops up to 2 weeks for people with chronic illness.

tallaght01

jonny24ie wrote: »

I'm a civil servant. In the last 3 years I have 1 day uncertified sick leave and I have 5 days certified sick leave for when I had a seizure on the job and was rushed to hospital.

There are plenty who abuse sick leave but please don't tar everyone with the same brush on this one.

No one wants to hear that :P

I got kidney stones in work coz I was so dehydrated (don't get lunchbreaks or water breaks). I went downstairs to the A+E unit in agony, pissed the thing out. Didn't take painkillers as I wanted a clear head because we were so understaffed upstairs that I knew I needed to go ack to the job straight after it was passed.

I took 1.5 hours off work. I can tell you how long I've certified many the private sector worker off work for kidney stones....it's a lot longer than 1.5 hours.

nesf

tallaght01 wrote: »

2 weeks wouldn't unusual. A flu and a tummy bug would do most of that. You're working on averages, so the easily crops up to 2 weeks for people with chronic illness.

So far this year:

Swine flu, 2 x chest infections, 2 x ear/throat infections, 1 x Winter Vomiting bug my kid brought home. I'd rack up 4+ weeks if I was working full time at the moment which thankfully I'm not (or else I'd have a lot of difficulty convincing to keep me hired I imagine).

tallaght01

nesf wrote: »

So far this year:

Swine flu, 2 x chest infections, 2 x ear/throat infections, 1 x Winter Vomiting bug my kid brought home. I'd rack up 4+ weeks if I was working full time at the moment which thankfully I'm not (or else I'd have a lot of difficulty convincing to keep me hired I imagine).

I'd be certifying u as a malingerer :P

Praetorian Saighdiuir

I work in the Public Sector, in 10 years I have taken 16 sick days altogether, 11 of which were a type of sick day that still require you to be in work, its called "light duty"........i.e "your sick, but you can still work".

So, in reality, I have taken 5 sick days at home in 10 years, and they were not back to back.

There have been plenty of times that I could have went sick and stayed out of work for weeks, especially with work related injuries. But I didnt, because I had work to do, like everyone else in the country.

There are still plenty of people in both sectors that take the piss when it comes to sick leave....and what about all these people on "disability" benefits with nothing wrong with them?????? Haemorraging the countries finances also.

I love the way everyone is jumping on the "public sector are ruining our country" bandwagon.

Yes, the high up people in the Public Sector took the piss bigtime and deserve to be punished, however, the frontline staff did not cause this and had no input in this. We are suffering like everyone else.

The Govermnent are turning us against each other bigtime

The reality is that no one in either sector wants to take anymore cuts, which is acceptable.

We ALL should be banding against the government to sort this out.

They should reduce their wage to a proper average industrial wage, no more than €50k a year. Ministers are taking the piss, that token 10% they took didnt make a dent in their cost of living, axe ALL their expenses.

I would be willing to take a 25% cut in my annual wage if the whole Government did the same.

So..........Private Sector people.......


.....dont hate me because of my chosen path in life, your argument is with the corrupt leaders of the State, complain to them, because I cant change anything with this country.

jimmmy

benwavner wrote: »

I work in the Public Sector, in 10 years I have taken 16 sick days altogether, .

Good for you, but we are talking about averages. I know people who are self employed who have taken no sick days in ten years. There must be a lot of people taking more that the average public sector sickies if you are trying to suggest there are a lot of people like you.

Praetorian Saighdiuir

jimmmy wrote: »

Good for you, but we are talking about averages. I know people who are self employed who have taken no sick days in ten years. There must be a lot of people taking more that the average public sector sickies if you are trying to suggest there are a lot of people like you.

I am not suggesting that there are other people out there like me.

The point I am making is, everyone is different. If you are sick, you are sick. I doesnt matter what sector you work in.

Some people are unluckier than others with illness and accidents, in both sectors.

These figures were released by "The Man" to further turn the ordinary Private Sector worker against the ordinary Public Sector worker...and it is working.

Nodin

jimmmy wrote: »

I know people(.................).

.....in every human endavour, or so it would appear.

ardmacha

If we got the HSE down to one or 2 weeks a year it would be a lot better than the 19 days they currently take ( about a month ).

it is desireable to reduce sick leave if people aren't really sick. However do you really want people sneezing and coughing working in a hospital?

jimmmy

benwavner wrote: »

I am not suggesting that there are other people out there like me.

The point I am making is, everyone is different. If you are sick, you are sick. I doesnt matter what sector you work in.

Some people are unluckier than others with illness and accidents, in both sectors..

How come "The average woman working in state departments was absent 14 days, while the average man was off for eight days, almost double the rate of absence in the private sector. By contrast the latest survey of absenteeism in the private sector shows an average rate of just six days per employee."

benwavner wrote: »

These figures were released by "The Man" to further turn the ordinary Private Sector worker against the ordinary Public Sector worker...and it is working.

oh, its all a big conspiracy against the public sector lol. Nothing to do with exposing inefficiency or waste in the public sector ? Do not forget due to this extra absenteeism, thousands extra are employed in the public sector.....and waiting lists lengthened etc

johnathan woss

Jimmmy you seem to "know" alot of people, do you actually work ?

What is your job ?

Please answer this time.

jimmmy

johnathan woss wrote: »

What is your job ?

private sector taxpayer. As I said before the rest is none of your business. I never asked you or anyone else what their job was. However, if I worked in the public sector, I would feel the same way about public sector pay, just like the half a dozen immigrant workers in the Irish public service who were interviewed in the Independent recently and who compared Irish wages and conditions and prices with their home countries, and who all hought Irish public sector pay too high.