On and On - We Carry On

tisnotover

Approx 500 runners turned up in Ballycotton last nite for the last in the 5 mile series, there were serious delays going through roundabout in Midleton and inevitably it led to delay in start.

Bumped into Sosa at start, he recognised me without my white cap Got a good warm-up in of a couple of miles, and ran another half mile or so with Sosa before lining up near the front at start-line.

I'd a target of 29:15 in my head for tonite, to not look at the watch too much, but to try and get into a good group to pace with.

The start was frantic, the field being led out by some big names, Alan O'Shea, Michael Herlihy, James McCarthy, Martin McCarthy and Sean McGrath, and the rest of us being swept along with them.

Sosa got off to a great start and I could see him tucked in behind a nice group through mile mark. Myself, well I ran the first mile too hard, a mile split of 5:36 proved this, its easy to look back at it now and say what was I doing, the 1st mile is down-hill, but I was 'working' too hard for that first mile!

2nd mile and it was about consolidation, I was running alongside Eamonn McEvoy from St.Finbarr's, and we were taking it turns off each others to push pace I felt, tho I felt I was working harder than I'd normally feel to keep up with him. Mile 2 in 5:55.

The 3rd mile has a sting in its tail, first half is net downhill, and I was running well here, we turned left and I knew what was coming, there's two parts to the climb in this half mile, an intitial drag, before a sharp ascent. Eamonn left me on the drag and I was caught by Derek, a club-mate of mine, seeing Derek go past me spurrred me on, and I went with him and attacked the sharper hill with him.

Through mile 3 in 6:10. Not a bad split at all considering this hill, but I was spent as I hit the lap button!! Thru 3miles in 17:42.

The start of mile 4, gives ya some recovery as the road drops down for a bit, but then another climb!My memories of running this last yr had left this one out, I found this really hard, even more so as I had a stitch coming in my side since mile 3, and I wasn't sure would it get worse if I pushed on more! Derek opened a gap on me here, and I couldn't go with him, this was a tough part of the race for me, I was trying to relax with the stitch, but I also had some bad-thoughts of pulling up, or take a break coming into my head! I got over the drag and relaxed on the downhill section to mile 4. Mile split: 6:05, not bad like, but before the race I had hoped to be doing 5:50 here!

The last mile does roll a bit, but I was worried about missing out on sub-30, I didn't look at the Garmin at all in the last mile, there was a guy on my shoulder and I wanted to hitch the ride with him for as long as I could into the finish. He left me at 400m to go, I had nothing, I was spent! Mile 5 in 6:01, giving 29:49 overall. Jasus I worked hard to get that tonite, there are easier ways to go sub-30 than that!

Denis McCarthy and Noel O'Regan passed me through 1.5miles, they ran 29:10 and 29:16. It shows ya how bad pacing at start costs ya. If I had tucked in with Denis at start, then who knows I mite have had a different race, the thing is I didn't know that I was ahead of him!

Results show I finished 41st, I did get a t-shirt as well for overall series, so happy to get that, considering I ran 34mins for the first race!

I will beat my 29:40 time, but it will have to wait till next year. I know I'm in sub-30 land now, I've done it in 3 races this year. I will run a 5k next week and the Cork half, but I will take a break from racing then for 4 weeks I'd say.

Final Note:
21euro is what it cost overall for the 4 races in the Ballycotton series, its savage value.Prizes every nite, a very accurate course, results online the next day, refreshments provided. A lot of other races could learn a thing or two from the way they run things down there.

seanynova

tisnotover wrote: »

Well I got the t-shirt but didn't get a PB. Clocked Ballycotton at 29:48. I'll post a report in morning, shattered now. I'll give ya a hint tho as to why the PB wasn't there, I went out too fast !!

Great to meet up with sosa and to have the chat! I hope you'll def sign-up for the Ballycotton 10 now next year! That was some time ya ran tonite, hope ya got back to Waterford ok.

seanynova met up with us after, jasus didn't realise ya were running those sort of times for tempo, savage session tonite, I'll def bump into ya in Blarney, who knows we might race it together !

well done on getting the T-shirt, hard course for a PB last night, from mile 3 on there is too many places where time is lost like....

my tempo paces seem to be going well, by feeling and im happy with the 177 HR, for me that seams to be in line with a 193maxHR...might be running them a little fast though, but as P&D says, "running at or a little faster than threshold pace will imporve threshold pace" and the shorter splits can be run a little faster again as by mcmillan!....will cap it at 6:10-6:15 until the half and go from there...not sure about racing the half, but i might "try" to keep you in sight until the hill, and if you hang around long enough afterwards ill prob meet up with you again...
but sub83 is the gaol now at a minimium!

tisnotover

Sosa wrote: »

I got home in good time tno,started the car at 8:33 and arrived in the door at 9:58....and i didnt have to go into turbo boost to do it either...

I would be interested in other runners times tonight that you know,whether they were up or down on when they wanted/capable of.
That was a hard slog tonight.

Looking at the elevation gain on the garmin it does not seem much,but when you run it...a different story

Its a tough course in fairness, and tougher than the memory I had of it last year, which was maybe a bit too rosy!

A quick look at the results shows that some lads I know maybe 15s off their times in other races for 5miles. There's no danger in a course being measured short down in Ballycotton!

tisnotover

seanynova wrote: »

well done on getting the T-shirt, hard course for a PB last night, from mile 3 on there is too many places where time is lost like....

my tempo paces seem to be going well, by feeling and im happy with the 177 HR, for me that seams to be in line with a 193maxHR...might be running them a little fast though, but as P&D says, "running at or a little faster than threshold pace will imporve threshold pace" and the shorter splits can be run a little faster again as by mcmillan!....will cap it at 6:10-6:15 until the half and go from there...not sure about racing the half, but i might "try" to keep you in sight until the hill, and if you hang around long enough afterwards ill prob meet up with you again...
but sub83 is the gaol now at a minimium!

Cheers seany. I don't think you've any worries for the cork half, I did the bay-run doing tempos at 6:25 pace, your 10-15s ahead of that. It'll be me trying to keep up with you I reckon! Plus, its your home race, you'll have to give it socks!

smmoore79

Congrats on the sub 30. Sounds like Ballycottons a very tough 5 mile course! Maybe a flat 5 miler and you'd go sub 29?

Speedy44

congrats tno, sounds like it was a really tough course. Isn't it amazing that no matter how many races we run we still manage to screw up the pacing sometimes !!

Were you going fast consciously though in fear of losing time on the upcoming hills?

I only ask because I have a 1/2 M this Sunday and they say that it is a good course for a negative split. The majority of the hills are in the first half, and the wind is generally behind you on the 2nd half. So I'm trying to figure out whether to take it 5 secs easier per mile on the first half in the hope that I'll be fresh for the rest of it?

misty floyd

Well done tno, still a great time. That first mile, working too hard, is a basterd isn't it. I think doubts enter the head too and its a struggle all the way home.
Well done.

tisnotover

Speedy44 wrote: »

congrats tno, sounds like it was a really tough course. Isn't it amazing that no matter how many races we run we still manage to screw up the pacing sometimes !!

Were you going fast consciously though in fear of losing time on the upcoming hills?

I only ask because I have a 1/2 M this Sunday and they say that it is a good course for a negative split. The majority of the hills are in the first half, and the wind is generally behind you on the 2nd half. So I'm trying to figure out whether to take it 5 secs easier per mile on the first half in the hope that I'll be fresh for the rest of it?

Ah its maybe not as tough as I wrote about it, but it was sure as hell made tough for me by the 5:36 opening mile! :eek: I was a bit about getting time in the bank for the hills, but 5:45 should have been the split. I wouldn't even average 5:36 in a 5km race at moment!

On the 1/2, best of luck firstly, which one is that ??
You're spot on with the pacing I reckon, its how I will go about the one down here in a couple of weeks too. Even 5-10s backed off for the first few miles will stand to ya, it should feel comfortable. By the sounds of it you will make up time in 2nd half.

tisnotover

smmoore79 wrote: »

Congrats on the sub 30. Sounds like Ballycottons a very tough 5 mile course! Maybe a flat 5 miler and you'd go sub 29?

Next year, with good pacing !

Gringo78

Good running tno. All part of learning to race. What were the HR's by the way? Would be interested to know how high the HR went attacking the hill at 3...it's good to do in training but in a race maybe not the right tactic??

tisnotover

Gringo78 wrote: »

Good running tno. All part of learning to race. What were the HR's by the way? Would be interested to know how high the HR went attacking the hill at 3...it's good to do in training but in a race maybe not the right tactic??

I'm def still learning ! When I saw Denis and Noel go past me after 1.5miles, I knew I was toast, the old dogs for the hard road;)

HR splits were: 173,181,181,179,182. I haven't uploaded to SportTracks yet, but I'd say the peak is high at that hill. Think ure right about how to approach the hills, in any other race i've done, I've ran steady up them, and went on from there, what feels like attacking the hills in training at say 7:30 pace is completely different when your trying to hold 6min pace, we learn!

Speedy44

tisnotover wrote: »

Ah its maybe not as tough as I wrote about it, but it was sure as hell made tough for me by the 5:36 opening mile! :eek: I was a bit about getting time in the bank for the hills, but 5:45 should have been the split. I wouldn't even average 5:36 in a 5km race at moment!

On the 1/2, best of luck firstly, which one is that ??
You're spot on with the pacing I reckon, its how I will go about the one down here in a couple of weeks too. Even 5-10s backed off for the first few miles will stand to ya, it should feel comfortable. By the sounds of it you will make up time in 2nd half.

Galway City 1/2. Looks like its going to be fairly competitive, I'd say it'll be won in at least 72. Weather is supposed to be spot on as well. I didn't do any long races before last years DCM so I want to use this to experiment as well. The experiment been taking it easy in the first half

Sosa

:eek:

tisnotover wrote: »

Ah its maybe not as tough as I wrote about it, but it was sure as hell made tough for me by the 5:36 opening mile! :eek: I was a bit about getting time in the bank for the hills, but 5:45 should have been the split. I wouldn't even average 5:36 in a 5km race at moment!

The majority of it is very fair,the first 2.5m are ideal,but its from 2.5m to 3.5m that the time is lost,you just cannot maintain the pace you want here.
Mile 5 then is not easy but not that hard,the main problem i had with mile 5 was the 4 previous miles in the legs :eek:

tisnotover

15.25 miles this morn with club, av-pace 7:42min/mile. This was a progression run of sorts over hills. Body was tired still this morn from effort on Thursday. Some of the lads were doing 18/20 miles, apparently they're training for something called a marathon ?? :rolleyes:

pace progressed something like 8:10 -> 7:46 -> 7:10 looking at 5mile splits in SportTracks, some of those last couple of miles were done at 6:30 pace.

Tired now, and will rest tomorrow. Only 4 days running this week, but still got in 33miles.

An excellent video of race from Ballycotton is available here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja4Er5l6gHw

Just look at the gap that Alan O' Shea had on the rest when they came back in...skip to 3:46

tisnotover

5miles steady after work at 7:17min/mile, hrm is f-ed, prob needs new battery (again!). Legs a bit tired, but always are on a Monday for me really. Hope to do Togher 5k wed evening, need to get pacing right for this one tho, unlike Ballycotton!

BeepBeep67

What's the target for the 5k - I should have checked the best of's before last Sat to give you extra incentive

seanynova

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

What's the target for the 5k - I should have checked the best of's before last Sat to give you extra incentive

+1, but also the half marathon?....

what training are you doing for the half? will you get in any tempo runs or HMP runs in over the next 2 weeks?

tisnotover

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

What's the target for the 5k - I should have checked the best of's before last Sat to give you extra incentive

Gonna try and push 17:40, thats 5:40min/mile pace, I've nothing to lose, got the sub-18 in the bag a few wks ago.

seanynova wrote: »

+1, but also the half marathon?....

what training are you doing for the half? will you get in any tempo runs or HMP runs in over the next 2 weeks?

I entered the half last nite, its worrying me now though, particularly the lack of tempo runs, I'm gonna try and do a session of 10/12 miles on sat with 2*3miles or 4*2miles or something similar, it won't stand to be for sun week, but it'll give me a feel of where I am pace wise!

I hit sub 1:23 in May, but it could be tough to get the same this time. Waterford is the goal for the next PB, the cork half is to give me a good kick up the ass if I need it

seanynova

tisnotover wrote: »

Gonna try and push 17:40, thats 5:40min/mile pace, I've nothing to lose, got the sub-18 in the bag a few wks ago.



I entered the half last nite, its worrying me now though, particularly the lack of tempo runs, I'm gonna try and do a session of 10/12 miles on sat with 2*3miles or 4*2miles or something similar, it won't stand to be for sun week, but it'll give me a feel of where I am pace wise!

I hit sub 1:23 in May, but it could be tough to get the same this time. Waterford is the goal for the next PB, the cork half is to give me a good kick up the ass if I need it

well you have the pace, but the pace endurance might be lacking a little(?) with all the shorter races you have been doing....still, i suspect a PB for you anyway...head out at 6:20 and after the IMRA style hill :eek: bring it back down in 6:10-6:15m/m!

tisnotover

seanynova wrote: »

well you have the pace, but the pace endurance might be lacking a little(?) with all the shorter races you have been doing....still, i suspect a PB for you anyway...head out at 6:20 and after the IMRA style hill :eek: bring it back down in 6:10-6:15m/m!

pace endurance could def be lacking ! :eek:

If I see you heading out at 6:20 though, I'll join ya

seanynova

tisnotover wrote: »

pace endurance could def be lacking ! :eek:

If I see you heading out at 6:20 though, I'll join ya

i hope this doenst turn into a showdown at high noon!!!

remember, im all about the marathon training!!!...and if jessica vonhatten couldnt distract me in ballycotton, racing against "someone" rather than "time" in blarney will be the least of my worries....no offence like....

AND remember on the same day this year, you did 82:XX, i did 84:XX(on a flatter course).....so, can you pace me and help me get my sub3 goal??? :cool:

tisnotover

seanynova wrote: »

i hope this doenst turn into a showdown at high noon!!!

remember, im all about the marathon training!!!...and if jessica vonhatten couldnt distract me in ballycotton, racing against "someone" rather than "time" in blarney will be the least of my worries....no offence like....

AND remember on the same day this year, you did 82:XX, i did 84:XX(on a flatter course).....so, can you pace me and help me get my sub3 goal??? :cool:

Ah ure training has come on some way since then, it'll be a good race tho, always competitive, they've chip timing this yr, not sure why?? Its not as if there'll be a delay getting across the start line!

no bother with the sub-3 pacing, pacers usually drop out after a bit don't they

seanynova

tisnotover wrote: »

Ah ure training has come on some way since then, it'll be a good race tho, always competitive, they've chip timing this yr, not sure why?? Its not as if there'll be a delay getting across the start line!

no bother with the sub-3 pacing, pacers usually drop out after a bit don't they

well in that case, ill take it out at 6:20m/m, and drop back to see you finish strong! wait.......im not the pacer!!!

ill know more about my pacing after this weeks tempo run, and the feedback of comfort/discomfort....and its damage limitation on the hill after that.

tisnotover

seanynova wrote: »

well in that case, ill take it out at 6:20m/m, and drop back to see you finish strong! wait.......im not the pacer!!!

ill know more about my pacing after this weeks tempo run, and the feedback of comfort/discomfort....and its damage limitation on the hill after that.

We better be careful here now or Sosa and Gringo will hop-over and bang our heads together for being conservative !

Gringo78

tisnotover wrote: »

We better be careful here now or Sosa and Gringo will hop-over and bang our heads together for being conservative !

The Cork HM brought me back down to earth last year with a bang - taught me a lesson about pacing which I still remember so I won't say anything about conservatism on this one. Will be interested to see the times though.

seanynova

Gringo78 wrote: »

The Cork HM brought me back down to earth last year with a bang - taught me a lesson about pacing which I still remember so I won't say anything about conservatism on this one. Will be interested to see the times though.

do you care to elaborate, or offer any advice on pacing it?

im worried that the hill might take too much out of me as i havent done any training over hills(there were none near me when i was in canada!)

tisnotover

5miles on grass at 8:15min/mile, was running with guy who ran two marathons at wknd, some going !

tisnotover

Well, I was after 17:40, but I'll take the above, its a new PB by 10s. Had to work for that tonite, there's no let up in a 5k, you work till the line like, the time is there if u want it i've learned, but u earn it.

2mile warm-up with Finn from home, legs feeling fine, but my stomach was sloshing around, worried that it could give me a cramp later, but it never came. On with the hyperspeeds, and off to the start. The route is very fair, downhill start, then flat with only a few drags in it, only down-side on route is a lot of twists and turns through housing estates.

Mile splits: 5:35, 5:48, 5:50 giving 17:42.

I learnt my lesson from last wk and didn't attack the downhill, I was running fast, but it was controlled, there was a group of 3 girls ahead of me, Emma Murphy, Niamh Roe and another girl, they were maybe 5-6s ahead of me through the mile mark I counted. I had in my head to try and bridge the gap to them, I was on my own really having passed a couple who were fading and tried to press on, did find myself catching them on the climb in the 2nd mile, and on the downhill I passed Niamh.

Emma had opened a good gap now tho, but I didn't think i'd get there. I did catch the 2nd girl, but she wasn't letting me get past her without a fight ! Could battle through the 2mile mark, but I did manage to pull a few seconds out.

Was really on the limit now, fear of getting a stitch and all that, but at the same time trying to press hard, I slowed a bit on this mile, bit of wind maybe, or else the body tiring, but I could see I was still on for a good time as I hit the 3mile mark, saw the clock in the distance and pushed on, nearly catching someone on the line.

Happy out as ya can tell, its a nice PB, and I did run a better race tonite, Ballycotton did teach me a lesson !

BeepBeep67

Savage - I think there's sub 17:30 in dem der legs!

seanynova

tisnotover wrote: »

Well, I was after 17:40, but I'll take the above, its a new PB by 10s. Had to work for that tonite, there's no let up in a 5k, you work till the line like, the time is there if u want it i've learned, but u earn it.

2mile warm-up with Finn from home, legs feeling fine, but my stomach was sloshing around, worried that it could give me a cramp later, but it never came. On with the hyperspeeds, and off to the start. The route is very fair, downhill start, then flat with only a few drags in it, only down-side on route is a lot of twists and turns through housing estates.

Mile splits: 5:35, 5:48, 5:50 giving 17:42.

I learnt my lesson from last wk and didn't attack the downhill, I was running fast, but it was controlled, there was a group of 3 girls ahead of me, Emma Murphy, Niamh Roe and another girl, they were maybe 5-6s ahead of me through the mile mark I counted. I had in my head to try and bridge the gap to them, I was on my own really having passed a couple who were fading and tried to press on, did find myself catching them on the climb in the 2nd mile, and on the downhill I passed Niamh.

Emma had opened a good gap now tho, but I didn't think i'd get there. I did catch the 2nd girl, but she wasn't letting me get past her without a fight ! Could battle through the 2mile mark, but I did manage to pull a few seconds out.

Was really on the limit now, fear of getting a stitch and all that, but at the same time trying to press hard, I slowed a bit on this mile, bit of wind maybe, or else the body tiring, but I could see I was still on for a good time as I hit the 3mile mark, saw the clock in the distance and pushed on, nearly catching someone on the line.

Happy out as ya can tell, its a nice PB, and I did run a better race tonite, Ballycotton did teach me a lesson !

good run, sounded like a very strong run lad! your flying at the moment and need i point out that mcmillan puts you in line for a 1:21:49 half marathon on that basis! :eek: ill leave you off....

there is a post about the cork half in "events" if you didnt see it, your experience might add to it, ill be asking about water stations on it next...

well done again tonight lad, savage run!