Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

15,278 public sector workers earn more than €100,000

Options
1234689

Comments

  • Options
    #152
    thebman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,012 ✭✭✭✭thebman


    Yeah the billion FAS got could have been better spent putting in a world class communications infrastructure to attract jobs when we hit hard times but was pissed away in a vote buying exercise.


  • Options
    #153
    Alcatel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 217 ✭✭Alcatel


    thebman wrote: »
    Yeah the billion FAS got could have been better spent putting in a world class communications infrastructure to attract jobs when we hit hard times but was pissed away in a vote buying exercise.
    Amen to that.

    And speaking of privatising things (like bins), a lot of the services we take from state and semi-states could be done more efficiently. AnPost, another great example of where deregulation should have arrived 18 months ago, when it was promised.

    Even in former semi-states that have been privatised we see how hard up these companies are with their public sector mentalities in the workforce. Eircom, for example. Aer Lingus. Etc.

    But, to take us back to the discussion, lads, PS pay is too high, we can't afford it. End of story. 57bn spending. 33bn income. That's the bottom line.


  • Options
    #154
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    Alcatel wrote: »
    Amen to that.

    And speaking of privatising things (like bins), a lot of the services we take from state and semi-states could be done more efficiently. AnPost, another great example of where deregulation should have arrived 18 months ago, when it was promised.

    Even in former semi-states that have been privatised we see how hard up these companies are with their public sector mentalities in the workforce. Eircom, for example. Aer Lingus. Etc.

    But, to take us back to the discussion, lads, PS pay is too high, we can't afford it. End of story. 57bn spending. 33bn income. That's the bottom line.


    heard a recent discussion on radio about the late seamus brennan , brennan was making changes at dublin bus which was obviously annoying the unions but it was annoying someone else too , good ol bertie , seems our former taoiseach decided to move brennan out of transport such was his obsession with keeping unions on side , the mans legacy closer resembles a rotten corpse as the days pass


  • Options
    #155
    KerranJast
    Registered Users Posts: 1,829 ✭✭✭KerranJast


    irish_bob wrote: »
    heard a recent discussion on radio about the late seamus brennan , brennan was making changes at dublin bus which was obviously annoying the unions but it was annoying someone else too , good ol bertie , seems our former taoiseach decided to move brennan out of transport such was his obsession with keeping unions on side , the mans legacy closer resembles a rotten corpse as the days pass
    Yeah I remember Bertie scuppering/delaying reforms at Aer Rianta/DAA because he was afraid of pissing off his local constituents rather than what was best for the nation.


  • Options
    #156
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    KerranJast wrote: »
    Yeah I remember Bertie scuppering/delaying reforms at Aer Rianta/DAA because he was afraid of pissing off his local constituents rather than what was best for the nation.

    party before country


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #157
    Dr Galen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    irish_bob wrote: »
    party before country

    i don't often agree with you Bob, but in this case, I have to say I think your spot on.


  • Options
    #158
    Riskymove
    Registered Users Posts: 10,888 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    irish_bob wrote: »
    party before country

    self before constituents before party before country....


  • Options
    #159
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    NewDubliner wrote: »
    It must have been a special edition.

    The Indo itself is not a source of reliable information - where did the article say its figures came from? Also, who wrote it?

    How many times can you say that!
    Don't bury your head in the sand, and deny the facts.

    Ireland is broke, and in the DEEP red...
    The Public Sector work for Ireland...

    You NEED to take a cut!

    Simple!


  • Options
    #160
    erictheviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭erictheviking


    jimmmy wrote: »
    The private sector collect vat, income tax ,stamp duty, cgt, cat, excise duty and all the other taxes and pay it to the government. Thats the governments income. ( along with 25 billion of borrowing ).

    The wages the government pay is part of government expenditure....yes to its employees it witholds some of the money as tax, but this money comes from others in the first place.

    I suppose the public sector workers don't pay VAT, excise duty etc. etc. (even people on the scratcher pay these stealth taxes or has this slipped your mind?)
    And their income tax isn't regarded by you as 'proper tax'? :rolleyes: gimme a break!
    Are the private sector companies whose workers do contract work for government agencies not paying 'proper tax' either?
    Everything you post is just plain petty!


  • Options
    #161
    Alcatel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 217 ✭✭Alcatel


    erictheviking wrote: »
    I suppose the public sector workers don't pay VAT, excise duty etc. etc. (even people on the scratcher pay these stealth taxes or has this slipped your mind?)
    And their income tax isn't regarded by you as 'proper tax'? :rolleyes: gimme a break!
    Are the private sector companies whose workers do contract work for government agencies not paying 'proper tax' either?
    Everything you post is just plain petty!
    Any tax paid by a PS worker is just a rebate.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #162
    erictheviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭erictheviking


    jimmmy wrote: »
    How come other countries have better public services at a lower cost ?

    How much is it costing you personally? Judging by the amount of time you spend posting on here I doubt you pay too much tax. Sorry for making an assumption but it seems its OK for you to make plenty of assumptions;)


  • Options
    #163
    erictheviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭erictheviking


    Alcatel wrote: »
    Any tax paid by a PS worker is just a rebate.
    :D
    I suppose you are going to tell us now they do nothing to actually earn their wages.


  • Options
    #164
    Alcatel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 217 ✭✭Alcatel


    erictheviking wrote: »
    :D
    I suppose you are going to tell us now they do nothing to actually earn their wages.
    No...? I'm saying that using the argument that PS workers prop up the economy, well, we're still borrowing/printing money that doesn't exist, and the real balance to pay off this debt will come from the private, not the public, sector in later years. What you're saying is the same as a bank loaning itself money to continue operations (or loaning one another, as two of our famous banks did recently...)

    57bn spending. 33bn income. That's the math.


  • Options
    #165
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    erictheviking wrote: »
    I suppose the public sector workers don't pay VAT, excise duty etc. etc. (even people on the scratcher pay these stealth taxes or has this slipped your mind?)
    And their income tax isn't regarded by you as 'proper tax'? :rolleyes: gimme a break!
    Are the private sector companies whose workers do contract work for government agencies not paying 'proper tax' either?
    Everything you post is just plain petty!

    Whereas Jimmmy's debating style is more of a tantrum than I would like. He always makes valid points, even if they are loaded with emotion.

    To call someone on his side petty, is exceptionally hypocritical!

    To ask the successful among the private sector to subsidise the obnoxiously bloated salaries in an underproductive, and overly buraucratic Public Sector is Petty!... and selfish!...


  • Options
    #166
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    Alcatel wrote: »
    Any tax paid by a PS worker is just a rebate.

    That is empty sloganeering: the tax deduction from my public service pension feels the same to me as the tax deduction borne by anybody in the private sector.

    Any tax paid by anybody, be they in the private or the public sector, is a payment for a package of services provided by the state (I am classifying social welfare as a service in this definition, but you may factor it out for separate consideration if you wish).


  • Options
    #167
    erictheviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭erictheviking


    optocynic wrote: »
    Whereas Jimmmy's debating style is more of a tantrum than I would like. He always makes valid points, even if they are loaded with emotion.

    To call someone on his side petty, is exceptionally hypocritical!

    To ask the successful among the private sector to subsidise the obnoxiously bloated salaries in an underproductive, and overly buraucratic Public Sector is Petty!... and selfish!...

    I'm sorry but to insinuate that there exists some type of elite supertaxpayer that singlehandedly pays another section of the workforces taxes for them is ridiculous and petty. Everybody pays taxes in one way or another.


  • Options
    #168
    Alcatel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 217 ✭✭Alcatel


    P. Breathnach wrote: »
    That is empty sloganeering: the tax deduction from my public service pension feels the same to me as the tax deduction borne by anybody in the private sector.

    Any tax paid by anybody, be they in the private or the public sector, is a payment for a package of services provided by the state (I am classifying social welfare as a service in this definition, but you may factor it out for separate consideration if you wish).
    The context of the discussion above is that PS workers contribute to the economy VAT, etc, and somehow help to keep us propped up.

    Simple long term fact is that the interest on the 24bn we borrow this year, the 20+bn we borrow next year, etc, on income of 33bn and falling, will mean that any extra money the PS workers put into businesses now will be screwed out of us in taxes and lack of services later while we simply service our debt.

    33bn income. 57bn spending. 4bn in adjustments this year (and there'll be war over it.) I mean, lads, does nobody see the long term picture here?

    Let me put it another way: You're earning 33,000 and your household costs 57,000 to run per year. You go to the banks for loans. Tell me, what's going to happen to your household income in 5 years when you're paying back the loans and still only have about the same income?


  • Options
    #169
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    erictheviking wrote: »
    I'm sorry but to insinuate that there exists some type of elite supertaxpayer that singlehandedly pays another section of the workforces taxes for them is ridiculous and petty. Everybody pays taxes in one way or another.

    I wouldn't say it is petty. I would say it is overly simplistic!.

    The fact remains, that for recovery, we need people to have disposable cash. They need to live. What the unions are asking, is to increase tax on the Alpha-consumers!

    Anyone with a fully functioning brain can see the holes in that!


  • Options
    #170
    Alcatel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 217 ✭✭Alcatel


    erictheviking wrote: »
    I'm sorry but to insinuate that there exists some type of elite supertaxpayer that singlehandedly pays another section of the workforces taxes for them is ridiculous and petty. Everybody pays taxes in one way or another.
    48% of all income tax is paid by 4% of the workforce. Food for thought.


  • Options
    #171
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    Alcatel wrote: »
    48% of all income tax is paid by 4% of the workforce. Food for thought.

    Yeah, but the Narnians running the unions have their members believing that the 4% are evil Bond-Villans... Pampered, non-working aristocrats!

    Which is of course the politics of petty envy!

    ALL of the successful people I know work very very hard. 80 Hour weeks are common-place for me and them... That is over twice what the PS do... isn't it?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #172
    erictheviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭erictheviking


    Alcatel wrote: »
    48% of all income tax is paid by 4% of the workforce. Food for thought.
    That means nothing to your average Joe. Those 4% are probably on massive earnings. As a percentage of earnings do they pay more than the average person? I doubt it!


  • Options
    #173
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    erictheviking wrote: »
    That means nothing to your average Joe. Those 4% are probably on massive earnings. As a percentage of earnings do they pay more than the average person? I doubt it!

    They pay tax at the highest rate!
    Tell me, why do you think they should pay more?

    Or, to be more direct, do you think they are not entitled to their high earnings?


  • Options
    #174
    Riskymove
    Registered Users Posts: 10,888 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    Alcatel wrote: »
    48% of all income tax is paid by 4% of the workforce. Food for thought.

    any details on what that 4% represents?

    i.e. what salary level


  • Options
    #175
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    Riskymove wrote: »
    any details on what that 4% represents?

    i.e. what salary level

    Why does that matter?


  • Options
    #176
    erictheviking
    Closed Accounts Posts: 102 ✭✭erictheviking


    optocynic wrote: »
    They pay tax at the highest rate!
    Tell me, why do you think they should pay more?

    Or, to be more direct, do you think they are not entitled to their high earnings?

    I didn't say they should pay more..
    a lot of people pay tax at the higher rate and I'll bet they pay a higher percentage of their overall earnings in tax than the 4% who are made out to be 'saviours' of the country on these boards.
    There are plenty of tax loopholes out there for the rich to take advantage of. The ordinary worker on a building site or factory floor have their taxes taken before they see their wages.


  • Options
    #177
    Diarmuid
    Registered Users Posts: 3,981 ✭✭✭Diarmuid


    erictheviking wrote: »
    As a percentage of earnings do they pay more than the average person? I doubt it!
    Is this a joke? You do know the Irish tax system is based on percentages. And it's progressive.
    oimg?key=0AoEU1Fq8-r6_cHpjc0NMRnZVUkxXTzVkU1dqTzJrYmc&oid=8&v=1257167215146

    EDIT: This is for a PAYE single person. Full figures here . Calculated from here


  • Options
    #178
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    Diarmuid wrote: »
    Is this a joke? You do know the Irish tax system is based on percentages. And it's progressive.
    oimg?key=0AoEU1Fq8-r6_cHpjc0NMRnZVUkxXTzVkU1dqTzJrYmc&oid=8&v=1257167215146

    EDIT: This is for a PAYE single person

    dont forget that on the remainder after income tax

    is also heavily taxed

    VAT, fuels, licenses,savings etc etc


  • Options
    #179
    optocynic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 755 ✭✭✭optocynic


    erictheviking wrote: »
    I didn't say they should pay more..
    a lot of people pay tax at the higher rate and I'll bet they pay a higher percentage or their overall earnings in tax than the 4% who are made out to be 'saviours' of the country on these boards.
    There are plenty of tax loopholes out there for the rich to take advantage of. The ordinary worker on a building site or factory floor have their taxes taken before they see their wages.

    I still don't see your point here.
    If you could prove that these 4% were not spending thier vast wealth in Ireland, I would take your side (maybe..).. but it is all just very envious ranting... especially when I see people using the phrase 'Average Joe'... who is this average Joe?..

    I guarantee that average Joe's salary (If he still has one) is most likely paid for by the 4% spending... purchasing goods and services...


  • Options
    #180
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    optocynic wrote: »
    ... I guarantee that average Joe's salary (If he still has one) is most likely paid for by the 4% spending... purchasing goods and services...

    It's called "trickle-down", and many consider it to be a discredited theory.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #181
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    erictheviking wrote: »
    I didn't say they should pay more..
    a lot of people pay tax at the higher rate and I'll bet they pay a higher percentage of their overall earnings in tax than the 4% who are made out to be 'saviours' of the country on these boards.
    There are plenty of tax loopholes out there for the rich to take advantage of. The ordinary worker on a building site or factory floor have their taxes taken before they see their wages.

    at what income level does one cease to be an ordinary worker , im curious because the unions want to slap a 60% plus tax rate on those earning over 100 k , many small business owners would earn over 100k and i assure you thier are few loopholes for the likes of those people


Advertisement