Tweedy Group - The Aftermath

Psychedelic

ex_infantry man wrote: »

Tweedy also has a club in l.a. Apparently? ? ?

Yeah he owns Club L.A. :pac:

Mickdots wrote: »

may i also add to those in the know, how much does he pay rent for rubys? yes mr tweedy doesnt own it. FACT!!!!!!!!!!

yes that's true

Ledger

if i could just clear up another matter here regarding rubys/the woodman:

The TG does own the woodman bar and the ruby lounge,
however he does not own any of the upstairs areas such as the nightclub or office space, and pays rent on this space part of the reson being most of this space is above other buisnesses such as esspresso xtravision and ladbrokes.

Also regarding the matter of renovation:

about 2-3 years ago the banks were throwing money at the TG for renovations to premesis and the matter of planning had been looked into, however, they simply were not ready at that time to renovate some places to the extent desired such as rubys and muldoons/oxygen.
(The exeption being the work carried out after the fire in rubys.)

And may i point out that renovation work was done in Oskars when it was being ran by the TG, and masons also as many know a lot of work was put into refurbishment of Ten/Electric Avenue over the years at several times such as when it was the pulpit, then ulysess (sp) was opened then the pulpit was remodeled and opened as ten then ulysess was remodeled and opened as electric avenue etc by the way before i get my head bitten off this was all while it was under the control of the TG if i am correct.


So there is no grounds for saying the "never bothered to refurbish anywhere", Because as i have pointed out the have spent a lot of money over the years on refurbished.



Ledger

anplaya

south wrote: »

3 doors up in twister vicks it's €1.20 cheaper for a pint.

twister vics were chargin 4.50 for a pint last time i was there so its about 50,60 cents cheaper now not 1.20 unless bobs charging 5.70?not even harveys is that dear,think it was 5.45 last time i went there,robbin cnuts,more fool me i know for paying it.

south

anplaya wrote: »

twister vics were chargin 4.50 for a pint last time i was there so its about 50,60 cents cheaper now not 1.20 unless bobs charging 5.70?not even harveys is that dear,think it was 5.45 last time i went there,robbin cnuts,more fool me i know for paying it.

twisters was €4 a pint only last week and has been any time i've been in there. €5.20 for a pint of Heineken in the woodman after whatever time the price goes up

deise red

A lot of posters on here have gotten very personal the fact is if a further 200 jobs go and the smaller local suppliers lose business/go bust for the same reason this is another nail in the coffin for our city. Surely it is better to have people gainfully employed whether you like the individual owners of particular establishmnets or not. I for one think its a shame and my sympathies are with the employees and their families as lets face it theres not a whole lot of work out there:(

JohnC.

If there is a demand for pubs/clubs, I'm sure either some of these will be saved, while the extra is disposed of, or if the group doesn't survive, the remnants will be taken over and again reopened to a sustainable level.

anplaya

south wrote: »

twisters was €4 a pint only last week and has been any time i've been in there. €5.20 for a pint of Heineken in the woodman after whatever time the price goes up

was in there sunday ,was definately 4.50 .so 70 cents then so ,not 1.20.ill ask a lad i know who works there whats the story with that and get back t ya.

anplaya

ye i knew it was 4 euro thats why i was like wtf.he said it went up to 4.50 at the weekend,friday to sunday,other days its 4 euro a pint.

giles lynchwood

having worked very closely with bob for many years starting at the construction of preachers i have first hand expeirance of the way he works,imho waterford pub scene was static,with no competion you have no incentive to maintain or improve your service and your customer's pay the price,as for the loss of job's,doormen will be retained,90% bar staff will also be kept by any new owners if it come's to breaking up the group to be sold,i think this will be the end result and will be a good outcome for punters in waterford look at killkenny pub scene for example it's way ahead of waterford,why,competion.I have no sympathy at all for bob because if it was another publician in this mess bob's attitude and i quote"that will be a cheap pub to buy"in for the kill show no mercy.I could list many examples of his total disregard for people but what is the point and anyway i do not want to go down to his level.Whatever the outcome one thing is for sure his lifestyle will not suffer to much.He is consumed by his own arrogence even now,his business in tatter's and he is giving advice on wlrfm on how to fix the recession,telling people not to be afraid to go out and spend money which is the reason he is on the verge of been bankrupt.Good Ridden's i say

ex_infantry man

Psychedelic wrote: »

Yeah he owns Club L.A. :pac:

funny man aint we

gobo99

good post there from giles lynchwood. The job losses can't be compared to the crystal. They had nowhere else to go.
If some of Tweedys places are sold (and they probarly wont), staff will most likely be kept by new owners.

mozattack

I have a reasonable knowledge of this. Tweedy had two cash cows (Muldoons and Rubys) and two dead ducks, Oscars and Masons. The later two were continually refurbished at an unreal cost to no benefit while the former were ignored as they were successful.

The former are now in need or repair, especially Muldoons which has is no a ghetto.

Muldoons was purchased solely to avoid someone else owning it and it has completely backfired. The proceeds the Kavanagh's got were mainly invested in Harveys (then Sheffs) which thereby stole most of the Ruby crowd...ha ha.

Also, no worries for him. He is still driving his €100k BMW and living in his 7,000 sq foot house which cost around 6 times the price of mine (including my fit out!)

Adyx

mozattack wrote: »

I have a reasonable knowledge of this. Tweedy had two cash cows (Muldoons and Rubys) and two dead ducks, Oscars and Masons. The later two were continually refurbished at an unreal cost to no benefit while the former were ignored as they were successful.

The former are now in need or repair, especially Muldoons which has is no a ghetto.

Muldoons was purchased solely to avoid someone else owning it and it has completely backfired. The proceeds the Kavanagh's got were mainly invested in Harveys (then Sheffs) which thereby stole most of the Ruby crowd...ha ha.

Also, no worries for him. He is still driving his €100k BMW and living in his 7,000 sq foot house which cost around 6 times the price of mine (including my fit out!)

Not quite true. Muldoons was not ignored. Plans were drawn up for a refurbishment not long after he bought it. However we all know how hard it is to get planning permission for such things especially considering some peoples constant objections :rolleyes:. lol at Muldoons being a ghetto

Odats

Not necessarily regarding Muldoons in cash cow terms when you think of it for the following reason

1. It has realistically only one night a week i.e. Saturday and Bank Holidays when it i packed. Dead most of the week.
2. Bought it at an inflated price at the height of the boom and at a generous interest rate would be paying atleast half a rock in interest alone p.a. before knocking off capital repayments

I agree with the planning problems regarding redevelopment and AFAIK the Kavanaghs had similar problems before they sold it.

Regarding the dead ducks what about Ten premises. Cannot see the Rental Income from EA and the strip club meeting the loan repayments.

Mason's IMO has potential but to survive with late licence etc. Think of moving the Ruby's Lounge over there would be a good idea if they cannot expand which is highly unlikely would make sense. Ruby's lounge is always packed. Not sure about midweek bands etc

Sure Bob is a smart businessman and overextended himself and that is where the problems lie due to the unavailability of credit from the banks.

Adyx

Odats wrote: »

Not necessarily regarding Muldoons in cash cow terms when you think of it for the following reason

1. It has realistically only one night a week i.e. Saturday and Bank Holidays when it i packed. Dead most of the week.
2. Bought it at an inflated price at the height of the boom and at a generous interest rate would be paying atleast half a rock in interest alone p.a. before knocking off capital repayments

I agree with the planning problems regarding redevelopment and AFAIK the Kavanaghs had similar problems before they sold it.

Regarding the dead ducks what about Ten premises. Cannot see the Rental Income from EA and the strip club meeting the loan repayments.

Mason's IMO has potential but to survive with late licence etc. Think of moving the Ruby's Lounge over there would be a good idea if they cannot expand which is highly unlikely would make sense. Ruby's lounge is always packed. Not sure about midweek bands etc

Sure Bob is a smart businessman and overextended himself and that is where the problems lie due to the unavailability of credit from the banks.

I think Ten is what did the damage tbh. It's costing him a fortune while it lies empty. Muldoons isn't even open midweek any more, just Fri, Sat and Sun and you're absolutely right about the Kavanaghs having planning problems too ( a hotel was planned at one stage). I don't think Bob realised the extent of refurbishment required in Muldoons when he bought it. It certainly wasn't worth what he paid for it.

ex_infantry man

the nails in the coffins for most businesses in this city are probably down to planning permission not being granted because of you know who!!!! imagine what our city could be like if permission was granted for businesses to expand or refurbish i,d say we,d be well ahead of other places and not lagging behind

giles lynchwood

i read in the media that the group last submitted account's to the compaines office dublin in 2007 and these were only approved in 2009 TG is this normal practice or does it suggest something else ?.Muldoons was not for sale,a offer of 8 mil was made by a solictor from dungarvan on behalf of a client the agreed figure in the end was 9.75 mil.Bottom line TG owes 10mil+ if the repayments were been made on time this would improve the TG borrowing power,if TG in default no more credit,it's that simple and these thing's do not happen over night.Bank' want their money one way or another,one more thing smart business man and overexstended don't sit right together.Just a thought

mozattack

Just wondering what the Auditors were doing in this case. Anyone know who they were/are and any word from them on this?

giles lynchwood

Another thought.
If the group was operating at a profit, the 3 year's waiting for planning was a ideal time to build up a strong line of credit with their lender's.

deisedol

I hope the tweedy group survive this. They are a local employer that pump a lot of money in to the local economy of our city. If an outsider comes in and takes over they will probaby use suppliers and services from Dublin or elsewhere such as printing, pr, etc. The tweedy group have given back so much to the city in terms of sponshorship of charity events and sports clubs supporting other local business as suppliers of services etc. It would be a shame to loose all that! We need people like Bob Tweedy to drive his home city forward. We need more local people like him willing to take on the headache of employing others and running a business. I dont see the point in outsiders coming in taking over the nightclub/pub scene and taking what they can get and giving nothing back. The tweedy s have employed lots of people over the years , they must be good employers as i know a lot of their staff have been with them over 20 years. Not many employers have such loyalty from their staff , that says a lot to me. Best of luck to the tweedys...a lot of local people hope you pull through this.

Marchandire

deisedol wrote: »

I hope the tweedy group survive this. They are a local employer that pump a lot of money in to the local economy of our city. If an outsider comes in and takes over they will probaby use suppliers and services from Dublin or elsewhere such as printing, pr, etc. The tweedy group have given back so much to the city in terms of sponshorship of charity events and sports clubs supporting other local business as suppliers of services etc. It would be a shame to loose all that! We need people like Bob Tweedy to drive his home city forward. We need more local people like him willing to take on the headache of employing others and running a business. I dont see the point in outsiders coming in taking over the nightclub/pub scene and taking what they can get and giving nothing back. The tweedy s have employed lots of people over the years , they must be good employers as i know a lot of their staff have been with them over 20 years. Not many employers have such loyalty from their staff , that says a lot to me. Best of luck to the tweedys...a lot of local people hope you pull through this.

Well said Bob! Lot of time on your hands lately, I expect?

merlante

deisedol wrote: »

I hope the tweedy group survive this. They are a local employer that pump a lot of money in to the local economy of our city. If an outsider comes in and takes over they will probaby use suppliers and services from Dublin or elsewhere such as printing, pr, etc. The tweedy group have given back so much to the city in terms of sponshorship of charity events and sports clubs supporting other local business as suppliers of services etc. It would be a shame to loose all that! We need people like Bob Tweedy to drive his home city forward. We need more local people like him willing to take on the headache of employing others and running a business. I dont see the point in outsiders coming in taking over the nightclub/pub scene and taking what they can get and giving nothing back. The tweedy s have employed lots of people over the years , they must be good employers as i know a lot of their staff have been with them over 20 years. Not many employers have such loyalty from their staff , that says a lot to me. Best of luck to the tweedys...a lot of local people hope you pull through this.

Why would they be 'outsiders'? Why wouldn't Waterford investors take them over? Wouldn't that be more likely, given that locals know the Waterford scene? What we need is for every pub to be sold to a different owner and for half of the owners to be local. It would be nice if somehow Tweedy ended up with one of them. We need people coming in from outside as well. We need new people buying into Waterford.

giles lynchwood

Adyx wrote: »

I think Ten is what did the damage tbh. It's costing him a fortune while it lies empty. Muldoons isn't even open midweek any more, just Fri, Sat and Sun and you're absolutely right about the Kavanaghs having planning problems too ( a hotel was planned at one stage). I don't think Bob realised the extent of refurbishment required in Muldoons when he bought it. It certainly wasn't worth what he paid for it.

When the K brothers went for planning for the hotel,this was solely done to avail of a tax break that was available at the time,all you had to do to was apply to build a hotel 35 room's or more and you were granted more tax relief even if your planning was refused the fact you applied was enough,they were no more going to build a hotel then the man in the moon.When i worked with the K brother's muldoon's was turning over 136k a week,and a 73% mark up.Imho bob bought muldoon's to save the group,within the industry it was common knowledge he was struggling back then.If the group goes bankrupt the amount of debt's outstanding will far outway it's input over the years

deisedol

Marchandire wrote: »

Well said Bob! Lot of time on your hands lately, I expect?

FYI- I am Deisedol- - In real life i am a woman and my name is not bob. Do you think women are not capapble of going on the net and having an opinion or comment on a local news issue. i am not related to tweedys either in case u are wondering. I just spoke my mind on the issue and i have no agenda whatsoever.

Adyx

giles lynchwood wrote: »

When the K brothers went for planning for the hotel,this was solely done to avail of a tax break that was available at the time,all you had to do to was apply to build a hotel 35 room's or more and you were granted more tax relief even if your planning was refused the fact you applied was enough,they were no more going to build a hotel then the man in the moon.When i worked with the K brother's muldoon's was turning over 136k a week,and a 73% mark up.Imho bob bought muldoon's to save the group,within the industry it was common knowledge he was struggling back then.If the group goes bankrupt the amount of debt's outstanding will far outway it's input over the years

Whatever about the hotel/tax break bit, I think you missed the point of my post. It doesn't matter why Bob bought Muldoon's, the fact is that considering the state the Kavanaghs left Muldoons in, it would cost a small fortune to put it right and even considering the size and location, it wasn't worth 9.5 million. Muldoons was on the way out before Bob bought it. I've worked there longer than anyone (since 2002) and as soon as Merlins was turned into Oxygen the place has just been getting quieter and quieter. It's input to the Tweedy group has been very poor for the last 2/3 years. In fact whilst Ten is probably the biggest single culprit for this mess, the lack of evolution in Muldoons compared with its cost is a significant factor.

giles lynchwood

adyx i agree 100% with what you say,the failure of oxygen was a kick in thr nut's to the k's and came very close to putting them in same boat as bob is now,however Muldoons always maintained it's figures and carried oxygen forever.I have no respect for both familes because of the way they run their business's,they had a stranglehold on the late night scene for far too long and it is time for change.I wonder if the person who lent bob the money for muldoon's still has a job.

2Bv¬2B

Just one thought....

Tweedy Group has 8-10 places in the town. I think this is just a stunt, if he cannot afford to repay the banks, the banks are going to be left with 8-10 locations that are worth nothing.

Clano

2Bv¬2B wrote: »

Just one thought....

Tweedy Group has 8-10 places in the town. I think this is just a stunt, if he cannot afford to repay the banks, the banks are going to be left with 8-10 locations that are worth nothing.

Nope iv heard from a very reliable that masons muldoons and oxygen are to be closed. not sure about others but rubys and rubys lounge are being kept.

abouttobebanned

Rumours, rumours, rumours, and the bullshhiit.

Adyx

8 to 10 places? Masons, Rubys and Muldoons equals 3 by my count. Ten is already closed but that's still only 4. Bad Bobs/Park Inn were never technically part of the group and Oskar's isn't either any more (neither are affected by this anyway). Also nothing will be closed before Jan/Feb (if even then). How can it be stunt? The High Court doesn't put companies in examinership for the lulz.