Fulham v Liverpool Match Thread 3pm Sat (Read mod note in OP)

K-9

d22ontour wrote: »

This makes sense, he started because the squad past maybe 14 players is weak , no ?

Yet you argue team the today was a decent enough one?

Make up your mind.

K-9

DM-ICE wrote: »

He said "I'm afraid It's got to a stage where Rafa has no option but to leave him out", speaking about Insua.

Ah thought so.

Any cover for Insua today?

daithijjj

Are you sure he was talking about insua?, i thought he was talking about carragher.

Insua is still a young fella learning as he goes along, he should be afforded the luxury of the odd mistake considering the sh1te carra has being playing this season. I like insua myself, doesnt bother me that he has had a few mistakes, carra on the other hand has been doing this for donkeys years and hes playing some awful sh1t to be honest.

d22ontour

K-9 wrote: »

Yet you argue team the today was a decent enough one?

Make up your mind.

Squad > Team ?

It was a decent team considering your squad depth no ? I said 8 of them could start any given week no ?

Your post makes little sense no ?

Flame me for posting something stupid but come on, squads are based on fit players not injuries that all clubs have to deal with.All you whine about is if such and such was fit when infact every starter should have a back up of some sort to give some impact at some stage.Looking at the whines here it's kinda obvious you dun have the backup , no ?

That's when it comes down to the manager.

K-9

d22ontour wrote: »

Squad > Team ?

It was a decent team considering your squad depth no ? I said 8 of them could start any given week no ?

Your post makes little sense no ?

Flame me for posting something stupid but come on, squads are based on fit players not injuries that all clubs have to deal with.All you whine about is if such and such was fit when infact every starter should have a back up of some sort to give some impact at some stage.Looking at the whines here it's kinda obvious you dun have the backup , no ?

That's when it comes down to the manager.

No, you said we put out a decent team today, which we did.

Then you say the squad past 14 players is weak.

There is no debating with you with those double standards.

d22ontour

K-9 wrote: »

No, you said we put out a decent team today, which we did.

For you, yes it was, even moreso with the injury whining.Infact without 2/3 players it's your strongest team.You can counter without 2/3 players it isnt your strongest team ?

K-9 wrote: »

Then you say the squad past 14 players is weak.

For the rest of us looking in , yes it is infact a weak squad bar 1/2/3 players that was your strongest team , no ?

K-9 wrote: »

There is no debating with you with those double standards.

We counter your whining about injuries by stating you had a half decent team out ? You think having 2/3 players out is a crisis ?

You can only start a game with 11 players ya know ? Naming 5/6/7 injured players is just another excuse for the current failings.

You have a squad of 25 assembled by your manager.You would think without Gerrard and some other minor players you could cope ?

K-9

d22ontour wrote: »

For you, yes it was, even moreso with the injury whining.Infact without 2/3 players it's your strongest team.You can counter without 2/3 players it isnt your strongest team ?



For the rest of us looking in , yes it is infact a weak squad bar 1/2/3 players that was your strongest team , no ?



We counter your whining about injuries by stating you had a half decent team out ? You think having 2/3 players out is a crisis ?

You can only start a game with 11 players ya know ? Naming 5/6/7 injured players is just another excuse for the current failings.

You have a squad of 25 assembled by your manager.You would think without Gerrard and some other minor players you could cope ?

No Johhson, Kelly, Agger, Skyrtel and Auerlio.
That's just the back 4.

Sinking in yet?

K-9

d22ontour wrote: »

For you, yes it was, even moreso with the injury whining.Infact without 2/3 players it's your strongest team.You can counter without 2/3 players it isnt your strongest team ?

No. You said it was a decent team.

My work is done!

d22ontour wrote:

For the rest of us looking in , yes it is infact a weak squad bar 1/2/3 players that was your strongest team , no ?

Yet you say it was a decent team.[/quote]

d22ontour wrote:

We counter your whining about injuries by stating you had a half decent team out ? You think having 2/3 players out is a crisis ? [/quote[

Yet, we've no strength in depth.

d22ontour wrote:

You can only start a game with 11 players ya know ? Naming 5/6/7 injured players is just another excuse for the current failings.

Same point over and over, just repeated ad nausea.

d22ontour wrote:

You have a squad of 25 assembled by your manager.You would think without Gerrard and some other minor players you could cope ?

Not responding anymore d22ontour.

Hank Scorpio

all in all liverpools team/squad is weaker than the other big teams and thats what it boils down too

ntlbell

Mr Alan wrote: »

Rafa Benitez is ****e at substitutions?

old article, but although i didn't agree with Rafas substitution of Yossi today, generally he makes the right changes.

I didn't really have time earlier to dicuss the finer points of the nonsense that you posted.

As with any article nonsensical stats runner up's etc produce because these things are usually only produced to prove why something didn't happen rather than why they did

so in the article above it's an attempt to prove why liverpool haven't WON the league under benitiez even tho they havent been capable of it for the last few decades

and before a mod decides it's not related to the thread it will be related at some point.

when you provide the stats above it can be interrupted in a number of ways

the first way is to assume if so many goals were scored when subs were made that the manager made poor choices before kick off and he rectified his mistakes afterwards. is this the sign of a good manager?

the second way is to compare them to previous managers

who had different players, the changes were made against different teams, in different circumstances, so like the above it says _some_ were made when behind.

how many of those times where when the pool were a goal or more behind? how many where when the teams went in 0-0 1-1 2-2

how many were when the team was 1-0 up 2-0 up 3-0 up?

at the time who had that particular manager got on the bench to bring on?

why were those particular players on the bench at that time

rafa's policy's of buying players and decisions over the last 4-5 years determined the bench he had TODAY, rafa decided on the starting 11 TODAY he put players in specific positions TODAY he chose the formation TODAY he chose the tactics TODAY he removed 3 of his most influential players TODAY (while each of them shook their head in dis belief TODAY

as has been pointed out by every pundit alive over the last few years rafa continues to make mistake after mistake after mistake.

when a pundit points this out about a wigan defence, or a halifax defence an eye lid is not baddid, but when pointed out about the pool LIKE TODAY AGAINST FULLHAM every trick in the book is pulled out including articles written years ago to try and throw some nonsensical delusion truth over whats really going on.

the team that was put out there today consisted of AT MOST two players worthy of playing in a top 4 team, the rest are not worthy. this is not due to lack of spending or lack of money to rafa it's a down to overall bad choices been made at managerr level year after year

TODAYS bench is nothing to do with swine flu or injuries regardless of that it wouldn't be good enough

today saw the 6th defeat in 7 games yet people ask who is out there that can do a better job? really? there's not many manager in any league world wide in the top flight who claim match such a bad record, by that rational surely anyone would be better?

today is a reflection of what every Liverpool fan didn't want to hear

the manager is not good enough, the squad is not good enough.

11 points the league leaders and no team has won the prem after losig more than 5 games.

should they lose on wed the year is practically over in nov

8 weeks before xmas?

who's good enough to better that with the money been spent and the current squad?

I'd assume Des could do a better job.

time to get real lads.

this not your year and while rafa is at the helm nor is "next year"

fullham were excellent today and did the basics that an other particular top 4 team didn't bother to do and showed up the extremely average mid field that was mighty last week for what it really is average at best.

jank

Just saw the Cara sending off or should I say rugby tackle. His dip in form reminds me of the way Sol Campbell ending his Arsenal career. His pace seems to have gone, a bit like Rio as well actually!

ntlbell

jank wrote: »

Just saw the Cara sending off or should I say rugby tackle. His dip in form reminds me of the way Sol Campbell ending his Arsenal career. His pace seems to have gone, a bit like Rio as well actually!

it has been said by me and many others before, his entuhisiasim over the years used to make up for everything else he lacked as a footballer, as he gets older you don't get two chances to make up for the same mistake and what got him out of it previously is vanishing.

your not now suddenly seing misktakes, the mistakes werre always there, but he had youth on his side to adjust from each of the mistakes he made

if he was like maldini or any other world class defender you wouldn't notice any change with age as his football brain would make up for it

but when you lack a football brain and pace/youth then you see problems. so his lack of real defence know how, for seeing problems before they arise is coming to the for which were never noticed before because he "worked" so hard previously to cover them up

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

all in all liverpools team/squad is weaker than the other big teams and thats what it boils down too

And somebody said otherwise on this thread?

ntlbell

K-9 wrote: »

And somebody said otherwise on this thread?

i didn't see any liverpool fans blame rafa for the streghnt or lack there of. who was a liverpool fan

did you?

K-9

ntlbell wrote: »

i didn't see any liverpool fans blame rafa for the streghnt or lack there of. who was a liverpool fan

did you?

Edit! So you agree.
Fair enough.

Hank Scorpio

K-9 wrote: »

Edit! So you agree.
Fair enough.

lols want me to quote some of yours posts so you look silly?:)

i really felt sorry for benitez today, no-one deserves that kind of pressure

ntlbell

ntlbell wrote: »

it has been said by me and many others before, his entuhisiasim over the years used to make up for everything else he lacked as a footballer, as he gets older you don't get two chances to make up for the same mistake and what got him out of it previously is vanishing.

your not now suddenly seing misktakes, the mistakes werre always there, but he had youth on his side to adjust from each of the mistakes he made

if he was like maldini or any other world class defender you wouldn't notice any change with age as his football brain would make up for it

but when you lack a football brain and pace/youth then you see problems. so his lack of real defence know how, for seeing problems before they arise is coming to the for which were never noticed before because he "worked" so hard previously to cover them up

Not trying to make a dig a United etc but this is a perfect explanation of Rio at the moment.

Good post.

ntlbell

K-9 wrote: »

Edit! So you agree.
Fair enough.

it's ok, i'm used to dealing with this in work.

here we go.

wait for it.

liverpool fans accept the team is rubbish and shouldn't be able to beat fullham or win the league.

but no liverpool fans blame rafa.

If we both agree.

i win

if you don't agree.

i win

if you don't agree

you have to explain why.

if you don't

i win.

it has to some way relate to the fullham match.

see? boards is easy!

Hank Scorpio

ntlbell wrote: »

it's ok, i'm used to dealing with this in work.

here we go.

wait for it.

liverpool fans accept the team is rubbish and shouldn't be able to beat fullham or win the league.

but no liverpool fans blame rafa.

If we both agree.

i win

if you don't agree.

i win

if you don't agree

you have to explain why.

if you don't

i win.

it has to some way relate to the fullham match.

see? boards is easy!

In fairness alot of there fans are loyal

But they realise there team isnt anywhere close to arsenal,utd or chelsea.

In a way i respect that - but when push comes to shove, trophys matter

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

lols want me to quote some of yours posts so you look silly?:)

i really felt sorry for benitez today, no-one deserves that kind of pressure

ntlbell wrote: »

it's ok, i'm used to dealing with this in work.

here we go.

wait for it.

liverpool fans accept the team is rubbish and shouldn't be able to beat fullham or win the league.

but no liverpool fans blame rafa.

If we both agree.

i win

if you don't agree.

i win

if you don't agree

you have to explain why.

if you don't

i win.

it has to some way relate to the fullham match.

see? boards is easy!

The thing is, very few of us, if any have said that!

Hank Scorpio

K-9 wrote: »

The thing is, very few of us, if any have said that!

No offence mate, but im a neutral, and everytime i see liverpool loose theres post upon post making excuses

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

lols want me to quote some of yours posts so you look silly?:)

i really felt sorry for benitez today, no-one deserves that kind of pressure

Huh? Vorinin?

ntlbell

Deleted User wrote: »

Not trying to make a dig a United etc but this is a perfect explanation of Rio at the moment.

Good post.

if the mods will allow me.

not exactly true.

rio has been brutal at times because he lacks focus, his concentration levels dropped at times and he got caught out.

carra had excellent concetration levels because he knew this was the only way he could stay in the squad because when you lack a footballing brain you have to work harder.

think of the slow guy in your math class to help, he could probbaly get the answer but it took him an hour to do so this was with full concentration.

rio was so good he thinks at times he doesn't need full concentration and gets caught got out, think of the swat in your class.

both are equally lacking something.

but we can have a jab at both.

I'm the one who doesn't care who you jab at.

and your probable the mate of the swat?

does this help?

(to the mods, i'm justing this as an example to explain the scenario, i'm not trying to infer he pals with swats, who does? )

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

No offence mate, but im a neutral, and everytime i see liverpool loose theres post upon post making excuses

If United, Chelsea etc. lose there is excuses! LOL
Nobody is offering excuses re Varonin!

You are seeing things that aren't there!

Hank Scorpio

reina is class, torres is class, gerrard is class

People seem to by hyping up benyaoun, (spelling prolly wrong) , but tbh, can u even see him getting into the arsenal utd or chelsea side?

Liverpool are a strong club with good history but thats all your living off I stopped supporting chelsea when the takeover happened, must be about 6 years ago now

Masherano is average, and so is your entire midfield, your defence is decent, but carragher is past it, and without torres up front there is nobody half decent to cut it

Hank Scorpio

K-9 wrote: »

If United, Chelsea etc. lose there is excuses! LOL
Nobody is offering excuses re Varonin!

You are seeing things that aren't there!

Utd or chelsea havent lost any where close to the amount of games liverpool has lost this season, nevermind the champions league games

ntlbell

K-9 wrote: »

If United, Chelsea etc. lose there is excuses! LOL
Nobody is offering excuses re Varonin!

You are seeing things that aren't there!

there is excuses from pool fans for today tho

flu.

ref.

blah blah.

carra should have gone off in previous games, could of changed the result

liverpool fans claim that wouldnt have happened

liverpool get a player sent of and get done in

now they claim it changed the result.;


lol

they have to make up their mind and stick to it

otherwise one just looks stupid.

you decide.

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

reina is class, torres is class, gerrard is class

People seem to by hyping up benyaoun, (spelling prolly wrong) , but tbh, can u even see him getting into the arsenal utd or chelsea side?

Liverpool are a strong club with good history but thats all your living off I stopped supporting chelsea when the takeover happened, must be about 6 years ago now

Masherano is average, and so is your entire midfield, your defence is decent, but carragher is past it, and without torres up front there is nobody half decent to cut it

There is no replying to that. Beny is an absolute bargain, hence why everybody moans when he's subbed.:rolleyes:

He's class when he's subbed but crap when played.

K-9

ntlbell wrote: »

there is excuses from pool fans for today tho

flu.

ref.

blah blah.

carra should have gone off in previous games, could of changed the result

liverpool fans claim that wouldnt have happened

liverpool get a player sent of and get done in

now they claim it changed the result.;


lol

they have to make up their mind and stick to it

otherwise one just looks stupid.

you decide.

Explain how Carra going of would have changed results?

Hank Scorpio

K-9 wrote: »

There is no replying to that. Beny is an absolute bargain, hence why everybody moans when he's subbed..

He's class when he's subbed but crap when played.

Ask yourself the 2 main questions mate,

Do liverpool have a chance to win the premiership

Are liverpool gona qualify for the knockout stages of the CL

Surely you must answer no to both

ntlbell

K-9 wrote: »

There is no replying to that. Beny is an absolute bargain, hence why everybody moans when he's subbed..

He's class when he's subbed but crap when played.

not trying to have a jab at benny.



but how many matches against world class teams has he came on and did the buisness?

just asking as i dont personally know

i'd like to know

its just something thats asked of great players you know, what do they do in big games

few examples?

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

Ask yourself the 2 main questions mate,

Do liverpool have a chance to win the premiership

Are liverpool gona qualify for the knockout stages of the CL

Surely you must answer no to both

Answer my previous post.

K-9

ntlbell wrote: »

not trying to have a jab at benny.



but how many matches against world class teams has he came on and did the buisness?

just asking as i dont personally know

i'd like to know

its just something thats asked of great players you know, what do they do in big games

few examples?

Benny is class. For 5/6 Million. Bargain!

ntlbell

K-9 wrote: »

Explain how Carra going of would have changed results?

well, rafa claimed sending off's effected liverpool today and changed the result

he should have been sent off in previous matches this year including a high profile match recently.

a lot earlier than he got the first yellow

liverpool been down to 10 possibly 9 men in those games could have changed the result

LIKE IT DID TODAY ACCORDING TO RAFFA

but him NOT going off possibly kept them with the points POSSIBLY

so eithier sending of today didn't change the result.

or previous games where he wasn't sent off where he should did


see?

Hank Scorpio

K-9 wrote: »

There is no replying to that. Beny is an absolute bargain, hence why everybody moans when he's subbed.:rolleyes:

He's class when he's subbed but crap when played.

He would not get into the utd, chelsea or arsenal side and i believe that

K-9

nuxxx wrote: »

He would not get into the utd, chelsea or arsenal side and i believe that

His record says No to that. He's an absolute bargain and manys the United fan who betted on him last season to score a goal.

ntlbell

nuxxx wrote: »

He would not get into the utd, chelsea or arsenal side and i believe that

dunno about that.

if i was sir alex ferguson one of the most succesful managers of all time.

i'd have benny in my first 11.

BASED ON TODAYS GAME AGAINST FULLHAM


(and other previous games and unites current squad)

K-9

ntlbell wrote: »

well, rafa claimed sending off's effected liverpool today and changed the result

he should have been sent off in previous matches this year including a high profile match recently.

a lot earlier than he got the first yellow

liverpool been down to 10 possibly 9 men in those games could have changed the result

LIKE IT DID TODAY ACCORDING TO RAFFA

but him NOT going off possibly kept them with the points POSSIBLY

so eithier sending of today didn't change the result.

or previous games where he wasn't sent off where he should did


see?

Ref doesn't care about previous matches, or shouldn't ntlbell, unlike yourself.

Nuff said.

K-9

K-9 wrote: »

His record says No to that. He's an absolute bargain and manys the United fan who betted on him last season to score a goal.

Just to add, a year ago I would have agreed with Nuxxxx.

Now, he could well be the best bargain of the top 4.

ntlbell

K-9 wrote: »

Ref doesn't care about previous matches, or shouldn't ntlbell, unlike yourself.

Nuff said.

you asked how carra not getting sent of would effect the game.

i answered you.

the ref is irrelevant.

nice mr alan job.

i like discussing the game with honest folk if you want to talk nonsense and play games, i know loads of games.

but i'll assume you'll apply with a smart answer and no response to the real question

avoidance i think they call it.

Hank Scorpio

K-9 wrote: »

His record says No to that. He's an absolute bargain and manys the United fan who betted on him last season to score a goal.

Hes a decent player im not argueing that, but i do not believe for a second he is top quality, hopefully he will prove me wrong.

I have no doubt you guys will finish 4th, but i sence a change in management after wednesday

ntlbell

nuxxx wrote: »

Hes a decent player im not argueing that, but i do not believe for a second he is top quality, hopefully he will prove me wrong.

I have no doubt you guys will finish 4th, but i sence a change in management after wednesday

if they had the cash your senses would be spot on

but while there is swine flu and a lack of cash.

your nose is blocked

K-9

ntlbell wrote: »

you asked how carra not getting sent of would effect the game.

i answered you.

the ref is irrelevant.

nice mr alan job.

i like discussing the game with honest folk if you want to talk nonsense and play games, i know loads of games.

but i'll assume you'll apply with a smart answer and no response to the real question

avoidance i think they call it.

Learned from the best.

Very little avoidance in this tread

Good night.

Hank Scorpio

ntlbell wrote: »

if they had the cash your senses would be spot on

but while there is swine flu and a lack of cash.

your nose is blocked

wasnt he bought a couple of seasons ago? and ye i do have swine flu

Paul Tergat

K-9 wrote: »

Just to add, a year ago I would have agreed with Nuxxxx.

Now, he could well be the best bargain of the top 4.

Benayoun for 5 million I think it was. Evra at 5.5 is a greater bargain just off the top of my head

Helix

K-9 wrote: »

Now, he could well be the best bargain of the top 4.

fabregas?

curry-muff

How the tides have turned Less Liverpool fans on Uniteds thread and less abu on Uniteds thread, surely this can only be good for boards.ie

curry-muff

K-9 wrote: »

Benny is class. For 5/6 Million. Bargain!

Benny, put him in arsenals team and youve got a winner, put him in any other premiership first 11 and you will regret it, the one team he would fit is Arsenal and honestly would be wasted anywhere else

anplaya

ntlbell wrote: »

if the mods will allow me.

not exactly true.

rio has been brutal at times because he lacks focus, his concentration levels dropped at times and he got caught out.

carra had excellent concetration levels because he knew this was the only way he could stay in the squad because when you lack a footballing brain you have to work harder.

think of the slow guy in your math class to help, he could probbaly get the answer but it took him an hour to do so this was with full concentration.

rio was so good he thinks at times he doesn't need full concentration and gets caught got out, think of the swat in your class.

both are equally lacking something.

but we can have a jab at both.

I'm the one who doesn't care who you jab at.

and your probable the mate of the swat?

does this help?

(to the mods, i'm justing this as an example to explain the scenario, i'm not trying to infer he pals with swats, who does? )

surely ya mean swot not swat?

have to say tho ive been reading most of the posts,and ive gotta agree with most of what your saying.a lot of liverpool fans are living in denial land tbh.

Handsome Bob

anplaya wrote: »

have to say tho ive been reading most of the posts,and ive gotta agree with most of what your saying.a lot of liverpool fans are living in denial land tbh.

LZ5by5 wrote: »

ntlbell, let's play a hypothetical game here;

Say John O'Shea was injured.

Say you had two arguable first choice defenders out like Johnny Evans and Rio Ferdinand.

Say you had Wayne Rooney out.

Say you had to substitute Berbatov after 50 minutes.

Finally, let's say all these important players have been either missing individually or as a unit over the last six games, do you think Man U wouldn't struggle? Don't bother replying, I know what your reply will be, and it won't be the truth. What's new with you eh?

Mr Alan wrote: »

thats also excl the likes of Aurelio (giggs?),Ngog (owen?), Riera (park?) Aquilani (scholes?fletcher?)

Next.