SGU 1x06 "Water" **SPOILERS**

hightower1

Next episode "Earth" preview here.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiW7LO0wUlE&feature=player_embedded

minidazzler

Senna wrote: »

Really enjoyed "Water", the attack seen was completely different from what would have been shown in SG1/SGA. I'm enjoying the character developments, but i still just dont get Eli, someone above dismissed the Wesley Crusher connection but i'm not so sure. Young telling him to clean up the room was very "Captain Picard to Wesley". He the boy genius who has no experience but still has more input compared to the real scientists on board. But i'll give that another few episodes to develop.

It's because of his lack of experience I would think.

Eli is not someone who can accept authority where he finds it, but has the backbone to stand up when he knows he's right. The Scientists on board were on the Icarus project for the chance of doing a once in a lifetime thing, with little to no personal danger that they knew of.

Eli, is not just a boy genius, he has shown the ability to learn at an incredible pace without being a social retard.

Young trusts him because Young see's Eli as someone who has no reason to lie, Eli wants to be please everyone so he is not gonna bull**** anyone. Young has led men before, he can probably see this in Eli.

hightower1

minidazzler wrote: »

It's because of his lack of experience I would think.

Eli is not someone who can accept authority where he finds it, but has the backbone to stand up when he knows he's right. The Scientists on board were on the Icarus project for the chance of doing a once in a lifetime thing, with little to no personal danger that they knew of.

Eli, is not just a boy genius, he has shown the ability to learn at an incredible pace without being a social retard.

Young trusts him because Young see's Eli as someone who has no reason to lie, Eli wants to be please everyone so he is not gonna bull**** anyone. Young has led men before, he can probably see this in Eli.

I have to say I agree with Senna, Eli is just a bit tacky and unrealistic compared to the rest of the people. He seems to stand out like a sore thumb as the "generic target audience point of relation" guy.
In a scene of military, scientific and administrative types the A typical teen slacker making goofy jokes is a bit obvious and irritating.

I mean come on....










And then....

Well there is a suicide coming up so I can only pray its him but you know its gonna be the guy hoarding food and popping pills sigh.

Overheal

hightower1 wrote: »

I have to say I agree with Senna, Eli is just a bit tacky and unrealistic compared to the rest of the people. He seems to stand out like a sore thumb as the "generic target audience point of relation" guy.
In a scene of military, scientific and administrative types the A typical teen slacker making goofy jokes is a bit obvious and irritating.

I mean come on....


<--- believable

<--- Odd

<--- Takes himself way too seriously

<---- Very believable

And then....


<--- me!

Well there is a suicide coming up so I can only pray its him but you know its gonna be the guy hoarding food and popping pills sigh.

.

Memnoch

I'm enjoying the show. I liked the way they handled "aliens" in this episode though the whole, lure em into a barrel of water was a bit obvious/cheap/cop out. I still can't shake the feeling that each episode contains far too much filler and far too little story.

What I also don't get is all this fanfare about the supposedly amazing characters. They don't seem that special or deep to me. Not yet anywho. I guess I haven't watched enough sci-fi/fantasy lately but the standard of characters must be really appalling for people to be so bowled over by Universe's.

BSG comparisons might be obvious but...

who here compares to...

psychotic, aggressive, stunning, gifted genius pilot who takes no **** and dishes the hurt - starbuck.

Pretty boy scott?

What about Adama? A real leader. Young pales in comparison so far. Even though they broke his head and leg in the first ep.

What about Tigh? Probably one of the best characters to grace a sci-fi show. So conflicted from the start. A poster child for irony.

And Guyus Baltar? Betrayer of the human race, genius, hopelessly narcisstic and oh SO human.

Now I agree it's only the first 6 episodes, but many of the major char's in BSG were much better established half way into season one.

So far, Rush seems kinda interesting though in an obvious, 'mad scientist,' kind of way. I like the 'bad ass,' dude (can't remember his name), though he could be a little less unpredictable from time to time. He's too much of a 'honoured and noble badass,' atm.

Again, I'm glad they made this. I'm still watching it every Tuesday night on Sky HD. It's a fun show. But let's not make it into something it isn't.

GSPfan

So basically you like BSG better than this. We get it.

ei.sdraob

GSPfan wrote: »

So basically you like BSG better than this. We get it.

i actually get offended when a comparison is made to BSG

its nothing like it and yes im a big fan of BSG and all the gates and treks

Universe stands well on its own, a comparison to BSG is very lazy

don ramo

Memnoch wrote: »

I'm enjoying the show. I liked the way they handled "aliens" in this episode though the whole, lure em into a barrel of water was a bit obvious/cheap/cop out. I still can't shake the feeling that each episode contains far too much filler and far too little story.

What I also don't get is all this fanfare about the supposedly amazing characters. They don't seem that special or deep to me. Not yet anywho. I guess I haven't watched enough sci-fi/fantasy lately but the standard of characters must be really appalling for people to be so bowled over by Universe's.

BSG comparisons might be obvious but...

who here compares to...

psychotic, aggressive, stunning, gifted genius pilot who takes no **** and dishes the hurt - starbuck.

Pretty boy scott?

What about Adama? A real leader. Young pales in comparison so far. Even though they broke his head and leg in the first ep.

What about Tigh? Probably one of the best characters to grace a sci-fi show. So conflicted from the start. A poster child for irony.

And Guyus Baltar? Betrayer of the human race, genius, hopelessly narcisstic and oh SO human.

Now I agree it's only the first 6 episodes, but many of the major char's in BSG were much better established half way into season one.

So far, Rush seems kinda interesting though in an obvious, 'mad scientist,' kind of way. I like the 'bad ass,' dude (can't remember his name), though he could be a little less unpredictable from time to time. He's too much of a 'honoured and noble badass,' atm.

Again, I'm glad they made this. I'm still watching it every Tuesday night on Sky HD. It's a fun show. But let's not make it into something it isn't.

no one is making it into something it isnt, cause its not BSG, if i wanted to watch a show like BSG id just watch BSG again,

this is stargate universe, its only 6 episodes in, it may have a slightly darker tone than regular stargate but if BSG is a 8-9 dark tone this is a 3-5 dark tone, if they want to keep the fans happy they cant really stray to far from what stargate is, stargate has always been an enjoyable show to watch,

i liked atalantis a lot but it strayed from what it started as in season one where we meet the wraith, a blood thirsty species that literally sucks the life out of you, now how ****in dark is that, but the show changed and became what is was, and thats a balance, and i dont think it was a bad thing, i mean we had what sci-fi has been since that 60s in stargate, fun and enjoyable to watch, and at the same time we had BSG i very intense dark sci-fi show to watch, so atlantis was never gonna maintain being so serious from the start, it was a great balance, and most likely a lot of stragate fans were BSG fans,

why not wait till at least mid-season before we judge the show to be stargate or BSG, personally i think its stragate, its just nowhere near BSG for intensity, and i dont consider that bad,

Overheal

Memnoch wrote: »

...

I dont see what any of your post had to do with this show. If you want to appreciate BSG take it to the BSG forum. This is not BSG. This is Stargate. The only relation this show has to BSG is they are on a ship out in god knows where heading to god knows where. There are no cylons, there is no destroyed homeworld, there is no religious or prophetic bull****, there are no vipers or phasers or photon torpedoes or klingons or sandworms or Vampires or Wizards or superheroes or Decepticons.

Its Stargate.

Turtwig

Overheal wrote: »

..This is Stargate...There are no ...Wizards....

*Cough* Merlin *Cough*:p

Overheal

he was an ancient dammit. not a wizard. though he played one on TV :pac:

Memnoch

I know it's stargate. But people keep going on and on about deep characters, and frankly I don't see that.

You might say a comparison to BSG is lazy or whatever. But as far as I'm concerned BSG set the standard for strong/deep characters, not only in the sci-fi genre but in recent television.

So naturally that's what I'm going to compare the characters too.

It is stargate, I LIKE stargate, I LIKE stargate Universe, but the characters aren't deep, sorry, they just aren't, not yet anyway.

For examples of characters with humanity and depth, see my post above.

Overheal

Those characters werent at all deep 7 episodes in either.

You had tomboy, drunk, old leader dude, scared brainhead, cute uhura homage, and whiney piss-ant president lady.

Time gentleman, Please.

Memnoch

Overheal wrote: »

Those characters werent at all deep 7 episodes in either.

You had tomboy, drunk, old leader dude, scared brainhead, cute uhura homage, and whiney piss-ant president lady.

Time gentleman, Please.

I don't remember the exact point where the characters in BSG became deep, I never found myself thinking they were cliche'd or shallow though.

Even if I agree 100% with this post, how does that change the fact that SG:U chars are just not that deep right now. MAYBE they will improve with time, maybe they won't. But they aren't anything special right now and people keep praising that aspect of the show about something that just isn't there.

ixoy

I don't think there was much depth to any of BSG's characters at this point and indeed, for some, there was never any - Apollo will always be a whiny bitch with daddy issues for example. The love triangles between the younger cast were always tiresome so I don't want to see anything repeated like that.

It's early days here and I think they're doing a good job. I'll agree though that there's nothing revelatory yet about them with only Rush being the most unique. I like the rest but they've not yet defined themselves in any remarkable way.

Overheal

I never did go for the Starbuck/Uhura/Lee/Billy thing. Helen is also the most worthless appendix of that whole series.

Saul really got into his click after Exodus (2+ Seasons). Adama was always alright - he's only cool when he's pissed off.

As for Young here, he's a neat guy. Human. rewatch the scene at his Ex-Wife's door and play it against any of his scenes aboard Destiny when he is presenting himself as a Commander.

Then of course theres Telford, a very 2 Dimensional Character, Chloe who is only scraping by on her looks at the moment (but I thought she did the drunk thing well enough) and Rush who is probably going to reveal himself to be a great character once we know more about him, much in the same way we had to learn about Characters like Saul Tigh or Jean Luc Picard before they became intriguing.

It'll take time. Its like meeting someone new in the pub. Fast forward 2 years later, and you'd probably like them a whole lot more knowing them a whole lot better. Despite the fact that they probably had the same personality 2 years ago as they did today. You just cant expect these characters to be all that rich just yet when we dont know a damn thing about most of them.

don ramo

Overheal wrote: »

I never did go for the Starbuck/Uhura/Lee/Billy thing. Helen is also the most worthless appendix of that whole series.

Saul really got into his click after Exodus (2+ Seasons). Adama was always alright - he's only cool when he's pissed off.

As for Young here, he's a neat guy. Human. rewatch the scene at his Ex-Wife's door and play it against any of his scenes aboard Destiny when he is presenting himself as a Commander.

Then of course theres Telford, a very 2 Dimensional Character, Chloe who is only scraping by on her looks at the moment (but I thought she did the drunk thing well enough) and Rush who is probably going to reveal himself to be a great character once we know more about him, much in the same way we had to learn about Characters like Saul Tigh or Jean Luc Picard before they became intriguing.

It'll take time. Its like meeting someone new in the pub. Fast forward 2 years later, and you'd probably like them a whole lot more knowing them a whole lot better. Despite the fact that they probably had the same personality 2 years ago as they did today. You just cant expect these characters to be all that rich just yet when we dont know a damn thing about most of them.

spot on, and the great thing about stargate being on the sci-fi channel is that the show will be here in 2 years time and we can debate this issue further,

Overheal

Especially if it stays this good - and DVD sales stay steady. Apparently SyFy is really paranoid about that.

don ramo

Overheal wrote: »

Especially if it stays this good - and DVD sales stay steady. Apparently SyFy is really paranoid about that.

i like dvds but TBH i much prefer waiting for complete series to buy boxsets,

lining up BSG and LOST blue-ray sets for next year, when i buy a blue-ray drive for the PC

im thinking of getting SG-1 complete as i bought the DVD magazine and its taking up 4 foot of shelve space, but it looks cool so i dunno, it really is just wastfull, ive TNG, SG-1 and Atlantis plus all the trek films, taking up a lot of shelf space,

Overheal

Having the SG-1 is pointless unless theres a lot of SF. Seasons 1 through 8 are all on Hulu. Im currently all the way up to Citizen Joe

don ramo

Overheal wrote: »

Having the SG-1 is pointless unless theres a lot of SF. Seasons 1 through 8 are all on Hulu. Im currently all the way up to Citizen Joe

seeing as i own them already, i also have digital copies on my hard drive to i can watch any epsisode i want whenever and wherever i like

and im to lazy to set up a workaround to watch them on hulu:D,

JohnK

Overheal wrote: »

Having the SG-1 is pointless unless theres a lot of SF. Seasons 1 through 8 are all on Hulu. Im currently all the way up to Citizen Joe

Yeah but dont forget Hulu is only any use to people in the US; the rest of us are **** out of luck

Stabshauptmann

hightower1 wrote: »

I have to say I agree with Senna, Eli is just a bit tacky and unrealistic compared to the rest of the people. He seems to stand out like a sore thumb as the "generic target audience point of relation" guy.
In a scene of military, scientific and administrative types the A typical teen slacker making goofy jokes is a bit obvious and irritating.

I mean come on....

A bit of warning that that spoiler was about a future episode, not Water, would have been nice

Memnoch

Overheal wrote: »

As for Young here, he's a neat guy. Human. rewatch the scene at his Ex-Wife's door and play it against any of his scenes aboard Destiny when he is presenting himself as a Commander.

So far I've found almost all of the "Earth" scenes to be bland and cliche'd. These include, Young and his wife, chloe and her mother, scott and the priest.

It'll take time. Its like meeting someone new in the pub. Fast forward 2 years later, and you'd probably like them a whole lot more knowing them a whole lot better. Despite the fact that they probably had the same personality 2 years ago as they did today. You just cant expect these characters to be all that rich just yet when we dont know a damn thing about most of them.

You're last point is a bit ridiculous and does not work as an analogy. These are fictional characters not people, they don't have set personalities. As the writers tell us more about them, they might develop more but until that's written, this is who they are.

Eg. Season 1 of 24.

Nina starts out being Jack's friend. It wasn't until half way into the season that they writers/producers even DECIDED to make her switch sides to the bad guys.

Sometimes a person telling a story will plan ahead, but in tv shows like this where even the writing team can get changed the characters develop organically. At best you could theorise that we don't know these chars as well as we will at the end of the season, and EVEN if that is the case, we don't have a crystal ball, we can only judge the depth of the characters from what we've seen so far.

God, I hate internet arguments. All I said was that I don't get people going on and on about the so called amazing characters, that as far as I'm concerned, just don't exist yet.

Ironically, you even admit this in your post.

Turtwig

Memnoch wrote: »

Spolier RE : 24 Season 1.

Eg. Nina in Season 1 of 24. She starts out being Jack's friend. It wasn't until half way into the season that they writers/producers even DECIDED to make her switch sides to the bad guys.

The fact of Nina being a mole was revealed in the pilot episodes of 24, she just tricked Jack into thinking it wasn't her by covering her tracks really darn good.

Also as far as I'm concerned that's a spoiler.
(Old though season 1 of 24 may be.)

Memnoch

Malty_T wrote: »

The fact of Nina being a mole was revealed in the pilot episodes of 24, she just tricked Jack into thinking it wasn't her by covering her tracks really darn good.

Also as far as I'm concerned that's a spoiler.
(Old though season 1 of 24 may be.)

Fair enough on the spoiler.

Well I watched the special features on the season 1 DVD boxset, and they said very clearly, that they didn't decide to make her a baddie until half way into the season. Something like, it was decided 3/4 episodes only before it happened. Unless my memory is playing tricks on me.

Turtwig

Memnoch wrote: »

Fair enough on the spoiler.

Well I watched the special features on the season 1 DVD boxset, and they said very clearly, that they didn't decide to make her a baddie until half way into the season. Something like, it was decided 3/4 episodes only before it happened. Unless my memory is playing tricks on me.

I have the dvd of season one too (complete boxset of seasons 1 -6, actually:p... awaiting season 7)..

Never really bothered with all the special features though...em so you're probably right, you gotta say though it does fit in well with the overall plot, I mean I didn't see any gaping holes in making her the baddie, did you?

Memnoch

Malty_T wrote: »

I have the dvd of season one too (complete boxset of seasons 1 -6, actually:p... awaiting season 7)..

Never really bothered with all the special features though...em so you're probably right, you gotta say though it does fit in well with the overall plot, I mean I didn't see any gaping holes in making her the baddie, did you?

Well, we're meandering off topic here but,

I did find it a bit of an unbelievable twist to be honest, and then when they said that they only made the decision late into the season, that made sense to me, because the role had been written and acted one way and then turned around later.