Credit Card Debt

carrickmilo

I've defaulted on my credit card payments, the balance is around €10,600. I'm out of work since July and had big medical expenses to pay in September €25,000.
The bank were calling me 6 times a day. In the end I lost it with them because I was just repeating the same story, 'I'm unemployed, I can't make the payments, why are you calling when I'm just telling you the same thing?'
I had to change my mobile number.

It was a Ryanair MBNA card which I was offered in a check-in line at Stanstead and given €10,000 credit with no checks and no wait. This was at the high water mark of the 'Celtic Tiger'

Does this amount to predatory lending practises? Obviously its a big problem for me but I have to say I don't take 100% responsibilty.

Can anybody relate?

100gSoma

carrickmilo wrote: »

Does this amount to predatory lending practises? Obviously its a big problem for me but I have to say I don't take 100% responsibilty.
Can anybody relate?

I can relate. Unfortunately I think alot of people are in similar situations now, and the banks are well covered against "predatory lending" legal defences.
You must have agreed to the terms and conditions when you signed for the MBNA card, and then proceeded to run up over 10k on the card. Even if its for emergency medical treatments the bank won't care. I take it you have no payment protection? That would at least cover your minimum payment while your unemployed. It does seem predatory but thats how credit card companies make their money. Giving hugh amounts of credit to people who cannot pay it back, then charge up to 25% interest on their debt.

Thomas_S_Hunterson

You would probably have been better off delaying payment of the medical bills than just living off a credit card. Not that it's any use now.

MBNA tend to be a bit loose with limits, it's unfortunate, but ultimately it was you who racked up the debt.

I have issue with some of the practices of certain credit card companies. Your experience is not unique. http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/surviving-the-recession/credit-card-debtors-harassed-1920987.html

BuffyBot

Does this amount to predatory lending practises? Obviously its a big problem for me but I have to say I don't take 100% responsibilty.

Oh come on. You are 100% responsible whether you like it or not. You took the card. You made the purchases. They didn't force you to do either.

Avoiding them by putting your head into the sand isn't going to help either - it'll just make the situation worse. You need to tackle it, and tackle it ASAP.

Cut the card (if you haven't/it hasn't been suspended by MBNA). Then speak to their credit control/arrears department and try to come to an agreement regarding making some sort of payment. Document all calls (who you spoke to, date, time, content of call) and/or keep copies of all letters. There is no point "losing it" as that will get you nowhere.

You may want to talk to MABS also, but I believe there may be some signifigant delay there as (unsurprisingly) they're quite overwhelmed at the moment

carrickmilo

Buffybot

The situation is more nuanced. If as you say I'm 100% responsible why then are say drug dealers jailed? They prey on people's weaknesses as well

jhegarty

carrickmilo wrote: »

It was a Ryanair MBNA card which I was offered in a check-in line at Stanstead and given €10,000 credit with no checks and no wait. ?

They didn't lend you €10,000 at the airport , than only authorised a credit limit. You didn't owe them a penny until you walked into a shop and used the credit card for purchases.

I presume no-one from MBNA walked you into the shop's you spent the money in ?

jhegarty

carrickmilo wrote: »

If as you say I'm 100% responsible why then are say drug dealers jailed?

Because selling drugs is illegal. As is buying them. Or just having them stored in your house.

Nothing to do with your situation.

jeckle

The fact is that you are now in this situation & you need to face it head on, as the problem will not go away.

The problem now is that interest, charges & fees are being added to your debt. You really need to get these stopped, so as the debt doesn’t spiral any further.

Make an appointment to see your local MABS money advisor. There is a waiting list as has already mentioned, but I’d strongly advise that you get on the waiting list.

In the meantime cut up your card. You can’t make any purchases with it anyway, but it might demonstrate to them that you fully realise your present predicament, & the gesture might help you in a small way further down the line.

Get a letter from DSFA stating that you are unemployed & what rate you are being paid. Photocopy all your medical receipts showing the €25,000. ask MABS if they can send you a letter stating that there is a backlog for appointments & of your interview date, or approximately how long it might be before you get one.

Compose a letter to MBNA. Acknowledge your debt. Inform them that you are currently experiencing financial difficulties & have made an appointment to see a MABS money advisor, that there is a backlog at MABS & request that they suspend all interest, charges & fees on the account until such a time that they contact them on your behalf with realistic repayment proposals, & enclose your cut-up credit card, copy of DSFA letter & copies medical receipts & a copy of the MABS letter with the letter to MBNA.

Inform them that until you can attend the meeting with MABS that you will pay monthly nominal amounts. Send it all by registered post to the credit control dept & keep a copy of everything you sent. Hold on to your DSFA original letter & medical receipts.

Make sure that you pay them something every month, even if it just €1.

MABS (site seems to be down at the minute) deal with this sort of thing every day, are a confidential & non-judgemental service - plus it looks good to any debtor that you have a government sponsored organisation advising you on your finances.

They will act on your behalf & when you do get to see them they will contact anyone you owe money to. They will tell them that they are currently examining your financial situation & request that they suspend any action(s) until they have a total picture of your situation, with a view to coming to a mutually acceptable repayment agreement.

aphex™

Try auctioning off the handbags/whatever you spent it on

BuffyBot

The situation is more nuanced. If as you say I'm 100% responsible why then are say drug dealers jailed? They prey on people's weaknesses as well

As counterpoints go, that fails on quite a few levels.

There isn't a "nuance" here, much as you seem to be trying to convince yourself otherwise.

100gSoma

Sean_K wrote: »

I have issue with some of the practices of certain credit card companies. Your experience is not unique. http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/surviving-the-recession/credit-card-debtors-harassed-1920987.html

good link... reminded me of this one thats also very relevant.

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/bank-is-hounding-us-about-mortgage-1931579.html

If a bank calls a customer more than once per day I have to agree that can be regarded as 'hounding'. Nothing has changed after lunch if they had no money in the morning.

edit:
Added to that, regardless of how predatory the lending seemed, you will still need to pay the debt back, and ASAP to avoid interest and fees. That won't go away.
I spend alot of time in Estonia, and there is a huge national debate on 'predatory lending' because there are adverts on TV where you just have to text a number to get a loan equivalent of several thousand Euro.
People are complaining its too easy to agree to this loan using a text message. No signatures, no cooling off etc. At least its not that 'predatory' here.

crossmolinalad

little bit late for u
i have the same card
from the first day i was unemployed i did put all my sw payments on it
if u put it on a credit card its still your money
pay my bills with my credit card
made a cut in my expenses esb from 280 to 45 tel and internet from 65 to 32 eu a month and more of that
have still no problems with nmba
pay still more in than the minimum payments

Mr. Presentable

carrickmilo wrote: »

Does this amount to predatory lending practises? Obviously its a big problem for me but I have to say I don't take 100% responsibilty.

Can anybody relate?

OP, you are an adult, in your 40s or so, no?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=62838800&postcount=3

You are well educated, an architect?
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=62385370&postcount=7

And want to leg it to Brazil?

And you don't feel responsible for your actions? Sorry, but you need a reality shower.

amdublin

carrickmilo wrote: »

Obviously its a big problem for me but I have to say I don't take 100% responsibilty.

Can anybody relate?

Nope.

I have credit cards. I understand that I have to pay back money on purchases etc so I don't use them for things I won't be able to afford to pay back.

I had sympathy up until your final sentence.

Contact MABS. Best of luck to you OP (I mean that).

carrickmilo

I'm going to defend myself against the incoming missiles and explain what I mean by responsibility:

How responsible is an individual if they loose their job because the economy falls of the cliff? This is a circumstance beyond an individual's control. I was servicing the debt when I was employed.

And/or they get sick and have to undergo surgery not available in Ireland and pay out of pocket?

These kind of life events are game changers

Maybe those people rushing to judge me have jobs for life with a pension and I say just think outside your normal parameters

namloc1980

carrickmilo wrote: »

I'm going to defend myself against the incoming missiles and explain what I mean by responsibility:

How responsible is an individual if they loose their job because the economy falls of the cliff?I was servicing the debt when I was employed

And/or they get sick and have to undergo surgery not available in Ireland and pay out of pocket?

These kind of life events are game changers

Maybe those people rushing to judge me have jobs for life with a pension and I say just think outside your normal parameters

Running from the debt is not the answer I'm afraid. You did rack up the debt...no one else. Many people are in difficult situations financially but they work with their Banks which is better in the long run for you. They will pursue you and the more you try to avoid them by changing your number etc the more they will come after you...registering judgments against you etc which will affect your credit rating into the future. My advice is call them and work out an arrangement. Most credit card companies will be happy to take any kind of payment (even very small amounts) while you get back on your feet and will work with you if you work with them.

FruitLover

carrickmilo wrote: »

they get sick and have to undergo surgery not available in Ireland and pay out of pocket?

The fact that you mention medical expenses is the only reason I'm not making a viciously scathing comment right now (although maybe you should have researched the concept known as health insurance when you were employed). I'm bloody sick of hearing about people up the proverbial creek because of spending ridiculous amounts of money they didn't have in the first place.

To call the practices of a credit card company 'predatory' is immature at best.

carrickmilo

Will you give over with the sarcasm. I have health insurance. You might have heard of their op out clause 'pre existing condition' I can't believe people making judgements without having the facts to hand

A predator hunts. Normally you apply to your bank for a credit card so you go to them. In this case they came to me. And not on the street where you can just continue walking but when I was standing in a check in que at Stansted (i'e' captive audience) and said it was a great offer because I could get free Ryanair tickets. Of course whenever I tried to get them they were never available.

Ok I was a mug but there is a predatory aspect to working through a check-in que to find takers

BTW Fruitlover if you're 'sick of hearing about people up the proverbial creek' why did you open this thread?

Long Onion

OP, I do have some sympathy for your situation, in our currnet climate many people have been made redundant, and many through no fault of their own. I empathise with you when you state that you were acting in utmost good faith at the time you placed purchases on your card and I have no doubt that ou were servicing the payments while you were able.

Furthermore, I do agree that there were many instances of predatory lending in this country and that the traditional prudent approach of the banks fell by the wayside during the boom years.

This being so, I think that your dilemma and your mindset in relation to it, is indicative of the sentiment that allowed such a situation to flourish. A credit card is something which allows you ease of payment and convenience when it comes to purchasisng certain goods. The idea is that you make the payment and then lodge the money to the card to avoid the harsh interest penalties. The danger is that many people in this country treat credit cards as a line of credit. If you do not clear the balance as it is charged to you, it becomes, effectively, a personal loan at an APR of 19% odd.

Herein lieth the problem, if you approach a bank for a term loan of €10,000, you should contemplate the consequences of what will happen to that loan should you become ill or unable to work. You could adress this by effecting some kind of insurance or PHI policy. If you neglect to do this, it is not realistic to expect to cry foul once the facility is called in. Too many of us used our cards as a personal loan facility and not in the manner for which they were intended.

My advice is to engage with the provider and tell them in honest and succint terms what your situation is. Tell them that you intend to clear your debts in full and outline the terms which you feel you can afford. Iterate the fact that you have had an excellent credit history up to the time you became unemployed and ill, and tell them that you cannot give more than you have.

Send the correspondence by registered post and request a reply by post also. Keep the documents to hand lest the case go to the courts. If our situation as outlined is true, I think it unlikely that you will recieve no sympathy from the courts. I also think that MBNA will realise this and attempt to agree a realistic plan with you - they would rather the money than a conviction.

This being said, it is my opinion that is is essential that you acknowledge the fact that the debt accrued is your doing and your responsibility. If you approach it from the point of view that you are an innocent victim of the 'evil' creditors, you are unlikely to do yourself any favours.

Best of luck and don't let a credit card debt define your life - manage it and it will pass.

carrickmilo

I'd like to thank those on here who in good faith offered me sound advice on my predicament especially Jeckle and Long Onion.

I've written to MBNA and contacted MABS as first steps to resolving this issue.

And for the others if you just have bile to spew why dont you buy a home punchbag instead?