Patton Flyer (mod warning post #404) SEE POST #659 ALSO

Transportuser09

foggy_lad wrote: »

Could be that aircoach have subcontracted the service out to patten like city link did with callinans for the galway route?

I'd be inclined to doubt it, but stranger things have happened...

Run_to_da_hills

Patton and Aircoach passed Dunlaoghaire Shopping Ctr airport bound after 3.00PM within 5 mins of each other, both busses only had two passengers.

foggy_lad

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Patton and Aircoach passed Dunlaoghaire Shopping Ctr airport bound after 3.00PM within 5 mins of each other, both busses only had two passengers.

out in swords today i saw loads of aircoach but did not see any "patton" coaches.

Cookie_Monster

foggy_lad wrote: »

out in swords today i saw loads of aircoach but did not see any "patton" coaches.

thats because they go nowhere near Swords

foggy_lad

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

thats because they go nowhere near Swords

do they also go nowhere near the airport and then into town? there were no patton fliers to be seen between the airport and city centre!

Cookie_Monster

foggy_lad wrote: »

do they also go nowhere near the airport and then into town? there were no patton fliers to be seen between the airport and city centre!

well they use the port tunnel so go no-where near town. and only once every 2 hours whereas you would have seen Air Coaches from several different routes

foggy_lad

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

well they use the port tunnel so go no-where near town. and only once every 2 hours whereas you would have seen Air Coaches from several different routes

an awful lot of aircoaches and no sign of the patton flyer not even at the airport!

devnull

Patton parks in the COach park, not near the arrivals like the Aircoach Dalkey/Greystones/Ballsbridge/Sandyford services do so that would explain it.

Seems that loading at DL have picked up a little bit on Aircoach last week or two. Not much but it's growing for sure.

Cookie_Monster

that and the Patton is the for about 15 mins ever two hours. not exactly a huge window to spot one

foggy_lad

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

that and the Patton is the for about 15 mins ever two hours. not exactly a huge window to spot one

true, that must be why i didn't spot one.

Rock Steady Edy

I saw an airport bound flyer yesterday that followed the aircoach route down Marine Road after leaving the Royal Marine Hotel in Dun Laoghaire rather than back along Georges Street. I presume this route change is to monitor the Aircoach stop outside the town hall when it happens to be ahead as all other stops are pretty much identically located.

devnull

Sorry for the delayed post - holiday!

Maybe they are getting worried, from what I have seen Aircoach's loadings have increased a pretty small amount, but they have increased, whilst Patton's have fell a pretty small amount as well, it's not a lot but it's progress as far as Aircoach are concerned, Patton sounds worried.

It also seems that some of those Setra's are having work done to them, I noticed one on the Dalkey route looking a bit like it had a refresh inside, and it appears also they are now fitting wifi to the Setra's which I guess will mean that Aircoach will have this advantage over Patton also soon. Saw one on the Cork route yesterday advertising it had Wifi.

schemingbohemia

Has the Patton Flyer ceased to be? I wasn't sure of the timetable so went down to the coach park at 620 yesterday after checking the time of the next aircoach (7pm) but one of the drivers down there told me the 6pm hadn't arrived. Anyone got any info?

The 7pm Aircoach had a reasonable loading around 25, i'd say.

devnull

RE: Loadings

Near the port tunnel Saw one bus go past from the Airport with two people on (Patton) and about 5 on the Aircoach on the Dalkey route, whilst saw about 5 or 6 going to the airport on each. Patton is touting for business in Sandymount now also.

Some of the Aircoach vehicles now appear to have wifi also.

Rock Steady Edy

I noticed the largest ever number (6-8) I'd seen waiting at the Aircoach stop in Dun Laoghaire on Sunday around 4pm. The bus stops are perfect adverts for the service, something Patton should have done from the start.

Aircoach loadings are probably highest on the hours when there's no competition.

KC61

Rock Steady Edy wrote: »

I noticed the largest ever number (6-8) I'd seen waiting at the Aircoach stop in Dun Laoghaire on Sunday around 4pm. The bus stops are perfect adverts for the service, something Patton should have done from the start.

Aircoach loadings are probably highest on the hours when there's no competition.

They require permission from the Garda Siochana and I doubt that would be forthcoming for an unlicensed service!

Cookie_Monster

KC61 wrote: »

They require permission from the Garda Siochana and I doubt that would be forthcoming for an unlicensed service!

if they actually cared, they prevent it from running in the first place. I was on a caoch from the the airport that was stopped at a safety checkpoint along with a load of trucks. Gardai check all required safety gear in place etc and waved on. If they cared about it being an unlicensed service, why not use this opportunity to impound the bus?

schemingbohemia

what i fail to understand is why Patton just didn't change his timetable to the half hour, then everyone who has just missed an Aircoach could hop on his service. he would hoover up any spare passengers.

devnull

You will give him ideas posting that on here! Seriously though, I honestly think when he feels the passenger numbers have dropped enough, this will be his next tactic but he does not seem to have lost people en-mass yet so can't see it happening for a while.

The only downside however is that historically Patton has been poor at informing his customers of changes, the website is normally updated days after the changes actually take place, and as he has no timetables he has no way to let everyone know about the changes.

Therefore it may be seen as a bit of a gamble as if people waiting for Patton realise his bus does not turn up they may be tempted to go for Aircoach. so it could backfire.

schemingbohemia

the fact that you've to make a deliberate decision at the airport to "chose" Patton by walking passed the Aircoach service makes it a no brainer to use Aircoach when the timetables are the same (at certain points of the day) which is why it would seem so obvious to change his timetable. but there's a lot that doesn't make sense of the Patton operation.

Rock Steady Edy

Going on the half hour makes sense from the airport - it would be easy to remember. It makes less sense so from Dalkey due to the multiple departure points; it's easy to remember that Dun Laoghaire departures are 10 past the hour, but harder that they might be 40 minutes past the hour.

It would also smack of them trying to co-exist in the long term, which is unlikely, but possible.

I'd be surprised if by Christmas there wasn't either a winner or formal co-operation.

patrickbrophy18

Rock Steady Edy wrote: »

I'd be surprised if by Christmas there wasn't either a winner or formal co-operation.

What do you mean?

Rock Steady Edy

Winner: one route operator with one having effectivey forced the other out because passengers substantially favour one service over the other or through one service provider blocking the other by some kind of legal action

Formal co-operation: some kind of merging of resources or agreement that both operate the route with each accepting the others' tickets to provide a better service to the customer. (This might be the case if it can be shown that passenger numbers have increased on the route due to the additional services that Aircoach has put on or generated through advertising or having actual bus stops to attract passing trade.) It would inevitably lead to one provider doing the half-hourly departures to stop wasteful duplication.

devnull

schemingbohemia wrote: »

the fact that you've to make a deliberate decision at the airport to "chose" Patton by walking passed the Aircoach service makes it a no brainer to use Aircoach when the timetables are the same (at certain points of the day) which is why it would seem so obvious to change his timetable. but there's a lot that doesn't make sense of the Patton operation.

Maybe so, but there are lots of people who have a mis-conception of local pride who will actually do this, hence how he has in the past been able to fill coaches up even since the Aircoach sevice has started, although I have not seen this for a while.

I noticed that Patton has now dropped Fitzpatrick's Castle hotel from his website timetable list. It seems the hotel are now promoting Aircoach on their website as the coach operator to use to get there, which must have been a blow to him, especially as it's in Dalkey.

Rock Steady Edy

devnull wrote: »

I noticed that Patton has now dropped Fitzpatrick's Castle hotel from his website timetable list. It seems the hotel are now promoting Aircoach on their website as the coach operator to use to get there, which must have been a blow to him, especially as it's in Dalkey.

There must be a story there!

foggy_lad

Have people thought maybe the reason he has filled coaches at the airport is by pre-booking groups going on holidays or to Lourds etc in the same way people pre-book a taxi. And he may be offering local bingo groups etc special rates for these trips?

AlekSmart

Rock Steady Edy posted:-

There must be a story there!

Indeed there is,but not as deep and byzantine as one might think.

First Aircoach is but a miniscule part of the greater First Group armoury.

Right now it is expanding in a big way in the good ol USA through it`s Greyhound and Bolt Lines coaching arms.

Fitzpatricks have traditionally been high-end American market focused and that is where the synergy exists between the two...simple enough really and makes quite a lot of commercial sense,unlike the more traditionally parochial Patton ethos......:)

Cookie_Monster

Rock Steady Edy wrote: »

There must be a story there!

I'm sure they got fed up with him abandoning the coach in the car park between runs

Fratton Fred

Lets face it, if you are a high end hotel, you would much rather promote Aircoach than the Flyer. It is a muh nicer way to travel.

On a side note, I was on an aircoach that had to wait for a parking slot at the airport the other week. it looks to me as though aircoach are outgrowing the space available for them. Maybe they need to start staggering departure times at the airport to reduce the number of coaches there at any one time.

patrickbrophy18

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Lets face it, if you are a high end hotel, you would much rather promote Aircoach than the Flyer. It is a muh nicer way to travel.

On a side note, I was on an aircoach that had to wait for a parking slot at the airport the other week. it looks to me as though aircoach are outgrowing the space available for them. Maybe they need to start staggering departure times at the airport to reduce the number of coaches there at any one time.

The Aircoach timetable is the first thing you see when you approach the reception area at The Fitzpatrick Hotel. Given that the Aircoach is a far more frequent service and actually operates on all 24 hours of the day (bar Christmas Day), The Fitzpatrick Hotel are obviously going to advertise the more superior service. Nevertheless, as Patton did advertise The Fitzpatrick Hotel on their website as a terminus, the hotel should have returned the favor as a token of mutual loyalty as well as advertising Aircoach. As for the outgrowing parking bay issue. It looks as though Dublin Airport may need to supply extra space for more terminating Aircoach.