Lucas "fu*king" Leiva

Fink Goddie

I say:

Lucas isnt good enough to have on the first team week in week out if you want a team that will challenge for the title. TRUE

Lucas was not a good enough replacement to have for Alonso, because he's not as good as him, so this weakens our team (dont mention Aqualani being his replacement, he wasnt in the picture til november) TRUE

Dont give me, he's young, he's improving, we dont have the money!
None of that changes the fact that he's not good enough to be a 1st team player!!!

So we can go around in circles all year but i'm still right Slicric

rossie1977

Fink Goddie wrote: »

Lucas was not a good enough replacement to have for Alonso, because he's not as good as him, so this weakens our team (dont mention Aqualani being his replacement, he wasnt in the picture til november) TRUE

no sh*t, nobody on planet earth would argue that statement, alonso is the best player in the world in his position (defensive playmaker) so obviously whoever comes in and tries to play that position will not be as good as him

Eire-Dearg

Who's saying Lucas is shít? Lucas is boss. Boss.

SlickRic

thanks guys, but i can't do it anymore.

i can't stand to hear the same stereotypical argument again saying Lucas is sh*t etc etc etc.

to the point where i wish you guys hadn't responded to her.

i was just going to leave it at that, and hope the thread got forgotten about.

Fink Goddie

SlickRic wrote: »

thanks guys, but i can't do it anymore.

i can't stand to hear the same stereotypical argument again saying Lucas is sh*t etc etc etc.

to the point where i wish you guys hadn't responded to her.

i was just going to leave it at that, and hope the thread got forgotten about.

Ah but look at you, you just cant leave, here you are again!

Fink Goddie

rossie1977 wrote: »

no sh*t, nobody on planet earth would argue that statement, alonso is the best player in the world in his position (defensive playmaker) so obviously whoever comes in and tries to play that position will not be as good as him

Yet when i mention him leaving being a cause of weakness for the team, i get told that we wouldnt have any more points than we do now if he was still on the team. BullSh*t!

SlickRic

Fink Goddie wrote: »

Ah but look at you, you just cant leave, here you are again!

i'm not making any points about it anymore.

try responding to the arguments put forward there.

i'm leaving it.

Fink Goddie

SlickRic wrote: »

i'm not making any points about it anymore.

try responding to the arguments put forward there.

i'm leaving it.

Leaving AGAIN are you??

Eire-Dearg

Fink Goddie wrote: »

Yet when i mention him leaving being a cause of weakness for the team, i get told that we wouldnt have any more points than we do now if he was still on the team. BullSh*t!

Not necessarily. Unless you're some sort of mystic? Alonso may have set up a winning goal in a game we lost, or he may have got injured, the fact is we will never know so it's a deadend argument.

Fink Goddie

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

Not necessarily. Unless you're some sort of mystic? Alonso may have set up a winning goal in a game we lost, or he may have got injured, the fact is we will never know so it's a deadend argument.

Well the team fell apart after he left, thats enough evidence for me.
I reckon we would have done better, but sure he's gone now and we're left with Lucas while Aquaman is crocked!

Smegball

Lucas will be quality in a few years, look at Fletcher, he was muck until he was around 25, Lucas is only 22, the same can be said of Anderson I think.

Eire-Dearg

Say what you like about last season with Alonso, and this season with Lucas, you can't comparison the two camaigns and you can't compare the two players.

But anyone who is still blind to the fact Lucas has been one of, if not the best performer this season are idiots. He's been the most consistent player in the squad, and has stayed uninjured - all testament to his work rate, his character and his self belief to overcome the haters and to up his game - most players would've just thrown in the towel after day one.

Lucas is not ****, he's steadily improving into one of the best centre midfielders in this particular Premier League season. Against Everton he was fantastic, against Utd he was fantastic, and there have been many games in between. Alonso won player of the year last year at Liverpool, and at the moment this season's is going to Lucas. I'm in admiration of how much he's come on, not many players get a second chance especially after getting booed off at Anfield of all places - by the HOME CROWD! He has all the genuine qualities a team needs in a midfielder, and they don't all add up to goals, creating goals and scoring more goals.

Also, Lucas wasn't Alonso's replacement. Aquaman was. Turns out we had a better holding midfielder in the squad in Lucas.

Give extreme credit where it's due, the lad must have the determination of a lion to do what he's done.

Fink Goddie

Smegball wrote: »

Lucas will be quality in a few years, look at Fletcher, he was muck until he was around 25, Lucas is only 22, the same can be said of Anderson I think.

Noone can be sure of that!

Quandary

Fink Goddie wrote: »

Well the team fell apart after he left, thats enough evidence for me.
I reckon we would have done better, but sure he's gone now and we're left with Lucas while Aquaman is crocked!

Yes Liverpool are weaker without Alonso - any team would be imo but him not being there is not the sole reason ye are playing the way ye are.

Gerrard & Torres are Liverpools 2 best players by a distance - no one would argue this. This season Torres has been his usual best but has been in and out with injuries - this has had a negative impact on the team. Gerrard on the other hand has played terribly all season compared to recent seasons - this has had a negative impact on the team also.

Some other players on the team namely a lot of ye'r centre halfs have been a bit all over the shop this season with injuries & off form performances.

All this has knocked the clubs morale & confidence.


These are the reasons Liverpool are playing the way they are at the moment

If Lucas wasnt in ye'r squad i have no doubt ye would be worse off. Ye have started to grind out the results lately & even though they havent been pretty wins they are helping the team out of the rut. Confidence and more attractive football go hand in hand & Liverpool are getting more confident week by week now imo.

rossie1977

Fink Goddie wrote: »

Yet when i mention him leaving being a cause of weakness for the team, i get told that we wouldnt have any more points than we do now if he was still on the team. BullSh*t!

well i ain't arguing that, liverpool are a stronger with alonso in there; its also no surprise that gerrard is half the player he is without alonso playing regularly beside him, alonso was a fantastic link between back and front and allowed gerrard the freedom to play his natural game

alonso was criminally under-rated especially among opposition fans, we had utd fans on here last year claiming michael carrick was a better player ffs :rolleyes:

Spiritoftheseventies

Came close with that shot near the end. Anyone know what his shots on goal stats are at this stage?

noodler

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Came close with that shot near the end. Anyone know what his shots on goal stats are at this stage?

Well there was that one last night, so I think it now stands at 1 in 26 League games.

Spiritoftheseventies

noodler wrote: »

Well there was that one last night, so I think it now stands at 1 in 26 League games.

suppose we should be thankful for small mercies.

d22ontour

rossie1977 wrote: »

alonso was criminally under-rated especially among opposition fans

Can't say i ever heard anyone i know say that.He is a quality player ijs.

rossie1977 wrote: »

we had utd fans on here last year claiming michael carrick was a better player ffs :rolleyes:

:eek:

Say it isn't so, Say it isn't so !!!!!!

Major fook up by Rafa in trying to sell him to buy Barry tbh.

jesus_thats_gre

Not this again....

SlickRic

d22ontour wrote: »

Major fook up by Rafa in trying to sell him to buy Barry tbh.

he was pretty ordinary for 12-18 months before the Barry saga.

in hindsight yes, it's a pity, but I've a feeling Alonso would've left for Spain at some point. maybe it ended up being earlier than it could've been.

but trying for Barry made sense at the time, as Alonso was not the player we saw last season for the previous year/year and a half.

and you're right, I don't think many underrated Alonso, especially last year. everyone knew how well he was playing.

Kess73

SlickRic wrote: »

he was pretty ordinary for 12-18 months before the Barry saga.
in hindsight yes, it's a pity, but I've a feeling Alonso would've left for Spain at some point. maybe it ended up being earlier than it could've been.

but trying for Barry made sense at the time, as Alonso was not the player we saw last season for the previous year/year and a half.

and you're right, I don't think many underrated Alonso, especially last year. everyone knew how well he was playing.

Ordinary by the standards he set in his first and last seasons, but when he played during the period you mentioned he was still one of the better players in the team.

There is also the small matter of the long term injuries he had during the two more ordinary seasons he had.

The Lucas/Alonso comparison that others have touched on,is not one I am really going to get into though. Everyone knows which one is the better player, but from a Liverpool pov it doesn't matter as only one plays in red now, and that guy has done enough this season not to warrant the flak he still gets from time to time.

GEM_13

if u were to run a poll now for player of the season,i would hazzard a guess that reina and lucas would probably be the two front runners.they have been the two constants who have put in a performance week in week out imo..

Kess73

GEM_13 wrote: »

if u were to run a poll now for player of the season,i would hazzard a guess that reina and lucas would probably be the two front runners.they have been the two constants who have put in a performance week in week out imo..

For me it would be Reina by a very long way, but Lucas would be the next best player this season.

JimsAlterEgo

TBH it shows how bad liverpools season has been when Lucas, who lets be honest while he has had a good season shouldn't be more than a squad player has been one of your stand out players.

I am not criticising him, he has done well but he shouldn't be in the running for your player of the season award given the level of player around him.

noodler

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Not this again....

Jesus, not THIS again.

MementoMori

Kess73 wrote: »

For me it would be Reina by a very long way, but Lucas would be the next best player this season.

Has to be Reina for me too but Lucas for his consistency

Spiritoftheseventies

The lad came of age last night. Scored a goal

SlickRic

the thing is, people rate him now for last night, simply because he scored.

it grates me a bit, because everything else he did, all the good things, he's been doing for most of the season.

Spiritoftheseventies

SlickRic wrote: »

the thing is, people rate him now for last night, simply because he scored.

it grates me a bit, because everything else he did, he's been doing for most of the season.

To be fair the lad has received his fair of stick. Took his goal very well. Who knows this could be the beginning of something beautiful

Ush1

SlickRic wrote: »

the thing is, people rate him now for last night, simply because he scored.

it grates me a bit, because everything else he did, he's been doing for most of the season.

Well I always thought he was more akin to Gerrard than these Alonso comparisons you hear. Surging runs, good finish, etc..Gerrard would probably never be dropped obviously.

SlickRic

Ush1 wrote: »

Well I always thought he was more akin to Gerrard than these Alonso comparisons you hear. Surging runs, good finish, etc..Gerrard would probably never be dropped obviously.

i made this suggestion earlier in the season; putting Gerrard back, and pushing Lucas further forward.

it still don't think it's a bad thing to try, considering Gerrard isn't exactly in undroppable form right now.

Spiritoftheseventies

Anyone remember that English PL player who played in defence and scored a rake of goals when he was converted to attack. In the 90s as far as I remember. Is it time to push Lucas further up front.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

K-9

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Anyone remember that English PL player who played in defence and scored a rake of goals when he was converted to attack. In the 90s as far as I remember. Is it time to push Lucas further up front.

Dion Dublin? Or was that the other way round?

Spiritoftheseventies

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Yes thats whom I thinking of.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Dublin_Gunner

Spiritoftheseventies wrote: »

Anyone remember that English PL player who played in defence and scored a rake of goals when he was converted to attack. In the 90s as far as I remember. Is it time to push Lucas further up front.

Gary Doherty??


:D

SM01

[/QUOTE]SlickRic
the thing is, people rate him now for last night, simply because he scored.

it grates me a bit, because everything else he did, he's been doing for most of the season.[/QUOTE]

Ush1 wrote: »

Well I always thought he was more akin to Gerrard than these Alonso comparisons you hear. Surging runs, good finish, etc..Gerrard would probably never be dropped obviously.

+1 on these remarks

Catenaccio!

SlickRic wrote: »

the thing is, people rate him now for last night, simply because he scored.

No they're not?

SlickRic

um, yes they are.

the match thread is filled with people lauding Lucas.

i was with a mate watching it last night, he can't stand Lucas, and in fact rips the p*ss out of me for supporting him. he called him great last night too.

i even got a couple of texts from fans saying how well he played.

i just chuckled.

you score a goal, and all of a sudden people see the other stuff you're doing in a different light.

Dublin_Gunner

I don't think people are going to suddenly over-rate Lucas after one goal.

However, I was impressed by him last night, and he took his goal with great aplomb - confidence & composure to round the 'keeper, and a cool finish.

The thing is, he's been let of the leash a few times this season, and to be honest, when pushing forward he looked really good.

I was never a fan of his really, but when he gets forward, he really does cause problems and I'm warming to him more and more this season.

Its when he's told to sit back and defend that he's a burdon (he can't tackle in fairness).

argosy2006

Good work horse,
Goal looked pure class at first,, replay showed it was very lucky ball cleared goal keeper, i thought he dragged it around keeper with conviction,, but he didn't , ball went over the keepers hand
He deserved his goal though,,, can't knock the lad,

mike65

]Lucas had come to bury Cesar

Henry Winter....made me laugh.

ShamoBuc

Lucas is not a natural defensive midfielder but he has done a job there. He is an attacking midfielder and has done well Whenever he has played there. I would really like for him to get 3 or 4 games in an attacking role as I believe he could excel there. You wouldn't expect Mascherano to play as an attacking midfielder but it is expected of Lucas to play as a defensive one. The lad is getting better and better after a very sluggish start.

I was genuinely delighted for the lad last night when he scored. He's come on so much this year.

It would be great if him and Mash managed to score a few more tbh, maybe it'll give hima bit more confidence in front of goal.

Peyton Manning

There's a lot of "appreciation" threads going round here lately. Wayne Rooney, Lionel Messi, Roy Hodgson..... but even though Lucas isnt as bad as some people make out to be, this thread is just embarassing. He's not awful, he's not awesome, he's just had an above average season for a team thats had a below average season. No wonder he's stoof out. He does NOT deserve an appreciation thread.

Ush1

Archimedes wrote: »

There's a lot of "appreciation" threads going round here lately. Wayne Rooney, Lionel Messi, Roy Hodgson..... but even though Lucas isnt as bad as some people make out to be, this thread is just embarassing. He's not awful, he's not awesome, he's just had an above average season for a team thats had a below average season. No wonder he's stoof out. He does NOT deserve an appreciation thread.

But that's the point, he gets so much stick. I think the thread is more about how he was being under rated than how great he actually is.

Peyton Manning

Ush1 wrote: »

But that's the point, he gets so much stick. I think the thread is more about how he was being under rated than how great he actually is.

He's equally as over rated as is he is under-rated imo. He's nothing special. I have no problem complimenting Liverpool players - there are some terrific footballers at the club. So far, despite his progression, Lucas is still a long way from being terrific. If Liverpool fans insist on labelling him one of the best players at the club this season, thats just further proof of the awful year they've had and how many other players arent performing.

SlickRic

Archimedes wrote: »

He does NOT deserve an appreciation thread.

to be fair though, it isn't one.

it was created to, i think;

1) put all the Lucas related sh*te that compiled in the Liverpool thread somewhere.

2) give everyone a chance, again without derailing the main superthread, a chance to have their say on a player who seemed to divide players on a ludicrous level.

the main crux of the thread is that he doesn't deserve the controversy he gets, merely because he's, as you say, average enough right now, with the potential to become a very good player. nothing more, nothing less. the mere fact the thread had this much interest, near enough 600 posts now, is ludicrous for such a player.