Court Summons for Finance Debt

boardsie08

I'm posting this on behalf of a relative and it's a bit of a long winded story so please bear with me...

About 2/3 years ago a cousin of mine was buying a TV from a well known electrical store. They had intended to pay for the TV with their credit card however the salesman at the store really pushed the finance option on them telling them that they'd get 12 months interest free etc... So long story short they agreed and felt that this would be a good offer to take advantage of.

However, when the salesman heard that my cousin was a student who wasn't working they said there was no way they would get approved for finance so suggested that their parent take on the finance agreement to which they agreed.

The parent was there with them and applied for and was approved for the finance agreement. The parent signed off on all the documents however it was the daughters bank account details that were being used to fund the direct debits every month.

Cue a few months later and family start receiving threatening phone calls from well known finance company (who are now no longer in Ireland) demanding payments be made - payments always were made. They were coming out of the daughters bank account.

Family always told reps on the phone that direct debits were being made as per agreement and gave them the daughters name and bank account number along with dates and amounts paid. Various reps would confirm this info over the phone and promise to update their system to show that all payments were current and up-to-date, however this never happened and a few days later threatening phone calls would once again commence..

This happened over a period of a few months - payments were being debited from daughters account on time every month as per agreement - Finance company failed to see/recognise this for whatever reason and kept insisting no payments had been made. Cue more threatening phone calls, more promises to look into it, and once again nothing was ever done and the phone calls kept coming...

In the end the Finance company refused to acknowledge that any sum had been paid off and sent a debt collection agency after the family. P*ssed off big time by now, that despite paying every month that the finance company had set a debt collection agency after them unfairly, which is when I think the family stopped corresponding with the finance company seeing as they weren't playing fair and they were being constantly pushed from tom, dick to harry and they weren't acknowledging any monies received.

So now the father has received a court summons to appear in court over this debt seeing as he was the one who signed the finance agreement.

The finance company are looking for the entire amount for which the finance agreement was originally taken out for - despite the daughter already having paid off X amount. The finance company can't seem to get their head around the fact that the money is coming from the daughters account despite the father signing up for the finance.

They're sick to the teeth of it all at this stage now and I know the father is sick with worry as he's never been summonsed to court for anything before, I'd love it if I could help them out and give some advice but I have no idea as I've never been in a situation like this before.

Can they just hand back the TV now? They have the money to pay the bill however the fact is X amount has already been paid off and finance company haven't acknowledged this and are still chasing for the original amount...

Any advice or information at all re: this matter would be greatly appreciated folks as I don't know what to tell them!

Thanks folks

petes

Have you got a solicitor involved?

First port of call if you ask me.

Sponge Bob

If you can prove the payments were made fully and on time then you have a case against the store itself , simply selling never never ****e is not enough of a getout .

A solicitor will get this thrown straight out if it is paid in full and up to date .

Dixons/Currys have a duty of care to their customers and their customers reputations and good name and this is what happens when they show blatant disregard for it

jor el

boardsie08 wrote: »

They're sick to the teeth of it all at this stage now and I know the father is sick with worry as he's never been summonsed to court for anything before,

They have the money to pay the bill however the fact is X amount has already been paid off and finance company haven't acknowledged this and are still chasing for the original amount...

I would go to court, bring the proof of the payments, and any details of the various calls to the finance company. The judge should tell the finance company to cop the feck on, and that will be that.

Best thing though, would be to put all details in a letter, and address it to the management (CEO maybe) of the finance company. Include absolutely everything, account numbers, photo copies of direct debits on bank statements, etc. If they fail to see this, or ignore it, then go to court, and he can have his say.

One thing, are the payments still ongoing, and is that as per the original agreement? 3 years seems quite a long time to be paying off the TV. As long as everything is proceeding as per the original agreement, he shouldn't be at all worried about going to court. The finance company will be read the riot act for being such idiots and wasting court time.

boardsie08 wrote: »

Can they just hand back the TV now?

No. It's nothing to do with the shop, and if there's nothing wrong with the TV, you have no right to return it. The issue is between the finance company and the person who signed the contract.

I'd imagine this is Currys/Dixons and HFC bank. Doesn't surprise me in the least.

eth0_

Why on earth is the dad "sick with worry"? He has absolutely NOTHING to worry about. Get his daughter to ring her bank and ask for a print out showing all the direct debits that have gone to the finance company (make sure they don't send statements as they charge for that).

Go to court. It will be great entertainment. The dad and daughter have done nothing wrong, the judge will immediately throw it out of court and who knows, might even award compensation for the stress caused to the family!

Oh and tell him to check his credit rating to see if the finance company has wrongly said the debt hasn't been paid.

eth0_

jor el wrote: »

One thing, are the payments still ongoing, and is that as per the original agreement? 3 years seems quite a long time to be paying off the TV.

Why didn't they pay the balance off at the end of the 12 months? I dread to think how much they've paid for that TV :eek:

Lenny

Are you 110% sure that the correct & full monthy payments were being met and they daughter hasn't be lleading the father on?
I find it kidna of hard pressed how this was passed onto a debt agency if payments were being sent, as you have informed the agency payments were being made they can send off a request to the finance company to confirm if they were
all you need if statementsd printed off to show the correct was being paid off
case closed really.

boardsie08

Insurgent wrote: »

Have you got a solicitor involved?

First port of call if you ask me.

They just got the Summons a day or two ago, I believe they've been trying to get in touch with their family solicitor but he's away for a few days atm.

Sponge Bob wrote: »

If you can prove the payments were made fully and on time then you have a case against the store itself , simply selling never never ****e is not enough of a getout .

A solicitor will get this thrown straight out if it is paid in full and up to date .

Dixons/Currys have a duty of care to their customers and their customers reputations and good name and this is what happens when they show blatant disregard for it

Yes it was Currys and HFC! :rolleyes:

jor el wrote: »

I would go to court, bring the proof of the payments, and any details of the various calls to the finance company. The judge should tell the finance company to cop the feck on, and that will be that.

Best thing though, would be to put all details in a letter, and address it to the management (CEO maybe) of the finance company. Include absolutely everything, account numbers, photo copies of direct debits on bank statements, etc. If they fail to see this, or ignore it, then go to court, and he can have his say.

One thing, are the payments still ongoing, and is that as per the original agreement? 3 years seems quite a long time to be paying off the TV. As long as everything is proceeding as per the original agreement, he shouldn't be at all worried about going to court. The finance company will be read the riot act for being such idiots and wasting court time.


No. It's nothing to do with the shop, and if there's nothing wrong with the TV, you have no right to return it. The issue is between the finance company and the person who signed the contract.

I'd imagine this is Currys/Dixons and HFC bank. Doesn't surprise me in the least.

Yep bang on, Currys/HFC!

Unfortunately this is where it gets messy... After X amount of months of the Daughter paying she stopped as she felt there was no point continuing anymore as previous payments she had made were left ignored and unacknowledged and she felt that any further payments would not be acknowledged by the Finance company either and it would be money down the drain...

HFC refuse to acknowledge that *any* payments were ever made now despite both daughter and father writing to HFC numerous times along with sending copies of bank statements showing direct debits being made..

I believe the buried their head in the sand and stopped the direct debit as they were getting nowhere with HFC, there were continuous calls multiple times a day and each time they would explain that payments were being made and provide account name and number, sort code, amounts paid and the dates etc... each time HFC would either promise to look into it or that they would update their system to reflect this, then cue 4 hours later a different rep would ring yet again demanding money.. it was a vicious cycle!

humanji

jor el wrote: »

Best thing though, would be to put all details in a letter, and address it to the management (CEO maybe) of the finance company. Include absolutely everything, account numbers, photo copies of direct debits on bank statements, etc. If they fail to see this, or ignore it, then go to court, and he can have his say.

Just to add, if you do the above then make sure you send it by registered post so that you'll also have proof of delivery.

boardsie08

eth0_ wrote: »

Why on earth is the dad "sick with worry"? He has absolutely NOTHING to worry about. Get his daughter to ring her bank and ask for a print out showing all the direct debits that have gone to the finance company (make sure they don't send statements as they charge for that).

Go to court. It will be great entertainment. The dad and daughter have done nothing wrong, the judge will immediately throw it out of court and who knows, might even award compensation for the stress caused to the family!

Oh and tell him to check his credit rating to see if the finance company has wrongly said the debt hasn't been paid.

I believe the fathers credit rating has already been advserely affected by this which is a shame as he's never missed a mortgage/credit card/loan payment etc... in over 50 yrs!

eth0_ wrote: »

Why didn't they pay the balance off at the end of the 12 months? I dread to think how much they've paid for that TV :eek:

I think the reason why they didn't make the baloon payment was that at the end of the 12 months HFC were still insisting that NO monies had been received and they were looking for original amount + late charges + interest etc... Obviously father and daughter weren't happy about this as had HFC acknowledged payments up to that they wouldn't have been hit with late fees and interest etc..

Lenny wrote: »

Are you 110% sure that the correct & full monthy payments were being met and they daughter hasn't be lleading the father on?
I find it kidna of hard pressed how this was passed onto a debt agency if payments were being sent, as you have informed the agency payments were being made they can send off a request to the finance company to confirm if they were
all you need if statementsd printed off to show the correct was being paid off
case closed really.

Yes, 100% sure that the daughter was making payments at the time (no longer is now however)

It got complicated as when daughter tried to ring HFC they wouldn't speak to her as she wasn't the undertaker of the loan which is fair enough I can understand that from their point of view, however they weren't able to take in what the father was telling them either in that whilst he took out the finance agreement she was footing the bill from her account..


Sooo as it stands now father is liable for entire original amount + interest + late fees + court charges + solicitor fees and whatever else you can imagine..

Whilst daughter is out of X amount she has already paid which HFC refuse to acknowledge..

jor el

eth0_ wrote: »

Why didn't they pay the balance off at the end of the 12 months? I dread to think how much they've paid for that TV :eek:

That's what I was thinking. Interest rates are typically 29.9% once the interest free period ends. Not nice.

boardsie08 wrote: »

Unfortunately this is where it gets messy... After X amount of months of the Daughter paying she stopped as she felt there was no point continuing anymore as previous payments she had made were left ignored and unacknowledged and she felt that any further payments would not be acknowledged by the Finance company either and it would be money down the drain...

That is not good news, not at all. She's left herself open there (or rather left her father open). A judge could go either way on this. Even though HFC were acting the mick, she should not have stopped payments, or better still, should have paid off what she knew was the remainder.

Canceling the payments, and not paying off the correct amount has left her wide open for court action.

They really need to get a hold of their solicitor, as this is not as clear cut as it first seemed.

boardsie08

jor el wrote: »

That's what I was thinking. Interest rates are typically 29.9% once the interest free period ends. Not nice.



That is not good news, not at all. She's left herself open there (or rather left her father open). A judge could go either way on this. Even though HFC were acting the mick, she should not have stopped payments, or better still, should have paid off what she knew was the remainder.

Canceling the payments, and not paying off the correct amount has left her wide open for court action.

They really need to get a hold of their solicitor, as this is not as clear cut as it first seemed.

Yep, this is what I was thinking too...

It's the father I feel sorry for in the whole mess though he was doing her a favour by signing up to the finance deal for her!

Hopefully they'll hear back from their family solicitor any day now though and he'll be able to advise them better

eth0_

If the daughter stopped making payments then unfortuantely that puts her and her father at significant disadvantage in this case...

dudara

The daughter has really shot herself, and her father, in the foot by stopping the payments. Up to that point, they were completely in the right.

However, since then, she hasn't made any contributions towards a debt, which is serious. I cannot emphasise enough how important it is to keep contributing towards a debt - you should never ignore it.

Go to a solicitor asap. Gather all documentation - original agreement and a listing of payments made.

jackbauer

I had a very similar issue with hfc and argos about 5 years ago. In fact when i read the first post on this thread i knew it was hfc. I purchased a large shed from argos and financed it with hfc for 12 months interest free option. Fast forward 3 months and the letters and phone calls start claiming non payment despite direct debits being paid out. Everytime was promised it was being sorted. Sent several registered letters which was really fun as they had about 4 addresses! Eventually got their registered office from companies house in the uk. Canceled the direct debit and started sending bank drafts by registered post. An post confirmed delivery and bank confirmed drafts were cashed out. Thought that was that until the debt collectors called! Said sod this and went to mabs. One week later I received an apology blaming a "computer error":rolleyes: Had mabs send them a draft for the final amount and extract a letter stating the account was closed. Guess what? last year i received a "final demand" for the full amount.:mad: Sent the letter back with a copy of the account closed letter by registered post. Never heard another word.

rugbyman

another isue here is the difference in the fathers name and the daughters.
I am aware of a case where a company cannot reconcile amounts coming in to their account with a list of non paying customers.
whoever was receiving the daughters payments may well have them stacked up and not know where they came from, and they have no customer of that name

Rugbyman

Sponge Bob

Funny how I got such a strong stench of Currys / HFC bank out of the original post , I must be getting really paranoid in my old age

dudara wrote: »

The daughter has really shot herself, and her father, in the foot by stopping the payments. Up to that point, they were completely in the right.

Correct . And they will need a solicitor and a properly prepared and competent solicitor too.

The odds are that

1. HFC will not show up at all
2. They will brief some young wan who will have no paperwork with them and will piss the judge off with their waffle, most likely outcome .

It is important that the judge DIRECTS HFC bank and does not let her go back to check things in the office otherwise they will try this on again .

MAKE SURE that the Judge DIRECTS HFC to FULLY remove any entries on the 2 credit ratings , Father and Daughter both .

MAKE SURE the young wan UNDERTAKES to do this TO the court and to Father/Daughter but most importantly to the court .

This means that you can actually bring their solicitor back in front of the same judge for breach of undertaking to teh judge if HFC are not compliant. I had to do this myself last year with another issue involving an out of state entity who had an Irish solicitor acting for them .

Rev. Kitchen

The daughter stopping payments has really messed up their case. Up to that point they where in the right and could have even made a counter claim for harrassment. But when she stopped making payments the bank are within their rights to instruct a debt collection agency to collect the debt.

The best you could hope for is to bring all the evedence of the payments made to court and hope the judge cuts them a break. You have to pay for things you buy regardless of book keeping mistakes.

How much has she paid of the TV maybe the judge will just decide that they pay the final amount and call it a day all round. But what a balls up stopping that payment.