*TOP DRAWER* - dealings & Insolvency

Lisap

Hi All,Just to let people know who gave the company TOP DRAWER Kilcoole, Cork, Glaway money for goods and has not yet received them - I am sorry to advise anyone who left deposits or unfortunately like we did paid in full fwill not get their goods! We ordered KUBA furtniture please note that it was never ordered by the company - I have found out this morning after 11 months of pulling my hair out to get our furniture that they attended an Insolvency meeting!We ordered the KUBA furniture value EUR1200 in January and were told that it would take months to be made and to arrive which was fine as we have always purchased our furniture from TOP DRAWER.I callled the company each month and was given countless excuses, then my husband stepped in and the manager of the Kilcoole branch told him that infact there was never any furniture and they would issue a cheque for a full refund. We contacted accounts and we were promised that we would recieve the cheque. Then the company shut its doors without any notification and now i find on the internet that they are insolvent. Im sure this is deemed as <snip> as the company admitted that they never ordered the furniture and im sure that there are many others like us that have been cheated out of our hard earned money.We have started legal proceedings and would like to know if anyone out there has any info to help us get our money back and hopefully money back for all the other people that gave their money in good faith to this company, I am also going to the police to see if there is anything else we can do. If anyone has any information can they please contact me thanks...

jor el

The Gardai can't do anything as this is a civil matte, and not a criminal one.

If you paid with a credit card, you may have protection. If you paid with debit card, cheque, cash, etc, you'll need a solicitor, but you'll be at the end of a very long line of creditors. Getting a 1-10% refund would be your best hope, but you could likely get nothing.

dudara

Post edited to remove personal details and accusations.

OP, you may feel aggrieved right now, but please refrain from posting any personal or libellous details.

dudara

mayolk

:mad:Real sick over it..called for weeks on end. Please let me know how thing go for you..I will also keep you posted on my progress..they really kept me hanging on..I was sure I was getting my stuff in the next few weeks..its terrible..they knew all along & took our money...reall angry over it..there must be loads more out there who were done over too..

Lisap

Hi, I know its soul destroying to hand over our hard earned money to a company that you have trusted and have purchased from over the past 10 years to find out that they just shut up shop without any notification. The latest update - I have been searching for weeks to track them down as Stillorgan, Kilcoole, Cork and Galway are closed. I found out on google that they had a liquidation meeting on Nov 3rd so am on the case and I am very close to getting further information so when i find out whats going on i will let you know asap. And we wont stop until we get our money refunded.

jor el

If they are in liquidation you will not get your money back. You may get a percentage, possibly 10% or less, but definitely not all of it. Consumers go at the end of a long list of creditors when a company is being liquidated.

e.o.r

hi , we too have been fobbed off for the past year over this kuba range, I paid over two thousand euro and then after six months looked for a refund, we got all back bar seven hundred, which was kept for a deposit. When they finally admitted to me , about a month ago that it was not coming, i switched my order to a different range that was to be shipped from cork within a few weeks.Lo and behold, it never arrived and I have two Kuba wardrobes and nothing else. If any one is interested in the two brand new wardrobes perhaps i could help them out to finish off their set?? I spoke to their liquidator today and they told me to put it in an e mail to them. Im guessing our lost monies etc are gone, I paid with my credit card , but because it has gone over 120 days since payment, i cant claim back anything. i might as well have fecked the money in the bin.
i also have heard on the grapevine, they have opened in DUblin under a new name....but surprisingly have very little furniture, just linens etc.
any other feedback from other people who have been 'robbed' would be great!

mayolk

I was also in touch with the liquidator ..looks like we have all lost out..its terrible that there is nothing that we can do..there is only a few of us that paid by cheque..I'll never make that mistake again..

bailybeattie

I bought 8 Kuba collection chairs from this company in March 2009 with a planned delivery date of “mid April”. For various reasons the chairs were paid for in full. This delivery date was extended and extended, information I was only given each time after repeated telephone calls and visits to Kilcoole head office. I eventually ran out of patience and managed to obtain the number of their financial controller, a gentleman based at a firm in Cork.
After some persistence and after informing him that in my opinion, judging from the broken promises and rumours in the Wicklow area of a furniture company in difficulties, that this company was in administration. The financial controller denied that the company was in difficulties but agreed to repay about half of the deposit.
More time passed with promises that the chairs were at sea and on their way and were due to arrive in Cork “next week”. Again, I ran out of patience with this company’s broken promises and contacted this financial controller and threatened legal action. The balance of my money was returned in October.

Quite early on I got the feeling that this company was in difficulty. There was no change in stock levels in Kilcoole and the planned re opening of the shop in Stillorgan was postponed several times.

I think I managed to get my money back by accusing this company of being in administration – a fact that they always strenuously denied.

Newaglish

bailybeattie wrote: »

I bought 8 Kuba collection chairs from this company in March 2009 with a planned delivery date of “mid April”. For various reasons the chairs were paid for in full. This delivery date was extended and extended, information I was only given each time after repeated telephone calls and visits to Kilcoole head office. I eventually ran out of patience and managed to obtain the number of their financial controller, a gentleman based at a firm in Cork.
After some persistence and after informing him that in my opinion, judging from the broken promises and rumours in the Wicklow area of a furniture company in difficulties, that this company was in administration. The financial controller denied that the company was in difficulties but agreed to repay about half of the deposit.

More time passed with promises that the chairs were at sea and on their way and were due to arrive in Cork “next week”. Again, I ran out of patience with this company’s broken promises and contacted this financial controller and threatened legal action. The balance of my money was returned in October.

Quite early on I got the feeling that this company was in difficulty. There was no change in stock levels in Kilcoole and the planned re opening of the shop in Stillorgan was postponed several times.

I think I managed to get my money back by accusing this company of being in administration – a fact that they always strenuously denied.

To be fair, they were correct to deny that. There's no such thing as "Administration" for Irish companies. Also if they were in Liquidation/Receivership/Examinership it would have been public knowledge.

That being said, it's very common for companies to blame shipping delays, computer errors etc. when in fact they simply haven't paid their suppliers which is what appears to be the case here unfortunately.

bailybeattie

Ok understood, I am not an accountant but these refunds had to be authorised by this "external" financial controller, this aroused my suspicions that this company was in difficulty.

djk1000

Two points to make for you guys,

1. If you're a creditor, you're entitled to notice of the creditors meeting, if enough of you didn't get notice, then you have a good argument for having another one. It probably won't change a huge amount, but you can get some answers and get some things off your chest.

2. If the company is in liquidation, there is a liquidator, the liquidator is appointed by a majority of creditors (you) to act on your behalf at the creditors meeting. The liquidator has to submit a report to the Director of Corporate Enforcement, the director may decided that the company acted illegally . In that case, the limited liability of the company may be removed, the directors could then be sued for outstanding debts.

3. If deposits were taken nearly a year ago and still no goods, then there could potentially be reckless trading going on, write down the details of what happened, names, dates, phone records, emails etc. Give it to the liquidator, it will help him to form a view about reckless trading.

Hope that helps a bit!

bailybeattie

Thank you, I think that will help a lot. I got my money back but I am willing to help with my experience of dealing with this company if anybody wants to contact me.

Newaglish

djk1000 wrote: »

Two points to make for you guys,

1. If you're a creditor, you're entitled to notice of the creditors meeting, if enough of you didn't get notice, then you have a good argument for having another one. It probably won't change a huge amount, but you can get some answers and get some things off your chest.

2. If the company is in liquidation, there is a liquidator, the liquidator is appointed by a majority of creditors (you) to act on your behalf at the creditors meeting. The liquidator has to submit a report to the Director of Corporate Enforcement, the director may decided that the company acted illegally . In that case, the limited liability of the company may be removed, the directors could then be sued for outstanding debts.

3. If deposits were taken nearly a year ago and still no goods, then there could potentially be reckless trading going on, write down the details of what happened, names, dates, phone records, emails etc. Give it to the liquidator, it will help him to form a view about reckless trading.

Hope that helps a bit!

Just to follow on from your points:

1. The initial creditors meeting was advertised in a national newspaper (the Daily Star) seven days prior to the creditors meeting. You wouldn't be able to force it to be held again although you can request a copy of the statement of affairs and the minutes of the meeting. The statement of affairs will outline the realisable value of the assets of the company and the amount of creditors, which will give you an idea of what dividend you may get. It will also allow you to check if you are included on the list of creditors.

2. The Liquidator is Gerard Murphy of Gerard Murphy & Co., 46 St. Mary's Road, Midleton, County Cork. It would be a good idea for creditors to call to get a copy of the Statement of Affairs and check if they are listed. It's not however an opportunity for you to give out to the liquidator; they're really not responsible. Removal of limited liability from the ODCE is quite rare and really only occurs where there is serious fraudulent activity occuring

3. Reckless trading... I'm not going to go into detail but again unless there was signifcant fraud or serious mismanagement of finances occurring it's just not going to happen. A delayed couch delivery is not going to result in the directors being strung up in front of the High Court for reckless trading.

Some random extra information (all from the web by the way - I'm not involved in any of the parties here) which will hopefully be useful. At the end of the day though, you're very unlikely to get anything back unless you can force a chargeback via your credit card.

djk1000

Newaglish wrote: »

Just to follow on from your points:

1. The initial creditors meeting was advertised in a national newspaper (the Daily Star) seven days prior to the creditors meeting. You wouldn't be able to force it to be held again although you can request a copy of the statement of affairs and the minutes of the meeting. The statement of affairs will outline the realisable value of the assets of the company and the amount of creditors, which will give you an idea of what dividend you may get. It will also allow you to check if you are included on the list of creditors.

2. The Liquidator is Gerard Murphy of Gerard Murphy & Co., 46 St. Mary's Road, Midleton, County Cork. It would be a good idea for creditors to call to get a copy of the Statement of Affairs and check if they are listed. It's not however an opportunity for you to give out to the liquidator; they're really not responsible. Removal of limited liability from the ODCE is quite rare and really only occurs where there is serious fraudulent activity occuring

3. Reckless trading... I'm not going to go into detail but again unless there was signifcant fraud or serious mismanagement of finances occurring it's just not going to happen. A delayed couch delivery is not going to result in the directors being strung up in front of the High Court for reckless trading.

Some random extra information (all from the web by the way - I'm not involved in any of the parties here) which will hopefully be useful. At the end of the day though, you're very unlikely to get anything back unless you can force a chargeback via your credit card.

Sorry, don't mean to be difficult, section 266 of the 1963 Companies Act says that notice of the creditors meeting must be sent by post to creditors at least 10 days before the date of meeting, notice must also be placed in two daily newspapers circulating in the vicinity of the registered office or place of business.

Fraud is a criminal offence, reckless trading is different. If a director knows that the company is insolvent, but continues to trade, then that is by definition reckless trading, a creditor may then hold them personally liable and take them to court for the money they are owed. I'd suggest that if a deposit is taken a year earlier and the goods don't show, then there is a distinct possibility of reckless trading. To clarify further, insolvency is when the company cannot meet its obligations as they fall due, if they reached that point and kept on taking deposits, then the directors could well be held responsible.

As for the liquidator, he's doing a tough job and he is not representing the company, he's representing the creditors, so don't give out, but also don't be fobbed off, fight for your rights! It's only natural that a liquidator will want to keep things quick and smooth, but ask tough questions about the companies actions, e.g. "when were the directors aware that the company was insolvant?" "how far back do unpaid creditors go?" etc.

I'm speaking obviously in hypotheticals here, I'm not making any comments about one situation or another.

EKRIUQ

I wish they'd get rid of that Trojan horse virus on their website, even if you google Top Drawer with Firefox it sets my anti virus off:mad:

pwurple

Top Drawer appears to have reopened, and are using their old customer list, as I received an 'invite' to their opening sale.

I wonder will they honour my credit note from before they went bust?

amoppet

commiserations to everyone who lost money with TD in the past, that's seriously a rotten thing to happen anyone with their hard earned money. i saw that there is a top drawer now over by the kinsale roundabout, mainly linens but some small amount of furniture, i bought from them some years ago when they were trading in douglas and i would like to order a chest of drawers from their irish coast collection (only from them because i can't find it anywhere else).. but i'm afraid to for fear it's only a temporary set up.... anyone order anything recently...successfully???

doniem

Sorry to drag up an old thread but i put a €400 deposit on a dining table, chairs and a sideboard in Top Drawer in Cobh Cross/Fota Retail Park yesterday. Today I was trying to show a friend the set online but when i googled it this was the 1st result i got. Im a bit worried after hearing the stories on here. While i have no doubt the posters here had legitimate complaints and problems before the company went into liquidation does anyone know if they are now running a proper operation since reopening or should i try and get my money back straight away?
Thanks for any replies.

maxer68

doniem wrote: »

Sorry to drag up an old thread but i put a €400 deposit on a dining table, chairs and a sideboard in Top Drawer in Cobh Cross/Fota Retail Park yesterday. Today I was trying to show a friend the set online but when i googled it this was the 1st result i got. Im a bit worried after hearing the stories on here. While i have no doubt the posters here had legitimate complaints and problems before the company went into liquidation does anyone know if they are now running a proper operation since reopening or should i try and get my money back straight away?
Thanks for any replies.

#1 - ALWAYS pay deposits by credit card - even if you have to borrow someone elses and pay them the cash. If anything happens to the company, you get your money back.

#2 - There are a fair few "Top Drawer" names about. (over 20 according to CRO) - Even some lingerie departments are called "Top Drawer" so there may be no connection with the old company.

dudara

You raised an old thread, and as a previous poster mentioned, we don't even know if the are the same "Top Drawer" operation.

doniem

dudara wrote: »

You raised an old thread, and as a previous poster mentioned, we don't even know if the are the same "Top Drawer" operation.

1st of all thanks for the replies folks. I didnt realise they're are so many companies with the same name. Also i did pay with a credit card so thanks maxer68 that has put my mind at ease.

Secondly the reason i posted in this thread is when i looked up the furniture range 'Kuba' and the company name 'Top Drawer' this thread is the first result in google. Also a previous poster mentioned that a new top drawer opened in 2009 and so did this place.

Apologies if i shouldnt have dragged up an old thread. I wasn't sure whether to start a new one or not.

dudara

Apologies if it came across a bit harshly - I was trying to say that it's a bit hard to tell to assess accurately. The original thread is from 2009, with recent posts in 2010, so things could well have changed since then.

You've paid with a credit card which is the smart thing to do in such situations. Here's hoping that everything is OK.

John Rubery

Lisap wrote: »

Hi All,Just to let people know who gave the company TOP DRAWER Kilcoole, Cork, Glaway money for goods and has not yet received them - I am sorry to advise anyone who left deposits or unfortunately like we did paid in full fwill not get their goods! We ordered KUBA furtniture please note that it was never ordered by the company - I have found out this morning after 11 months of pulling my hair out to get our furniture that they attended an Insolvency meeting!We ordered the KUBA furniture value EUR1200 in January and were told that it would take months to be made and to arrive which was fine as we have always purchased our furniture from TOP DRAWER.I callled the company each month and was given countless excuses, then my husband stepped in and the manager of the Kilcoole branch told him that infact there was never any furniture and they would issue a cheque for a full refund. We contacted accounts and we were promised that we would recieve the cheque. Then the company shut its doors without any notification and now i find on the internet that they are insolvent. Im sure this is deemed as <snip> as the company admitted that they never ordered the furniture and im sure that there are many others like us that have been cheated out of our hard earned money.We have started legal proceedings and would like to know if anyone out there has any info to help us get our money back and hopefully money back for all the other people that gave their money in good faith to this company, I am also going to the police to see if there is anything else we can do. If anyone has any information can they please contact me thanks...

have tried to send letter without success, does anybody know of email or contact number of top drawer representatives. Here is the message that we have tried to post. Visited store today to arrange delivery for goods purchased and paid for which were been stored. Was very shocked to see that store was closed and emptied of all stock. Would be very grateful if you could let me know the situation. Goods paid for and stored amount to approx 3 to 4 thousand euros. My phone number was on file but was not informed that closure was imminent. Please advise of my position and the whereabouts of our stock.

<SNIP- personal details removed>

Would very much appreciate a reply at your convenience.