Frontline 16-11-09

RedorDead

Make sure to watch the frontline tonight @ 10.30 - the motor industry and inevitably Belgard will be discussed.

Doh - only saw healyc's post there.

-Chris-

RedorDead wrote: »

Make sure to watch the frontline tonight @ 10.30 - the motor industry and inevitably Belgard will be discussed.

Doh - only saw healyc's post there.

Good Jesus, this is painful.

Healyc

Healyc wrote: »

Supposedly there is going to be a part about Belgard Motors tonight on Pat Kenny's Frontline show!

http://www.rte.ie/news/thefrontline/

-Chris- wrote: »

Good Jesus, this is painful.

Never watched this in the end, couldn't keep my eyes open :rolleyes:

So what did they say?

-Chris-

Nothin we haven't said here a million times.

Belgard got a one word mention, the SIMI pushed for a scrappage scheme because it would generate VRT receipts, the greens said they'd prefer to use the scrappage scheme money to make peoples houses more energy efficient.

<insert circular arguement here>

Everyone went home.

Hellrazer

-Chris- wrote: »

the greens said they'd prefer to use the scrappage scheme money to make peoples houses more energy efficient.

That bloke from the Greens was a right knob in all fairness.He hadnt a clue about anything to do with motors.Couple of times he mentioned using the money from a scrappage scheme for people upgrading their existing cars by changing and I quote "A torque"<<<----WTF :eek::eek: If thats what running the country no wonder we are where we are!!
He kept spouting on about upgrading cars and making them more environment friendly.Thats going to cost more than a 2k scrappage scheme.

Drummerboy08

Oh, was this on last night? Oh well, LL Cool J got my viewing on NCIS LA. Christ, thats alot of initials.

Seth Brundle

Did anyone see Frontline last night with the SIMI & Peter Bacon on making their case for a scrappage scheme? (can't see it yet on rte.ie)
As a petrolhead, I'm all for having cars on our road but I don't believe that a scrappage scheme is the way to do it. I can't see that many taking one up anyhow given the lack of finance, etc.
I have to admit, the green fella (for those that didn't see it he wasn't green party!) was very good in putting down the various arguments put forward by both Bacon and the SIMI!

R.O.R

http://www.rte.ie/player/#v=1060206

Linky for it on the RTE Player.

Sleepy

If you're driving something that would qualify for a scrappage scheme, I think it's fair to say that you can't afford a brand new car in this climate.

kodute

Sleepy wrote: »

If you're driving something that would qualify for a scrappage scheme, I think it's fair to say that you can't afford a brand new car in this climate.

Not necessarily true
Bangernomics thread that way ->


For the most part the banks aren't giving out car loans.
Also a major downside the UK experienced was a huge increase in Kias and Hyundais on the road... :eek:

hobochris

Legislation should support a free market not force people to buy when their old car still does the job.

jamiecall

In my opinion it was a bit like "my report is better than your report" between Mr Bacon and the 12 year old from the Greens.

At the end of the day the motor trade is in a very bad way, 10,000 jobs already gone with the prospect of losing another 10,000 jobs over the next 12 months. Any other sector would have been bailed out by now! When 1900 jobs were lost at Dell there was outrage. At least they got some redundancy. I've been left go by 2 motor dealers in the last 12 months because of difficult trading and i've been lucky enough to leave with a weeks wages not to mind any redundancy package.

It needs a scrappage scheme to stimulate it again and to create some kind of retail positivity. In saying that, if they dropped the VAT rate to 15% it would stimulate a lot more than just the Motor Trade.

smash

I saw a part of it and what I found great was when the guy representing electric vehicles in the audience went on his little rant, Pat immediately turned around and said "yea, but most of our electricity comes from fossil fuels!" ... so what's the point!

jamiecall wrote: »

It needs a scrappage scheme to stimulate it again and to create some kind of retail positivity. In saying that, if they dropped the VAT rate to 15% it would stimulate a lot more than just the Motor Trade.

To be honest, if they want it they can drop their margins and do it themselves or campaign to the distributors and introduce a scheme like Renault did!

jamiecall

steve06 wrote: »

I saw a part of it and what I found great was when the guy representing electric vehicles in the audience went on his little rant, Pat immediately turned around and said "yea, but most of our electricity comes from fossil fuels!" ... so what's the point!


To be honest, if they want it they can drop their margins and do it themselves or campaign to the distributors and introduce a scheme like Renault did!

Margins have already been cut. Thats why so many dealerships are closing. Dealers are not making any money! Distributors seem to be washing their hands with it.

amovingstatue

Personally, I always thought that the people driving old cars are (though personal financial circumstances or personal choice - i.e. that a new car purchase is ludicrous given the 1st and 2nd year devaluation) not the people who will be buying a new car whether a scrappage scheme operates or not.

What sort of controls were and will be in place to prevent dealers clearing a yard full of traded in cars not worth the scrappage amount and buying new cars in taking ownership of them to get the allowance and selling them on as new?

I think there would be a lot more sympathy for the car industry here if the dealerships offered better service. There's many stories of people having issues with modern cars which have sensors measuring everything now and a dealership garage producing an enormous bill for troubleshooting and parts replacement. The cost of some engine management parts which for the most part are mass produced moulded plastic with a bit of electronics hidden away is scandalous, but this is going into an off topic rant...

TomMc

jamiecall wrote: »

In my opinion it was a bit like "my report is better than your report" between Mr Bacon and the 12 year old from the Greens.

It needs a scrappage scheme to stimulate it again and to create some kind of retail positivity. In saying that, if they dropped the VAT rate to 15% it would stimulate a lot more than just the Motor Trade.

Dropping the VAT rate to 15% makes things worse. You get 6.5% less on all VAT turnover (not just the increased sales) And gain 15% on the incremental increase over and above the norm. While it gives the public an extra 6.5% spending power in their pockets, the state ends up collecting much less VAT overall and so cuts in public spending or increases in taxes will be the consequences. And who pays that in the end ? the general public do.

---

They are putting the VAT rate back to 17.5% in the UK from the 1st Jan 2010. Weak Sterling, lower business operating costs/overheads, lower retailer margins are why people travel north to shop. The VAT difference is really just incidental.

omega man

Hellrazer wrote: »

That bloke from the Greens was a right knob in all fairness.He hadnt a clue about anything to do with motors.Couple of times he mentioned using the money from a scrappage scheme for people upgrading their existing cars by changing and I quote "A torque"<<<----WTF :eek::eek: If thats what running the country no wonder we are where we are!!
He kept spouting on about upgrading cars and making them more environment friendly.Thats going to cost more than a 2k scrappage scheme.

Eh, that guy was NOT part of the green party! You obviously listened to what you wanted to hear. Although i did not agree with all of what he said i have to say he spoke far more sense then the dealer/SIMI guys and even Bacon seemed to be lost for concise statements to be honest. I thought the proposal was a non runner before and now i am totally sure.

-Chris-

omega man wrote: »

Eh, that guy was NOT part of the green party! You obviously listened to what you wanted to hear.

Was it not James Nix?

omega man

jamiecall wrote: »

In my opinion it was a bit like "my report is better than your report" between Mr Bacon and the 12 year old from the Greens.

At the end of the day the motor trade is in a very bad way, 10,000 jobs already gone with the prospect of losing another 10,000 jobs over the next 12 months. Any other sector would have been bailed out by now! When 1900 jobs were lost at Dell there was outrage. At least they got some redundancy. I've been left go by 2 motor dealers in the last 12 months because of difficult trading and i've been lucky enough to leave with a weeks wages not to mind any redundancy package.

It needs a scrappage scheme to stimulate it again and to create some kind of retail positivity. In saying that, if they dropped the VAT rate to 15% it would stimulate a lot more than just the Motor Trade.

In fairness it should be pointed out that guy was not a Green Party member. I felt he spoke well and represented his views better than Bacon and the dealer/SIMI guys. Ok he may not have known too much about cars but he spoke a bit of sense. I actually thought Bacon seemed unable to put clear concise statements together.

Hellrazer

omega man wrote: »

Eh, that guy was NOT part of the green party! You obviously listened to what you wanted to hear. Although i did not agree with all of what he said i have to say he spoke far more sense then the dealer/SIMI guys and even Bacon seemed to be lost for concise statements to be honest. I thought the proposal was a non runner before and now i am totally sure.

Ok apologies.I know he wasnt from the green party--he was from some environmental agency but he may as well have been John Gormleys love child with the crap he was spouting.

/edit/Thanks Chris.

10,000 more jobs will go next year if something isnt done all because him and his ilk want us either on bicycles or using a crap,useless public transport system.I think he(or was it the other bloke in the audience) mentioned something about using the money that could be spent on a scrappage scheme to insulate peoples homes--so now he wants to prop up the building industry who got us here in the first place.

Apologies if I sound pissed off with these bunch of hippies but Ive already been made redundant once this year and I dont want to be made redundant again in the foreseeable future.

TomMc

The bottom line is if someone drives around in an old banger, the one thing they are not is vain (at least in motoring terms). So even if they have the means to buy new or obtain credit, these people are going to end up buying bargain basement reliable cars, not more expensive temperamental prestige ones. Something that is cheap and cheerful, with a long warranty like a Kia Ceed. It just doesn't generate a decent return for the exchequer. Likewise where motor dealerships are concerned, it treats the symptoms of their predicament, not the problem itself. A quick fix and nothing more. Brushes the problem under the carpet, postponing the inevitable. Until dealerships return to the more humble environs of several decades earlier, greatly reducing costs and improving service, they do not have a future. The ones who adapt their business model to suit the times, will be the ones who have.

---

The truth is that if most of the dealerships that are going under are Ltd companies, it is ultimately the banks, their suppliers, the revenue and of course their staff who are bearing the consequences for their recklessness and lack of business acumen. The principals lose capital invested but only a percentage of the total debt, for their absolute incompedance and mismanagement. These losses end up been paid off by the general public in one form or another later on.

Seth Brundle

jamiecall wrote: »

In my opinion it was a bit like "my report is better than your report" between Mr Bacon and the 12 year old from the Greens.

At the end of the day the motor trade is in a very bad way, 10,000 jobs already gone with the prospect of losing another 10,000 jobs over the next 12 months. Any other sector would have been bailed out by now! When 1900 jobs were lost at Dell there was outrage. At least they got some redundancy. I've been left go by 2 motor dealers in the last 12 months because of difficult trading and i've been lucky enough to leave with a weeks wages not to mind any redundancy package.

It needs a scrappage scheme to stimulate it again and to create some kind of retail positivity. In saying that, if they dropped the VAT rate to 15% it would stimulate a lot more than just the Motor Trade.

Was the "12 year old" wrong (and as I have already said, he wasn't from the greens)?
I don't want to see people in the industry lose their jobs but from an economic point of view, is it better that people spend whatever money they have on goods manufactured here or on goods where a large whack of the RRP is exported? The government cannot be asking people to stop heading North and at the same time, encouraging them to buy cars manufactured abroad.
Secondly, where are people going to buy a new car from? Nobody is going to give them credit, unless the manufacturers are rolling out various finance packages.
However, given the lack of finance available and people's insecurity over their jobs, is a scrappage scheme actually going to work (and I'm not going to trust the impartial words from Dr. Bacon and the SIMI!)? How many people would actually buy a new car under the current climate (over and above those actually doing so now)?

Yakuza

I can't take Peter Bacon seriously. [conspiracy] He just wants us to borrow money from the banks to rebuild their profitability[/conspiracy].
(OT) Some interesting analysis here on his performance on Prime Time a few months ago.

omega man

Hellrazer wrote: »

Ok apologies.I know he wasnt from the green party--he was from some environmental agency but he may as well have been John Gormleys love child with the crap he was spouting.

10,000 more jobs will go next year if something isnt done all because him and his ilk want us either on bicycles or using a crap,useless public transport system.I think he(or was it the other bloke in the audience) mentioned something about using the money that could be spent on a scrappage scheme to insulate peoples homes--so now he wants to prop up the building industry who got us here in the first place.

Apologies if I sound pissed off with these bunch of hippies but Ive already been made redundant once this year and I dont want to be made redundant again in the foreseeable future.

Ok i get your point but you have just mentioned 10,000 jobs will go and then you had a go at the building industry. What about the average jobs within that sector? Im sure there are far more then 10,000 at stake. I work in the tourism industry, what of the many jobs at stake there also? Really it should just be about supply and demand and sadly i imagine there are just too many in the business right now. The most efficient, dynamic and customer focused companies should get through it.

Hellrazer

I understand completely and hate to see any jobs go in any industry but this is the motors forum and the show last night was about the motor trade.

omega man wrote: »

Ok i get your point but you have just mentioned 10,000 jobs will go and then you had a go at the building industry. What about the average jobs within that sector? Im sure there are far more then 10,000 at stake. I work in the tourism industry, what of the many jobs at stake there also? Really it should just be about supply and demand and sadly i imagine there are just too many in the business right now. The most efficient, dynamic and customer focused companies should get through it.

omega man

-Chris- wrote: »

Was it not James Nix?

Nope dont believe so.

smash

TomMc wrote: »

The bottom line is if someone drives around in an old banger, the one thing they are not is vain (at least in motoring terms). So even if they have the means to buy new or obtain credit, these people are going to end up buying bargain basement reliable cars, not more expensive temperamental prestige ones.

Nail on the head... if you have a 10 year old car then you're not a reg snob. If you were looking for a new car you wouldn't scrap for 2k and spend another 18 on a new car, you're more likely to spend 15 on the same car that's a few months old and has a few miles on it. Then sell your car privately for a grand or so... have 4k in your pocket then!

omega man

Hellrazer wrote: »

I understand completely and hate to see any jobs go in any industry but this is the motors forum and the show last night was about the motor trade.

Im well aware its a Motors forum but that does not mean everyone has to agree on the merits of a scrappage scheme. You mentioned the building industry, not me. Anyhow, in fairness it probably was not a serious 'debate' last night.

Fozzie Bear

I just don't get how a scrappage scheme will work currently. A couple of years ago yes but now? Come off it lads, yer having a laugh.

IF someone is in the position to buy a brand new car they are probably filthy rich and a piffling couple of grand scrappage is not worth a fiddlers to them as they will in all likelyhood be currently driving a high spec few year old Merc/Beemer or similar.

If you are an ordinary Joe blogs and thinking of buying brand new you will in all likelyhood have far more pressing things to spend 20+ grand on if you have it saved, (unlikely to get a bank loan for it), like a mortgage or saving for a rainy day if you or your spouse gets laid off or just paying day to day bills. A brand new car is a luxury the vast majority of us cannot and will not splash out on when most of us are up to our eyes in debt, negative equity, unemployed or just too worried about whats around the corner in this screwed up little country of ours.

SIMI/car trade are grasping at straws here much like the public sector unions and restaraunt trade with their 10 point plans to save their arsés/pay packets the country. Sooner we all accept that this is survival of the fittest time and we are all going to take severe hits to our pockets and life style in the coming years the sooner we will all start pulling in the same direction and we get out of this shít.

TomMc

Hellrazer wrote: »

I understand completely and hate to see any jobs go in any industry but this is the franchised dealers motors forum and the show last night was about the motor trade.

This is a motoring forum for the general public not for motor trade propaganda.:D

Darragh29

omega man wrote: »

Ok i get your point but you have just mentioned 10,000 jobs will go and then you had a go at the building industry. What about the average jobs within that sector? Im sure there are far more then 10,000 at stake. I work in the tourism industry, what of the many jobs at stake there also? Really it should just be about supply and demand and sadly i imagine there are just too many in the business right now. The most efficient, dynamic and customer focused companies should get through it.

The problem here is that in reality, the industry cannot support those 10,000 jobs on the basis of a normal realistic volume of vehicle sales. Effectively, there are 10,000 people still employed in the industry on the basis of the kind of sales that were going on back in 2006.

These jobs have to be lost, the industry is basically inflated and needs to shrink in terms of employees, back to a size that is consistent with realistic sales volumes as opposed to the madness that was going on up until recently enough.

You could see it for yourself on The Front Line last night, dealers with multi franchise outlets looking for sympathy and business welfare from the state. Like all enterprise, you take your chances and if you decide to grow rapidly and then the market changes and you are left with a showroom and no customers, then that's capitalism and market reality in action and you move on and try something else.

I don't agree that the industry be given welfare by the state, in the form of a scrappage scheme or any other flavour, there are plenty of opportunities out there, one that springs to mind is green/electric vehicles, if these guys had any initiative, they would be exploring new opportunities instead of pestering the government and the taxpayer for a bail out...

Hellrazer

Some great points there Darragh.Whether or not a scrappage scheme is introduced isnt the point.The point is these greens are totally anti-car and wont even accept that having a car is a necessity with the **** public transport we have.Thats what has me annoyed the most.
I tried the commute to Dublin from Maynooth on the train and christ never again.I felt like a sardine on the train-no seat,stuffy and tbh it was just as long door to door.

I agree that there are too many dealers here but I still hate to see jobs going.

The dealers that will survive are the ones who try something different.

As for the electric car argument--that was shot down aswell last night since we still use fossil fuels to fuel the electric car and of course thats also against the green agenda.

So in effect until everyone in the country is cycling a 70 mile round trip to work the greens wont be happy.

Darragh29 wrote: »

The problem here is that in reality, the industry cannot support those 10,000 jobs on the basis of a normal realistic volume of vehicle sales. Effectively, there are 10,000 people still employed in the industry on the basis of the kind of sales that were going on back in 2006.

These jobs have to be lost, the industry is basically inflated and needs to shrink in terms of employees, back to a size that is consistent with realistic sales volumes as opposed to the madness that was going on up until recently enough.

You could see it for yourself on The Front Line last night, dealers with multi franchise outlets looking for sympathy and business welfare from the state. Like all enterprise, you take your chances and if you decide to grow rapidly and then the market changes and you are left with a showroom and no customers, then that's capitalism and market reality in action and you move on and try something else.

I don't agree that the industry be given welfare by the state, in the form of a scrappage scheme or any other flavour, there are plenty of opportunities out there, one that springs to mind is green/electric vehicles, if these guys had any initiative, they would be exploring new opportunities instead of pestering the government and the taxpayer for a bail out...

-Chris-

omega man wrote: »

Nope dont believe so.

http://www.rte.ie/ie/frontline/entry/the_banks_the_developers_and

Well known economist Peter Bacon (who of course was the architect of NAMA) will debate the issue with environmentalist James Nix.

Was it a different environmentalist also called James Nix?

-Chris-

Posts merged from Belgard thread

amovingstatue

Hellrazer wrote: »

Some great points there Darragh.Whether or not a scrappage scheme is introduced isnt the point.The point is these greens are totally anti-car and wont even accept that having a car is a necessity with the **** public transport we have.Thats what has me annoyed the most.
I tried the commute to Dublin from Maynooth on the train and christ never again.I felt like a sardine on the train-no seat,stuffy and tbh it was just as long door to door.

I agree that there are too many dealers here but I still hate to see jobs going.

The dealers that will survive are the ones who try something different.

As for the electric car argument--that was shot down aswell last night since we still use fossil fuels to fuel the electric car and of course thats also against the green agenda.

So in effect until everyone in the country is cycling a 70 mile round trip to work the greens wont be happy.

anti-car = anti-reality in Ireland today. The number of people commuting into cities as a result of the property price bubble must be massive, and the lengths of the commutes. wonder if there's a poll taken anytime of daily commute distances.

McSpud

6 months ago I would said there would not be a scrappage scheme but not sure now.

2k scrappage discount will not make any one buy a 20k car but might sell some 12k cars. Its hard to see how such a scheme could save many jobs that are likely to be lost eventually anyway. The recession might end towards the end of 2010 but full employment is a long way off. The motoring retail sector will not get anywhere near the sales numbers of recent years possibly ever again.

smash

ok lads, if a scrappage scheme was introduced, it would only effect new car sales. There's maybe what... 200 franchise dealers in Ireland? If there was 100,000 cars sold through the scheme spread out over the 200 dealers, that's 500 cars each dealer, so that's 42 cars a month (rounding it up). If the average car is 20k and the dealer makes a 10% margin on that, the dealer will make 1m a year... now minus rent, upkeep, tax and salaries it doesn't leave a whole lot!

So ask yourselves, is that going to save 10,000 jobs at an average of 30k+ commission? I don't think so, you're dreaming!

Wertz

Just to add on this whole scrappage scheme rubbish...where does the motor tax being collected under the old CC system then come from when people trade up to a more efficient car that is assesed on CO2 outputs?

Say someone is driving a 2 litre petrol now, paying €630 motor tax annually....they trade it in for something of a similar sized/powered engine but in diesel and end up paying a much reduced rate under the CO2...in some cases as much as 75% less in tax.

So not only is €2K(?) being thrown in by the taxpayer to fund a foreign purchase, but over the life of the car, much less motor tax is generated and has to be made up in other taxes.

That's not to say that the tax bands under carbon dioxide output will remain at rates that are that different from the current CC rates either though...

VolvoMan

And what would happen to the trade of all those independent mechanics if most of the older cars were wiped off our roads? A scrappage scheme in this country has far more negative points than it does positive. As somebody previously mentioned, it will be nothing more than a stop-gap from the industry collapsing.

Also, I can tell you from first-hand knowledge that the majority of these people who drive around in old cars would never buy new in a million years.

Rev. BlueJeans

Scrappage is running full swing atm, in the UK.

In terms of shifting cars, it is working, as it seems to be Stateside.

However.

The elephant in the room is the overhead in terms of pollution involved in the manufacture of the new vehicle, coupled with the disposal of the old.

As well as that, the UK government are effectively subsidising the Korean et al economies, as most vehicles purchased are economy brands like Kia and Hyundai.

Most people who invest in a new vehicle, are middle to low income families or old folk who went through a bad MOT and don't want the hassle. The latter group will have readies to hand, the others will go down the finance/balloon payment route.

The vast majority of vehicles scrapped in UK (as would be here), are perfectly serviceable vehicles (and in many cases, quite rare, but not carrying enough of a premium to exceed their scrappage value), and all for the government with an eye to VAT, the sales industry lobbyists, and the grasping bankers.

Anyone who has any love for cars at all should be dead set against such an idea.

As for the environmental lobby wanting to future-proof homes, great, keep doing what we are doing, and offer more carrotts for doing so (bigger grants).

But knocking homes, and scrapping worthy vehicles for the sake of it? Feck off.

Mr.Boots

The building boom is over cos it was unsustainable
Maybe the motor industry also is.....
Maybe 10,000 jobs have to go.
Maybe its time for people to hold on to their car for 5/6 years instead of 1/2.
The scrappage scheme will never work. were in to big a hole and the banks arnt lending anyway.

galwaytt

The Irish Environmental Network.

The who ?

Exactly, Who the **** more like

That's where James Nix is from.

"Irish Environmental Network, with funding from the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, it says, HERE

...this, this, Muppet, is paid by the Irish Taxpayer ?? :eek: :mad: FFS :mad:

...and when I see they're shoulder-to-shoulder with that august body - An Taisce - that tells me all I want to know..............that it's a self-serving, self-centred bunch of ill-informed Dublin City Centre based morons. You know, the place with the LUAS. The DART. Dublin Bus. Mainline and InterCity Rail. The M50, M1, M4 etc etc.......Deceaux bicycles, even...

Why such a person would even be asked to comment on car policy, from the confines of a virtual plethora of public transport, escapes me.

Makes me want to Do A Kenny on it @ the 20min 10 second mark, btw......

maidhc

Anyone notice the dealer who said his service business would start to drop off as "there was a two year follow on" from a sale to parts/service. Oddest logic ever.

Anyway, the problem is that the people who used to change every 2/3 years are not doing so... The people with a 9 year old car now were driving a 6 year old car at the height of the celtic tiger...!

Rev. BlueJeans

It's worth noting too, that if the sales industry is unsustainable to any degree, it's not just down to lazy spiv salesman, or profiteering dealers (although we all know that exists to some point).

Much of it is down to the manufacturers, distributors, who forced honest to god garages to demolish premises in order to build big greenhouses to make the brand, and the wares, look good.

-Chris-

maidhc wrote: »

Anyone notice the dealer who said his service business would start to drop off as "there was a two year follow on" from a sale to parts/service. Oddest logic ever.

That was Arthur O'Sullivan, he's a pretty sharp cookie in my opinion. Any of the stuff that we moan on about (customer focus, servicing on Saturdays etc.) he's normally implemented. He tends to be ahead of the curve, by-and-large.

If he's saying it, I'd say he's done the numbers on it, and I'd think the logic could stack up - if 70% of a main dealer's servicing is on 0-3 year old cars, with a drop off after that, it's reasonable to say that if you have a couple of lean years in sales that it'll cause a reduction in service work down the line.
I'd say if you looked at the statistics of new car buyers who stay within the dealer network vs buyers of 3-4 year old cars who use the dealer network, it'd support that logic.

Hellrazer

maidhc wrote: »

Anyone notice the dealer who said his service business would start to drop off as "there was a two year follow on" from a sale to parts/service. Oddest logic ever.

His figures are correct.Most people that buy a new car will return to the dealer they bought it from for the first 2 years--its actually for the life of the warranty ie parts and service.After that they start using indys for their servicing and repairs.

I was at a course about it a few weeks back--all about main dealers trying to extend that return period out to 5/6 years instead of the 2/3 it is now.My point--drop your servicing prices and you`ll get the business back :D
The bloke running the course didnt like that.

smash

Rev. BlueJeans wrote: »

Scrappage is running full swing atm, in the UK.

In terms of shifting cars, it is working, as it seems to be Stateside.

As I stated previously, the cash for clunkers scheme in the states didn't work out because of the terms and conditions attached to it. On August 5, 2009 184,304 cars had been scrapped... that's not a success!

maidhc wrote: »

Anyone notice the dealer who said his service business would start to drop off as "there was a two year follow on" from a sale to parts/service. Oddest logic ever.

Not really, most cars carry a 20,000km service interval.

maidhc

Hellrazer wrote: »

I was at a course about it a few weeks back--all about main dealers trying to extend that return period out to 5/6 years instead of the 2/3 it is now.My point--drop your servicing prices and you`ll get the business back :D
The bloke running the course didnt like that.

Well assuming the "national car park" (as they call it) does not decrease, and assuming the average age of cars gets older, one must assume there will be more maintenance work to go around.... the work may well go to the lowest bidder, but so be it, the main thing is the work is there... and who better to be able to compete in the maintenance of modern cars than a main dealer with a good knowledge base!

But these lads don't like the idea of having to come out with new business plans it seems...

smash

now that the greens and revenue and dealers are pushing for diesel cars, can I just throw this out there... http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=arLpHvpEGn9o

So go on and set up your scrappage schemes, then in 5 years you'll all be penalised for driving them with massive pollution taxes and you'll be pushed into buying an electric one!

VolvoMan

I don't think there is any obligation to service car at a main dealer anymore since Block Exemption was introduced.