SU bashing and complaints

cson

Paul Howard should really have let that character die after the first 5 books. Its extremely tired at this stage and that it's spawning imitators is embarrassing to be honest.

So to keep this on topic and for my own interest; Are the two Aoife's happy with how their term in office has gone so far?

NickDrake

cson wrote: »

Paul Howard should really have let that character die after the first 5 books. Its extremely tired at this stage and that it's spawning imitators is embarrassing to be honest.

So to keep this on topic and for my own interest; Are the two Aoife's happy with how their term in office has gone so far?

You will find Fiachra above did not go off topic. He mentioned Aoife's performance so far and stated he has admiration for her.

Also respect to him for coming on here standing up against censorship. Cant be easy for the fella.

Ms. Education

cson wrote: »

So to keep this on topic and for my own interest; Are the two Aoife's happy with how their term in office has gone so far?

So far, it's been ok. I'm not thrilled but I'm not disappointed. There are ups and downs to every job and here is no different. At the start, I focused a lot on university represenation and policy stuff but now I've moved more into trying to let more students know what I do and how I can help them if they need it, particularly coming up to exams. That's why I joined boards, set up an officer page on Facebook, update my blog as regularly as I can, etc. I try to take any criticism of me on board and act on it or at the very least explain why I've done something in a particular way.

That's about the sum total of it.

cson

And would you be happy with the performance of the Union and its officers so far (aside from yourself obviously)?

Ms. Education

Like my opinion on my performance, I'd say that there have been good points and bad. I can't speak for everybody but I think that there's room to improve and be better. There always is.

sceptre

Working with the certainty that pretty much everyone needs only one account, Fiachra D-W no longer requires access to the site. NickDrake, you and your housemate can keep one account each like everyone else - you don't require the Fiachra D-W one as well. Feel free to scream censorship till you're blue in the face but given that that's a complaint about moderating, that belongs on the Help Desk or nowhere at all. Those are sitewide rules. Take it there or take it nowhere.

Complaints about the banning of the alter-ego you guys enjoyed can go in the prison forum or on the Help Desk. I don't have a problem banning the lot of you for a complete inability to not thread spoil when other people want a reasoned discussion. I already pointed out this isn't your playground: you ignored that. You don't get to ignore it - you are merely the centre of your universe, not the universe. And lest there be any confusion, this has nothing to do with your views on anything. it's got all to do with your inability not to be an ass on a board that caters for more than you.

Complain to me via PM, to the Edu Cmod or on the Help Desk. I would suggest following that line of complaint, moving in an iteration from one to the next. This board is certainly not your playground. I don't intend to babysit you. Having hit the age you have, you shouldn't require it. This thread had a purpose and still does. That a small number of you have chosen to ignore that in favour of idiocy doesn't mean it doesn't still have a purpose for those capable of non-idiocy. Discussion is cool. Dissent is cool. Disagreement is cool. Idiocy and gob****edness is not. I'm not interested in furthering the silliness of a small number of individuals that will cause other people to stay away from the board. It will stop. And it will stop now. I don't have a problem taking nuclear options when presented with continued idiocy and there has been that. Though I can't believe that any of you, even the idiots among you, believe that the SU or any SU or any form of student politics is significant enough that any moderator would bother taking steps to stamp out opposition to whatever the SU line is on anything as opposed to encouraging reasonable and reasoned discussion.

The reply to (as in "complaint about") the moderation aspects of this post belong in a PM to me, to the cmod or on the HelpDesk. Pick whichever one of those three you like. Do not pick another option. It's threads like this that sometimes remind me why politicians with larger constituencies are frequently reluctant to engage with the public on the Internet - this is what they would get presented with and hence why would they bother.

On-topic replies are obviously welcome for those of you that can (and obviously some of you can- some of you already have:)).

/mod

mrmanire

sceptre wrote: »

Working with the certainty that pretty much everyone needs only one account, Fiachra D-W no longer requires access to the site. NickDrake, you and your housemate can keep one account each like everyone else - you don't require the Fiachra D-W one as well. Feel free to scream censorship till you're blue in the face but given that that's a complaint about moderating, that belongs on the Help Desk or nowhere at all. Those are sitewide rules. Take it there or take it nowhere.

Complaints about the banning of the alter-ego you guys enjoyed can go in the prison forum or on the Help Desk. I don't have a problem banning the lot of you for a complete inability to not thread spoil when other people want a reasoned discussion. I already pointed out this isn't your playground: you ignored that. You don't get to ignore it - you are merely the centre of your universe, not the universe. And lest there be any confusion, this has nothing to do with your views on anything. it's got all to do with your inability not to be an ass on a board that caters for more than you.

Complain to me via PM, to the Edu Cmod or on the Help Desk. I would suggest following that line of complaint, moving in an iteration from one to the next. This board is certainly not your playground. I don't intend to babysit you. Having hit the age you have, you shouldn't require it. This thread had a purpose and still does. That a small number of you have chosen to ignore that in favour of idiocy doesn't mean it doesn't still have a purpose for those capable of non-idiocy. Discussion is cool. Dissent is cool. Disagreement is cool. Idiocy and gob****edness is not. I'm not interested in furthering the silliness of a small number of individuals that will cause other people to stay away from the board. It will stop. And it will stop now. I don't have a problem taking nuclear options when presented with continued idiocy and there has been that. Though I can't believe that any of you, even the idiots among you, believe that the SU or any SU or any form of student politics is significant enough that any moderator would bother taking steps to stamp out opposition to whatever the SU line is on anything as opposed to encouraging reasonable and reasoned discussion.

The reply to (as in "complaint about") the moderation aspects of this post belong in a PM to me, to the cmod or on the HelpDesk. Pick whichever one of those three you like. Do not pick another option. It's threads like this that sometimes remind me why politicians with larger constituencies are frequently reluctant to engage with the public on the Internet - this is what they would get presented with and hence why would they bother.

On-topic replies are obviously welcome for those of you that can (and obviously some of you can- some of you already have:)).

/mod

Amazing how mad people get over such trivial things. Now I thought that boards.ie was supposed to be interesting and a bit of fun. It seems to be getting as serious as the 'Henry' debacle now. Maybe the thread did go 'a bit' off topic but what the hey; people were talking.

As for knocking the SU; I can't comment on how the two Aoifes are getting (got) on but I can only assume it's a lot better than in the past. During my last year in UL (07-08); I can only state my believe that that the administration of St John was a disgrace. I only have to cite events like the ridiculous protest over the car park and the state of an focal to make my point. The resignation of Judith Lynch that year only further depicts the incompetence of student administration that year which justly warranted student criticism.

As I wasn't a student in UL during bluedolphin's tenure; I can't comment on SU policy that year but if I remember rightly, most campaigned that year for a shake up of the SU and I hope that happened. Honestly I do.

Hope that wasn't too far off topic.
Also; I get that FDW is taking the piss but how is a fake poster? Like somebody has to own it.

Rineanna

This could possibly have been mentioned in the last 5 pages of the thread, but is it my imagination or on page 2 of the current An Focal does it say, and I quote:

"How much work each individual officer does is down to them but one thing is certain, no one does anything".

That tickled me pink.

Feyy

I'm pretty sure 90% of the students don't know what the SU or the officers actively do and don't care either.

ninty9er

Fiachra D-W wrote: »

Basically roysh, All my posters were removed from campus by members of the SU and others in the SU 'clique' that has ruined the SU.

Fiachra D-W never submitted a nomination form, was not a candidate an as such was infringin on the election process which the candidates had engaged with.

The Electoral and Referenda Board has a responsibility to run fair elections, and I see no fault (if it was the case at the time) that the Board would have ordered the removal of the posters.

On the issue of cliques: First years arrive on campus, in general, having no connection whatsoever to ULSU. The fact that they become active within ULSU doesn't mean they are in a clique, it means that they have chosen to get involved in the same manner as anyone who can be bothered to get off their arse can do.

An association with ULSU means you are engaging with your representation on some level, not that you are becoming "cliqued"

If the SU was a clique it would have died long long ago as nobody would have been there to take over from John Reddington in 1973.

Many of the posters here are involved in the Union, they don't all want the same things from it and they don't all engage in the same areas, but they do use it and anyone that does shouldn't need to be distinguisehd from those who don't by way of name calling.

Tom Dunne

NickDrake wrote: »

The SU has been censoring threads and posts on this forum for years. Anything that was said against the SU was either deleted or the thread locked.

Search for it if you don't believe me.
Most of the users on here over the years were in the SU or involved in it in some way or another. In other words part of the clique.

So I am doubting that the SU will be allowed a good roasting on here as it has been censored for years by them.

I actually find it a bit ironic to be honest that this thread was started, considering what has happened over the years here with censorship.

If you have issues with the way this forum is being run, as the Education Category moderator, with no connections to UL, I can offer a neutral opinion.

I'm all ears.

cson

Feyy wrote: »

I'm pretty sure 90% of the students don't know what the SU or the officers actively do and don't care either.

I'm pretty sure you're wrong. I'm sure most of the Student body know the officers and have a basic idea of what their role is. I'm also sure that most of the Student body will only deal with them if something that affects them becomes an issue. It's that classic Irish cliché of complaining away about something and not doing anything proactive about it until it impacts on you.

ynwa_17

Feyy wrote: »

I'm pretty sure 90% of the students don't know what the SU or the officers actively do and don't care either.

Gonna have to say thats true. I've had the odd conversation with Ruán and Fergal but thats only due to my involvement in C&S. Im sure Derek and the two Aoife's do a great job, i havent had the pleasure of meeting them yet. On behalf of the first years (Wow i feel important), if either of the pair, more than likely Aoife Finnerty more than Aoife Ni, want to discuss how they could improve their role amongst students and get their opinions im more than happy to help out. I dont have anything to bash the SU about, they do all they can with the power they have.

Zeouterlimits

My only complaint with the SU right now is the 'use' of the tv on the right side (as you come in) of the common room.
The speakers reside just above our heads and even though so few pay heed to Sky News we're forced to shout/feel physically un-comfortable trying to sit & read/talk to my friends.
Today wasn't the first time I've gone down to reception about turning it down.
What's odd, especially today was the large difference in volume between the speakers on the left (light-entertainment) and the speakers above us (sky news).

It's a minor complaint yes, but a complaint none-the-less.

ninty9er

The TV thing is something easily fixed, I suppose it's a matter that we're spending a small fortune doing up the Common Room so making use of the TVs given the swings and roundabouts that it took to get them running is important.

The speakers are set at the same volume level on both sides. The difference must be the broadcast volume.

cson

The state of the common room at times is disgraceful, I really think anyone who doesn't have the decency to put their rubbish in the bin should be banned from the place.

Zeouterlimits

cson wrote: »

The state of the common room at times is disgraceful, I really think anyone who doesn't have the decency to put their rubbish in the bin should be banned from the place.

Personally I agree, I only wish those around me felt similarly.
Childish excuses like "look at the other tables, everyone else does it" serve only to have it on-going.

cson

It really annoys the ****e outta me if I head up there around 4/5 sometimes for a game of pool or whatever and find it in a disgraceful state. There are some animals in UL for sure. :mad:

ninty9er

Any of you who want to volunteer to police the common room can come in and talk to Fergal. I'm sure he'd be delighted to get you a t-shirt to get o people's back about it.

Mossin

Sorry for just replying to this now, but I have been quite busy as I am sure the SU officers have been...I know this as I read the officers reports at council..

I am not having a go at the SU, or MS.Education for starting this thread, I commend her for doing so, and I hope that it serves to improve not only her office, but the SU as a whole.

I just have some comments to make on some posts....

ergonomics wrote: »

I have posted on Boards throughout my entire 4 years in UL. I enjoy coming here and reading the threads. If I'm having a bad day I love having a rant or reading other rants in the bitch thread. There are many reasons why I come here. If I had to see a thread every single day telling me how sh!t I am at my job then it would take all the fun out of. Boards is one of my guilty pleasures. I don't want work to start taking away from it.

Another big thing is that I would now count a lot of the regular posters on here as my friends. If I were to see them bitching and bashing the work I am doing I would honestly be very very hurt. I have an open door policy. Anyone is welcome to come and give out to me or give me criticism, and if my "friends" were to resort to an online, very public forum, rather than coming to me in person I'd be heartbroken.

If people do want to bitch about me or my work they can work away. I'm not going to stop them and I will take heed of anything that is said. I read every thread on here, and I have gone back and read old threads to see what sort of criticisms were made before. Like I said earlier, the reason I didn't ask for criticism before is because I would like to have one or two places that I can go where I don't have to talk about work/read about work/hear about work.

I understand completely that you have been posting here a lot longer than you have been an officer in the SU, and I would regard myself and yourself as friends outside of the SU.

I know that the boards was always a place where you could come and get away from work too, but you would still don your work hat where necessary, and that is kinda the point I was making.

Ms. Education wrote: »

However, considering that most of the people who have commented on this thread have been in contact with/had loads of opportunities to contact me during the year, I'm not really reaching many new people unfortunately.

I obviously cannot comment with any certainty there, but there was a lot of Education related questions on here earlier this semester that we could not answer, and all we could do was refer them to you...My original point was that it would have been nice if you had been able to answer those queries here, because if the same question arises next year, the same thing will happen....we still wont know the answer!

If you felt very strongly about me being on boards, then you should have said it to me. I'm not being aggressive or sarcastic when I say this, it's genuinely how I work. Tell me something and I can do it, expect me to read your mind, you'll be waiting a while.

I'm not being smart here, but you said you knew about this forum and wouldnt join when you were an undergrad, but surely as soon as you were an officer it must have crosssed your mind before week 10 to join??

The same argument of "why didn't you do this (sooner)?" could be used for every forum, event, night out, talk, lecture, envelope opening, etc. because boards isn't the only place that students give feedback and it isn't the place where most students give feedback.

I do realise that, and tbh I never said that boards was the place where most students give feedback. But there are plenty of new people here who need help too..

Aside from that it's up to individuals whether or not they want to join boards. I chose to in an attempt to improve my office. It isn't part of the job, it's beyond the job.

Say that again now?
Its not part of your job to improve your office?
Please explain to me how its beyond the job, as I am genuinely confused by that....

bluedolphin wrote: »

I don't know if the policy forbidding dual accounts applies in this instance as technically it is "two" different people. Why should someone use their personal account to answer professionally? Also, in this instance, it just so happens that we know that Ergonomics is Aoife Ní and ninty9er is Derek; what about anonymity?

I agree with you on the dual account policy in this instance, and perhaps it is something that the SU and the mods on this forum could put in place for next years elected officers.

Mossin

Feyy wrote: »

I'm pretty sure 90% of the students don't know what the SU or the officers actively do and don't care either.

ynwa_17 wrote: »

Gonna have to say thats true. I've had the odd conversation with Ruán and Fergal but thats only due to my involvement in C&S.

I'm gonna suggest that ye have a chat with your class rep if you dont know what the SU does. They represent the class in SU matters, but it is also their responsibility to inform their classes about important matters.

If you want to know what the SU do, then go ask someone!

cson wrote: »

I'm pretty sure you're wrong. I'm sure most of the Student body know the officers and have a basic idea of what their role is. I'm also sure that most of the Student body will only deal with them if something that affects them becomes an issue. It's that classic Irish cliché of complaining away about something and not doing anything proactive about it until it impacts on you.

I have to agree that students will only involve themselves with the SU when something bothers them. Its unfortunate, but its something that I dont think can be changed.

ergonomics

Mossin wrote: »

Say that again now?
Its not part of your job to improve your office?
Please explain to me how its beyond the job, as I am genuinely confused by that....

I'm pretty sure she meant it goes beyond her job/is not part of her job to sign up to boards.

Dante on Fire

Mossin wrote: »

I have to agree that students will only involve themselves with the SU when something bothers them. Its unfortunate, but its something that I dont think can be changed.

i agree and disagree with you on this one - it goes back to the combat apathy element of previous years.

its hard to get some people who genuinly dont care about what goes on until something effects them but at the same time you have to ask what new methods of student involvement are being used.

some students will want to involve themselves but its all about the kind of satisfaction they'll end up getting from it be it intrinsic or extrinsic - and the way and means by which the union reaches out to them.

Ms. Education

Mossin wrote: »

I obviously cannot comment with any certainty there, but there was a lot of Education related questions on here earlier this semester that we could not answer, and all we could do was refer them to you...My original point was that it would have been nice if you had been able to answer those queries here, because if the same question arises next year, the same thing will happen....we still wont know the answer!

I'm going to be honest, at the start of the year I barely had time to handle all the people queuing outside my office and all the emails I was getting on a daily basis, not to mind to check boards for queries from students. I had to prioritise the students at my door. If students were referred on with their queries, then why is that a bad thing? If they contacted me, then I helped them. As soon as there is a response saying "talk to the Education Officer", then it was a matter of copying and pasting the boards post (query) into an email. My email addresses, phone numbers and office location are all on the web. Aside from that, if I was sitting in my office looking through boards for questions everyday, then I'd be slated for being lazy and a time-waster. It's a lose/lose Mossin.

Mossin wrote: »

I'm not being smart here, but you said you knew about this forum and wouldnt join when you were an undergrad, but surely as soon as you were an officer it must have crosssed your mind before week 10 to join??

No, it really didn't. It's not like I had the idea and then though, "Nah, I won't bother". It was an idea that came to me, so I did it. It could have been Week 1, Week 10, or two weeks before I finished my term. Given that I can't remember any other Education Officer specifically setting up an account for work on boards, it wasn't like I could copy the idea from someone else.

Mossin wrote: »

I do realise that, and tbh I never said that boards was the place where most students give feedback. But there are plenty of new people here who need help too..

And they're being referred to me... There are all these channels for people to contact me and if I know that people here are being directed to me, then I see that as a good thing. Aside from that, the only thread that I've found (glancing down the lists) with a question for me was posted by a student, with whom I met. Maybe there are more, but I actually haven't come accross them.

Mossin wrote: »

Say that again now?
Its not part of your job to improve your office?
Please explain to me how its beyond the job, as I am genuinely confused by that.....

What Ergonomics said

mrmanire

Jesus... Anger

Ms. Education

mrmanire wrote: »

Jesus... Anger

If you mean me, then none of that was meant angrily. If it came across that way that wasn't the intention.

ninty9er

Dante on Fire wrote: »

it goes back to the combat apathy element of previous years.

its hard to get some people who genuinly dont care about what goes on until something effects them but at the same time you have to ask what new methods of student involvement are being used.

some students will want to involve themselves but its all about the kind of satisfaction they'll end up getting from it be it intrinsic or extrinsic - and the way and means by which the union reaches out to them.

That's pretty much the story.

Some want something, they come and get it....it may be something that leads to 6 years interaction, or it may be something that requires 4 minutes interaction.

I'm not so sure what people want us to do. It's not like I have masses and masses of time to go asking 10,000 people what I should be doing, like Aoife said, I have to prioritise the ones that contact me. And even if I could ask 10,000 individuals what they wanted, there'd be so many different responses that terms would have to be 5 years to get anywhere near figuring out what to do with th results.

Dante on Fire

ninty9er wrote: »

That's pretty much the story.

Some want something, they come and get it....it may be something that leads to 6 years interaction, or it may be something that requires 4 minutes interaction.

I'm not so sure what people want us to do. It's not like I have masses and masses of time to go asking 10,000 people what I should be doing, like Aoife said, I have to prioritise the ones that contact me. And even if I could ask 10,000 individuals what they wanted, there'd be so many different responses that terms would have to be 5 years to get anywhere near figuring out what to do with th results.

Very chicken / egg dont ya think - what about visibility as in are the union seen enough is there an element about the union that targets a student enough to get all hands on deck for something like Rag week etc.

i was interested from the start -particuarly with what sinead did with a cucumber - year 1 for me! - its a difficult one sometimes ppl dont have the ways means or dare i say it, courage to say there is a difficulty until it is under their noses

so do students say it then s.u act or do s.u act then students benefit?

Hello chicken!......oh hello egg!..... related? :)

mrmanire

Ms. Education wrote: »

If you mean me, then none of that was meant angrily. If it came across that way that wasn't the intention.

I apologise. Didn't mean it that way

NickDrake

mrmanire wrote: »

I apologise. Didn't mean it that way

Good to see things are back on topic