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House in negative equity

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  • 17-11-2009 3:49pm
    #1
    Lirca
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3 ✭


    The mortgage is in both names but the relationship in deteriorating fast,there are children involved. Having been told the house is in negative equity I have been told it may be as well sign it over. Both sharing mortgage payments with the aim of providing some structure/calmness for the kids. But as the relationship deteriorates the house is becoming more of an issue.

    Just looking for some advice or websites that may be of benefit?


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    #2
    Paulw
    Registered Users Posts: 13,381 ✭✭✭✭Paulw


    Lirca wrote: »
    Should I sign the house over the fact its in negative equity or does anyone have any other suggestions as to what I can do?

    I recommend you speak to a qualified solicitor, rather than seeking opinion/advice online. That way you will get proper professional advice.


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    #3
    Chris_533976
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,082 ✭✭✭Chris_533976


    Get a solicitor, but dont ruin his life.


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    #4
    helimachoptor
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 21,655 Mod ✭✭✭✭helimachoptor


    So you want to saddle him with all the debt yet still live in the house?? Grow up!

    If you signed over the house and he continued to make repayments and if in 10 years it was worth 100k more you'd be straight to court seeking half of that 100k.


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    #5
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    helimachoptor wrote: »
    So you want to saddle him with all the debt yet still live in the house?? Grow up!

    Yeah, I can't help but think that's a ****ing sick thing to do.


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    #6
    Zamboni
    Registered Users Posts: 4,305 ✭✭✭Zamboni


    I think its just a troll.

    This post appears to be a woman with a family and the only other post by the user is what appears to be a bloke back from construction work in Perth...:D


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    #7
    Lirca
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3 ✭Lirca


    Zamboni wrote: »
    I think its just a troll.

    This post appears to be a woman with a family and the only other post by the user is what appears to be a bloke back from construction work in Perth...:D
    Its a genuine situation,I find it difficult to understand as I have been out of the country and solicitors are expensive!


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    #8
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    Lirca wrote: »
    Its a genuine situation,I find it difficult to understand as I have been out of the country and solicitors are expensive!

    For a start you should think about why you are so willing to screw over the father of your children. A psychotherapist might be able to help you.


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    #9
    jon1981
    Registered Users Posts: 4,359 ✭✭✭jon1981


    whats with all the hot replies?

    have i missed something? the original post seems to be edited


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    #10
    Sleipnir
    Registered Users Posts: 5,514 ✭✭✭Sleipnir


    Both your names are on the mortgage so you are both equally responsible for paying it.
    You can't just "sign it over" to him leaving him with the full responsibility of paying it and then run away.


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    #11
    helimachoptor
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 21,655 Mod ✭✭✭✭helimachoptor


    jon1981 wrote: »
    whats with all the hot replies?

    have i missed something? the original post seems to be edited
    Basically she wanted to sign the house over to him as its in negative equity and she was told that as he is the father of her kids he has to provide a roof over her and kids head.

    So basically she wants to give him the house and have him pay the mortgage while the house is in negative equity yet stay living in it.

    Pretty damn low... especially as if the house goes up she's bring him to court to get her share of the profits!!


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    #12
    Sleipnir
    Registered Users Posts: 5,514 ✭✭✭Sleipnir


    helimachoptor wrote: »
    Basically she wanted to sign the house over to him as its in negative equity and she was told that as he is the father of her kids he has to provide a roof over her and kids head.

    So basically she wants to give him the house and have him pay the mortgage while the house is in negative equity yet stay living in it.

    Pretty damn low... especially as if the house goes up she's bring him to court to get her share of the profits!!

    Wow, nice.


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    #13
    Paulw
    Registered Users Posts: 13,381 ✭✭✭✭Paulw


    Lirca wrote: »
    Its a genuine situation,I find it difficult to understand as I have been out of the country and solicitors are expensive!

    Solicitors are expensive because they give you proper legal advice.

    The situation is no where near as simple as you assume. You cannot simply sign over the house and still expect to live there.


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    #14
    Jaden
    Registered Users Posts: 2,393 ✭✭✭Jaden


    Chances are that the bank won't allow this. Unless the guy in question can demonstrate that he can easily cover the repayments.

    If the house value was going up, would you still want this done?

    This is a sad situation, but it seems to getting more and more common.....


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    #15
    Duckjob
    Registered Users Posts: 2,859 ✭✭✭Duckjob


    Sleipnir wrote: »
    Wow, nice.

    Indeed, the OP was swiftly edited and toned down when she realised she wasn't getting a lot of support for her plan.

    OP, as had been stated. If the house is in both your names, then it's both your responsibility.

    If the house is in negative equity, then that negative equity is half yours. Regardless of the situation between you, trying to screw him by burdening him with your debt is a pretty low vindictive act.

    I'm genuinely seething writing this.Mentioning calmness and stability for your kids is a cowardly copout. If anything what you are proposing will have the opposite effect as it will make it very difficult for him to maintain even a civil relationship with you, and I wouldn't blame the guy.

    The best thing you can do is accept things didn't work out, accept that you both need to co-operate to rear your kids, each accept your share of financial responsibilities, and move on with your lives. That is if your kids welfare is REALLY the highest priority as it should be.

    I suggest you rethink your strategy and your life.


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    #16
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    Duckjob wrote: »
    Mentioning calmness and stability for your kids is a cowardly copout.

    Spot on.


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    #17
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Lirca wrote: »

    I've recently split from my partner and after having the house valued by three estate agents it was deemed to be in negative equity of about E60,000 having bought the house for E325,000.

    The mortgage is in both our names but the relationship in deteriorating fast,we have children together I am at a loss as to what to do. I have been told that the fact it is in negative equity I may be as well sign it over to him as he is obliged by family law to put a roof over our kids till they turn 18. The reason I'm posting is because I'm currently living in the house and he elsewhere,we are both sharing mortgage payments with the aim of providing some structure/calmness for the kids. But as our relationship deteriorates I realize the house is becoming more of an issue.

    Should I sign the house over the fact its in negative equity or does anyone have any other suggestions as to what I can do?

    In the first instance- the amount of negative equity is purely hypothetical until you actually go to sell the property. Its a safe bet that property has most probably fallen by between 40-50% since peak 2006 values (depending on property type and location). Estate agents are not necessarily going to give you an accurate valuation- and this is reflected by the further discount of 25% that many lending institutions are automatically applying to valuations carried out.

    The fact that the mortgage is in both your names- means that you are both responsible for the mortgage- full stop. You cannot simply sign the property over to him though- its highly probable that the mortgage lender would refuse to countenance him as a sole mortgagee on a property in which he is not residing (totally regardless of the reasons why he is no longer resident there). He will also not qualify for any social welfare payments to assist with the mortgage interest (which is going to shoot up- as interest rates increase), if he experiences difficulty in servicing the mortgage. He may have to legally put a roof over his children's heads- but the fact of the matter is quite simply- if he doesn't have the money, he doesn't have the money. You can dress it up anyway you like- but its probable he has a paycut- he now has to rent along with service a mortgage- and if interest rates increase (as they are expected to next year)- the whole house of cards could all of a sudden just not add up any longer.

    You need to accept that it is probable that the property will have to be sold at some stage- there will be a debt associated with the negative equity (which could be substantially higher than you anticipate)- you need to have an agreement in principle detailing how this debt will be apportioned.

    The provision of calmness and stucture for the kids is only one aspect of the equation- what to do with what is clearly a millstone of a debt is another aspect altogether. Stop confusing the issue- you need to start a dialogue with your ex towards discussing how to approach the issue.


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    #18
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,299 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    helimachoptor wrote: »
    Basically she wanted to sign the house over to him as its in negative equity and she was told that as he is the father of her kids he has to provide a roof over her and kids head.
    I'm reading it differently. It looks like she wants to give him the house. She also mentions that
    Lirca wrote: »
    as the relationship deteriorates the house is becoming more of an issue.
    which to me means that when she signs the house over to him, and they seperate, she'll want him to move out.

    An english case not so long ago had the man continue to pay the rent, even though he was no longer living there. It seems this woman was looking to do something of the same. With the Irish courts being the way they are, I can't see them throwing out the wife and kids, and she may look for something similiar.

    A very low thing to do.


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    #19
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    the_syco wrote: »
    which to me means that when she signs the house over to him, and they seperate, she'll want him to move out.

    An english case not so long ago had the man continue to pay the rent, even though he was no longer living there. It seems this woman was looking to do something of the same. With the Irish courts being the way they are, I can't see them throwing out the wife and kids, and she may look for something similiar.

    A very low thing to do.

    My understanding is that he has already left and is seperately renting elsewhere- while continuing to pay the mortgage on what was originally the family home- but is most likely experiencing financial difficulties through both paying the mortgage and also renting somewhere elsewhere. Perhaps the OP could clarify.

    At the end of the day- its far more likely to be the case that he becomes incapable of paying the mortgage (particularly if interest rates go up)- than it is that he would consciously be attempting to throw his children out in the street. Unfortunately- if you don't pay your mortgage- its only a matter of time before the mortgage lender will affect a repossession order. There is a temporary stay on these- but as business plans for the institutions who availed of the government guarantee are clarified with the EU Commission- its only a matter of time before 'business-as-usual' applies.


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