My outrage at some members of the Private Sector..

Liam79

Who believe everything they read and hear in the biased media.....
ye havent a clue

OMD

Liam79 wrote: »

Who believe everything they read and hear in the biased media.....
ye havent a clue

Enlighten us Liam. I see your wife is lower paid civil servant but to keep it simple people (on both sides) have been talking about average public servants.

Liam79

OMD wrote: »

Enlighten us Liam. I see your wife is lower paid civil servant but to keep it simple people (on both sides) have been talking about average public servants.

What people dont realise is the HSE brings up the average for the rest of them! The HSE is ridiculously over staffed with admin staff, there are 800 Grade 8's!! 800!! My wife is a Local Authority worker and i guarantee you the average wage in the LA's is nothing like what it is in the HSE. But John Doe reads Kevin Myers, Listens to George Hook and thinks they are all the same when they patently are not!

To be honest this thread is just an angry reaction to the ridiculous thread about Public Sector workers on this same page

cavedave

Liam79

ye havent a clue

Well at least the teachers of English are doing a good job.

jimmmy

Liam79 wrote: »

What people dont realise is the HSE brings up the average for the rest of them!

You are correct in that health workers are better paid - on average - than other public servants, but I quote direct from the governments own C.S.O. website :

Average weekly earnings in the Public Sector (excluding Health) are €973.09


I appreciate not everyone in the public service is on the average pay there. That is why is the average pay.

OMD

Liam79 wrote: »

What people dont realise is the HSE brings up the average for the rest of them! The HSE is ridiculously over staffed with admin staff, there are 800 Grade 8's!! 800!! My wife is a Local Authority worker and i guarantee you the average wage in the LA's is nothing like what it is in the HSE. But John Doe reads Kevin Myers, Listens to George Hook and thinks they are all the same when they patently are not!

To be honest this thread is just an angry reaction to the ridiculous thread about Public Sector workers on this same page

I understand the anger but I am afraid it is not just the HSE. Figures from the CSO show that average public service pay excluding HSE was €948.91 (or €49343.32 a year)

http://www.cso.ie/quicktables/GetQuickTables.aspx?FileName=PSA01.asp&TableName=Public+Sector+Average+Weekly+Earnings&StatisticalProduct=DB_PS

Count Dooku

Liam79 wrote: »

Who believe everything they read and hear in the biased media.....

Do you think that we must believe to union lies rather then facts from media and public service themselves?

Liam79

Ger receives the bones of about 790 euros a fortnight after tax. a fortnight, not a week, a fortnight. and so do many many many others in her LA

Blazer

Honestly Liam...we don't give a flying fúck what the public sector think..
Quite frankly if my boss told me "i'm cutting your wages by 10% but giving you a job for life and a guaranteed pension" I'd bite his fúckin hands off.
If you think you're underpaid sod off to the private sector and see how much more you can get there...:mad:
oh wait...your job isn't guaranteed and your pension fund has lost about €15,000 of your pension this year...sorry about that..but what the hell....you're earning more than the public sector...lol..what a fúcking laugh...

seamus

Forgive me Liam, but I've no idea what a grade 8 and how it relates to payscales.

In any case, it's irrelevant. Take any company in the world and ask them for their "average" salary, you'll find that this average salary is being increased dramatically by a small number of individuals who get a large amount of money.

This is the case in both the public sector and private sector. So in reality, the private sector could equally say that the 30-odd grand figure pushed about as the "average" wage is being brought up for the rest of us by a few thousand highly-paid directors and CEOs.

Your point still doesn't make any difference to the fact that the average public sector wage is higher than the average private sector. Individual cases are irrelevant, however the government should be careful to avoid making indiscriminate swinging cuts and focus on trimming the fat where it's gotten too bulky.

jimmmy

Liam79 wrote: »

Ger receives the bones of about 790 euros a fortnight after tax. a fortnight, not a week, a fortnight. and so do many many many others in her LA

Do you think people of her age, qualifications and experience in the private sector, or her age, qualifications and experience in the public sector in other countries, earn more ?

A guaranteed 790 a fortinight ( plus pension provided for ) after tax is not bad ....I know many hard working, well educated people in the private sector who would be damn glad to get that every fortinight. Lucky her.

shoegirl

Liam79 wrote: »

What people dont realise is the HSE brings up the average for the rest of them! The HSE is ridiculously over staffed with admin staff, there are 800 Grade 8's!! 800!! My wife is a Local Authority worker and i guarantee you the average wage in the LA's is nothing like what it is in the HSE. But John Doe reads Kevin Myers, Listens to George Hook and thinks they are all the same when they patently are not!

You've hit the nail on the head there. A big part of the problem though, is permitting TNCs to obliquely block worker organizations like trade unions has created a communications gap that is easy to manipulate via the media, and lead to an impression that trade unions/public sector workers are the entire cause of the problem.

You are absolutely right on the admins in the HSE, but there are also lots of overworked grade 3s doing the real admin work, on a max wage of about 32k a year, without whom the system simply would break down (these are the folks who do the record keeping, send/answer letters, make appointments etc). Part of the reason of course why there are so many grade 8s is because of the plethora of small units that require local management - I understand a significant part of rolling together smaller units into bigger ones is to eliminate a lot of this expensive local management. Of course why not simply get rid of the local management instead and manage it remotely from the bigger units?

Secondly there are a lot of skilled and qualified roles in the sector that have severe barriers to entry - qualifications that take 4-5 years to achieve like engineers, architects, legal profession etc. You cannot compare that to a similar role in the private sector where technically, nobody in their right mind should pay 900 a week to somebody with no skills or qualifications (although in reality, significant numbers of low skilled idiots are still there on vastly inflated wages also).

Deadalus

Just want to say that the average can be misleading also. I mean there could be 5 public servants working in one area of an organisation. 4 of them make 500 a week and the other makes something like 1800 resulting in an average of around 900 a week for that department. There are huge gaps in pay depending on what position you hold.

meditraitor

Deadalus wrote: »

Just want to say that the average can be misleading also. I mean there could be 5 public servants working in one area of an organisation. 4 of them make 500 a week and the other makes something like 1800 resulting in an average of around 900 a week for that department. There are huge gaps in pay depending on what position you hold.

760 actualy, but I get your point. Get rid of the guy on 1800 a week, the lucky backstart

OMD

Deadalus wrote: »

Just want to say that the average can be misleading also. I mean there could be 5 public servants working in one area of an organisation. 4 of them make 500 a week and the other makes something like 1800 resulting in an average of around 900 a week for that department. There are huge gaps in pay depending on what position you hold.

That is true. However the organisation 24/7 Alliance which is fighting public service pay cuts says that 66% of public service workers are earning over 40,000 a year. (I think you can safely assume that is is well higher than this figure)

ParkRunner

meditraitor wrote: »

760 actualy, but I get your point. Get rid of the guy on 1800 a week, the lucky backstart

This seems to be happening behind the scenes as we speak. Certainly from my experience the numbers retiring over the last 6 months has been phenomenal and there are more to come. Most of these are at the higher grades too. It wont achieve €1.3bn but every little helps!

Tipp Man

Liam79 wrote: »

Ger receives the bones of about 790 euros a fortnight after tax. a fortnight, not a week, a fortnight. and so do many many many others in her LA

Sorry Liam I don't know you from Adam, what is your wife doing for the 790 a fortnight?? She could still be overpaid at that level, its not just a case of the monetary number but also the amount of work involved, level of responsibility etc etc

Liam79

Tipp Man wrote: »

Sorry Liam I don't know you from Adam, what is your wife doing for the 790 a fortnight?? She could still be overpaid at that level, its not just a case of the monetary number but also the amount of work involved, level of responsibility etc etc

Its a valid question Tippman. no problem
she is a full time Library Assistant in Limerick.

dodgyme

Liam79 wrote: »

The HSE is ridiculously over staffed with admin staff, there are 800 Grade 8's!! 800!!

What would your be arguing if your wife was a HSE admin worker. Would you be saying 'oh that is ok we are over staffed and my wife paid too much'.

Pull the other one. My neighbours wife is a HSE admin worker and she is moaning while half the estate is out of work.

This thread is just another case of public sector deflection.

Blazer

dodgyme wrote: »

What would your be arguing if your wife was a HSE admin worker. Would you be saying 'oh that is ok we are over staffed and my wife paid too much'.

Pull the other one. My neighbours wife is a HSE admin worker and she is moaning while half the estate is out of work.

This thread is just another case of public sector deflection.

He'd prob be bitching about library staff being paid €790 to hand out a few books now and then..:rolleyes:

jimmmy

Berkut wrote: »

He'd prob be bitching about library staff being paid €790 to hand out a few books now and then..:rolleyes:

Take home pay of 12.34 per hour, after tax, in a nice warm, cosy environment. The last time I was in a library the librarians spent 99% of the time chatting to each other about their holidays, social lives etc....nice work if you can get it, esp. as its guaranteed, with a pension. No stress, danger, pressure, lack of security etc. I am sure if such a position was advertised plenty of people would apply.

Liam79

jimmmy wrote: »

Take home pay of 12.34 per hour, after tax, in a nice warm, cosy environment. The last time I was in a library the librarians spent 99% of the time chatting to each other about their holidays, social lives etc....nice work if you can get it, esp. as its guaranteed, with a pension. No stress, danger, pressure, lack of security etc. I am sure if such a position was advertised plenty of people would apply.

Jimmy/Berkut...
those types of attitudes are typical of what I would expect! It just shows up your own ignorance and lack of understanding of the real world.
All Librarians do is chat and hand out books, thats it, nothing else
To be honest, those types of attitudes are disgraceful, very offensive and actually seriously dilute any serious argument you may in future try to make.

GoldenTickets

Liam79 wrote: »

Who believe everything they read and hear in the biased media.....
ye havent a clue

+1,000,000

jimmmy

Liam79 wrote: »

All Librarians do is chat and hand out books, thats it, nothing else

Nobody said that. I am sure the junior librarians involved also restack books. And the odd time order books. Very important job.

Now, why exactly do you express " outrage at some members of the Private Sector ", when its the private sector who are paying the bulk of the money to the govt, as opposed to taking money from it ?

Blazer

Liam79 wrote: »

Jimmy/Berkut...
those types of attitudes are typical of what I would expect! It just shows up your own ignorance and lack of understanding of the real world.
All Librarians do is chat and hand out books, thats it, nothing else
To be honest, those types of attitudes are disgraceful, very offensive and actually seriously dilute any serious argument you may in future try to make.

lol..god the delusion of the public sector...:D

S.L.F

jimmmy wrote: »

The last time I was in a library the librarians spent 99% of the time chatting to each other about their holidays, social lives etc.....

Maybe you caught them on a break?

westtip

cavedave wrote: »

Well at least the teachers of English are doing a good job.

And getting overpaid for it.

Liam79

you know something, I feel sorry for you with attitudes like that. The arrogance and downright sheer ignorance of the real situation in the public sector says a lot more about your own intellect and grasp of reality than I ever could. But hey, if Kevin Myers says its so....it must be......

Have a cup of tea lads. Do ye the world of good.

danman

Sorry, we don't have time to drink tea. work to be done in the real world.

soden12

jimmmy wrote: »

Take home pay of 12.34 per hour, after tax, in a nice warm, cosy environment. The last time I was in a library the librarians spent 99% of the time chatting to each other about their holidays, social lives etc....nice work if you can get it, esp. as its guaranteed, with a pension. No stress, danger, pressure, lack of security etc. I am sure if such a position was advertised plenty of people would apply.

Could be worse - could be a nice comfy job in a bank - opening from 10-4 , loads of holidays, cheap loans subsidised by customers , swan out to lunch during their busy period, overcharge accounts and get away with it..

MaceFace

Liam79 wrote: »

you know something, I feel sorry for you with attitudes like that. The arrogance and downright sheer ignorance of the real situation in the public sector says a lot more about your own intellect and grasp of reality than I ever could. But hey, if Kevin Myers says its so....it must be......

Have a cup of tea lads. Do ye the world of good.

Liam, that is on the low side and it is a crime that people in this country need to earn signicantly more than this to have what would be considered a modest living.
Not trying to be bad here, but if a typical library assistant went into the private sector, what job would they be doing, and what would be the typical pay there?

Just because someone is on a low wage does not mean they are underpaid.