Walked by DCC office on the quay, 20 people only striking

MaceFace

Its all a lot of crap this talk about us vs them.
Last night on the Frontline the ISME lady was all about how the private sector had pain so the public sector must also take some.
Rubbish - just cause one sector is suffering does not mean everyone should.

Pitching each against one another is just a way of stoking the debate and getting viewers/listeners.

As much as I am disgusted by ISME trying to claim to represent me and somehow giving the impression that everyone in the private sector agrees with them, it is equally disgusting how members of the public sector are happy to allow their Unions to claim that everyone in the PS is in the same boat when they are simply not.

The simple fact is that we are borrowing €500m a week with 60% of that going to pay and welfare.
The only reponse the Unions have is to tax our way out of it. I have not heard one Union official acknowledge that there are some of their members paid way too much (e.g. 43k for a teacher with 4 years experience in todays IT).

Right now, most private sector people see the PS as one big group who only care about themselves and are not willing to accept their employer is effectively bankrupt. Yes, the PS have taken pain, but so what, pain is not going to get us out of this - closing the gap between what we take in and what we give out will.

I have neither seen nor heard anyone have any sympathy with the strikers today and unless the Unions start getting the public (ie. non members) on their side, they have no chance of getting what they want.

BornToKill

dan_d wrote: »

If the public service was a private company it would have gone bankrupt some time early this year.

Yeah, just like Anglo, AIB, Irish Nationwide, Bank of Ireland ... oh hang on ...

Scofflaw

dresden8 wrote: »

At least you'll have his autograph on your P.45, unless he's contracted that out to China, of course.

And that's enough of that kind of thing for the next two weeks. Go and keep jimmmy company.

Banned for two weeks for persistent thread spoiling, attacks on other posters, repeated breaches of the peace and provocation of other posters.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Sleipnir

gerry28 wrote: »

You see this is where I have the problem.... slowly the truth is emerging through all the smoke and untruths spun by the media and some of the regular posters on here - nowhere near the majority in the private sector have taken cuts... its estimated that 70% have not.

So don't ask me to take another paycut ontop of the pension levy taken off me last year (when my income is already thousands of euro less than the average industrial wage).

Yeah I didn't have to take a pay cut this year because, as the company announced
"With the redundancies we've made today, only senior managers will be required to take a pay cut"

So people are lost their jobs instead. Will that happen in the public sector? You'd have to murder someone to lose your job in there.

Oh, and they said that it should be enough to protect the rest of the jobs for another year. So I face the chop again in March.

silverharp

I heard a funny one form a cousin that works for a charitable run college for special needs adults in Clonmel, a picket arrived and they didnt get any of their usual deliveries. One of the staff came out and asked them why they were there and it turned out they had come to the wrong place????? they should have ben at some VEC college.

neil_purdy

The lovely financial regulators have got themselves a peach.. They are deciding to picket on friday... Lovely long weekend!!!!

KindOfIrish

The shopping centres are unusually crowded today in Limerick. Public sector went shopping! At least it will help local retalers:)

BC

A lot of people have taken leave.
I work in the PS. Out of the 12 people that i work with, 4 are in the union and so are striking. 2 are working and the remainder have taken a days annual leave to avoid having to pass the picket. The public sector management have organised the whole thing unbelievable badly (as usual i know). This strike has been on the cards for weeks yet no provisions were put in place and the people not in the union genuinely did not know what to do. With restrictions on building opening hours and some buildings physically closed, people who aren't in the union are actually being penalised and prevented from doing their job due to the sheer lack of organisation.

muboop1

average_runner wrote: »

Sure isnt every day not a piss up for the PS, i mean they dont do any work any day really?

oh yeh, teachers, garda, nurses, ambulance driver etc... they never work...

Easiest jobs in all the land...

Don't be a plank.

Don't just jump on a band wagon and generalise.

Think for yourself, and think it through...

gerry28

average_runner wrote: »

that is over 80% of companies have given pay cuts to their staff.

This fugure tells us nothing... its just more spin and wordplay. If you tell me that 80% of private sector workers have taken paycuts then i'll tell you i don't believe you.

But 80% of companies giving paycuts - what does that mean??? a company of 500 people and one manager takes a paycut but 499 don't -that would qualify under this catch all description.

I want accurate figures on % of workers not companies or any other such spin.

PCPhoto

dresden8 wrote: »

I will picket, when I am rostered.

Not that it's any of your business.

My family, friends and peers don't believe in taking it up the ass without at least saying "excuse me, what are you doing?".

If you're not on strike how come you're on boards during the day.

Back to work you.

maybe thats because your family friends and peers are also PS workers - feckin nepotism is rife in there. (not a personal attack meerly pointing out that the amount of people related in the PS is abnormally high - and NO I dont have any stats to back this up - rather than knowledge of some PS workers)

I'd also like to point out that its not the lower end of the PS who should be shafted - the amount of middle management and upper management is ridiculous - the entire system needs an overhaul -

HSE riddled with managers, understaffed under resourced or badly managed and overworked at ground level...

Judicial System - Judges walking through corridors of the courts with a "Tip-Staff" - I believe this started in the early 1900's ... the role of the "tip-staff" is to walk in front of the judge holding a stick/staff and gently nudge/remove people from the pathway of a judge - these days they dont nudge anyone - as they'd get sued for it.

Gardai - under staffed, under trained, mismanaged and on rare occasions prone to promoting their version of the truth in court.

Politicians - a draconian group of "political leaders" who have been raised through the "brown envelope" era and have learned through the years how to spin/hide information from the public, generations of politicians exist as they realise the amounts of money they can get for very little (Physical) work.

I could continue and could debate possible solutions but thats for another thread/post :P

PCPhoto

BC wrote: »

A lot of people have taken leave.
I work in the PS. Out of the 12 people that i work with, 4 are in the union and so are striking. 2 are working and the remainder have taken a days annual leave to avoid having to pass the picket. The public sector management have organised the whole thing unbelievable badly (as usual i know). This strike has been on the cards for weeks yet no provisions were put in place and the people not in the union genuinely did not know what to do. With restrictions on building opening hours and some buildings physically closed, people who aren't in the union are actually being penalised and prevented from doing their job due to the sheer lack of organisation.

of the two that are working - are they actually doing anything or just inside the office - just turning up so they dont have to take an annual day and get paid for doing nothing during the day ?

Gumbo

PCPhoto wrote: »

of the two that are working - are they actually doing anything or just inside the office - just turning up so they dont have to take an annual day and get paid for doing nothing during the day ?

imo there would be work to do, taking an annual day was not allowed in my end of the PS.

i know theres work sitting on my desk waiting to be done and i could of being doing it today if i was allowed.

PCPhoto

there might be work there - but will they actually do it ?

Gumbo

PCPhoto wrote: »

there might be work there - but will they actually do it ?

yes they would imo i know i would, because if you dont then quite simply the day would drag in if anything else! deadlines havent been moved to take account of the strike, work and drawings that were due on Monday are still due Monday, so gives us one less day to have the work completed.

BroomBurner

BC wrote: »

A lot of people have taken leave.
I work in the PS. Out of the 12 people that i work with, 4 are in the union and so are striking. 2 are working and the remainder have taken a days annual leave to avoid having to pass the picket. The public sector management have organised the whole thing unbelievable badly (as usual i know). This strike has been on the cards for weeks yet no provisions were put in place and the people not in the union genuinely did not know what to do. With restrictions on building opening hours and some buildings physically closed, people who aren't in the union are actually being penalised and prevented from doing their job due to the sheer lack of organisation.

Have to agree with the complete lack of planning by management in the PS to deal with the strike. We only received official guidance on the matter yesterday evening.

The problem is though, if you try to take responsibility for something in the PS, you have layers and layers of people ahead of you telling you that it's not your business. :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

BC

PCPhoto wrote: »

of the two that are working - are they actually doing anything or just inside the office - just turning up so they dont have to take an annual day and get paid for doing nothing during the day ?

As i'm not one of them I don't know. I'd guess they're doing something but the fact that a lot of people aren't there will probably prevent them doing a full days work.

PCPhoto

gerry28 wrote: »

You see this is where I have the problem.... slowly the truth is emerging through all the smoke and untruths spun by the media and some of the regular posters on here - nowhere near the majority in the private sector have taken cuts... its estimated that 70% have not.

So don't ask me to take another paycut ontop of the pension levy taken off me last year (when my income is already thousands of euro less than the average industrial wage).

I'm sorry - but the pension levy is an increased payment into your pension - which means that by the time you retire you'll get more money than you would have gotten previously ..... in other words WHEN YOU RETIRE YOU WILL STILL GET THE MONEY SO ITS NOT TAKEN OFF YOU.

I'm self employed and as a result of this "strike" I havent been able to work today as I'm reliant on PS workers to operate so I can work - I'm pi$$ed off at PS workers blaming the government when its the in-house inefficiencies that need to be addressed.

The people that are striking are the people getting shafted - but its not the government they should be striking against - its their managers...or their managers' manager.... or even the higher up managers.

PCPhoto

BroomBurner wrote: »

Have to agree with the complete lack of planning by management in the PS to deal with the strike. We only received official guidance on the matter yesterday evening.

The problem is though, if you try to take responsibility for something in the PS, you have layers and layers of people ahead of you telling you that it's not your business. :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

this in my opinion is the main problem of the PS

PCPhoto

BC wrote: »

As i'm not one of them I don't know. I'd guess they're doing something but the fact that a lot of people aren't there will probably prevent them doing a full days work.

like most businesses - if everything works properly - then everything runs smoothly - BUT if one department is late or doesnt do something correctly it fuppes it up for other departments - which in turn results in inefficiencies.

a lot of people dont seem to understand this and management dont prepare for it.

gerry28

PCPhoto wrote: »

I'm sorry - but the pension levy is an increased payment into your pension - which means that by the time you retire you'll get more money than you would have gotten previously ..... in other words WHEN YOU RETIRE YOU WILL STILL GET THE MONEY SO ITS NOT TAKEN OFF YOU.

No, you are wrong on this. The money taken out of my wages as a pension levy i will never see again. We do not get it back.

Gumbo

PCPhoto wrote: »

I'm sorry - but the pension levy is an increased payment into your pension - which means that by the time you retire you'll get more money than you would have gotten previously ..... in other words WHEN YOU RETIRE YOU WILL STILL GET THE MONEY SO ITS NOT TAKEN OFF YOU.

the pension levy goes nowhere near the pension fund. it goes into the tax take and is not seen again by the individual that contributed it again.

Darragh29

gerry28 wrote: »

No, you are wrong on this. The money taken out of my wages as a pension levy i will never see again. We do not get it back.

But when you retire, you get:

(1) An up fromnt lump sum

(2) A weekly pension payment

If you add up the cost of your pension benefits above, it is very considerably greater than what you have personally paid into it throughout your employment...

Gumbo

Darragh29 wrote: »

But when you retire, you get:

(1) An up fromnt lump sum

(2) A weekly pension payment

If you add up the cost of your pension benefits above, it is very considerably greater than what you have personally paid into it throughout your employment...

this has been done to death on this forum already. unless you earn a significant salary in the PS, your pension is cost neutral to the exchequer. it was published in the independent a few weeks ago, will try find a link!

for somebody earning 40k they more than cover their pension entitlements.
dont forget the weekly pension from your contributions is minus the state OAP that everybody gets. and the 150% lump sum is based on 40 years service. i'd like to know how many people actually retire with 40 years service.

bridgitt

kceire wrote: »

and the 150% lump sum is based on 40 years service. i'd like to know how many people actually retire with 40 years service.

I thought, but I could be wrong, it was 30 or 35 years for some groups like the Gardai ? I thought in a study in the papers it said public servants would need to be paying 26% of their salary to have the guaranteed pension. Not many people are getting guaranteed pensions nowadays, only public servants.

NinjaTruncs

kceire wrote: »

the pension levy goes nowhere near the pension fund. it goes into the tax take and is not seen again by the individual that contributed it again.

There is no pension fund for PS works, their pension comes out of the current tax intake.

Gumbo

bridgitt wrote: »

I thought, but I could be wrong, it was 30 or 35 years for some groups like the Gardai ? I thought in a study in the papers it said public servants would need to be paying 26% of their salary to have the guaranteed pension. Not many people are getting guaranteed pensions nowadays, only public servants.

sorry forgot about gardai, yeah they have a different system again. i work for a local authority and ours is 40 years service. our contributions would cover our pension, but i suppose its the extra 10 years of payments that cover this.

of course not everybody has guaranteed pensions but alot do, when i was in the private sector i have a private pension and to this day it has onlt lost 10% of its value, thats with AIB. i dont contribute to it anymore as i cant pay into both but i still get the statements and will slightly benefit from it when i retire at 65.

NinjaTruncs wrote: »

There is no pension fund for PS works, their pension comes out of the current tax intake.

exactly what i was pointing out!

funnyname

kceire wrote: »

and the 150% lump sum is based on 40 years service. i'd like to know how many people actually retire with 40 years service.

It's pro-rata so someone with 20 years service will get a 75% LS, etc etc.

funnyname

NinjaTruncs wrote: »

There is no pension fund for PS works, their pension comes out of the current tax intake.

Ever heard of http://www.nprf.ie/home.html

gerry28

Darragh29 wrote: »

If you add up the cost of your pension benefits above, it is very considerably greater than what you have personally paid into it throughout your employment...

Probably not, i earn less than 30K a year and joined too late to do the full 40 years.