24th Nov Strikes... What a joke

testicle

kippy wrote: »

I never said that there were no public servants involved in these trips up North today........

So you admit that there were some?

The Irish Times has this to say - "Many of the shoppers were public sector workers who were reluctant to be identified but said they were taking advantage of the strike to stock up on groceries and goods."

You can bet your life they were reluctant to be identified!

lazer.blue

bonzos wrote: »

I am a private sector worker who up until a few weeks ago was on the dole,i got a job for 6 week on upgrading work in 2 state offices in my local area....i was delighted to get work even if is only for 6 weeks!the level of waste i have witnessed in the past few weeks is unreal,countless cigarette+ tea breaks every day,most people bring a paper or a book with them to work and seem to have time to read it during working hours,supervisors ignoring constant dosing and every excuse ben used to complain that we are prevenying them from working....its a disgrace!!!!we were told yesterday that if we entered the buliding today the guards would be called and we would be arrested for tresspassing....these people(not all of them) dont need pay cuts ....they need to be sacked for ripping off our country,i passed the building today several times and only a handfull of people outside.they are dragging our country into the ground!!!!!!

As I said earlier I have family working in the public sector and they are not the multi tea break taking, book reading, dossing type described above. There are wasters like this in all walks of life. In over 20 years working in the private sector I saw plenty of people get away with this type of carry on. Granted it soes seem harder for public sector employers to take action against people like this. We should not tar all puiblic sectors with the same brush, the majority ARE hard woking conscientious people. Reform is needed but it should not be achieved by riding roughshod over people

Firetrap

So back to the original question. Does anybody know who exactly went to Newry? Were they all public servants? I'd be curious to know what percentage might be parents who figured that since their kids were off school for the day, that they'd go north.

P.C.

brianthebard wrote: »

You seem to be confused about what a Trade Union does. It represents its members and seeks to maintain and improve their working experience. Trade Union representatives are not required to walk into the dept of finance and provide a alternative budgetary plan.

Yes, a Trade Union represents its members - BUT:

Trade unions also represent the unemployed - a fact which they choose to ignore most of the time.
And before you say it - I know that the unemployed are not members of the Trade Union, but they could be, if they had a job.

And -

Trade Unions are supposed to try and have as many people employed at as high a wage as possible (and before you jump on the words 'as high a wage as possible' - let me explain).
It is no good to have everyone in employment if they are only earning €1 a day, but it is just as bad to have 10 people employed, each earning € 10 000 a day. There is a balance, and the trade unions are supposed to find it.

And a trade union is a non-profit organization. The trade union representatives should not earn more than the average wage of its members.

Ronanireland

Badboy1977 wrote: »

What business of anybody's is it what a striking worker does? There is no legal requirement that you picket your place of work.If Im not paid by my employer (for this strike day), then if I decide to go North,South East or sit buck naked in my living room-its no bloody business of yours or anybody's. The major point of a strike(this needs to be pointed out to the dim wit who started this thread and others of his dwarf like intellect) ,is the withdrawal of Labour.


That's it-deal with it.

You wouldn't be a shopkeeper in Newry by any chance?:p

lazer.blue

oscarBravo wrote: »

From what I can see, that's equally true of the unions. They don't know the figures and they don't have the answers, but they're pre-emptively striking to try to dissuade the government from doing something that might actually address the problem. What do you have to say to this post?

To that post I repeat what I said, that everyone should contribute according to their means. The better off you are the more you should be willing and able to contribute. I also say we can no longer afford to have 50% of PAYE workers paying no tax. Again the country is in a mess and we all have to pay a price to get it sorted and that includes the unemployed and lower paid.

CamperMan

I thought council workers were going on strike today.....

I saw loads standing around idle in Carrick-on-Shannon... one man at each road junction to warn people that the road was flooded... f*ck me, thought that was what the road signs were for..

kippy

testicle wrote: »

So you admit that there were some?

The Irish Times has this to say - "Many of the shoppers were public sector workers who were reluctant to be identified but said they were taking advantage of the strike to stock up on groceries and goods."

You can bet your life they were reluctant to be identified!

Of course there were some. On a "normal day" there would be some Public Sector workers up there. There were probably a few more than that today, either way no one can say anything for sure about it. Its been mentioned in countless threads and in the media that this whole exodus was made up of all the public sector workers on strike.....which is plainly untrue and unprovable. Even if every one of them were public sector, why would you care? They are not getting paid for it and could well have done their rostered time.....

This is what I said:
"Theres absolutely no proof that this extra traffic in the north is fully made up of Public servants on strike."

What exactly are you trying to do?

Dr Kamikazi

So, today every civil servant walked out of their job in disgust over their unfair treatment and scapegoating.
Here's a few of their arguments:
I had nothing to do with the crash!
That's right, you didn't. Neither did I, I still lost my job. There where many, many people on the Titanic, whose fault it definitely wasn't that they hit that iceberg. Guess what? They went down nevertheless. Maybe you should try addressing the Universe with that argument. Surely it will turn around and say “Isn't it? That's alright then, go back to work where you'll find you where given a 20% raise and a mug of cocoa”

Why am I being singled out for punishment?
That one is just plain ignorant, pigheaded, thick and selfish. What about the hundreds of thousands of people who lost their job? Not even an argument.

I work hard at my job and deserve my money!
When I still had a job, there where quarterly reviews where you had to hit your targets. As soon as you hit them, the target was raised. Overtime was something you did cause you had a job to finish. You were not paid for it and if you where late the next day, you where in trouble.
My job took me to nearly every public office in Munster and quite frankly, civil servants don't work too hard. Unless standing around, chatting and drinking tea qualifies. And then going for a half an hours tea break. The come back and spend half an hour whining as to how hard and unfair life is to you. And as for the dole office? Had I worked at that pace in my job, I would have been fired after the first week. It's like watching continents drift. In slow motion.
Pushing paper across a desk is not work. Not even close.

Why don't the fat cats pay?
Look, I don't care what the other kids are doing. Nothing to do with you. If all the other kids jumped off a cliff, would you? Pointing at others and winging has never gotten anyone anything. Besides, monkeys point.

We don't earn as much as anyone makes out!
So, the central statistics office telling barefaced lies again? Those scallywags! Surely when they compiled data from across Europe, they must have employed morons again.
But seriously, I know civil servants who came over here from Germany because they can MORE THAN DOUBLE OR EVEN TRIPLE their earnings! Ambulance drivers here get paid as much as doctors in Finland! I didn't even make 30k in my job but it did me well. Anyone who declares they are a below average earner on that surely knows where to pick up the gravy train.

So far, every single argument I've heard from civil servants translates into “I didn't hit that Iceberg!”, “Nothing to do with me, not my problem, don't expect any help fro ME!”, “How dare you piss in my soup!” and “Keep your hands of the controls of the gravy train!”, or just downright "Waaaaahhhh, waaaaahhh!!!!!! I wanna sweety!"

Also, civil servants are complaining that there is a perception that they are being selfish and greedy.
It's because you are. No one needs to sell that to me.
Also, don't forget, lazy, arrogant, pig headed, irresponsible, unpatriotic, and ignorant.
No one sold those to me. That's simply my own conclusion.
The new program is (and how often have I had to hear that) suck it up or get out. If Ireland really is that horrible and unfair to you, go somewhere where you are appreciated. There are a few openings in LaLa Land I hear.

JHMEG

gerire wrote: »

Don't know too many earning this much on the front line; Take out the senior management out of the CSO figures and it may be slightly realistic

The unions and others keep telling us the CSO figures are wrong.

So, why are we wasting money on the CSO... why isn't it shut down and the staff made redundant if they keep producing bad figures?

KELTICKNIGHTT

thers over 4 million in ireland plus and 317,000 public servants, so under 1 pubilic worker too every 15 private worker,wonder what the ratio lets say in uk or states that it cost ireland so much

brianthebard

yoshytoshy wrote: »

The fianna fail set up and every agreement that was made in the last ten years with them.
Everything has changed ,maybe if they were gone ,it would make it easier to understand.

Yes the fianna fail set up is broken, but it sounds like your solution is to keep following FF and go along with the cuts they propose. Why?

P.C. wrote: »

Yes, a Trade Union represents its members - BUT:

Trade unions also represent the unemployed - a fact which they choose to ignore most of the time.
And before you say it - I know that the unemployed are not members of the Trade Union, but they could be, if they had a job.

And -

Trade Unions are supposed to try and have as many people employed at as high a wage as possible (and before you jump on the words 'as high a wage as possible' - let me explain).
It is no good to have everyone in employment if they are only earning €1 a day, but it is just as bad to have 10 people employed, each earning € 10 000 a day. There is a balance, and the trade unions are supposed to find it.

And a trade union is a non-profit organization. The trade union representatives should not earn more than the average wage of its members.

What is this post about? It doesn't have anything to do with my post that you quoted, nor the post I was replying to. Besides which, Trade unions are not Fás. Where are you coming up with these assertions??

Badboy1977

Its no business of anyone here what a public servant did or didnt do today. If you want to argue about whether or not there should be a strike-fine,but whether or not there were pickets is none of your bleeding business. You are not obligated to picket. I was not paid today so piss off if you wanted me picketing my workplace all day. Its simply being petty and none of your business. The strike itself is a different matter.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

SwanV

Big deal. If you knew your wages were going to be cut by another eight percent who wouldn't take an oppurtunity to travel north.
If you had a chance to show a united front to wage cuts in your job you'd do it too.It's all well and good to complain about the PS but you know you'd do the exact same thing.
Cuts are inevitable. It's ok to show that you are pissed off.

Badboy1977

kippy wrote: »

Of course there were some. On a "normal day" there would be some Public Sector workers up there. There were probably a few more than that today, either way no one can say anything for sure about it. Its been mentioned in countless threads and in the media that this whole exodus was made up of all the public sector workers on strike.....which is plainly untrue and unprovable. Even if every one of them were public sector, why would you care? They are not getting paid for it and could well have done their rostered time.....

This is what I said:
"Theres absolutely no proof that this extra traffic in the north is fully made up of Public servants on strike."

What exactly are you trying to do?

So what if they went shopping?? What business of yours is it, if they did or not?? The strike itself might be your concern-but these people were not paid today so if they wanted to scratch their backsides at home-what concern of your petty world is it about what they did with their time? Ever read the "valley of the squinting windows?"? The fact we were not working is your concern but its all legit and what I did or anyone did is none of your small minded business!

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

ressem

What was with all the interviewed strikers saying that the levy had cost them €400/€650/€800 per month net?
According to a spreadsheet on the AGSI (association of Garda Sergeants and Inspectors )
http://www.agsi.ie/agsi_files/file/revised-levy-comparisons.xls-5.xls

you'd need to be on pay pre-tax ( individual ) of over 97 K to be losing €400 per month in your take home pay(slightly less than 5% after tax relief).

Badboy1977

Fianna Fail have no Moral authority for cuts but that being said (as a Blueshirt), I still prefer them to clean up their own Dog poo and then slither away in a taxi after election result-a six seater should just about do it, as its only inbreeds who would vote for them now!

timmmy

Dr Kamikazi wrote: »

There where many, many people on the Titanic, whose fault it definitely wasn't that they hit that iceberg. Guess what? They went down nevertheless.

Not everyone went down. Who is getting the lifeboats here?

KELTICKNIGHTT

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

i didnt say who was working,but make it even worse if 2 million work in private setor and 317,000 in public sector

yoshytoshy

brianthebard wrote: »

Yes the fianna fail set up is broken, but it sounds like your solution is to keep following FF and go along with the cuts they propose. Why?

You sound like your purposefully pretending to pick me up the wrong way ,my cuts were offered by me so that I could get more work.I don't work in the public sector.

By taking cuts when I did ,it means I hopefully will be working in a stronger envoirnment when things get even tougher.

Dr Kamikazi

Badboy1977 wrote: »

Its no business of anyone here what a public servant did or didnt do today. If you want to argue about whether or not there should be a strike-fine,but whether or not there were pickets is none of your bleeding business. You are not obligated to picket. I was not paid today so piss off if you wanted me picketing my workplace all day. Its simply being petty and none of your business. The strike itself is a different matter.

Maybe that's the solution!
Keep ignoring the civil servants, other than the usual laughing and pointing at them and goading them into more and more Strikes for which they will not get paid.
If we can come to an agreement that all of them will strike one day a week and not get paid for it, problem solved, instant paycut!
They would have to agree to clear the backlog of work upon their return of course...

brianthebard

yoshytoshy wrote: »

You sound like your purposefully pretending to pick me up the wrong way ,my cuts were offered by me so that I could get more work.I don't work in the public sector.

By taking cuts when I did ,it means I hopefully will be working in a stronger envoirnment when things get even tougher.

I didn't say you work in the public sector, I realise that was a separate point. But you seem to think that cuts are necessary, and said the FF system is broken, so why continue to follow the FF way when its doing nothing for us?

Dr Kamikazi

timmmy wrote: »

Not everyone went down. Who is getting the lifeboats here?

Yep, but crying foul and pointing at others won't get you a seat on one

yoshytoshy

brianthebard wrote: »

I didn't say you work in the public sector, I realise that was a separate point. But you seem to think that cuts are necessary, and said the FF system is broken, so why continue to follow the FF way when its doing nothing for us?

Money only has the value that we give it.

irish_bob

yoshytoshy wrote: »

It's got to do with how out of touch they are with the economy.
Half the arguments on the radio today came from picketers ,who claim that if they get wage cuts ,it will affect the economy.

thats what happens when you recycle union rhetoric non stop , you end up not being able to swallow your own story

JHMEG

SwanV wrote: »

Big deal. If you knew your wages were going to be cut by another eight percent who wouldn't take an oppurtunity to travel north.

I can understand the PS not being happy about the seven point five percent pension levy.

Have any PSers or their unions approached their employers about getting rid of the levy and the pension, in favour of taking out a private pension?

That'd seem fair to me.

irish_bob

timmmy wrote: »

Not everyone went down. Who is getting the lifeboats here?

naff i know to quote from that 9 hr film but in the words of the villian played by billy zane when responding to kate winslets comment about how half the people will die , not the better half , seems some people are more entitled to avoid the stormy waters of a rescession than others

boodlesdoodles

irish_bob wrote: »

naff i know to quote from that 9 hr film but in the words of the villian played by billy zane when responding to kate winslets comment about how half the people will die , not the better half , seems some people are more entitled to avoid the stormy waters of a rescession than others

Seriously, you're quoting Titantic? Just gets better :P