Second day of strike action planned for Thursday Dec 3rd

KELTICKNIGHTT

timmmy wrote: »

Do you have any conception of how this works? You don't get paid by your employer when on strike. It's a withdrawal of labour.



Ah now, that's not true. I do get out a fair bit. I've had to a lot more this year to try to make up what I lost with the pension and income levies.

i have more of a conception than you will ever know laddie, like most in private sector,dont support your so called strike for alot of reasons
the more you strike ,the more the private will be againist you:)
i dont get paid holidays either as i work as contractor

eiresurfer

timmmy wrote: »

I've had to a lot more this year to try to make up what I lost with the pension and income levies.

Do you have any idea how the idea of Public Servants complaining about a Pension Levy makes those in the private sector feel physically sick? Unlike you, we didn't suffer a pension levy, because we have to pay for 100% of our pension. Unlike you lot, who get it paid for by the taxpayer.

Celticfire

eiresurfer wrote: »

Do you have any idea how the idea of Public Servants complaining about a Pension Levy makes those in the private sector feel physically sick? Unlike you, we didn't suffer a pension levy, because we have to pay for 100% of our pension. Unlike you lot, who get it paid for by the taxpayer.

Just wondering what percentage of your pay are you paying into your private pension fund and how many years will you have contributed when you retire?

nesf

eiresurfer wrote: »

Do you have any idea how the idea of Public Servants complaining about a Pension Levy makes those in the private sector feel physically sick? Unlike you, we didn't suffer a pension levy, because we have to pay for 100% of our pension. Unlike you lot, who get it paid for by the taxpayer.

We, in the Private Sector, do get something from the Government towards our pension payments because we get to write them off against tax to some extent. This means the Government is effectively giving us a % of our pension payments to the pension company for us.

gandalf

Well the time has come to remove tax relief on Trade Union Subscriptions to begin with. I will fully support any political party that will neuter these unions. They are protecting antiquated work practices and are holding the country to ransom at the expense of the majority of working people at a time of crisis.

dvpower

nesf wrote: »

We, in the Private Sector, do get something from the Government towards our pension payments because we get to write them off against tax to some extent. This means the Government is effectively giving us a % of our pension payments to the pension company for us.

But since they tax pension income at the far side, its a deferred benefit for the most part.

dvpower

gandalf wrote: »

Well the time has come to remove tax relief on Trade Union Subscriptions to begin with. I will fully support any political party that will neuter these unions. They are protecting antiquated work practices and are holding the country to ransom at the expense of the majority of working people at a time of crisis.

I think it only a €40 credit so removing it isn't going to neuter the unions.
I predict that they'll keep it.

gandalf

dvpower wrote: »

I think it only a €40 credit so removing it isn't going to neuter the unions.
I predict that they'll keep it.

Notice the phrase "to begin with" after that comment. I think it will give a very clear signal of intent to the Union Mandarins.

Josey Wales

eiresurfer wrote: »

Unlike you lot, who get it paid for by the taxpayer.

Every worker in the public service is a tax payer too.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

KELTICKNIGHTT

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

thats a good one

nesf

dvpower wrote: »

But since they tax pension income at the far side, its a deferred benefit for the most part.

Only if you view pension income as being somehow different to regular income for the purposes of taxation (i.e. if you hold the view that all income to a person should be liable to be taxed then this isn't a problem per se). Though, admittedly without it being tax deductible it'd be double taxation which would be a very bad thing.

Sleepy

marco_polo wrote: »

So, if the estimates are to be believed, another 100 million cost to the economy next month as well.

That should help matters no end.

How does a cost centre being shut down for a day cost the economy money?

Those in the private sector taking the day off to mind their children are using their holiday leave which is already factored into their pay and the opportunity cost of their day's work should thus already be factored into their employers' budgets?

Or is 100 million an estimate of how much was spent in Northern Ireland today?

JHMEG

Do most of the public/civil service have the 6th of Dec off for shopping? Some long standing thing?

nesf

Sleepy wrote: »

How does a cost centre being shut down for a day cost the economy money?

Those in the private sector taking the day off to mind their children are using their holiday leave which is already factored into their pay and the opportunity cost of their day's work should thus already be factored into their employers' budgets?

Or is 100 million an estimate of how much was spent in Northern Ireland today?

Well, parents who need to take a day off work will cost money in terms of tax not paid on hours not worked. They won't necessarily be able to take holiday leave and may have to take unpaid leave to do it! All appointments and operations and such will need to be rescheduled and somehow fit in on very tight waiting lists in some areas. There are probably other obvious costs that I'm not thinkings.

That said we get one day off the public pay bill, which has to be worth quite a bit!

JHMEG

nesf wrote: »

There are probably other obvious costs that I'm not thinkings.

It sends the message out internationally that we're closed for business.

Dannyboy83

nesf wrote: »

Well, parents who need to take a day off work will cost money in terms of tax not paid on hours not worked. They won't necessarily be able to take holiday leave and may have to take unpaid leave to do it! All appointments and operations and such will need to be rescheduled and somehow fit in on very tight waiting lists in some areas. There are probably other obvious costs that I'm not thinkings.

That said we get one day off the public pay bill, which has to be worth quite a bit!

If PS Wages are 30% and Social is 35%, and we are borrowing €500million per week, then I guess it must come in at something between €30 and €60million...........which may cover the recent flood damage I guess.

lmimmfn

nesf wrote: »

Well, parents who need to take a day off work will cost money in terms of tax not paid on hours not worked. They won't necessarily be able to take holiday leave and may have to take unpaid leave to do it! All appointments and operations and such will need to be rescheduled and somehow fit in on very tight waiting lists in some areas. There are probably other obvious costs that I'm not thinkings.

That said we get one day off the public pay bill, which has to be worth quite a bit!

Is it just me or is the whole thing complately selfish, the country is nearly bankrupt and these folk dont give a toss and down tools for something thats completely unsustainable, not only that the lower paid are just doing the bidding of the overpaid fat cats which the cuts are all about?

dvpower

nesf wrote: »

Only if you view pension income as being somehow different to regular income for the purposes of taxation (i.e. if you hold the view that all income to a person should be liable to be taxed then this isn't a problem per se). Though, admittedly without it being tax deductible it'd be double taxation which would be a very bad thing.

I wouldn't consider a pension to be income in the usual sense. Apart from the part of it that is profit from investment. The capital is just savings.

dresden8

JHMEG wrote: »

Do most of the public/civil service have the 6th of Dec off for shopping? Some long standing thing?

You're thinking of culchie shopping day.

nesf

dvpower wrote: »

I wouldn't consider a pension to be income in the usual sense. Apart from the part of it that is profit from investment. The capital is just savings.

So should someone who inherited 5,000,000 in cash have to pay tax on taking 100,000 a year out of it as spending money?

timmmy

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote: »

i have more of a conception than you will ever know laddie, like most in private sector,dont support your so called strike for alot of reasons
the more you strike ,the more the private will be againist you:)
i dont get paid holidays either as i work as contractor

Why would you ask such basic questions if you do understand it? I don't get that. I have worked on contracts in the past and that's how it is when you're effectively self-employed. Of course no-one is going to pay you to take holidays. I saw huge support yesterday and that's for sure.

eiresurfer wrote: »

Do you have any idea how the idea of Public Servants complaining about a Pension Levy makes those in the private sector feel physically sick? Unlike you, we didn't suffer a pension levy, because we have to pay for 100% of our pension. Unlike you lot, who get it paid for by the taxpayer.

Do you have any idea how annoying sweeping generalisations like this are? First, though, a correction. You didn't suffer a pension levy because you don't work in the public service and not because you pay 100% for your pension. I pay 100% for mine too. I will not get back what I have to pay in. I am not permitted to opt out. It's tiresome being criticised for having a gold-plated pension when you actually don't. Is it possible to realise that the public sector is not one homogenous whole? We're not all on some gravy train.

nesf

timmmy wrote: »

Do you have any idea how annoying sweeping generalisations like this are? First, though, a correction. You didn't suffer a pension levy because you don't work in the public service and not because you pay 100% for your pension. I pay 100% for mine too. I will not get back what I have to pay in. I am not permitted to opt out. It's tiresome being criticised for having a gold-plated pension when you actually don't. Is it possible to realise that the public sector is not one homogenous whole? We're not all on some gravy train.

Seriously, I'm one of the ones arguing for public sector pay cuts and even I can't convince them that the pension situation is complex (especially for the lower paid public servants in councils and whatnot).

jenzz

Does anyone know if this is actually going ahead ?

dvpower

nesf wrote: »

So should someone who inherited 5,000,000 in cash have to pay tax on taking 100,000 a year out of it as spending money?

No. They have to pay inheritance tax on the 5m. After that, they can do with it what they wish. Seems reasonable to me.

Should a PAYE worker who earns 5m and takes 100,000 a year from beneath the mattress have to pay tax on that?

KELTICKNIGHTT

timmmy wrote: »

Why would you ask such basic questions if you do understand it? I don't get that. I have worked on contracts in the past and that's how it is when you're effectively self-employed. Of course no-one is going to pay you to take holidays. I saw huge support yesterday and that's for sure.



Do you have any idea how annoying sweeping generalisations like this are? First, though, a correction. You didn't suffer a pension levy because you don't work in the public service and not because you pay 100% for your pension. I pay 100% for mine too. I will not get back what I have to pay in. I am not permitted to opt out. It's tiresome being criticised for having a gold-plated pension when you actually don't. Is it possible to realise that the public sector is not one homogenous whole? We're not all on some gravy train.

YOU AND YOUR FELLOW PS WORKERS want too wake up,the beeps wherent supporting you ,just laughing at you ,i know :D
very few support you but glad your taking day off as it saves the country few euros:)

jenzz

jenzz wrote: »

Does anyone know if this is actually going ahead ?

Anyone know??

KELTICKNIGHTT

probly unless they reach a midway agreement,you know by friday i would think

rossithelegend

Ok so lets look at some facts here from reading the last number of posts one thing I have noticed is not a lot of people have facts on what there talking about!
1. All public ervice workers are tax payers paying PAYE and PRSI
2. Public service pensions are NOT as gold plated as many think and we have always paid for them. If you look at any public servants payslip you will see under deductions the following.
PRSI
PAYE
Pension Related Deduction (Pension Levy)
Super (Superannuation or Pension Contribution)
Income Levy
I had never even looked at my pension entitlement untill this year (there was no need to as im still under 35) but when the levy came in i thought well lets see how much I'll get tbh I was shocked with the findings as I'd be better off putting my money in a high interest account or an outside scheme. A lot of people also don't realise that the first 12k of any public service pension is made up of your state pension which we are all entitled too. the whole public -vs- pvt sector thing is a load of bull. One needs the other. If public sector workers can't afford to spend cash then private sector business will suffer further job losses will be incurred and further business will close now this will have a kickback on public sector finances as rates will drop as a result. It's about time we all grew a pair and looked at who got us in the mess im refferring to Messers Ahern and Cowen, the amount of money that has been wasted in this Country is criminal 50 million on E-voting which never saw the light of day, the farce that was the port tunnell. Irish people in particular the working class pvt and public have been made to pay for the incompetence of our government which maybe we deserve considering we voted them in (though a lack of real opposition may of had a part to play) This Country has been run in such a way that those who were willing to work and pay there way have been shouldered with the burden of carrying many who weren't. I don't think anyone can argue that a person who has worked in the pvt sector for the last 10 years paying taxes and has recently lost their job should have their dole cut nor would I argue that a public sector worker who is and has been working for the equivalant time have their income squezzed to a point where they can't make ends meet. This Country needs answers not lynch mobs and finger pointing the problem is the Government that is in power does not seem to have them or gives us the wrong ones leading us down even darker corridors. I've worked in both private and public sectors over the last 5 years and both have their perks and problems.

jmayo

prinz wrote: »

The traffic jam is the facts. Trying to tie it into the strike is a dig.

Why it is a dig, it is reporting a fact ?
Surprising RTE bothered with it although they may have bene told to do so by government in order to embarass public sector.

Funny that the day most of the public sector is on strike has a massive increase in people heading into Newry to shop.
Must be conincidence

I could be real cynical and state the ones that were on picket duty last week won't be on next week so that they can get to Newry

Joe the Santa wrote: »

what that one midweek day when schools are closed that people decide to head up and shop.

So are you saying either private sector workers took the day off their work because the kids were off and thus decided to go Newry or that unemployed with kids headed to Newry ?
If unemployed and can afford it why not head whilst kids are in school ?
Sorry forgot it is easier to afford it in Newry than Dublin :rolleyes:

Perish the thought it was public sector workers that weren't on picket duty decided to head up to Newry :rolleyes:

dresden8 wrote: »

You're thinking of culchie shopping day.

Except this year they aren't heading for the overpriced shopping in Dublin or even their nearest large town, but they are heading to Enniskillen, Derry, Newry or Belfast.