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Primetime 24/11: Since when is 55,000 not a good wage?

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    #32
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    the guy on 34K

    saying

    "that will set me back 5 years"

    well thats the thing, the country is set back more than 5 years now, we were living in a bubble

    thats the harsh reality :(
    they look like nice people but come on


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    #33
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    was doing more thinking

    across the Irish sea (and border up north) in UK

    everyone including the public sector is literary 30% poorer due to money printing and currency devaluation


    30% !! thats how much they are being screwed by


    are there any strikes about it?


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    #34
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    brianthebard wrote: »
    So it could conceivably be quite a poor wage, or at least not a rich or 'good' wage as you previously suggested?

    Is 55k a good wage? Yes.

    Is it enough money for a man with a couple of kids and some debt? That's a different question.


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    #35
    MaceFace
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,697 ✭✭✭MaceFace


    ei.sdraob wrote: »
    how about the teacher on PT, ~49-50K salary

    saying "whats the point of having a job if you cant make ends meet"

    a simple question, would he get more by working as private teacher? would he even have a job?? does he think he would be better of on the dole??

    and "getting 900euro a fortnight"
    is it me or the numbers dont add up here?

    I didn't get those numbers either. Something fishy going on......


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    #36
    brianthebard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,165 ✭✭✭✭brianthebard


    nesf wrote: »
    PrimeTime did their usual graphics with how much someone earned etc. They identified her as earning 55K if that's what you mean.

    Yes that's what I meant thank you. I agree 55k is nothing to sneeze at, but after tax it is substantially reduced and should not be considered living in the lap of luxury as some here are suggesting.
    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Is 55k a good wage? Yes.

    Is it enough money for a man with a couple of kids and some debt? That's a different question.

    It is indeed, one which most here seem unwilling to ask.


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    #37
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    apparently in UK starting teacher salary is £21K thats €24K

    the teacher guy on PT can be replaced by 2 teachers from UK

    hmmm i bet unions wont like that


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    #38
    Riskymove
    Registered Users Posts: 10,888 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    gurramok wrote: »
    The OP asked the question and you have your answer. It works out at 3,400 a month, http://www.hookhead.com/Tools/tax2009b.jsp.

    Anyone who says it is not a good wage is lying.

    ah I see

    so this thread is just a discussion about whether or not 55k is a good wage....but noone has actually said it isnt

    ......and the starting position is anyone disagreeing is a liar?...interesting


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    #39
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    brianthebard wrote: »
    Yes that's what I meant thank you. I agree 55k is nothing to sneeze at, but after tax it is substantially reduced and should not be considered living in the lap of luxury as some here are suggesting..

    Honestly, I'd consider it a good salary and enough to raise a small family on comfortably even after the deductions. Not rich but the idea of it being in the same category as someone on under 30K which was suggested by Prime Time (not the girl herself!) is absurd.


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    #40
    Riskymove
    Registered Users Posts: 10,888 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    nesf wrote: »
    Honestly, I'd consider it a good salary and enough to raise a small family on comfortably even after the deductions. Not rich but the idea of it being in the same category as someone on under 30K which was suggested by Prime Time (not the girl herself!) is absurd.

    I agree

    but the problem with threads like this is that context is everything

    we can pick any amount and speculate about what lifestyle you'd have but obviously variables like kids, mortgages, health etc will seriously skew things

    55K is a comparitvely good wage, it has to be given wages generally....but its another story to talk about "rich" and "poor"


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    #41
    alastair
    Registered Users Posts: 19,309 ✭✭✭✭alastair


    tomcollins97 wrote: »
    900 odd a fortnight. Mortgage of 900 a moth - so he has 900 to play with each month for all other expenses.

    2 children in childcare so presumably a partner worker - therefore more spare cash a month. The figures do not add up at all.

    Anyone notice the fancy sound system mounted on the wall behind him? :)

    The stereo wasn't anything fancy tbh - but the 900 into his hands a fortnight makes no sense unless he's already accounted for loan repayments, car payments, utilities, something else he chose not to mention. And given that he's in a two income household, the whole personal affordability of paycuts issue is fudged to high heaven. I won't be rushing to shed tears for his situation though.


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    #42
    hellboy99
    Registered Users Posts: 6,219 ✭✭✭hellboy99


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Is 55k a good wage? Yes.

    Is it enough money for a man with a couple of kids and some debt? That's a different question.
    It's more than enough if your not stupid and living beyond your means. Myself, wife and child get by on 22k, these people need to cop themselves on.


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    #43
    bbam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭bbam


    alastair wrote: »
    The stereo wasn't anything fancy tbh - but the 900 into his hands a fortnight makes no sense unless he's already accounted for loan repayments, car payments, utilities, something else he chose not to mention. And given that he's in a two income household, the whole personal affordability of paycuts issue is fudged to high heaven. I won't be rushing to shed tears for his situation though.

    Surely the fact he didn't mention what his partners income was ruined the whole point of having him on.. My SO works in the public sector and she agreed it looked like he was mis-representing his situation.


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    #44
    MysticalRain
    Registered Users Posts: 1,428 ✭✭✭MysticalRain


    brianthebard wrote: »
    It is indeed, one which most here seem unwilling to ask.

    Maybe that's because it's irrelevant. We're talking about people's level of pay, not people's ability to manage their own personal finances. Most people in this country have raised families on far less than 55K.


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    #45
    Vyse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,400 ✭✭✭Vyse


    AARRRGH wrote: »
    Is 55k a good wage? Yes.

    Is it enough money for a man with a couple of kids and some debt? That's a different question.

    You get paid based on your qualifications/ experience not your personal circumstances.


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    #46
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    Vyse wrote: »
    You get paid based on your qualifications/ experience not your personal circumstances.

    one word:

    benchmarking


    higher pay for no productivity gain


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    #47
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Vyse wrote: »
    You get paid based on your qualifications/ experience not your personal circumstances.

    In the public sector?
    Other than teachers and some other cossetted segments- no, you don't. Irrespective of your qualifications or experience- you come in at the bottom of the salary scale for a particular role- and very often, even if you have qualifications highly pertinent to the body/department/organisation assigned to- you may be given a menial role where you have precisely zero opportunity to make use of your expertise.

    Its criminal.


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    #48
    RMDrive
    Registered Users Posts: 554 ✭✭✭RMDrive


    smccarrick wrote: »
    In conjunction with this- there *has* to be an audit of people's skills and qualifications in the public sector- it is criminal that there are thousands of highly skilled people being postboxed into menial chores- when they could play a much more meaningful and necessary role in trying to get the country back together. To put this into context- there are at least 18 economists in the Department of Finance doing admin work- while the Department feels its necessary to bring in external consultants, because it doesn't have the necessary internal expertise. This is both demoralising to those who are highly capable and qualified- but also scandalous that the taxpayer is paying several times over the odds, for a resource that is already present........

    If this were replicated across all government departments- you can be certain the bill for external consultants could be drastically reduced- and very fulfilling roles given to those who are already present. Just because someone is employed in what might be considered a menial admin role- does not mean they cannot be more profitably employed elsewhere.

    I am shocked that there has been no calls for a skills audit in the Public Sector.


    It's a very good point. Wage cuts alone are not going to be enough to take us through the next 10-20 years. If there is expertise and experience available it should be used to the maximum.
    It's a great idea.


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    #49
    thebiglad
    Registered Users Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭thebiglad


    nesf wrote: »
    Honestly, I'd consider it a good salary and enough to raise a small family on comfortably even after the deductions. Not rich but the idea of it being in the same category as someone on under 30K which was suggested by Prime Time (not the girl herself!) is absurd.

    Yes €55k is a decent wage but...

    If you suddenly receive that today - have previously earned €20k then happy days.

    If however you previously earned more then you have probably cut your cloth based on the higher salary - it is more difficult and many previously higher earners have lost their jobs or seen their salary reduced.

    Please do not start with the well I earned €27k and reduced to €x cos that is not the point I am going to make.

    Based on the earnings of €55k pa rightly or wrongly they have probably gotten a mortgage which is around €2k per month in repayments. Add to that a car loan (which a lot of us have) and then the utility bills and basically they are no better off than the rest of us and have a lot further to fall if they do lose that €55kpa job - there are even less of them than there are in the €25k - €30k bracket

    If you do not have a mortgage (or a lower cost mortgage) then it is very good, if not then it is possible to struggle with an income of €55k as much as the next guy - it is all relative.

    Doubtless many will shoot down this logic as they do not believe anyone should be entitled to spend money on a larger house or earn such salaries but the question was, is this a good salary.

    Answer yes but as I came in with, one adjusts living to their salary and it goes no further once the mortgage is paid.


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    #50
    brianthebard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,165 ✭✭✭✭brianthebard


    nesf wrote: »
    Honestly, I'd consider it a good salary and enough to raise a small family on comfortably even after the deductions. Not rich but the idea of it being in the same category as someone on under 30K which was suggested by Prime Time (not the girl herself!) is absurd.

    I agree that its a good salary, but will the person on under 30k (perhaps 29,500?) not be on a lower tax band? obviously the 55k person will take home more, but how much more?


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    #51
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    thebiglad wrote: »
    Yes €55k is a decent wage but...

    If you suddenly receive that today - have previously earned €20k then happy days.

    If however you previously earned more then you have probably cut your cloth based on the higher salary - it is more difficult and many previously higher earners have lost their jobs or seen their salary reduced.

    Please do not start with the well I earned €27k and reduced to €x cos that is not the point I am going to make.

    Based on the earnings of €55k pa rightly or wrongly they have probably gotten a mortgage which is around €2k per month in repayments. Add to that a car loan (which a lot of us have) and then the utility bills and basically they are no better off than the rest of us and have a lot further to fall if they do lose that €55kpa job - there are even less of them than there are in the €25k - €30k bracket

    If you do not have a mortgage (or a lower cost mortgage) then it is very good, if not then it is possible to struggle with an income of €55k as much as the next guy - it is all relative.

    Doubtless many will shoot down this logic as they do not believe anyone should be entitled to spend money on a larger house or earn such salaries but the question was, is this a good salary.

    Answer yes but as I came in with, one adjusts living to their salary and it goes no further once the mortgage is paid.

    so once again

    we should feel sorry for someone

    who got themselves into alot of debt?!


    you know whats really perverse?
    shes (and other PS buddies) want the whole country to keep getting into deeper debt for longer so her debt fueled lifestyle can be sustained

    does anyone else see a problem with that?


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    #52
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    avalon68 wrote: »
    Im not sure if it was before or after tax

    55 k gross meaning before tax , only spoofers and public servants who speak to journalists quote NET wage , you quote gross and only gross


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    #53
    MysticalRain
    Registered Users Posts: 1,428 ✭✭✭MysticalRain


    thebiglad wrote: »
    Answer yes but as I came in with, one adjusts living to their salary and it goes no further once the mortgage is paid.

    And you know what the simple answer here is? They should their living to more modest standards. It's called budgeting.


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    #54
    AARRRGH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,382 ✭✭✭✭AARRRGH


    hellboy99 wrote: »
    It's more than enough if your not stupid and living beyond your means. Myself, wife and child get by on 22k, these people need to cop themselves on.

    Yeah, I wasn't saying 55k isn't enough to live on, I was trying to point out that the question "Is 55k a good wage?" is a different question than "Is 55k enough to pay for my lifestyle?"

    The problem in Ireland is people are so used to spending so much money they've lost track of how much money they really have.

    For example, a lovely 1st world country like Spain, if you earn 20k you are doing very well indeed.


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    #55
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    brianthebard wrote: »
    I agree that its a good salary, but will the person on under 30k (perhaps 29,500?) not be on a lower tax band? obviously the 55k person will take home more, but how much more?

    http://www.irishtimes.com/indepth/aprilbudget2009/calculator/

    knock yourself out


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    #56
    Iago
    Registered Users Posts: 6,638 ✭✭✭Iago


    brianthebard wrote: »
    I agree that its a good salary, but will the person on under 30k (perhaps 29,500?) not be on a lower tax band? obviously the 55k person will take home more, but how much more?

    around about €1,300 a month more after tax and prsi.....


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    #57
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    Vyse wrote: »
    You get paid based on your qualifications/ experience not your personal circumstances.

    +1 times ten thousand

    im sick of all this , but is it a good wage for someone with ten kids business , if we were to set wage levels based on a persons expense commitments , it would open up can of worms with countless implications


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    #58
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    thebiglad wrote: »
    Yes €55k is a decent wage but...

    If you suddenly receive that today - have previously earned €20k then happy days.

    If however you previously earned more then you have probably cut your cloth based on the higher salary - it is more difficult and many previously higher earners have lost their jobs or seen their salary reduced.

    Please do not start with the well I earned €27k and reduced to €x cos that is not the point I am going to make.

    Based on the earnings of €55k pa rightly or wrongly they have probably gotten a mortgage which is around €2k per month in repayments. Add to that a car loan (which a lot of us have) and then the utility bills and basically they are no better off than the rest of us and have a lot further to fall if they do lose that €55kpa job - there are even less of them than there are in the €25k - €30k bracket

    If you do not have a mortgage (or a lower cost mortgage) then it is very good, if not then it is possible to struggle with an income of €55k as much as the next guy - it is all relative.

    Doubtless many will shoot down this logic as they do not believe anyone should be entitled to spend money on a larger house or earn such salaries but the question was, is this a good salary.

    Answer yes but as I came in with, one adjusts living to their salary and it goes no further once the mortgage is paid.

    One does but one also has to accept that you may be forced to adjust it down. This is something that most of us lived with, I grew up knowing years when holidays were cancelled and Christmas small because times were tight mixed in with better years and so on. The idea that you can live and always earn what you earn today is something no child of the 80s or before should think. I've some sympathy for the kids born in the 90s who've never seen anything like this before but they aren't really those earning 50 odd thousand a year so it's a side point.

    I agree with you but I think anyone who approached life never planning for a time when things could be tough for a few years was foolish. If they remember the 80s and 70s doubly so. I was raised to spend yes, enjoy my money sure but always be putting some aside in case it all went to crap. It's something I'll pass on to my son, and soon to be born daughter but really it's something that everyone needs to cop on to. Life is a bitch, it sucks but it's true no matter what way you square it.


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    #59
    Magsthedog
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6 ✭Magsthedog


    A common theme running through this thread is that mortgages are the outgoings which mean any adjustment to salary, even an annual 55K, makes life a struggle and a reason why cuts in public sector pay packets cannot be tolerated. I own my own business and due to government cutbacks which were unilaterally imposed and decreased consumer spending I was no longer in a position to make my monthly repayments. I phoned my bank and we came to an agreement wherby I could stay afloat and they could get their money. Surely this is an option open to everybody who has at least a few years gone off their mortgages. My salary and that of my staff (who are left) has been reduced by an average of 15% so I am finding it very hard to have any sympathy for public servants. My wife is a public servant currently on maternity leave (six months paid with an option of taking three months unpaid which is unheard of in the private sector) and when she sees firsthand at how I am struggling she is relatively relieved that she is only looking at a 7% cut. We are extremely lucky to have security in the knowledge that if my business goes tits up at least she will still have a job to go back to


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    #60
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Riskymove wrote: »
    ah I see

    so this thread is just a discussion about whether or not 55k is a good wage....but noone has actually said it isnt

    ......and the starting position is anyone disagreeing is a liar?...interesting

    Eh no, common sense. If you earn 55k a year and think its not a good wage, its tin foil hat territory. Considering that 80%+ of the workforce would love to have that wage in the first place, it is a selfish perspective to think it is not a good wage. The earnings involved are huge, over 3 grand per mth with lifestyle in tow.

    By the way, do you think its a good wage? You never said.
    thebiglad wrote: »
    Yes €55k is a decent wage but...

    If you suddenly receive that today - have previously earned €20k then happy days.

    If however you previously earned more then you have probably cut your cloth based on the higher salary - it is more difficult and many previously higher earners have lost their jobs or seen their salary reduced.

    Please do not start with the well I earned €27k and reduced to €x cos that is not the point I am going to make.

    Based on the earnings of €55k pa rightly or wrongly they have probably gotten a mortgage which is around €2k per month in repayments. Add to that a car loan (which a lot of us have) and then the utility bills and basically they are no better off than the rest of us and have a lot further to fall if they do lose that €55kpa job - there are even less of them than there are in the €25k - €30k bracket

    If you do not have a mortgage (or a lower cost mortgage) then it is very good, if not then it is possible to struggle with an income of €55k as much as the next guy - it is all relative.

    Doubtless many will shoot down this logic as they do not believe anyone should be entitled to spend money on a larger house or earn such salaries but the question was, is this a good salary.

    Answer yes but as I came in with, one adjusts living to their salary and it goes no further once the mortgage is paid.

    What one spends their money with on whether they are on 25k or 55k is their problem. 25k is not good money, 55k is good money. Big difference in lifestyle there.


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    #61
    TelePaul
    Registered Users Posts: 4,093 ✭✭✭TelePaul


    That was tough to watch. Surprised she could keep a straight-face, claiming 55k couldn't cover her outgoings. Ever hear of a budget?


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