Sub €500 i5 build.

Solitaire · 27-11-2009 11:55pm

CompuFreak wrote: »

Kudos man. Seriously. But would that be in anyway upgradeble for the future?

Sweet [CENSORED] no. You'd be stark raving not to spec it with a more suitable HDD and RAM in the first place - and that's the HWVS build I'm talking about!

Bottom line: You could build an i5 for under €500 with a 22" monitor, but since it'd get free admission to the PC equivalent of the Darwin Awards you probably shouldn't. €500 not including monitor is more realistic for a non-gaming build, and €600 a bare minimum for an i5 that could game to some extent.

Mister Man · 27-11-2009 11:58pm

Solitaire wrote: »

Sweet [CENSORED] no. You'd be stark raving not to spec it with a more suitable HDD and RAM in the first place - and that's the HWVS build I'm talking about!

Bottom line: You could build an i5 for under €500 with a 22" monitor, but since it'd get free admission to the PC equivalent of the Darwin Awards you probably shouldn't. €500 not including monitor is more realistic for a non-gaming build, and €600 a bare minimum for an i5 that could game to some extent.

Don't some of the Motherboards come with a decent (by decent i mean passable) Onboard graphics to play some games which can get you buy till you spring for a fancy one?

CompuFreak · 28-11-2009 12:01am

Solitaire wrote: »

Sweet [CENSORED] no. You'd be stark raving not to spec it with a more suitable HDD and RAM in the first place - and that's the HWVS build I'm talking about!

Bottom line: You could build an i5 for under €500 with a 22" monitor, but since it'd get free admission to the PC equivalent of the Darwin Awards you probably shouldn't. €500 not including monitor is more realistic for a non-gaming build, and €600 a bare minimum for an i5 that could game to some extent.

Thought so.
So what sort of i5 system could be had for ~500 ex. monitor and OS?

lmimmfn · 28-11-2009 12:02am

Mister Man wrote: »

Don't some of the Motherboards come with a decent (by decent i mean passable) Onboard graphics to play some games which can get you buy till you spring for a fancy one?

god no, theyre totally crap, good for 5+ year old games if lucky.

Would be fine for playing old arcade games with Mame also.

CompuFreak wrote: »

Thought so.
So what sort of system could be had for ~500 ex. monitor and OS?

A decent AMD setup or Core 2.

marco_polo · 28-11-2009 12:10am

Attempt number 1 @ 501 Euro if you ignore the 30 delivery charge. Not exactly great by any means. Some trimming potential for cheaper PSU and/or smaller HDD (Or ditch the DVD)

CompuFreak · 28-11-2009 12:18am

Thanks for that marco! The passive GFX is a big plus!
But what's not great about it?

Solitaire · 28-11-2009 1:45am

Here's an attempt for €500 (well, €503) inc. delivery:

I wouldn't be trying to upgrade to a HD5770 on that PSU, but otherwise its okay(ish).

lmimmfn · 28-11-2009 1:51am

Solitaire wrote: »

I wouldn't be trying to upgrade to a HD5770 on that PSU, but otherwise its okay(ish).

you picked out some decent enough components for the max range, that psu will eat everything if it blows lol.

CompuFreak · 28-11-2009 2:25am

Solitaire wrote: »

Here's an attempt for €500 (well, €503) inc. delivery:

I wouldn't be trying to upgrade to a HD5770 on that PSU, but otherwise its okay(ish).

How does the 4350 fair against onboard graphics? i.e. what can i not do with it. Besides gaming.

marco_polo · 28-11-2009 5:43am

Sorry I didn't reply earlier I nipped out on the town for, oh about 5 hours or so

When I say could be better, I think the components I have picked out are decent and at least as good an OEM PC. Perhaps I have a slight enthusiast mindset on but what I really mean is that the RAM/Board/Graphics are fine and will service the average non-gaming / non-overclocking user pretty well nothing more, nothing less. PSU is excellent/ case ok once you don't intend on making a major gaming level graphics upgrade. Would have stuck in a bigger hard drive as well with a slightly larger budget.

As for the HD4350 vs onboard graphics, for regular PC usage (Internet/Office etc) onboard graphics will do a grand job. But if near flawless HDMI / Blu-Ray playback experience (or some light gaming) is, or will be a requirement, then a dedicated graphics card is recommended. If that is not an issue then you should have no fear of onboard option (Warning - I am pretty sure that the board I selected has no onboard GPU so that would need to be revised. As I recall in general it is mostly mATX boards, rather than ATX boards that have the onboard option.)

LOL When trying to figure out how solitare undercut me by 30 euro I noticed I picked out a 1gb HD4350, blowing about 10 euro of the budget on 512MB of extra memory that is as useless as tits on a bull.

CompuFreak · 28-11-2009 7:56pm

marco_polo wrote: »

Sorry I didn't reply earlier I nipped out on the town for, oh about 5 hours or so

When I say could be better, I think the components I have picked out are decent and at least as good an OEM PC. Perhaps I have a slight enthusiast mindset on but what I really mean is that the RAM/Board/Graphics are fine and will service the average non-gaming / non-overclocking user pretty well nothing more, nothing less. PSU is excellent/ case ok once you don't intend on making a major gaming level graphics upgrade. Would have stuck in a bigger hard drive as well with a slightly larger budget.

As for the HD4350 vs onboard graphics, for regular PC usage (Internet/Office etc) onboard graphics will do a grand job. But if near flawless HDMI / Blu-Ray playback experience (or some light gaming) is, or will be a requirement, then a dedicated graphics card is recommended. If that is not an issue then you should have no fear of onboard option (Warning - I am pretty sure that the board I selected has no onboard GPU so that would need to be revised. As I recall in general it is mostly mATX boards, rather than ATX boards that have the onboard option.)

LOL When trying to figure out how solitare undercut me by 30 euro I noticed I picked out a 1gb HD4350, blowing about 10 euro of the budget on 512MB of extra memory that is as useless as tits on a bull.

Great advice. Would that gfx card be up to some HD encoding? And Rendering with some 3d modelling software?

marco_polo · 30-11-2009 12:56am

CompuFreak wrote: »

Great advice. Would that gfx card be up to some HD encoding? And Rendering with some 3d modelling software?

It supports H.264, VC-1 and MPEG-2 hardware decode acceleration.

As for 3D modeling that would depend on whether the particular software does most processing on the CPU or GPU. If it is heavily CPU based then the card ability really doesn't come into it, if the software is heavily GPU based then the limitations of a 30 Euro card will be exposed (Why you pay big money for graphics cards for is not the bread and butter stuff like HDMI and HD acceleration, but for the extra processing power).

EDIT: Have to backtrack here a little bit it *seems* that the ATI Avivo Video Converter, for converting files between formats) only supports the 4600 ond 4800 series GPUs. So the 4350 only supports realtime playback hardware acceleration, but not file conversion.

jonny72 · 30-11-2009 1:33am

Leman_Russ wrote: »

Because it's the best price/performance around?

Think the AMD 620 has it beat on price/performance - i5 is double the price, but not quite double the performance (although close)

http://www.techspot.com/review/197-amd-athlon2-x4-620/

Solitaire · 30-11-2009 1:36am

Hang on... I thought P55 lacked any graphics! If it ain't a G-class chipset, you're gonna need some kind of discrete GPU to even hook up to the monitor! :eek:

If you wanted basic modelling and Avivo then at least a HD4650 is advisable. Real-time hardware (i.e. GPU-based) rendering needs a GPU suitable for the monitor; for heavy-duty stuff on a 1080p screen you'd need at least a HD5770 like you would if you were 3D gaming.

mgadget · 30-11-2009 10:35am

Custom PC magazine have an article on building a sub £500(close enough?) PC this month (Jan 10 edition).
To hit that mark for gaming, they've gone with an AMD build. For media/editing they've built an i5 rig. Both builds included an OS Windows 7(£83), and are for the box only with no monitor, mouse or keyboard included.

I've cut and pasted their i5 build here, the use Scan.co.uk as their reference.
I made two changes to their build - I removed the OS and doubled the RAM from 2GB to 4GB instead.

Shipping to Ireland is about £25 more so it looks like around €580 all in. Cut the memory back to 2GB and you're at €530ish. That build sourced from somewhere like Hardwareversand.de could be cheaper again.

The gaming build was based around an Athlon II x2 240 and a GTX 260 graphics card.

On hardwareversand it came to €493 + delivery, so €523. Mainboard is a slight upgrade from the Scan build. Take the CPU cooler out of the list and you are down to near enough €500, but the build is designed for some overclocking so it is recommended to keep it.

Komplett: Marc · 30-11-2009 4:37pm

Amazing topic, love the ingenuity in getting together a build like this on a shoestring, and the comment on it being a PC build Darwin Award contestant

At the same time, there's a part of me that can't help but be totally fascinated. I may see if I can persuade one of our RMA team to put together his own little €500 Frankenstein... it's always fun to give people a task you know they'll frown the whole way through but secretly enjoy

Edit: Oh yeah, and I'd second/third/fourth the comment on going AMD if you wanted to game at that price. It makes a lot more sense.

Komplett-Tech: Ryan · 30-11-2009 4:48pm

I think i can feel a nice dose of h1n1 coming on

cherryghost · 30-11-2009 6:50pm

Effluo · 30-11-2009 8:16pm

Yeah the case is a bit scary, with strangely good reviews...

Decent psu, onboard graphics

22" monitor, 250gig hard-drive...

Not the worst build, not exactly sure why you'd bother though... ?

You could save on the psu, take a chance, get a smaller monitor and then a gpu and you could actually play games on it then!

CompuFreak · 30-11-2009 8:58pm

Effluo wrote: »

Yeah the case is a bit scary, with strangely good reviews...

Decent psu, onboard graphics 22" monitor, 250gig hard-drive...

Not the worst build, not exactly sure why you'd bother though... ?

You could save on the psu, take a chance, get a smaller monitor and then a gpu and you could actually play games on it then!

LOL everyone on here is obsessed with gaming. Better value buying a PS3, at least then one doesn't need to upgrade year on year it to play new (more demanding$ games at perfection!

cherryghost · 30-11-2009 9:02pm

CompuFreak wrote: »

LOL everyone on here is obsessed with gaming. Better value buying a PS3, at least then one doesn't need to upgrade year on year it to play new (more demanding$ games at perfection!

Uh-oh.

CompuFreak · 30-11-2009 9:29pm

cherryghost wrote: »

Uh-oh.

Que?

mgadget · 30-11-2009 9:43pm

Had a poke around our 'local' websites to see what was the best that could be done and suprisingly got a match in price to the Scan build with equal or better components. Tempted by an i5/i7 upgrade myself hence the interest.
Again I think 2GB of RAM instead of 4GB is too much of a compromise especially with a single stick, two sticks for dual channel is the best way forward. You could save €50 going for 2GB PC3-1066 and another €16 going with the stock cooler bringing it down to the €515 figure or €498 if the komplett part of the order is collected and the cheap but awful 2GB ram is ordered from dabs.ie and not memoryc.com

Using sites I've dealt with in the past and would use again, personally I'll never use hardwareversand.de, it just ain't worth it.

€581 with 4GB ram. subtract €50 for 2GB ram and €16 if using a stock cooler.

Dabs.ie:

Komplett.ie

4GB G.Skill DDR3 PC3-12800 1600MHz NQ Series (9-9-9-24) Dual Channel kit €103 delivered from www.memoryc.com

Elect to collect the Komplett order from their pickup point in Dublin saves €12.50 and MemoryC are based in Celbridge in Kildare, 20 mins drive from the M50/N4 interchange and pickup is also free. Potential savings of €18 for a total of €563.

BeansBeans · 30-11-2009 9:46pm

CompuFreak wrote: »

Que?

Upgrading year on year is total mythology. You can get a lot more out of pc gaming as well really but thats down to preference.

CompuFreak · 30-11-2009 9:52pm

BeansBeans wrote: »

Upgrading year on year is total mythology. You can get a lot more out of pc gaming as well really but thats down to preference.

I sort of mean the next title in a series of games. What happens when the next crysis( -esque game) comes out? How much of an upgrade will that cost without a performance hit? That's all I'm saying

BeansBeans · 30-11-2009 10:38pm

It may well not need an upgrade. Most people dont actually care about Crysis and its the most extreme example on the PC. What about when Uncharted 3 or 4 comes out on the PS4 or Gran Turismo 6 comes out on PS4 etc.

The same argument can be applied to both examples. A pc you can tone down your graphics and play happily, a console you have to go out and spend €500 if you want a highly anticipated launch title.

So basically no, you dont have to upgrade a pc year on year, whats the life cycle of Crysis? Seeing as you use that most convenient example.

Effluo · 30-11-2009 10:44pm

CompuFreak wrote: »

LOL everyone on here is obsessed with gaming. Better value buying a PS3, at least then one doesn't need to upgrade year on year it to play new (more demanding$ games at perfection!

No comment

lol

CompuFreak · 30-11-2009 11:29pm

BeansBeans wrote: »

It may well not need an upgrade. Most people dont actually care about Crysis and its the most extreme example on the PC. What about when Uncharted 3 or 4 comes out on the PS4 or Gran Turismo 6 comes out on PS4 etc.

The same argument can be applied to both examples. A pc you can tone down your graphics and play happily, a console you have to go out and spend €500 if you want a highly anticipated launch title.

So basically no, you dont have to upgrade a pc year on year, whats the life cycle of Crysis? Seeing as you use that most convenient example.

I specifically said Crysis-esque. Lets not get deep into semantics, this discussion does not belong to this thread. But there is a certain convenience to having games console where a game will play perfectly, as designed, on my machine, on your machine and so on. Added to the convenience of turining on and playing straight away, no installing onto Hard Disk. The life cycle of a Playstaion comes in at 6 years btw. What is it for a highend gfx card? (i.e. when it goes from playing any game flawlessly, to the user having to tone done some detail/resolution etc.)

Anywho, sin é from me on that!

Cheers to all who have contributed to the thread.

BeansBeans · 30-11-2009 11:38pm

CompuFreak wrote: »

I specifically said Crysis-esque. Lets not get deep into semantics, this discussion does not belong to this thread. But there is a certain convenience to having games console where a game will play perfectly, as designed, on my machine, on your machine and so on. Added to the convenience of turining on and playing straight away, no installing onto Hard Disk. The life cycle of a Playstaion comes in at 6 years btw. What is it for a highend gfx card? (i.e. when it goes from playing any game flawlessly, to the user having to tone done some detail/resolution etc.)

Anywho, sin é from me on that!

Cheers to all who have contributed to the thread.

Crysis is pretty much alone in its demands....
You have to install on consoles too.
I talked about the life-cycles above. You make sacrifices on each by sticking out the life cycle of a console. Toning down some details isnt really that big a hit to the eye candy, im sure many can live without AA and bloom.

Anyway sorry for partaking in the derailment

CompuFreak · 04-12-2009 8:24pm

So, how would the i5 compare to a Phenom2 build on the same budget(or less) ?

Sub €500 i5 build.

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