Random People on the street (C+C)

dazftw

Finally got the confidence. Fairly happy with the results. Trying to decide whether to go full body or half from now on..?

All taken with:

Bronica SQ-A
80mm f/2.8 Zenzanon-S
Kodak Portra 160VC

1.

2.

3.

4.

5.

DaireQuinlan

These are really good. The subjects look really awkward though, particularly the guy in the first one. I guess this is sort of the exact opposite of the criticism aimed at your first street set. It might be your awkwardness at approaching people reflected in them or something, so will pass as you get more confident and more able to put them at their ease.

As regards the composition, its a doozie. I understand your opposition to cropping, but I sometimes specifically shoot for a 6x4.5 or an 8x10 aspect ratio crop. In that respect I just view the square as giving me a little leeway after the event. I also don't like shooting for a square and then cropping as an afterthought. If square then I'd probably either go for a head shoulders shot, or place the subject dead centre, or if I had some completely dead space on one side I might put the subject on the opposite third. It sorta depends on what the scene is.
Also, if you start shooting portraits a lot you'll soon run into the IMO bane of thr bronicas, the close focusing distance of the lenses. Start looking for an S-18 :-)

AnimalRights

While I agree with 99% of Daire's assessment, I'd say #1 is my favourite because he look's good posing like the way a proud old man would.
IMO the others all fail because young people doing street photography should never be posed, they should be caught doing whatever they were doing at the time.
Another reason why the others fail IMO is that they're almost all standing on the identical spot! Like they're part of some survey you were conducting.

SinisterDexter

First off I don't like posed photos. Well never something I will do.

But I like 1,3 & 5.

1. As said before it is the way an old proud person stands. Also having him in sharp focus and the rest out of focus works well I think.

3. Mainly for his lip being curled up on the left while the skull/face on his hat is tilted to the right.

5. Looking off into the distance works very well IMO. Then there is his piercings, I think they really suit him so therefore not taking away from the picture. And the hair - suits him aswell and so helps the picture.

I must agree that catching the young people in motion would have been better, did I mention that I don't like posed photos, but the old man is what you would expect from and old man save for catching him smoking.

Good work, keep it up.

AnCatDubh

Bravo Dazftw - You have come a long way in a short space of time and have obviously taken the advice from last time on board.

As an overall statement: I think they are really good.

I love that you've interacted with the street people. I suspect that it gets easier with practice. I think to get yourself onto the street in the first place is a hurdle.

Without a specific statement of intent my comments may be quite ill founded but i'll give them anyhow;

I think as a set they work nicely. A couple of awkward poses in there as has been commented on. This is probably as they've been left too far from you to be entirely engaged and if they are ordinary individuals they are probably thinking "oh my god, here i am standing in the middle of the plaza - who is looking at me and what will they think".

Much of the street scene has nothing to endear itself to the viewer - sometimes this isn't possible but you could try varying your location/angle/scene. Open your eyes to what is happening around you and seek out the things which will form interesting compositions. You can't drag people to those locations but you will find suitable locations where you can interact with people.

I think you need to vary this type of work - get in there close for interesting subjects :: IMO the #1 and #5 has sooooooo much potential for a face shot or a head and shoulders shot. Perhaps an opportunity missed but again without a full statement this comment might be be toss.

You did well. Ask yourself the next question when you head out or form an opinion as to how you are going do better, how you are going to stretch yourself.

Well done.

DaireQuinlan

Actually, having clicked through to the flickr shots, one more thing. I think it'd be good to get at the very least their names. I know the pictures ought to speak for themselves, but knowing the subjects names, maybe something else about them, provides for little more to identify with, and shows a littlr more intent from you as a photographer aswell, evidence that you've interacted with them a little as humans as opposed to just subjects.

Ricky91t

I actually like the photos,And quite surprised you got people to stand(pose?) for a photo!

What did you say to them to get them to do it?

AnimalRights

Getting people to pose is the easy bit Ricky, especially if they think ur a bit of a fruit cake and you've a 'professional looking camera'

Getting the Beggers and down and outs is basically the same but throw in a few cigs or the odd bottle of cheap Lidl lager always seems to work.

gandalf

1, 3 & 5 are my favs. Especially one, that guy is an excellent subject

Wouldn't go for posed shots myself but they work very well.

humberklog

AnimalRights wrote: »

Getting the Beggers and down and outs is basically the same but throw in a few cigs or the odd bottle of cheap Lidl lager always seems to work.

Ooooh jayzuz Daz I think you're doing great work. No. 1 is my fav...I'd stick it on the wall.


Capturing homeless etc. really is lowest common denominator stuff. It's always lacking the pathos the 'tog thinks he's conveying (that's if they really believe that guff themselves, I have my doubts). But a photographer's not conveying anything other than a shallowness and willingness to decieve and thread all over anybody at any costs...he's ripping the p!ss out of them as much as any banker or politician. Pictures of swans top trump pictures of homeless. Steer well clear would be my advice...your capturing great stuff with these.

Fajitas!

I'm rather hungover at the moment, but bear with me.

I think they're great, the awkward poses work really well - The people are awkward, and there's an even more awkward photographer with a Bronica taking their photo.

if they are ordinary individuals they are probably thinking "oh my god, here i am standing in the middle of the plaza - who is looking at me and what will they think".

That's exactly what makes them though. They're almost deadpan images, I mean, the people are awkward, but they're not 'posing' in the 'trying to aesthetically please' sense of the word.

The first one is almost my favorite - I just really wish you'd angled the camera so the cars weren't as present. It's a great shot though. The only one I wouldn't be such a fan of is the last, I think the composition including quite a lot of the subject environment is really needed with shots like this.

Check out The Sartorialist - Actually, I think they have his book in the Book Centre if you're about. His website is http://thesartorialist.blogspot.com/ - While you're not as interested in fashion, I think his trademark style is quite similar to what you're possibly after.

/fin

dazftw

Thanks for the comments guys I appreciate it!

@ Daire
@ AnCatDubh

They look awkward I know but thats the kind of thing I was going for. I wanted them to just stand there and not smile or anything. Just think about something that makes you, you and look into the camera. (this is what I actually said to them)

@ Ricky91t

I just basically stopped them and said I was wondering if I could ask you a quick question.. followed by.. Are you from waterford? Im doing a series of photographs on people I come across on the streets around waterford from young to old and I was wondering do you mind if I take your photograph for it..

Most of them come out with a little joke and said sure why not.

@ humberklog

I have a plan to take a photo of a hobo type guy.. hes not homeless but hes an alcoholic. Pretty much all of Waterford knows him and hes ususally a friendly guy.. so it might work out

Im going into town now and I have some Ilford FP4+ I think ill push it to 200 down as its a bit dim out.. Going to see who I can find and see if b&w makes a difference.

humberklog

Ah yeah Daz it can be done and especially when you're working it, or doing something with it. I'd say you could pull off whatever you throw you're hand at as there's a big dollop of the photographer in you as opposed to someone guffing on about social documentry tosh about their quarry. When it's used as a default mode I'd have a problem...but sure that's only my problem, no need for it to be roundly shared.

Sure I've one or two pics myself...jayzuz I even did flowers this week!?
That camera suits you sir though. Good on you wheeling it out again.

dazftw

@ Al

Yeah Ive got some ideas for framing from him but ill have to figure it out with the bronica being square. Im going to try to look for interesting backgrounds and go full body!

Most if not all of my inspiration comes from this guy.. http://www.flickr.com/photos/27789880@N02/sets/72157622783023958/

Fenster

I love #1

AnimalRights

See this is the problem I'm having with Boards at the moment, because Daz is a long term and respected poster people are pussyfooting around the bare facts.
For someone as experienced as Fajitas to say that photos are great is mind boggling, sure maybe 1 awkward one may have worked...may, but 3??
How is Daz expected to learn with soft C&C like what he has gotten here?
What's interesting about C&C is that the people that don't like something just don't reply so we get the equivalent of an Afganistani 'Democratic' general election. :rolleyes:

To Humberklog, how many pictures have you seen me put up of down and outs?
I did the Polish lads a few weeks back but thats because they were in my flats.
I see the same people thanking each others pics on random photos because they're either friends or have met each other recently in 'RL'

Reminds me of my sister in law whose 1st utterings does be when she meets new people is either "thats a lovely top" or "you're looking well" pure bull **** tbh.

AnimalRights

AnimalRights wrote: »

See this is the problem I'm having with Boards at the moment, because Daz is a long term and respected poster people are pussyfooting around the bare facts.
For someone as experienced as Fajitas to say that photos are great is mind boggling, sure maybe 1 awkward one may have worked...may, but 3??
How is Daz expected to learn with soft C&C like what he has gotten here?
What's interesting about C&C is that the people that don't like something just don't reply so we get the equivalent of an Afganistani 'Democratic' general election. :rolleyes:

To Humberklog, how many pictures have you seen me put up of down and outs?
I did the Polish lads a few weeks back but thats because they were in my flats.
I see the same people thanking each others pics on random photos because they're either friends or have met each other recently in 'RL'

Reminds me of my sister in law whose 1st utterings does be when she meets new people is either "thats a lovely top" or "you're looking well" pure bull **** tbh.

I disagree - I think Al's post was one of the better ones given that he provided a very good example of that style of photography and went into a bit of the theory behind it.

Personally, I don't like the images, but what can I say, apart from that? And unless Daz wants to focus in on me as a target audience, the reasons for not liking them are pretty immaterial.

KarmaGarda

There's one thing I love about ya AR, it's your brutal honesty .

To comment on the photos directly, I'm not going to pick out individual photos. I think they should be viewed as a set. They're not bad at all. I like the fact that they look like complete strangers who were asked to pose (this is conveyed in their awkwardness). I'm going to go with AnCatDubhs view point on "what do you do next to improve". Because, even though I'm impressed with what you've achieved, they don't fully work for me. But I think you're on to something here. How do you make these work? I'm not sure. I think when interacting with the public, as opposed to just asking someone to stop so you can take their photo, you need to get them to do something. Maybe if you catch them doing something interesting, etc, ask them to do it again, pose while you photo that "interesting thing" you saw them doing. Or if you see someone standing at or beside something interesting... if you see what I'm getting at.

As they stand they're just a set of photos of people. They're missing that *something* I can't put my finger on. Bravo for your bravery though.

humberklog

Eh....to AR.
Although I quoted your post my remarks were only going in another direction to that post and was in no way a comment on your good self or your work nor any photographer either on Boards or anywhere else for that matter. I was just giving that genre an air of my own thoughts, whimsy, if you will.
To answer your question I can't recall any pics of homeless people by yourself. I didn't think the one of the Polish lads was one as they didn't look destitute or indeed homeless. Just some dudes drinking outdoors. Something I enjoy myself, I was only having a glass of wine yesterday on the street in town (a smart Chianti too). Also to add, if you check that post (of the Polish lads) you'll find that I thanked it. I did so because I like the pictures (although I would generally agree with you that one pic is plenty, two if cohesive can work but three does water down the effect if shown all at once or in quick succession).
Like your input to Daz and your own post of the Polish chaps; it's good to contradict one's self. I do it too as I've posted a pic or two of homeless people.
I do stand by what I said and in particular about Daz's pics and in particular No.1. I've nothing either good or bad to say about the others, maybe they aren't floating my boat. But I would hang No.1 on my wall...for a week or so. I don't know Daz nor have any affiliation or loyalty to him but I do enjoy keeping up with his progression in film. Also on a personal note...I just like looking at medium format film pics...they do float my boat (with just a tinge of jealousy).


But really AR there was no personal dig thrown at yourself and if my post was easily taken up that it was then I apologise for not wording it better and more correctly. It was a dig at the genre on a whole, something I could go on about at length.

dazftw

Cmon guys wheres the love :rolleyes:

I was out today and got a photo of a man named Padraig Ill have them up monday night id say! Develop them in college! Same style as the 1st shot I put up!

EDIT: Another photo from the 1st lot.. Its a bit blurry but I said id upload it anyway..

Morrisseeee

I'm liking no.'s 1 & 2. 1 because of the pose, & 2 because its centered and looks like a nice composition, ie. with the background blur, light & activity, the others are off-centre and don't appeal.
I think people should take into account the camera & processing you are using here, its not point-n-shoot ! or digital click-click-click !

AnimalRights

Humber it was not a personal dig at you I was just stating something.
Fair enough to your interest in Daz's progress on film though.
As for the latest Dazgate pic...
#6 I'd crop that distraction out to the left and bring the crop in to the right so its just about including the bystander.
Problems with the main subject...er I mean Padraig is that his face is 'lost' in the background and his eyes are closed, he's shyer then you!

DaireQuinlan

Morrisseeee wrote: »

I think people should take into account the camera & processing you are using here, its not point-n-shoot ! or digital click-click-click !

Why should that have anything to do with the image ? It's particularly irrelevent in terms of composition and subject matter dealing with static subjects as dazftw is here. We're considering the images on their merits, not as an adjunct to some camera system or other.

dazftw

AnimalRights wrote: »

Humber it was not a personal dig at you I was just stating something.
Fair enough to your interest in Daz's progress on film though.
As for the latest Dazgate pic...
#6 I'd crop that distraction out to the left and bring the crop in to the right so its just about including the bystander.
Problems with the main subject...er I mean Padraig is that his face is 'lost' in the background and his eyes are closed, he's shyer then you!

That not padraig. Padraigs in black and white :eek: lol

Morrisseeee

Why should that have anything to do with the image ? It's particularly irrelevent in terms of composition and subject matter dealing with static subjects as dazftw is here. We're considering the images on their merits, not as an adjunct to some camera system or other.

mmm.....somehow I had this feeling you would have a go at me !!!!!! I must be psychic :eek: For the record I do think it matters, he even mentions it himself 'in commentary', anyways I was just giving people a 'heads-up' with regard to the set-up as some people might have missed it or overlooked it in the OP. So.........back on topic.......:rolleyes:

DaireQuinlan

Morrisseeee wrote: »

mmm.....somehow I had this feeling you would have a go at me !!!!!! I must be psychic :eek: For the record I do think it matters, he even mentions it himself 'in commentary', anyways I was just giving people a 'heads-up' with regard to the set-up as some people might have missed it or overlooked it in the OP. So.........back on topic.......:rolleyes:

Ah now, no need to be so sensitive. I wasn't having a 'go' at you, merely pointing out that its the quality of the images we're concerned with here, not what camera was used to shoot them. For the record, I have exactly the same system as dazftw, and I sure as hell wouldn't have the guts to go street shooting with it. It makes me respect dazftw the photographer all the more, it doesn't however effect how I'm going to critique the images (except in the crudest practical terms)

AnimalRights

Is there an image of this Camera?

Morrisseeee

, merely pointing out that its the quality of the images we're concerned with here, . For the record, I have exactly the same system as dazftw, and I sure as hell wouldn't have the guts to go street shooting with it. It makes me respect dazftw the photographer all the more,

^^ My point is proven then.................:p
.....and no, i'm far from being 'sensitive' !

magicbastarder

number 1 is superb.
i much prefer it to your average candid shot, partly because it's so different (and most street candids leave me kind of cold anyway).
the subject is engaging with the camera and the image is more arresting as a result.

i don't think the cars take away from it; they add context.
and regarding the importance of the equipment, at the very least, the square format (unavailable on digital, as far as i know) obviously has an impact on the shots.

number 6 is the weakest of the shots in the first post; it looks like an ordinary fashion style shot.

magicbastarder

what were they scanned on?

Anouilh

I would love if you took time to upload these wonderful character studies to the "Combing the Streets" thread:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055564779

In that way they will become part of the street narrative on Boards and not get lost, should this thread stop.

You must enjoy being with people, they responded so well.

Fajitas!

AnimalRights wrote: »

See this is the problem I'm having with Boards at the moment, because Daz is a long term and respected poster people are pussyfooting around the bare facts.

Not at all tbh, in fairness if I didn't like something, I'd have no qualms in saying it. Similarly, if I do like something, I'm enthusiastic about saying it.

For someone as experienced as Fajitas to say that photos are great is mind boggling, sure maybe 1 awkward one may have worked...may, but 3??
How is Daz expected to learn with soft C&C like what he has gotten here?
What's interesting about C&C is that the people that don't like something just don't reply so we get the equivalent of an Afganistani 'Democratic' general election. :rolleyes:

It's not really mind boggling, it's an alternative aesthetic to what you're familiar with, but one I'm familiar with, and do enjoy, because it's incorporating the photographer, the model and the environment. I've also said what doesn't work in the image, which is fair.

I see the same people thanking each others pics on random photos because they're either friends or have met each other recently in 'RL'

Reminds me of my sister in law whose 1st utterings does be when she meets new people is either "thats a lovely top" or "you're looking well" pure bull **** tbh.

I see where you're coming from, but if I don't like something, I don't like it. But that's not the only reason I'll thank it. Other reasons I'll thank something is if I find it amusing, or even find it to provide insight or inspiration... or even debate.

/waits 3 months for AR's reply :pac:

Trev M

Just offering my opinions as a casual observer...Im not big on technicalities, a good shot is a good shot for me essentially.

I think no.1 is the most interesting, its the only one of them all that makes me feel anything or think beyond the image. Primarily because of the gent himself and the body language. He is well turned out as they'd say kinda has a certain dignity about him which in my opinion makes him a great find to photgraph. He looks comfortable and confident despite his almost neutral facial expression.

No.2 really doesnt look like he wants to be shot at all.

No.3 - I like the expression on the face , but again the awkwardness kinda doesnt sit well with me

No.4 - Looks like he robbed his Dads trousers again not very comfortable or particularly interesting to shoot

No.5 - Like the photo, doesnt look awkward to me , prefer if the subject was framed evenly though. I like the contrast, its a nice fresh vibrant image for me.

Trev M

I also picked up a nugget here from Animal Rights on his observation about young people in street photopgraphy , spot on !

Crispin

#1 is brilliant. I think the straight back, proud look makes the uncomfortable pose really work for this, as many people have said.

the rest don't work imo. they look like teenagers being told to stand for a photo by their parents. bored and uncomfortable. I think the comments about catching the teenagers doing more natural things is good advice.

Fajitas!

Go down to Waterford and stand in John Roberts Square at lunchtime - What they're doing in the pics is what they naturally do

They are all bored. And uncomfortable - Which makes the photos really interesting, as opposed to setting them up doing something incredibly exciting for one day, which they'll never do again. It's a banal photograph; it's banality is what makes it interesting.

Tallon

Excellent excellent photos... I really love them..
Nice work

ColmDawson

AnimalRights wrote: »

I'd say #1 is my favourite because he look's good posing like the way a proud old man would.

This, this, this. Good work.

dazftw

Anouilh wrote: »

I would love if you took time to upload these wonderful character studies to the "Combing the Streets" thread

I meant to the other day but forgot Will do now though.

This is the camera for people wondering(not my photo):

http://www.flickr.com/photos/theclash976/4055335765/


I developed the other roll in college the other day and it came out terrible so thats gone. I think the chemicals were too cold or something the negatives are awful thin If I see him again ill ask him for another one!