Dodgy horse sellers

chickenlegs

Hi
Just wondering if I can do anything about this situation I encountered yesterday, currently trying to buy new horse have been going and seeing a few and besides maybe making them seem a bit better schooled then they actually are have had no real issue till yesterday. Went to see horse yesterday was a little concerned when the girl told me she would have someone else riding him because she didn't jump, i asked on e mail did this horse have any vices and when I look now she said he was a gentleman but actually cleverly never said specifically no vices. I asked her no rear no buck no bolt specifically again when I got to the yard and she said no, She had the guy ride him for a few mins just through paces then I got up I managed one walk around arena then one trot half way around and he shied violently left then right and then bucked me off. I am quite sore and bruised but otherwise fine I think, I have a job which requires a lot of upper body movement and am therefore hoping there will be no longterm neck trouble because my neck is quite stiff today, the girl just said "thats a first" after they had to admit he bucked because my friend was watching just wondering can i report them somewhere because I was lucky but the next person may not be so

sisco

chickenlegs wrote: »

Hi
Just wondering if I can do anything about this situation I encountered yesterday, currently trying to buy new horse have been going and seeing a few and besides maybe making them seem a bit better schooled then they actually are have had no real issue till yesterday. Went to see horse yesterday was a little concerned when the girl told me she would have someone else riding him because she didn't jump, i asked on e mail did this horse have any vices and when I look now she said he was a gentleman but actually cleverly never said specifically no vices. I asked her no rear no buck no bolt specifically again when I got to the yard and she said no, She had the guy ride him for a few mins just through paces then I got up I managed one walk around arena then one trot half way around and he shied violently left then right and then bucked me off. I am quite sore and bruised but otherwise fine I think, I have a job which requires a lot of upper body movement and am therefore hoping there will be no longterm neck trouble because my neck is quite stiff today, the girl just said "thats a first" after they had to admit he bucked because my friend was watching just wondering can i report them somewhere because I was lucky but the next person may not be so

Hello...
Well to be honest i bought my horse 3 years ago in a dodgy place for only 1700 he was in bits so he was we just bought him cause felt sorry for him... Now 3 years on everythings changed he turned into n amazing horse can jump 1.50 have hunted him and gone clear in most hunter trails... hes a little bay love horse.... So I would always say chance it to be honest if your willling to put the work in thing will turn out fine....

shanagarry

What exactly are you going to report them for? It's unfortunate that you had a fall, and I hope you're feeling better soon, but horses buck from time to time, that's just the way it is. Remember, they were trying to sell the horse, it's not in their best interests to have him buck a potential buyer off. If they were unscrupulous they'd have had him worn out before you got there and you would have potentially only found out when you got him home.

Also, be careful that you ask about bucking specifically (or probably best to ask if it's a novice ride, as that sounds like what you are looking for?) as if you just ask about vices they will think you mean stable vices like cribbing or weaving.

Are you an experienced rider? If not, it might be worth bringing someone experienced with you and they can ride first and then you just get up if they think the horse is suitable?

convert

Buying horses can be quite tricky as one can/will always come across sellers/dealers who can be unscrupulous. However, as you've said yourself, it is a minority who are 'dodgey', hence unfortunately tarnishing the others, too.

It's very difficult to know if you can make a complaint as from your post it doesn't seem that they did anything really bad. The horse bucked and you fell off. It happens from time to time. All horses can/will buck at some point, and it's something that we as riders have to learn to deal with. It's very unfortunate that you had such an experience, but maybe you could try asking for a horse that is very quiet and does not buck (i.e. novice ride). It might cut out some of the horses like the one above.

The best thing you can do is use the situation as a lesson and if you get an inkling feeling that something's not right, then go with your gut instinct. It's rarely wrong.

If you have somebody who's experienced, especially regarding the buying and selling of horses, then it's a good idea to bring them with you when you go to look at a horse, as they might spot something much quicker than you as they are a 'bystander' rather than actually being involved in the sale. Definitely invaluable.

Re vices: when one refers to vices, the most common ones would be stables vices, including crib biting, windsucking, box walking and weaving, all of which are declarable vices (i.e. must be mentioned at time of sale). Bucking, spooking, refusing, etc. don't have to be declared at time of sale, but most sellers will mention it.

Here's a useful list with descriptions and management tips for vices.

Regarding your fall: most people will feel sore and stiff for a few days after a fall; it's natural after any type of impact, especially if you don't have a lot of 'riding' muscle, specifically around the neck and shoulder area, to take the impact. What you feel is your body's reaction to the fall and you shouldn't have any long term problems. However, if you're in any doubt, go see a doctor ASAP

Slightly off topic, but... There was a programme on RTE a year or two ago about a jockey who was having problems making the weight and needed help/advice changing his diet. The presenter, who was a doctor (I think - same guy who does 'How long will you Live') changed much more than his diet, and worked on building up lean muscle to help his body deal with the impact of falls. It really does work, especially if you fall 'properly' - i.e. landing on the back of the shoulder rather than on your side, head first, flat on your back, etc.

chickenlegs

convert wrote: »

Buying horses can be quite tricky as one can/will always come across sellers/dealers who can be unscrupulous. However, as you've said yourself, it is a minority who are 'dodgey', hence unfortunately tarnishing the others, too.

It's very difficult to know if you can make a complaint to a body, as I'm not sure if there is a regulatory body. If the place where you went was an established riding centre affiliated to the AIRE, then you could contact them, but I'm not sure it would be of any benefit.

The best thing you can do is use the situation as a lesson and if you get an inkling feeling that something's not right, then go with your gut instinct. It's rarely wrong.

If you have somebody who's experienced, especially regarding the buying and selling of horses, then it's a good idea to bring them with you when you go to look at a horse, as they might spot something much quicker than you as they are a 'bystander' rather than actually being involved in the sale. Definitely invaluable.

Re vices: when one refers to vices, the most common ones would be stables vices, including crib biting, windsucking, box walking and weaving, all of which are declarable vices (i.e. must be mentioned at time of sale). Bucking, spooking, refusing, etc. don't have to be declared at time of sale, but most sellers will mention it.

Here's a useful list with descriptions and management tips for vices.

Regarding your fall: most people will feel sore and stiff for a few days after a fall; it's natural after any type of impact, especially if you don't have a lot of 'riding' muscle, specifically around the neck and shoulder area, to take the impact. What you feel is your body's reaction to the fall and you shouldn't have any long term problems. However, if you're in any doubt, go see a doctor ASAP

Slightly off topic, but... There was a programme on RTE a year or two ago about a jockey who was having problems making the weight and needed help/advice changing his diet. The presenter, who was a doctor (I think - same guy who does 'How long will you Live') changed much more than his diet, and worked on building up lean muscle to help his body deal with the impact of falls. It really does work, especially if you fall 'properly' - i.e. landing on the back of the shoulder rather than on your side, head first, flat on your back, etc.

Hi
Thank god I went side of behind first then finally head but neck is just a bit sore in a kinda whiplash sort of way. unfortunate not to be able to do something though.
buyer beware I suppose.
Thanx for yours help

Yep, with horse sales it really is a case of caveat emptor.

If you know of anyone who is very knowledgeable in the subject, it might be an idea to bring them along. The seller is less likely to 'get creative' if they think the buyer (or their agent) knows more then they do.

Censorsh!t

That's quite unfortunate...and you really do have to watch out.

A friend of mine ended up buying a drugged pony before! However, he did tun out to be pretty well behaved after a while.

It's probably best to go through people you know...or friends of friends. I waas lucky that I bought my pony through a girl who kept her at the riding school I was learning at.

Esroh

Have to agree with others who say there's not a thing you can do. Falls come with riding horses.
I have had something similar happen when getting up on a friends horse just so they could see someone else ride it. Trotted 3 times around the arena and the horse exploded. He was 5 and had done a winter league and hunted but had never been ridden by anyone else. As was said above if horse or people were real dodges they would have made sure he was well worked b4 you got there.

chickenlegs

Hi
We were wondering about how they hadn't lunged the hell out of him ourselves first too on way back but to be honest I thought it was because horse was slightly lazy when I rode him so possibly they didn't want him entirely dead?? We went to another yard after and mentioned where we had been and they were not too shocked by what had happened the reaction was good rider but wouldn't buy horse off him! so I don't think I am over reacting as I think some earlier posts are implying I just think I was lucky and thought myself naively maybe that something could be done about it. By the way I am experienced have been riding all my life fourth horse of my own and many other people's over the years and I had an instructor with me with over 30 years experience in the business.

chickenlegs

By the way I have found most people selling to be really lovely the 2nd yard I went to that day really restored my faith they were terribly nice so I'm not bashing people selling horses at all have sold a few myself but I would just like a little more honesty

Theponylady

Since dealers aren't licensed, there is no one to report them to. Best thing you can do is let your friends know what happened. Word gets around, and people start staying away from people who pull crap like that. If you'd actually been hurt, you could sue them, but you'd have to prove that the horse had been known to do what it did before. tough to do without pictures or video, or a doctor's report from someone else who got dumped and got hurt, it ends up being he said she said.

Best bet is stick to reputable dealers, or bring along a friend who is a really good rider to ride the horse first. And if you are unsure about the horse, just walk away and don't try it out at all. There are plenty of other horses out there.