Discussion on The Boards.ie Top 100 Must Have Metal Albums

D.Q

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

So how 'bout that Mozart guy?

****in brother Mozart man.

If you had one choice.. JUST one. The definitive Metal album. What would it be?

Angron

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

So how 'bout that Mozart guy?

Give me Beethoven :P

ride-the-spiral

DieselQueen wrote: »

****in brother Mozart man.

If you had one choice.. JUST one. The definitive Metal album. What would it be?

As in defines metal as a whole or defines your own taste in metal?

Max Power1

Denny M wrote: »

oh god no, I hate Dimebag :P

DieselQueen wrote: »

+ 1000000000

all this "brother Dime" bull**** does my head in.

Mark Morton and Willie Adler write FAR better riffs and LOG write much better songs as a whole... Theres no Brother Mark, or Brother Willie :P

ride-the-spiral wrote: »

Dime had a good few good riffs and a few good solos, overall he was nothing special in my opinion. There's way too much fanboyism around Pantera in general, I find them to be very inconsistent.

Chuck Shuldiner is the best dead musician

Oh sweet merciful CRAP.. this IS the rock and metal forum isnt it?? Feels like i've stepped into some sort of paralel forum where the greatness of pantera/dimebag is not acknowledged!!!

ride-the-spiral

Max Power1 wrote: »

Oh sweet merciful CRAP.. this IS the rock and metal forum isnt it?? Feels like i've stepped into some sort of paralel forum where the greatness of pantera/dimebag is not acknowledged!!!

The world is against you isn't it?

Angron

Max Power1 wrote: »

Oh sweet merciful CRAP.. this IS the rock and metal forum isnt it?? Feels like i've stepped into some sort of paralel forum where the greatness of pantera/dimebag is not acknowledged!!!

I'm not saying they are total crap, but they aren't as good as most people make them out to be imo.

Dark Artist

I'm also disappointed Nightwish didn't make it. Once definitely deserved to be in there somewhere.

Glad to see Black Clouds & Silver Linings, whopper record!

Otis Driftwood

Just a few things in respect of the feedback over the last few pages.

1.The rules were pretty simple.
Someone pointed out that they had 2 or 3 picks over 5 or 6 spaces and that 2 of the picks were removed which they feel shouldnt have happened.They said that no-one would have more than 10 picks so 2 or 3 together should have been grand.If that was the case then 10 posters could have picked 10 albums of their choice which wouldnt be at all reflective of the forum,just 10 peoples personal favourites.

2.Albums per band.
In hindsight I should have put a one or two album per band limit into the rules as we inevitibly have 4 Metallica,only one of which I personally feel is a must have.

3.Time taken to fill the list.
I genuinely didnt think the list would fill as quickly as it did.The reason for the 1 pick per 10 rule was to allow as many posters as possible to contribute to the list,it just happened to get filled a helluva lot faster than anticipated.

4.That is/isnt metal.
Albums like Nirvanas Nevermind are as important to metal as anything Sabbath,Metallica or Slayer ever produced.Heavy metal is constantly morphing and transitioning.Nevermind heralded the end of hair and glam metal crap like Def Leppard,Twisted Sister or Poison,Korn heralded the death of "grunge",the rise to prominence of bands like Chimaira,Lamb of God and Mastodon has brought about the death of nu-metal.Metal IMO is currently in a state of flux with "death core" coming to the fore - Black Dahlia Murder,Job For A Cowboy,Despised Icon or any other number of extreme and heavier bands currently doing the rounds.To say Nirvana,and in particular Nevermind shouldnt be on the list is either naive or ignorant,maybe a bit of both.

Cathy666

No Manowar! I'm shocked and appauled. Ensiferum and Finntroll aren't there either. I really have to start using this forum more often.

Angron

nedtheshed wrote: »

Metal IMO is currently in a state of flux with "death core" coming to the fore - Black Dahlia Murder,Job For A Cowboy,Despised Icon or any other number of extreme and heavier bands currently doing the rounds.

I wonder did any of the previous... changings, shall we say, were met with as much hostility as the arrival of deathcore.

ride-the-spiral

nedtheshed wrote: »

Metal IMO is currently in a state of flux with "death core" coming to the fore - Black Dahlia Murder,Job For A Cowboy,Despised Icon or any other number of extreme and heavier bands currently doing the rounds.

Deathcore is a horribly underrated genre. Once you get past Bring me The Horizon and Suicide Silence there are loads of great bands like After the Burial, Born of Osiris, All Shall Perish or The Contortionist. Love it :

Otis Driftwood

Denny M wrote: »

I wonder did any of the previous... changings, shall we say, were met with as much hostility as the arrival of deathcore.

I really dont know why people find it neccessary to moan about death core.I reckon the bitchers just want to sound cool.Meh.


@ ride-the-spiral,check out Chelsea Grin,their only release is a blistering,self titled 6 track EP.They are kinda like Job For A Cowboy crossed with Prostitute Disfigurement.Very impressive.I dunno what kind of release the EP got so you may be forced to get it from your cousin.Worth tracking down though.

waltersobchak

nedtheshed wrote: »

Just a few things in respect of the feedback over the last few pages.

1.The rules were pretty simple.
Someone pointed out that they had 2 or 3 picks over 5 or 6 spaces and that 2 of the picks were removed which they feel shouldnt have happened.They said that no-one would have more than 10 picks so 2 or 3 together should have been grand.If that was the case then 10 posters could have picked 10 albums of their choice which wouldnt be at all reflective of the forum,just 10 peoples personal favourites.

2.Albums per band.
In hindsight I should have put a one or two album per band limit into the rules as we inevitibly have 4 Metallica,only one of which I personally feel is a must have.

3.Time taken to fill the list.
I genuinely didnt think the list would fill as quickly as it did.The reason for the 1 pick per 10 rule was to allow as many posters as possible to contribute to the list,it just happened to get filled a helluva lot faster than anticipated.

4.That is/isnt metal.
Albums like Nirvanas Nevermind are as important to metal as anything Sabbath,Metallica or Slayer ever produced.Heavy metal is constantly morphing and transitioning.Nevermind heralded the end of hair and glam metal crap like Def Leppard,Twisted Sister or Poison,Korn heralded the death of "grunge",the rise to prominence of bands like Chimaira,Lamb of God and Mastodon has brought about the death of nu-metal.Metal IMO is currently in a state of flux with "death core" coming to the fore - Black Dahlia Murder,Job For A Cowboy,Despised Icon or any other number of extreme and heavier bands currently doing the rounds.To say Nirvana,and in particular Nevermind shouldnt be on the list is either naive or ignorant,maybe a bit of both.

to be honest i think everyone, in hindsight just saw a list of 100 albums and basically went nuts all over it.. althought i do think its an awesome list the original list was a more balanced and varied one.. maybe again in hindsight "the rules" shouldnt have been so enforced or else slightly different.. as you say yourself 2 albums per band and 4 posts per person would have been better imo.. maybe in a few weeks try a similar concept again 100 must have ROCK albums or something..

Personally i think its naive to consider Nirvana worthy of inclusion on a list of metal.. simply put Nirvana ruined guitar playing and encouraged mediocrity in musicians that took almost 10 years for music to recover from.. look at the Ozzfest.. it was created because Loolapooloza considered Ozzy, and metal dinosaurs of the past..in my opinion its exactly like including Never Mind The Bollox by The Sex Pistols it heralded the end of progressive and hard rock music that has only recovered in the last few years because of Opeth, Dream Theater, Porcupine Tree, Pain Of Salvation etc,.. i know a lot of people made a big deal about labelling music genres, and usually i dont care, but seriously Nirvana arent a metal band and to consider them as important to metal as Black sabbath is probably the most stupid thing iv ever heard..

Catari Jaguar

nedtheshed wrote: »

JTo say Nirvana,and in particular Nevermind shouldnt be on the list is either naive or ignorant,maybe a bit of both.

IT'S NOT METAL

o1s1n

Lil Kitten wrote: »

IT'S NOT METAL

Too true.

People can go on and on with deep analysis of how x band caused the death of y, influenced y, are important to y, morphed from y. It still doesn't make it the same genre of music as y.

Bill Ward from Black Sabbath was heavily influenced by jazz. Does this then make Jazz musicians Metal? No, it makes certain elements of Jazz an influence/important to its development.

Nirvana are a grunge band. They shouldn't be on a Metal list. They might be important to some elements of certain bands development, but they're not heavy metal. Therefore how people can include them on a list of heavy metal bands I don't know.

If it was a list of 'Bands that influenced heavy metal' it would have been a different matter.

shofukan

...Slayer -_-
CRAP!

Otis Driftwood

So Nirvana shouldnt be on the list then.

Ok,what about Alice Cooper or Def Leppard,they are on the list,not exactly metal either,are they?

Someone also commented on a lack of Thin Lizzy,very much a rock band,no?

The fact remains,like it or not,that Nirvana released albums with tracks heavier/louder/angrier than anything some of the "metal" bands on the list released,but they arent metal.

In the purest sense of the word ie Slayer,pre AJFA Metallica or Opeth,no,they arent metal,but if you intend picking holes in their inclusion,would you be so kind as to do the same with some of the other so called metal bands on the list.

waltersobchak

nedtheshed wrote: »

So Nirvana shouldnt be on the list then.

Ok,what about Alice Cooper or Def Leppard,they are on the list,not exactly metal either,are they?

Someone also commented on a lack of Thin Lizzy,very much a rock band,no?

The fact remains,like it or not,that Nirvana released albums with tracks heavier/louder/angrier than anything some of the "metal" bands on the list released,but they arent metal.

In the purest sense of the word ie Slayer,pre AJFA Metallica or Opeth,no,they arent metal,but if you intend picking holes in their inclusion,would you be so kind as to do the same with some of the other so called metal bands on the list.

Alice Cooper is basically the godfather of the theatrical style of metal, without him there would be no Kiss, no Slipknot, no Manson no White Zombie

Def Leppard were considered a part of the NWOBHM along with Saxon,Maiden,Diamond head, Motorhead etc etc etc so yeah they're a metal band

So just because Nirvana are heavy they're automatically Metal?? Thats such a simplistic analysis, what about The Pixies? they're as loud and angry as Nirvana, or My Bloody Valentine they're the loudest band ever, are they Metal??

Catari Jaguar

nedtheshed wrote: »

So Nirvana shouldnt be on the list then.

Ok,what about Alice Cooper or Def Leppard,they are on the list,not exactly metal either,are they?

Someone also commented on a lack of Thin Lizzy,very much a rock band,no?

The fact remains,like it or not,that Nirvana released albums with tracks heavier/louder/angrier than anything some of the "metal" bands on the list released,but they arent metal.

In the purest sense of the word ie Slayer,pre AJFA Metallica or Opeth,no,they arent metal,but if you intend picking holes in their inclusion,would you be so kind as to do the same with some of the other so called metal bands on the list.

Well if you're saying Nirvana should be included because they popularised grunge and basically killed hair metal.. then Alice Cooper should be included for pioneering the metal live show and influencing metal, shock rock and glam rock/metal.

A line has to be drawn somewhere. If you're letting on a few bands for having "angry" or heavy tracks then the list would be full of non metal bands (even more so than it is now)

Nirvana's prime focus was of the grunge variety. Nevermind is a grungey pop album. Bleach, ok, was slighty heavy/trashy. Kurt wasn't heavily influenced by metal bands. He idolised Pixies, Iggy Pop and the punk rock sound.

I already disagreed with a bunch of the bands on here.

Otis Driftwood

waltersobchak wrote: »

Alice Cooper is basically the godfather of the theatrical style of metal, without him there would be no Kiss, no Slipknot, no Manson no White Zombie

Def Leppard were considered a part of the NWOBHM along with Saxon,Maiden,Diamond head, Motorhead etc etc etc so yeah they're a metal band

So just because Nirvana are heavy they're automatically Metal?? Thats such a simplistic analysis, what about The Pixies? they're as loud and angry as Nirvana, or My Bloody Valentine they're the loudest band ever, are they Metal??

Im being simplistic?

Re-read your post mate.

When Nirvana got big they were classed as grunge metal by every section of the media that reported on them.As Ive said,Nirvana dont sound like Slayer or old Metallica,but they are a variation on the heavy metal sound.
Same as the Sex Pistols are a punk metal band,MBV are also a variation on the heavy metal template.

The above and countless other bands dont sound anything Sabbath or Led Zeppelin or Metallica or Slayer but they still come under the metal umbrella.
Bands like Converge or Aborym 666 are as far removed as anything sound wise from Sabbath or Metallica but they are considered metal so where do you draw the line?Or is it just a line in your head?

You simply cannot discount one band and include others just because you think they shouldnt be there or dont like them.

Angron

I'm not going to go into a big rant like others, I'm just gonna say what my opinion is. Nirvana may have influenced the progression of metal by signaling the end of glam and hair metal, as was said earlier, but that doesn't make them metal, even if the media says so (The mainstream media is really hopeless at tags >_<). It also, as was said, doesn't discount their importance to metal. But if this list is based soley on metal albums, then Nirvana shouldn't be there (though again, that's my opinion, I just don't think grunge is metal, at all). However, if it's on albums that were important to metal as a whole, then there would be a good cause to put Nirvana on it.

--Kaiser--

Nonsense....if you are going to include Nirvana you might as well include every other band that use a distortion pedal.

EDIT.....Pearl Jam.....>WTF? /EDIT

My reason for putting forward Slipknot is IMO that they advanced the game of mainstream metal when it was stagnating dangerously, the people who denigrate Slipknot are usually the same people who are happy to have Slayer release the SAME album over and over again. Their first album had a raw, visceral, unfettered energy that is rare to hear on any album, clever use of stop/start dynamics in songs and creative song strcuture, they were far away from any other 'Nu-metal' (usually the genre they are lumped in with) band at the time. Whilst Iowa was trash, The Subliminal Verses is a masterclass in metal, the best released in the last decade along with Crack the Skye and The Blackening.

GLaDOS

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

My reason for putting forward Slipknot is IMO that they advanced the game of mainstream metal when it was stagnating dangerously, the people who denigrate Slipknot are usually the same people who are happy to have Slayer release the SAME album over and over again. Their first album had a raw, visceral, unfettered energy that is rare to hear on any album, clever use of stop/start dynamics in songs and creative song strcuture, they were far away from any other 'Nu-metal' (usually the genre they are lumped in with) band at the time. Whilst Iowa was trash, The Subliminal Verses is a masterclass in metal, the best released in the last decade along with Crack the Skye and The Blackening.

Meh, if you want originality prog is the way to go, nothing particularly ground breaking about anything I've heard from Slipknot

yupyup7up

Reign in blood is my favourite album of all time an Slayer are my favourite band. But I think that,

Slayer - Reign in Blood, Seasons in the Abyss
Slipknot - Slipknot,
Cradle of Filth - Cruelty and the Beast,
Metallica - Master of Puppets, and Justice for all
Iron Maiden - Seventh son of a Seventh son

all have to be in here.

Pantera are a very overrated band, good but not great.


Good to see Death being well represented.

Even though they've rubbish for years I cant beleive no Korn made it?

waltersobchak

nedtheshed wrote: »

Im being simplistic?

Re-read your post mate.

When Nirvana got big they were classed as grunge metal by every section of the media that reported on them.As Ive said,Nirvana dont sound like Slayer or old Metallica,but they are a variation on the heavy metal sound.
Same as the Sex Pistols are a punk metal band,MBV are also a variation on the heavy metal template.

The above and countless other bands dont sound anything Sabbath or Led Zeppelin or Metallica or Slayer but they still come under the metal umbrella.
Bands like Converge or Aborym 666 are as far removed as anything sound wise from Sabbath or Metallica but they are considered metal so where do you draw the line?Or is it just a line in your head?

You simply cannot discount one band and include others just because you think they shouldnt be there or dont like them.

Re-read your own posts mate,since your the one who considers anything thats heavy/loud/angry to be metal
Look its this simple Nirvana aren't metal they're grunge
Sex Pistols aren't metal they're punk
Mbv aren't metal they're alternative rock/shoegazing
and even calling them metal is laughable..

At the end of the day you can argue all day that Nirvana are this and that.. But there a glorified punk band simple as, like a said before i usually dont give too Fs bout who is this genre or that genre, because metal has so many differant offshoots and styles.. But i take serious offence to someone labelling Nirvana metal because they single-handedly nearly killed metal..

cournioni

yupyup7up wrote: »

Pantera are a very overrated band, good but not great.

Are you serious? They were the first metal band to have a number one single on the US billboard chart, and are also one of few metal bands to have a number one album on the US billboard. None of which was music aimed towards the mainstream, it was metal the way it should be played.

They in effect, kept metal alive during the barron 90's.

Otis Driftwood

I do get the points that people are making but if Nirvana dont fit into this list,then surely the albums from Steve Vai and Thin Lizzy (and a couple of others) dont fit either.

They are very much in the rock spectrum and are obviously not "metal" yet they arent mentioned.Is it because TL are cool and you just cant disrespect them?

IMO a big part of it is something that always happens in the world of rock/metal and that is elitism.The "this band isnt metal \m/ but that band is" argument.

The same craic is happening with all the death core haters that spam various fora across the net bitching about the music because it makes them cool to take the piss out of popular types of music.

The same goes for the current emo trend,personally I think the music is facking horrendous,but in alot of instances,and this is true of many bands down the years,what is popular at the time gets new fans into metal and as they get older they get into heavier bands/genres.

My first exposure to rock/metal was a Deep Purple cassette my Dad had about 22 years ago.As I got older my tastes developed,from DP,to Maiden/Judas Priest to Metallica,to Slayer,to Cannibal Corpse and so on.Now I listen to anything from Iggy and the Stooges to Cock and Ball Torture.

The one thing is,they all fall under the overall umbrella of metal.Sure some of them are holding the umbrella while others only have their shoulder covered,but they are still there or there abouts.

Nirvana introduced heavy guitar based music to a generation of people and they changed music forever,whether you want to admit it or not.

They deserve to be on a list of must have albums as much as anyone else.

Otis Driftwood

waltersobchak wrote: »

Re-read your own posts mate,since your the one who considers anything thats heavy/loud/angry to be metal
Look its this simple Nirvana aren't metal they're grunge
Sex Pistols aren't metal they're punk
Mbv aren't metal they're alternative rock/shoegazing
and even calling them metal is laughable..

At the end of the day you can argue all day that Nirvana are this and that.. But there a glorified punk band simple as, like a said before i usually dont give too Fs bout who is this genre or that genre, because metal has so many differant offshoots and styles.. But i take serious offence to someone labelling Nirvana metal because they single-handedly nearly killed metal..

Then riddle me this Batman,what is metal?

Since you are so sure what it isnt then kindly share your infinite wisdom with me as to what it is.

waltersobchak

nedtheshed wrote: »

Then riddle me this Batman,what is metal?

Since you are so sure what it isnt then kindly share your infinite wisdom with me as to what it is.

In my humble opinion, Metal is whatever it wants to be.. simple as that

--Kaiser--

It's quite simple;

Thin Lizzy were a hard rock (metal evolved from hard rock) band who influenced hundreds of Metal bands and were a pioneer of the sound.

Nirvana were a grunge band, they influenced NO metal band