Standing up for Teachers.

Scofflaw

Reduce the abuse, or the thread will be closed, and people will be unable to contribute here for a while.

Any ban given now is likely to last until after Budget Day, and I know how people would hate to miss that.

moderately,
Scofflaw

MaceFace

Stark wrote: »

And the Government is calling for a 1.3bn reduction in wages, €1bn reduction in social welfare and €1.7bn reduction in services. Seems fair enough to me.

No. The government is calling for a 1.3b in savings in the public sector pay bill. This does not neccessary mean a reduction in an individuals wages.

kangaroo

Not specific to this thread, I suppose, but I notice some PS workers and others seem to count twice the pension levy:

- It is generally described as a pay cut

but

- One is not supposed to now say they get a very good pension deal as they say they contribute to it with the pension levy, on top of other contributions [also I think people who were employed before 1995/6/7 (can't remember exact year) don't have to pay as much PRSI but when having discussions figures tend to be calculated based on the newer recruits].

Anyway, I don't think people should let the pension levy be counted twice in discussions. For example, if it is a pay cut, then they get a very very good pension that most private employers would not pay for. If it is a pension levy, then they haven't taken a pay cut and they, certainly teachers, had two pay increases in 2008 http://www.education.ie/servlet/blobservlet/cl0106_2008rates.xls 2.5% 1-3-2008 and 2.5% 1-9-2008. Probably more a subject for another thread perhaps - Added: actually I decided I'd set up a new thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055761185

ardmacha

No doubt those who condemned teachers for striking for one day will be equally critical of Batty O'Keefe who has now closed schools for 3 days when the vast majority of pupils will be perfectly well able to travel to school in fairly normal January conditions.

I'll bet that hardly any schools in NI will be closed tomorrow, while those in the neighbouring areas of the 26 counties will be closed.

OMD

ardmacha wrote: »

No doubt those who condemned teachers for striking for one day will be equally critical of Batty O'Keefe who has now closed schools for 3 days when the vast majority of pupils will be perfectly well able to travel to school in fairly normal January conditions.

I'll bet that hardly any schools in NI will be closed tomorrow, while those in the neighbouring areas of the 26 counties will be closed.

Teachers can pretend this is the unpaid leave they wanted pre budget and can offset it in their minds against the pay cut.

jetfiremuck

Doesn't matter. There are enough holidays before the State's eams to make up for lost time. O Keefe did the right thing. At least it keeps conformity in the school year regarding attendance. As long as the school days are met that's ok.

FGR

I'm of the opinion that the schools should have remained open and the decision to allow the children to attend be at the discretion of their parents. Same for teachers as regards safety to make the commute.

Why shut them completely?

97i9y3941

cause ireland been ireland are a sue nation i can see the point closeing them to other matters such as one school on the news during the week when the pipes where so frozen they water inside putted weight on it which pushed them through the roof,let alone johnny and mary would love to sue if their little darlings slipped during the ice in school..

kangaroo

jetfiremuck wrote: »

Doesn't matter. There are enough holidays before the State's eams to make up for lost time. O Keefe did the right thing. At least it keeps conformity in the school year regarding attendance. As long as the school days are met that's ok.

(I bolded that bit) Not sure what you are saying. Are you saying you think schools will open for extra days that they were scheduled to closed for, to make up for the lost days? I don't follow the news that closely sometimes but I didn't hear any mention of that and would have thought it would have been mentioned.

brianthebard

ForegoneReality wrote: »

I'm of the opinion that the schools should have remained open and the decision to allow the children to attend be at the discretion of their parents. Same for teachers as regards safety to make the commute.

Why shut them completely?

So you want teachers to be in work without any students to teach? Or better yet, 3 students to deal with 400 students? Yeah that sounds reasonable.

deise blue

kangaroo wrote: »

(I bolded that bit) Not sure what you are saying. Are you saying you think schools will open for extra days that they were scheduled to closed for, to make up for the lost days? I don't follow the news that closely sometimes but I didn't hear any mention of that and would have thought it would have been mentioned.

There was a gentleman from school management on morning Ireland who suggested that due to the rather fractious industrial climate at the moment that it would be extremely difficult to make up any lost days.

OMD

brianthebard wrote: »

So you want teachers to be in work without any students to teach? Or better yet, 3 students to deal with 400 students? Yeah that sounds reasonable.

Well if the teachers were at school alone surely it would give them time to do all the extra work they always say they have to do.

dolliemix

OMD wrote: »

Well if the teachers were at school alone surely it would give them time to do all the extra work they always say they have to do.

What a really intelligent post! :rolleyes:

Riskymove

deise blue wrote: »

There was a gentleman from school management on morning Ireland who suggested that due to the rather fractious industrial climate at the moment that it would be extremely difficult to make up any lost days.

funnily enough the "fractious industrial climate" didn't stop the schools being closed by order!

Riskymove

OMD wrote: »

Well if the teachers were at school alone surely it would give them time to do all the extra work they always say they have to do.

well a lot of that work is generated by the students!!

OMD

dolliemix wrote: »

What a really intelligent post! :rolleyes:

Why? Do teachers not have lots of extra work to do that does not involve teaching? They keep on saying they do.

OMD

Riskymove wrote: »

well a lot of that work is generated by the students!!

Well do the work that isn't. Spend the rest of the time teaching the students that actually do come in. Considering in Dublin last week all public transport was working nearly normally and taxis were everywhere most students would have been at school. Today everything is normal in Dublin.

dolliemix

OMD wrote: »

Why? Do teachers not have lots of extra work to do that does not involve teaching? They keep on saying they do.

Where are you getting 'extra' work from.
Teachers do their jobs. Full Stop. Same as everybody else.

What do you mean by extra?

OMD

dolliemix wrote: »

Where are you getting 'extra' work from.
Teachers do their jobs. Full Stop. Same as everybody else.

What do you mean by extra?

Thank god. A teacher who admits there is no extra work beyond teaching. No work to correct, no plans to be made for classes, no staff meetings, no preperation for parent teacher meetings.

97i9y3941

Call for Minister to re-open schools
Monday, 11 January 2010 10:30

Fine Gael has called on the Minister for Education to rescind his decision to close primary and second-level schools until Thursday.

Fine Gael Spokesman on Education Brian Hayes said while many schools are still unable to reopen it is clear this morning that in many parts of the country they can and should open from tomorrow morning.

Mr Hayes said Minister Batt O'Keeffe's decision on Friday was based on weather forecasts and he should now re-visit that decision based on the latest conditions.


Mr Hayes said the Minister's blanket-ban decision had given certainty to school, but the worst of the weather seemed to have passed.

Chambers Ireland urged the Department of Education and Science to review the decision.

Deputy Chief Executive Seán Murphy said 'while there may be a case to be made for shutting those schools whose heating systems or water supplies are not working, a blanket shut down does little to help struggling businesses and working parents trying to source additional expensive childcare at this time.'


Story from RTÉ News:
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0111/educationweather.html

looks like case of john and mary who bought the two houses during the boom and still want to keep them must had got on their politician cause they cant afford the babysitter

dolliemix

OMD wrote: »

Thank god. A teacher who admits there is no extra work beyond teaching. No work to correct, no plans to be made for classes, no staff meetings, no preperation for parent teacher meetings.

Are you for real? That is all part of a teacher's work!!!

What is your problem?

spurious

OMD wrote: »

Well if the teachers were at school alone surely it would give them time to do all the extra work they always say they have to do.

That's what I have been doing, plus setting and marking work on Moodle which the students have completed online.
The weather hasn't been as much of an inconvenience as it could have been.

Oh - was I supposed to say I stayed in bed?

OMD

dolliemix wrote: »

Are you for real? That is all part of a teacher's work!!!

What is your problem?

I have no problem. I never said it was not part if a teachers work. I said it was extra to actual teaching. As per my first post, what is to stop teachers doing this work?

OMD

Anyway it doesn't matter now. Most of you will be back to school tomorrow. It has just been anounced.

doc_17

OMD wrote: »

Anyway it doesn't matter now. Most of you will be back to school tomorrow. It has just been anounced.

Not me. Or any other teacher in my school or within 20 miles. please don't let that annoy you though:D:D:D:D!

the_syco

foxymm wrote: »

Thousands of people walk into their own cushy private sector jobs on a daily basis starring at computer screens (example) until their eyes get sore and then go home. . . .

I stopped reading there. Thousands of private sector jobs have been let go. Although there are many sub teachers that do not have a pernament job, it's a lot safer than the private sector. Private sector goes bust, everyone in it goes jobless. The public sector runs out of money, they keep on borrowing. Thus, public sector seems a lot safer than private sector.

deise blue

Riskymove wrote: »

funnily enough the "fractious industrial climate" didn't stop the schools being closed by order!

I have no idea what point you are trying to make .
Schools were closed for health and safety purposes.

doc_17

some people really don't like teachers! they must have been so mean to yez! They closed the schools the same way they cut the pay of teachers, by decree. get over it. they'll be open again in a couple of days, then only 4 weeks til mid-term!

OMD

doc_17 wrote: »

! They closed the schools the same way they cut the pay of teachers, by decree. get over it. !

Or you could look at it another way. Teachers unions wanted unpaid leave instead of a pay cut. Teachers can write these days off against the pay cut. So in terms of pay per days worked average teacher will be no worse off this year than last year. Will that stop teachers whinging about how badly they have been treated? Will that remove any threat of industrial action by teachers? Or do teachers "get over" some "decrees" but not all?

doc_17

Lots of resentment, hate and anger floating about in some of these posts regarding teachers!!