United Away - League Cup QF

scudzilla

Hey guys, will you take Berbatov back from us?

He's yours for a Mars bar and half a packet of Tayto

Pacing Mule

mickman wrote: »

game over at old trafford

Game of two halves - scored 8 recently etc

mickman

look very bad at centre half tonight. what has changed since saturday? ekotto and corluka , do they make that much of a difference?

mickman

hutton,bentley,jenas,keane all very poor tonight

no killer pass at all. all a bit dis interested or something. keane cant even last 70 mins now in a carling cup game, will he be moved on in january?

yiddo

yiddo wrote: »

Harrys "weakened" team don;t look too bad

I was wrong :(



threw the towel in with half an hour to go. Keane shocking as were Bentley and especially Hutton. How Hutton passes himself off as a professional footballer I'll never know! Jaysus give me Edman or Atouba instead anyday

We need at least one more midfielder and a striker. Levy should go all out and pay the big wages and get Ruud Van Nistelroy in January.

el diablo

very poor result and can't believe someone like Gibson scored two against us which is slightly embarrassing. Alll he's good at is long distance shooting and will probably be moved on the the next year or two by Fergie.

Time to concentrate on the league now and hopefully get a good result on Sunday v Everton.

I-Bleed-White

Take everything with a pinch of salt as it was ONLY a league cup game. No way you would have heard me say that last season. We now have bigger fish to fry. Feels good to say. It was a mistake playing both Hutton and Bentley on the same wing. They were both SHOCKING.

Bentley doesn't even have his killer ball anymore. No doubt with a good run of games he has the ability to come good but how can he expect a run of games when he made that reserve LB look like Cashley Cole. He is now a championship player in my eyes, if hes lucky.

Hutton was a joke playing two stupid poor passes across the front of goal in quick succession and none of his crosses beat the first man. Surely a pro footballer can get the ball off the ground.

Lennon should have been on the right at least from the start of the second half.Palacios should never have been brought off as we immediatly gave up midfield.

No big deal we lost but would have been nice to keep momentum going.

COYS

I-Bleed-White

forgot to give Bale props. Thought the attacking side of his game was very good tonight. One positive to take from the game.

RichMc70

Well, congratulations Harry, you frigged around with the team tonight and we were beaten by Man U's reserves/bench warmers.

Come 9th May 2010, IF we have not finished in the top four, then I would like him to justify his reason for blowing our only realistic chance of silverware this season.

Even though we dominated the game for long periods tonight, we looked completely sterile. WTF was Lennon doing on the left. Hutton, Bentley, Keane and Jenas were all very poor.

As I said in a previous post, we can not afford the luxury of resting players for games like this and expect to compete. Tonight's result proves the point.

KingdomYid

Totally agree Rich, Jenas Bentley Keane and Hutton not at the races. No matter what is said about our squad once we bring these guys in we never will be good enough. There was something missing tonight no passion or fight. Defoe even looked disinterested. Very frustrating to watch.

Hatch99

Just saw the last 20 mins after training, looked very poor. As said, Hutton looked chronic, and Bentley looked completely uninterested.
Just saw Harrys interview and he looked very pi**ed off.

Will be interesting to see can he lift them for a huge game sunday evening.

curraghyid

what a shambles hutton is not a defender,bentley built his reputation on his crossing ability that is a distant memory on tonites evidence, bassong was completely disinterested ???.
we had no cutting edge service to defoe keane crouch was abysmal it just prove bentley,bale,hutton have no chance of ever being first team regularsve .
on a positive we are out concentrate on league and fa cup but harry needs to bring in 2/3 more midfielders/defenders in january because this strong bench thats being talked about is a myth.

StillRickyVilla

Hate to break it to you lads but the reason why the players looked disinterested tonight was......because they were disinterested! There was no motivation or passion because they didn't give a sh1t! They would never have played like that in a PL game. The players or manager would never admit this openly, but i bet they are happy tonight to be out of this cup to get on with what they really want.

I just feel sorry for the fans who travelled & those on here who wanted us to go for the cup as they have been f*cked over big time.

Lets not get carried away with the criticism. We were talking 2 days ago about how great we are - and tonights farce hasn't changed a thing.

Bring on Everton.

ohnoigotsick

StillRickyVilla wrote: »

There was no motivation or passion because they didn't give a sh1t! They would never have played like that in a PL game.

you have forgotten the arsenal chelsea and united games in the league already !

Dave11

Very very poor tonight!!! :mad:

Whoever says its good to be out of the cup so we can concentrate on the league is talking crap!!! We need the cup runs to keep the morale up and winning feeling! We are not yet a top four team. We are a team in the top four in the first week of December!!!! Long long way to go! Disgusted at the attitudes of some of the players tonight! They looked like they didn't care less about it. Like this was now to small for them cause there in the 'big four'.... boll*x!!!!

Bale, Hutton, Bentley NOT GOOD ENOUGH!!! please tell me Harry has realised this by now and is just waiting to move them on!!!

Keane looked really disinterested which is so dissappointing as he should be hungry to play and keen to impress. His starting place is far from guarenteed but he didn't look to bothered tonight!!! :mad:

Could keep going on but just to annoyed and need to try calm down here!

Sunday v Everton.... Gomes, Corluka, Dawson, Bassong, Lennon, Palacious, Huddlestone, Krancjar, Defoe and Crouch!!!

Better lift it big time!!!

StillRickyVilla

Dave11 wrote: »

Very very poor tonight!!! :mad:

Whoever says its good to be out of the cup so we can concentrate on the league is talking crap!!! We need the cup runs to keep the morale up and winning feeling! We are not yet a top four team. We are a team in the top four in the first week of December!!!! Long long way to go! Disgusted at the attitudes of some of the players tonight! They looked like they didn't care less about it. Like this was now to small for them cause there in the 'big four'.... boll*x!!!!

Bale, Hutton, Bentley NOT GOOD ENOUGH!!! please tell me Harry has realised this by now and is just waiting to move them on!!!

Keane looked really disinterested which is so dissappointing as he should be hungry to play and keen to impress. His starting place is far from guarenteed but he didn't look to bothered tonight!!! :mad:

Could keep going on but just to annoyed and need to try calm down here!

Sunday v Everton.... Gomes, Corluka, Dawson, Bassong, Lennon, Palacious, Huddlestone, Krancjar, Defoe and Crouch!!!

Better lift it big time!!!

But like I said earlier on in the thread - whether we like it or not - the players, manager & club DO NOT GIVE A SH1T ABOUT THE CARLING CUP!! (whatever they might openly say to the media). So it is no surprise when the players appeared all disinterested with no passion or motivation.

Compare tonight to the fantastic heart, determination and quality of Sundays performance v Villa in the PL - 3 days earlier. No comparison.

I don't really understand everyone's surprise - normal service will be resumed v Everton.

RichMc70

StillRickyVilla wrote: »

But like I said earlier on in the thread - whether we like it or not - the players, manager & club DO NOT GIVE A SH1T ABOUT THE CARLING CUP!! (whatever they might openly say to the media). So it is no surprise when the players appeared all disinterested with no passion or motivation.

Well they should give a sh1t about the League Cup for the fans and their own pride. I don't know how many spurs fans travelled to manchester for the game but I bet they gave a sh1t about the match and the fact that Man U reserves/bench warmers were there for the taking but one person has decided that the League Cup (in his opinion) is not worthy.

Well, if we finish the season with no silverware, no top four and possibly not even in a europa cup place, I'd like to speak to the one who thought the League Cup was not worthy.

Remember, since the Champions League format started, we have never finished in the top four and we have not even won an FA Cup. Our only domestic success has been in the League Cup. Prior to that we have to go back to 1985 as the last time we actually looked like we could challenge for the title itself.

I'm starting to think at this stage, that the manager, players and some fans are believing they can run before they can walk.

Yes we have improved this season, but ffs let's take a reality check here...we are years away from actually challenging the 'so called big four', when it comes to something serious like an actual title challenge.

Sure we had a good result against Liverpool on the first day, but since then we've been whooped each time by the other three, whereas the other supposed top four challengers (Man City & Aston Villa) have performed much better and got some results against them.

To finish top four we're going to need at least 70 points and that means taking points of the 'so called big four' as well as winning the bread and butter games.

Trust me lads there is a hell of a long way to go and were not even halfway and (although very cliche) I would seriously recommend that we take each game as it comes regarding the league.

Mr. Guappa

Dave11 wrote: »

Bale, Hutton, Bentley NOT GOOD ENOUGH!!! please tell me Harry has realised this by now and is just waiting to move them on!!!

I thought Bale was one of our better performers tonight. If anything good comes out of that match its that surely it was Bentleys last game for us.. he was absolutely atrocious, I can't remember watching a match and being so angry by a single players performance since Bentley in the Arsenal match.

StillRickyVilla

RichMc70 wrote: »

Well they should give a sh1t about the League Cup for the fans and their own pride. I don't know how many spurs fans travelled to manchester for the game but I bet they gave a sh1t about the match and the fact that Man U reserves/bench warmers were there for the taking but one person has decided that the League Cup (in his opinion) is not worthy.

Well, if we finish the season with no silverware, no top four and possibly not even in a europa cup place, I'd like to speak to the one who thought the League Cup was not worthy.

Remember, since the Champions League format started, we have never finished in the top four and we have not even won an FA Cup. Our only domestic success has been in the League Cup. Prior to that we have to go back to 1985 as the last time we actually looked like we could challenge for the title itself.

I'm starting to think at this stage, that the manager, players and some fans are believing they can run before they can walk.

Yes we have improved this season, but ffs let's take a reality check here...we are years away from actually challenging the 'so called big four', when it comes to something serious like an actual title challenge.

Sure we had a good result against Liverpool on the first day, but since then we've been whooped each time by the other three, whereas the other supposed top four challengers (Man City & Aston Villa) have performed much better and got some results against them.

To finish top four we're going to need at least 70 points and that means taking points of the 'so called big four' as well as winning the bread and butter games.

Trust me lads there is a hell of a long way to go and were not even halfway and (although very cliche) I would seriously recommend that we take each game as it comes regarding the league.

Hey I'm not saying its right or wrong - this is the reality of it!!

Do we want to be a 'big club' again, challenging for top honours? Yes
Does being a 'big club' mean Champions League football? Yes
Is the ambition of world class players to play Champions League football & challenge for top honours? Yes
Will we be able to attract top top players again (instead of moaning about some of the sh1te we have all the time) if we make the Top 4? Yes

Will any of these things happen by winning the Carling Cup? NO!!!!!

I think its the fans that need a reality check. How can we possibly get excited about a competition where mostly reserve team's are played. And WORSE have so little back-bone that we are happy to feed off the scraps that Fergie throws us (by him fielding a weakened team). Lets grow some balls.

NOBODY is saying we are definitely going to make Top 4 by being out of the Carling Cup. Everybody agrees that its going to take an absolutely monumental effort to get there - but by having focus & having no distractions it MAY be possible. We missed out by 1 point to the Scum the other year - if going out last night means we pick up an extra point which means we qualify that would be great IMO!

I really feel for the fans who travelled who have been cheated. All I am doing is giving my honest opinion of what Harry & the players are quite clearly thinking.

mickman

guys- i think we will have to accept fire sale prices for these guys in january

hutton - 2 million
pav - 8 million
bentley - 5 million
jenas - 6 million

2-0 down last night and jenas kept passing back to gomes. bentley crosses were so bad that bale had to take the set pieces. bale played very well in my opinion. the whole team didnt care though. defoe missed a sitter in the first half and didnt care one bit.

harry couldnt even give the post match interview he was so pissed off. the one thin you can take from it is that the players are gunning for the league this year and not cups - the complete opposite of the last few years

mickman

sandro and van nistelerroy would be my picks in january assuming he is fit.

bentley made me laugh last night, all these attempts at tricks and ended up making a fool of himself every time. he even had to be moved off the right wing. why was palacious taken off again, we were over run in the second half due to it

everdead.ie

Everyone bar Bale looked disinterested I don't know if it was because it was the league cup or if it was because it was against"kids" but bar Bale who I thought played great taking on players and that pin point cross to defoe in the first half was magnificent.

Don't know what happened to Bassong last night he was poor but maybe it was a reflection of the positions he was being put in by the team last night Crouch was far worse in my opinion he took the ball off Lennon last night after he got in his way ,Lost the ball we won it back then got in Jenas' way and lost the ball again.

ohnoigotsick

mickman wrote: »

sandro and van nistelerroy would be my picks in january assuming he is fit.

bentley made me laugh last night, all these attempts at tricks and ended up making a fool of himself every time. he even had to be moved off the right wing. why was palacious taken off again, we were over run in the second half due to it

thought centre mid were brutal first half , they couldn't pass the ball to save their life.

seems bentley is a player to come on when we are playing brutal opposition or hammering teams , he should have been moved to the left wing way sooner if only to get lennon going as he wasn't doing much on the left wing.

positives out of last night ,
gomes did well in a few tight situations
bale made a good few runs from LB.

thats about it really

StillRickyVilla

mickman wrote: »

sandro and van nistelerroy would be my picks in january assuming he is fit.

bentley made me laugh last night, all these attempts at tricks and ended up making a fool of himself every time. he even had to be moved off the right wing. why was palacious taken off again, we were over run in the second half due to it

Ye, I was thinking about Van Nistelroy - he would be a gamble, but if fit his goals could propel us to where we want to be.

I was also last night thinking about Ashley Young again - as Villa now have Milner & Downing they are a bit over-loaded on the left - they may now be willing to sell.

The other one was one of the commentators was saying Carrick is having a really bad time at United. I wouldn't support this, but would you have him back? Given the inconsistency of Hudd & Jenas?

mickman

i would take carrick back. he is very very reliable and efficent on the ball.

young? we have no where to play him with all the croats who are as good as him in my opinioin. plus villa will have him priced at 30 million.

maybe they were all still pissed from sunday night

StillRickyVilla

mickman wrote: »

i would take carrick back. he is very very reliable and efficent on the ball.

young? we have no where to play him with all the croats who are as good as him in my opinioin. plus villa will have him priced at 30 million.

maybe they were all still pissed from sunday night

Haha!
Ye I reckon Carrick is still better than Hudd unfortunately. If Hudd could get a bit more consistency to his game he would be as good. Its the same with Jenas. They are both annoying as they have the potential but how long can you keep saying that? When Palacios came in, you knew immediately he was the real deal.

My one fear is that we get involved in some sort of part-exchange with Modric & Carrick which i would be so p1ssed off about.

If Bale could re-discover his form then we would also have proper cover on the left.And yes you are right the Croats give us good quality there.

I think it will be mainly out-goings from now on (Pav, Bentley def!) - With one major signing like Van Nistelrooy it could be enough.

everdead.ie

I miss Sheringham in the team:(

ya i would take Carrick back when he came on at WHL early this Season he got a good cheer from the crowd and an applause when his name was mentioned on the subs bench for united at the start of the game

Kiith

StillRickyVilla wrote: »

My one fear is that we get involved in some sort of part-exchange with Modric & Carrick which i would be so p1ssed off about.

If Redknapp/Levy go for this deal, i'll lose a lot of faith in them. We need to hang on to our best players, not trade them for cash and average players.

everdead.ie

I wonder when Mod comes back would Harry play him behind Defoe and Keep Kranjcar on the left?

mickman

what about this for january onwards :-)


gomes

corluka king woodie ekotto

palacious sandro

lennon modric kranjcar

defoe van nisteleroy

StillRickyVilla

Gomes
Corluka, Woods/Daws, Leds/Bassong, BAE
Lennon, Pal, Sandro/Carrick, 1 Croat
Defoe, Van Nistelrooy

mickman

we can live in hope

Kiith

mickman wrote: »

what about this for january onwards :-)


gomes

corluka king woodie ekotto

palacious sandro

lennon modric kranjcar

defoe van nisteleroy

Think you better check your numbers :P

ohnoigotsick

Kiith wrote: »

Think you better check your numbers :P

ha ha

someone posted a team yesterday with 10 players , and now we have one with 12

keane=cock

Hatch99 wrote: »

Just saw the last 20 mins after training, looked very poor. As said, Hutton looked chronic, and Bentley looked completely uninterested.
Just saw Harrys interview and he looked very pi**ed off.

Will be interesting to see can he lift them for a huge game sunday evening.

same myself hatch, only caught the end of the game. looked very poor in my opinion. thought the centre of midfield was non existant. lennon didnt wnt to run at players, crouch wasnt winning many headers. hudds passn was poor, bassong n dawson didnt look great. bale got the ball a couple of times and looked to play. bentley-nothing.

as i say i only seen the end but with he space gibson was gtting it was no mystery as to why he got 2 goals.

keane=cock

StillRickyVilla wrote: »

But like I said earlier on in the thread - whether we like it or not - the players, manager & club DO NOT GIVE A SH1T ABOUT THE CARLING CUP!! (whatever they might openly say to the media). So it is no surprise when the players appeared all disinterested with no passion or motivation.

quote]

not saying your wrong but why field such a strong side?
leave defoe/crouch out and give pav a run.
fair enough bale bentley hutton started.

StillRickyVilla

keane=cock wrote: »

StillRickyVilla wrote: »

But like I said earlier on in the thread - whether we like it or not - the players, manager & club DO NOT GIVE A SH1T ABOUT THE CARLING CUP!! (whatever they might openly say to the media). So it is no surprise when the players appeared all disinterested with no passion or motivation.

quote]

not saying your wrong but why field such a strong side?
leave defoe/crouch out and give pav a run.
fair enough bale bentley hutton started.

The managers & clubs have to 'be seen' to be treating the cup, the fans, the Bookies etc etc with respect to maintain the integrity of competition. Which is why Man U say, don't/can't field an entire team of youth players.

But the difference between players 'wanting it' and players just turning up and going through the motions with one eye on the weekend was obvious to me anyway.

StillRickyVilla

golfball37 wrote: »

Newcastle and Everton both fell at the qualifying round after they believed they had the hard work done in finishing 4th. I certainly wouldn’t fancy us against a seasoned European team especially at WHL where we just allow good teams to play it seems without any pressure.
I’m not sure it’s fair to say the Carling Cup has diminished that much, if anything it’s the FA Cup that has. CL is so important now that the FA cup really is a joke. The carling Cup never had the profile to begin with so it hasn’t really suffered imo. What other club can say they beat Chelsea in a club final since Abramovich has been there? Us and Man u. I don't care what ye say but that is something to be proud of. Finishing 4th then getting a hiding off Lyon would be even more painful with an empty trophy cabinet, what then would we have gained?

As for tonight- Spurs at 10/3 is well worth a flutter. Besiktas beat the same team last week and they were 8/1.

So lets not even bother going for the CL cos we might lose the CL qualifier????????

While we are at it, lets not bother going for the FA Cup - afterall, we might get beat in the Final!!!!!!

And there's no point in Ireland even entering the Euros qualifiying campaign in case there maybe a play-off at the end of it....

The Carling Cup win over Chelsea was indeed a great day. But it was a completely different situation. We had a brand new Manager, we were lowly in the League with no thoughts of challenging at the top, and whatsmore in those days it got us into Europe! It was also a great release after the pain of Jol's exit. I might add that after the euphoria of that great day out, we never recovered emotionally & went on to hardly win a game for the rest of the season..

Today, we sit 3rd in the League, nearly half way through the season. As things stand we have every reason to believe we can sustain a challenge for the Top 4. I'm not saying we will definitely do it - but if we can - it COULD change the whole course of our history.

RichMc70

Thinking again about last nights game, there were a good few of our players who had the chance to make a strong case to Harry that they are better than bench players.

IMO the only one who played with any determination and spirit was Gareth Bale. It was a shame that the others, Jenas, Hutton, Bentley and to some extent Keane, did not play with the same approach.

The hypocrisy from Harry though, does rile me. Last night he was saying to Skysports how "disappointed" he was but yet the day before he seemed to basically express a view that qualifying for the CL is more important. If that's the case then why didn't he just stick the reserves out. Why risk the likes of Defoe, Dawson, Bassong, Lennon, Palacios, Gomes, Crouch etc !

Our subs bench last night were: Walker (gk), Huddlestone, Pavlyuchenko, Crouch, Naughton, Corluka, Rose. If he was true to his opinion that CL qualification was more important then he should have played

Walker
Hutton Dervite Bassong Bale
Bentley Rose Jenas Parrett
Pavlyuchenko Keane

and then make a subs bench from other reserves

StillRickyVilla

RichMc70 wrote: »

Thinking again about last nights game, there were a good few of our players who had the chance to make a strong case to Harry that they are better than bench players.

IMO the only one who played with any determination and spirit was Gareth Bale. It was a shame that the others, Jenas, Hutton, Bentley and to some extent Keane, did not play with the same approach.

The hypocrisy from Harry though, does rile me. Last night he was saying to Skysports how "disappointed" he was but yet the day before he seemed to basically express a view that qualifying for the CL is more important. If that's the case then why didn't he just stick the reserves out. Why risk the likes of Defoe, Dawson, Bassong, Lennon, Palacios, Gomes, Crouch etc !

Our subs bench last night were: Walker (gk), Huddlestone, Pavlyuchenko, Crouch, Naughton, Corluka, Rose. If he was true to his opinion that CL qualification was more important then he should have played

Walker
Hutton Dervite Bassong Bale
Bentley Rose Jenas Parrett
Pavlyuchenko Keane

and then make a subs bench from other reserves

The managers & clubs have to 'be seen' to be treating the cup, the fans, the Bookies etc etc with respect to maintain the integrity of competition. Which is why Man U say, don't/can't field an entire team of youth players.

But the difference between players 'wanting it' and players just turning up and going through the motions with one eye on the weekend was obvious to me anyway.

everdead.ie

Just because Champions League is the priority doesn't mean he's not going to give it a lash besides he needed to give some players a game because they are nowhere near the first squad and he had to see who is worth keeping and who needs to be cleared off ie. Bale(who stepped up),Bentley,Hutton,Jenas(who needs game time),Keane and defoe to see if they where as good together as Crouch and defoe

Dublin Spur

I thought we played quite well, we passed it well, we had more possession, we created a lot of chances.
Not bad given we had our 2nd choice back 4 playing. Not a disaster in any shape or form.

We've been to the CC final 2 years running, we need to look beyond that now. It was not an important fixture in the grand scheme of things in my book and I think it could be a blessing in disguise to be out.

We have a lot bigger fish to fry this season.

Oh look, City just scored, Tevez - lovely jubbley

Hatch99

Dublin Spur wrote: »

Oh look, City just scored, Tevez - lovely jubbley

Great finish too.

el diablo

Hatch99 wrote: »

Great finish too.

3-0 now. Those kids are seriously overrated.