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Federal United States of Europe

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  • 01-12-2009 11:07pm
    #1
    Hellm0
    Registered Users Posts: 1,028 ✭✭✭


    Anybody read this?

    I would like to hear from Yes voters specifically, now that we are heading head first and eyes closed into a unified state (and someday federal taxes), how do you feel about your vote?

    Jo Leinen, a senior German Social Democrat MEP, hailed 1 December as a "day of joy" for those who wanted to build a federal United States of Europe.

    "The Lisbon Treaty is better than reported, with it Europe is going forward towards political union," he said.


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    #2
    Agent Smith
    Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 21,504 Mod ✭✭✭✭Agent Smith


    I'd rather us be in then out in the cold.


    and i did vote yes


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    #3
    sdanseo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,233 ✭✭✭sdanseo


    Jo Leinen can go jump. There would be armed rebellion if they even tried. Too many different societies and customs not to mention 21 different languages for it to even have a tiny chance of working. Any alliances between "sides" (i.e. American Civil War) or realignments within countries that have resulted in federal governments have been united by language.

    I voted yes the second time because I felt I had no choice.

    Absolute bull.


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    #4
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    Hellm0 wrote: »
    Anybody read this?

    I would like to hear from Yes voters specifically, now that we are heading head first and eyes closed into a unified state (and someday federal taxes), how do you feel about your vote?

    If you regard taxes that go to fund the EU as federal taxes, you already pay them - and as far as I can see, get a lot more for them than you do from our 'national' taxes.

    If you really believe that Lisbon creates a federal state, you're entirely incorrect - and if you believe it's a "step on the road", I'll just point out that Dundalk is on the way to Belfast, but in an entirely different country.

    regards,
    Scofflaw


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    #5
    meglome
    Registered Users Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    Hellm0 wrote: »
    Anybody read this?

    I would like to hear from Yes voters specifically, now that we are heading head first and eyes closed into a unified state (and someday federal taxes), how do you feel about your vote?

    The German constitutional court found nothing in the Lisbon treaty that lead to a Federal Europe. I didn't see anything that concerned me when I read it either (not that I'd put my view on a level with actual experts).

    I voted Yes, I voted Yes with little or no qualms. If anything I've got even more comfortable with my decision since then. I disagree completely with your premise that "we are heading head first and eyes closed into a unified state". And even if I'm completely wrong and we are heading that way, the Irish people would be required to want a unified Europe and vote for it. So no matter what happens the majority of the Irish people will have wanted it... go democracy.


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    #6
    evercloserunion
    Registered Users Posts: 1,889 ✭✭✭evercloserunion


    I'm pretty happy with my Yes vote.


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    #7
    r14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 205 ✭✭r14


    evercloserunion wrote: »
    I'm pretty happy with my Yes vote.

    I'm also happy with my yes vote. FUSE is a much better acronym than USA at least. Go federalism!


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    #8
    O'Morris
    Closed Accounts Posts: 619 ✭✭✭O'Morris


    The EU is not set to become a United States of Europe and Bill Clinton did not have sexual relations with one of his interns.
    Scofflaw wrote:
    I'll just point out that Dundalk is on the way to Belfast, but in an entirely different country.

    Dundalk and Belfast are in the same country.


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    #9
    meglome
    Registered Users Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    O'Morris wrote: »
    Dundalk and Belfast are in the same country.

    What is it about 'nationalists' that makes them so much nationalistic than the rest of us nationalists. I get the impression you can't be a real nationalist unless you also voted No to Lisbon.


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    #10
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    O'Morris wrote: »
    The EU is not set to become a United States of Europe and Bill Clinton did not have sexual relations with one of his interns.
    You seem to be accusing someone of lying here, but I can't figure out whom.
    Dundalk and Belfast are in the same country.
    Item #3066294 on the list of "stuff that, no matter how often you repeat it, won't magically become true".


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    #11
    ChocolateSauce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,892 ✭✭✭ChocolateSauce


    O'Morris wrote: »
    .



    Dundalk and Belfast are in the same country.

    Not since 1921 actually, and no matter how much you wish it were true it isn't, it isn't legally, it isn't metaphorically, it isn't even culturally (although the difference between the Irish and the British is so small that only the Irish can actually tell the difference), and it isn't going to be for quite some time.


    Anyway, yeah, I'm elated with my yes vote. If there is going to be a federal Europe, it A) won't be here for many decades, and B) we'll get to vote on it, and anyone who says we won't, or that we didn't, is part of the tin-foil hat brigade.


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    #12
    ei.sdraob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,376 ✭✭✭ei.sdraob


    ah yes the torygraph

    always posting anti EU articles and predicting the death of the euro every other week

    ironically their coverage of their own currency which is imploding or how they are printing money in order to survive till next election is glossed over

    bleh


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    #13
    force eleven
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,039 ✭✭✭force eleven


    Ah yes, the rampant federalists of Brussels are coming out of the woodwork. I have no interest in Ireland becoming 'integrated' into a federalist single government Europe, nor do I believe that will be allowed to happen. We have integrated as much as we need to, single currency, bank, open borders etc, and let that be enough.

    :cool:


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    #14
    Martin 2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 268 ✭✭Martin 2


    I wouldn't have any problem with a federal EU provided it's democratically initiated, and nothing so far would lead me to believe that it wouldn't be.

    As for the 'Irish Question' that's been raised in the thread, well with the exception of the GFA, greater EU integration more than anything has been responsible for diminishing the political, economic and social barriers between NI and the republic; furthermore if the UK eventually adopts the euro we'll also have the same currency, so I can't see any logical reason for those that want a united Ireland to oppose it.

    .


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