The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread

neilster

davyjose wrote: »

My only credible response to this could possibly be...

Over and out!!! I'll pick Ryan's season up again in January.

who cares about your response? really its friday who cares

neilster

spiralism wrote: »

Fitzy is looking very good tbh but Orton is rapidly evolving into a top tier qb. There's a hell of a lot of problems with this Denver team but he isn't one of them, this may sound ridiculous but imo he reminds me of Drew Brees at the same age.

Seriously, he's got no run support, our coach is a question mark to say the least, he's getting battered half the plays he's in because our Oline is horribly inconsistent (prob due to a banged up clady and rookies at C and RT... also our oline coach is a former f'n tight ends coach) and his wide recievers are Jabar Gaffney, Brandon Lloyd, Eddie Royal and 2 rookies. No TE to speak of either as Graham solely blocks pretty much.

Having half the defence injured and a rake of UDFAs/low rounders out in their place does not help either.

2140 yds 11 TDs 4 INTs, 92.1 QBR from that is not too shabby to tell the truth, if he was in the NFC he'd be guaranteed probowl with that... even then he has an outside chance this year behind manning and rivers.

You are a broncos fan so i will beg to your opinion on this one but apart from Dumervil and Ayers gone and a banged up Clady , Denver are missing 3 more starters on defense ? are they not ...who are the others and is it all on the OLINE?

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

You know Im going to skip the rest because it seems you are in the know and I bow down to your inside knowledge of the events back in the early 90's. I have read many of the reports and many of the pieces on Favre and talked to many from WI and all I can do is go on what I have learned over the year and there was never any solid evidence that he was abusing in Atlanta. But I stand corrected if you are more knowledgeable on the subject than myself.

As for praising other peoples posts Oh I am sorry for not praising your posts. I didn't realise you like people on the internet praising you. But I will say I agree with a lot of things you have said. In fact I have already said that earlier in the thread. From now on I will praise your post before replying.

As for moving the context around. Yes that is what I am doing. The fact of the matter is I stuck by the same points on Fitzy throughout. If you feel I am moving the context around that is your opinion and I respect that.

The stuff from the Atlanta days with Favre was a mix of things....generally great college scouting reports before he got there but jocklike stuff late at night , curfews, busts covered up ...not enough to move a great QB down the draft but getting close and then in Atlanta more of the same but awful lot of hard-drinking

again love to hear your take on the Bears

Peyton Manning

neilster wrote: »

The stuff from the Atlanta days with Favre was a mix of things....generally great college scouting reports before he got there but jocklike stuff late at night , curfews, busts covered up ...not enough to move a great QB down the draft but getting close and then in Atlanta more of the same but awful lot of hard-drinking

That pretty much describes Ryan Mallett's draft prospects next year too actually.

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

The stuff from the Atlanta days with Favre was a mix of things....generally great college scouting reports before he got there but jocklike stuff late at night , curfews, busts covered up ...not enough to move a great QB down the draft but getting close and then in Atlanta more of the same but awful lot of hard-drinking

I know what scouts look at and I know they include the players personal lives i.e partying etc etc. What is your point with that? It was common knowledge Favre liked to Party in college, in fact he got into trouble a lot during his Freshman and Sophomore years for it. It was obvious Glanville didn't like Favre because of Favre's attitude and lifestyle during his college year. But what I am saying to is on the drugs point, is that from what I have learned and that is me personally is from the media back then and friends and fellow football folk over the years that there was never any solid proof on the Drugs thing. Now if you have any other evidence 100% disputing what I just said as I said I stand corrected and respect your opinion.

neilster wrote: »

again love to hear your take on the Bears

To be honest with you we went through Cutler and Orton and the Bears in another thread and I personally don't want to open up that can of worms again. I don't understand why you want to hear my opinion of them anyways. What bearing has that on this discussion. I care less for them and really couldn't bothered getting into another discussion about Cutler and the Bears. Best thing to do is go find that thread if you want to see my opinion on the bears.

eagle eye

I remember the painkiller addiction thing. I remember it on tv over there at the time and he came out and admitted it. It was definitely when he was with the Packers that it all came out, he was already a big name at that stage.

tallaghtoutlaws

eagle eye wrote: »

I remember the painkiller addiction thing. I remember it on tv over there at the time and he came out and admitted it. It was definitely when he was with the Packers that it all came out, he was already a big name at that stage.

Yeah I remember that also but he never admitted it during his Atlanta days. In fact many of the Reports said he started taking them when he was starting for the Packers in 1992.

This is a very good article on the whole thing and Favre himself admits in the article he started his addiction with the Packers in 1992. In fact his 7th start for them is where it all began.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/features/favre/flashbacks/bitter_pill/

Green Bay Packers quarterback Brett Favre can pinpoint when, where and why he got scared straight. It happened on Feb. 27 in room 208 of Bellin Hospital in Green Bay, where he had just undergone surgery to remove one bone spur and several bone chips from his left ankle. One minute Favre, the NFL's MVP last season, was talking to his girlfriend, Deanna Tynes, their 7-year-old daughter, Brittany, and a nurse. The next thing he knew, there were tubes and IVs coming out of him everywhere.

He doesn't remember the 20 minutes in between, during which his limbs thrashed, his head banged backward uncontrollably, and he gnashed his teeth. During those minutes his body told him in a loud wake-up call to stop popping painkillers as if they were Lifesavers. He never heard Tynes scream to the nurse, "Get his tongue! Don't let him swallow his tongue!" He never heard a terrified Brittany ask, as she was being whisked from the room, "Is he going to die, Mom?"

After the seizure had ended and he had come to his senses, Favre looked into a sea of concerned medical faces and saw Packers associate team physician John Gray. "You've just suffered a seizure, Brett," Gray told him. "People can die from those."

Favre's heart sank. Upon hearing from doctors in the room that his dependence on painkillers might have contributed to the seizure, he thought, I've got to stop the pills, I've just got to.

Last season Favre went on such a wild ride with the prescription drug Vicodin, a narcotic-analgesic painkiller, that Tynes feared for his life. He scavenged pills from teammates. At least once he took 13 tablets in a night. But on Tuesday of last week, during his final telephone call before entering the Menninger Clinic, a rehabilitation center in Topeka, Kans., to treat his dependency (and also to evaluate his occasional heavy drinking), Favre told SI that he hadn't taken Vicodin since the seizure. "I quit cold turkey," he said, "and I entered the NFL substance-abuse program voluntarily. I don't want a pill now, but I want to go into a rehab center because I want to make sure I'm totally clean. The counselors I've seen think it's best for me. The one thing they've taught me is that there will always be a spot in your brain that wants it."

A source close to Favre told SI that Favre initially balked at entering a rehab facility. The source said Favre also did not want to comply with a demand from his NFL-appointed addiction counselors to sign a 10-part treatment plan that called for him, among other things, to stop drinking for two years. Favre claims he doesn't have an alcohol problem. However, the league's substance-abuse policy mandates that a player who turns himself in for treatment comply with his counselors' recommendations. Had he refused to sign the treatment plan and enter a rehab center, Favre could have been considered in noncompliance with the policy. That could have triggered the penalty clause, under which he could have been subject to a four-game suspension in 1996 without pay (which would cost him $900,000). So he signed the document, revealed the depth of his problem in a press conference in Green Bay on May 14 and traveled by private jet to Kansas at 5 a.m. the next day.

The news hit the quarterback-starved NFL hard. Favre is the newest star in the NFL galaxy, a fresh-faced 26-year-old savior with Bradshawesque leadership skills, charisma and Deep South backwoods likability. Outside of the Dallas Cowboys' Troy Aikman and Emmitt Smith, he's probably the most significant player in football, both for what he has done on the field at a young age and for what he means to the league long-term. Many of the NFL's star quarterbacks, including John Elway, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino and Warren Moon, are in the twilight of their careers, and most of the Generation Xers -- Drew Bledsoe, Trent Dilfer, Rick Mirer, Heath Shuler et al. -- are struggling to make an impact. Not Favre. In the last two seasons he has thrown 71 touchdown passes, including a team-record 38 in 1995. His two-TD machine-gunning of the San Francisco 49ers in a 27-17 playoff victory last January put the Packers in the NFC Championship Game, their first title contest in 28 years, which they lost to Dallas 38-27.

But in building the longest starting streak among active quarterbacks, 68 games, Favre has paid a painful price. He has had five operations in the last six years, dating back to a July 1990 car accident before his senior season at Southern Mississippi. "Brett's not coming out of the game unless a bone's sticking out," said Ty Detmer, his Packer backup of four years, who signed with the Philadelphia Eagles in the off-season.

Like many pro football players Favre would -- almost without thinking -- take a numbing injection or a painkilling pill to get through a game. It's tough to determine just how widespread this practice is, because painkillers aren't detected in annual NFL drug screenings. But in the wake of Favre's revelation, Robert Huizenga, a former team doctor for the Oakland Raiders and a past president of the NFL Physicians Society, said, "This is not an isolated incident. We want people to play hurt, and when someone doesn't play hurt, he's no longer our hero. We need a system where a physician, without fear of losing his job, can say to an athlete, 'The injury is not healed. You cannot play.'"

As he walked out of the Chicago Bears' training complex last Thursday carrying a small box of club-prescribed anti-inflammatory pills for a bulging disk in his back, linebacker Bryan Cox said that he thought half of the players in the NFL needed painkillers or anti-inflammatories to make it through a season. Phil Simms, who quarterbacked the New York Giants for 14 seasons before retiring in 1993, estimated that each NFL team would need a roster of 250 players to make it through a season if games were played with only healthy, nonmedicated players.

"I'm sure there are a ton of NFL players out there -- I mean it, a ton -- who'll watch me come out and say to themselves, 'Man, that's me,'" Favre said last week. "That's one reason I'm talking. I hope I can help some players get help. I realize now how dangerous it is to keep using these things."

It didn't seem so dangerous to Favre when he first experienced the wonder of painkilling medication, in his seventh NFL start, on Nov. 15, 1992, against Philadelphia. A second-year player at the time, he had separated his nonthrowing shoulder in the first quarter, and the pain was so intense that he didn't think he could go on. "I saw [backup] Don Majkowski rarin' to go, and if he'd gotten back in there, I may never have gotten my spot back," Favre said. "At halftime the doctors said, 'It's your choice, but we can shoot it up [with Novocain] without further injury.' I said, 'Let's do it.' They had to pull my shoulder out, and they stuck the needle way down in my shoulder. In a little while I didn't feel any pain. I played well, and we won the game. I thought, damn, that was easy."

He was thinking much the same thing in the wake of surgery in January 1995 to repair a herniated muscle in his right side. Doctors estimated it would take 12 months for the muscle to heal normally; Favre played a preseason game less than eight months after the surgery.

As the injuries mounted during the 1995 season, Favre began using Vicodin heavily. By Week 7 he had a throbbing turf toe, a bruised right shoulder, an arthritic right hip, a bruised left knee and a sore lower back. "I knew there was something wrong," Tynes said last Saturday. "He'd ask me to ask friends for Vicodin, but I wasn't going to do that."

Favre said he believed he was hiding his addiction well, but Tynes, then-Packers quarterbacks coach Steve Mariucci, and best friends and teammates Mark Chmura and Frank Winters sensed late in the season that he had a serious problem. Mariucci even told the Green Bay training staff to monitor Favre's Vicodin use. However, according to Tynes and Favre's agent, Bus Cook, in addition to the prescribed doses he received from the team, Favre also scored Vicodin from teammates who didn't finish their prescriptions and from doctors outside the organization, including one who had treated him for a past ailment. "I started finding pills everywhere," Tynes said. "I'd catch him throwing up so badly, I'd be looking for blood. And he didn't come to bed at a normal time all season long. He'd just sit there in front of the TV for hours. Sometimes I'd wake up at four o'clock and find him in front of the TV or playing solitaire on the computer. I'd say, 'What's wrong with you? You've got meetings at eight, and you haven't been to bed.'"

Despite the heavy use of painkillers, Favre was playing the best football of his life, and that complicated Tynes's efforts to get him to quit taking the pills. He was also working out like a madman with strength coach Kent Johnston. "I'm in the best shape of my life," he said in October. When Tynes would beg him to stop -- she flushed down the toilet countless pills she found in his hiding places -- he would reply, "Why should I stop what's helping me get through this?"

Said Chmura, Green Bay's Pro Bowl tight end, "We'd tell him time and again: 'You've got to cut this out.' But players think they're invincible, and Brett was no different. He'd be fine for the games because I think he didn't do much of it on the weekend. But some weekday nights he'd be zapped."

Tynes, whose relationship with Favre dates back to 1985, said she considered leaving Favre but worried that he might increase his Vicodin consumption if she did. Finally, at the Pro Bowl in early February, she demanded that he quit taking the pills. Favre promised he would. He didn't. At the ESPY Awards in New York on Feb. 12, she noticed that despite the fact he had not been drinking, he was slurring his words more and more as the night went on. When they returned to their hotel room Tynes confronted Favre. "Why are you acting like this? What have you been taking?" she said.

"I took a couple of Vicodins," he said.

"A couple? No way!" she said angrily.

"Well, five or six," he said.

"How many? Tell me the truth!"

"Thirteen."

Later, Tynes said Favre told a doctor he was in pain and that the Packers usually prescribed Vicodin for it. According to Tynes, the doctor wrote him a prescription for 30 pills and four refills.

"I was worried he was going to die," Tynes said.

She called Gray to tell him of Favre's dependency. Yet only after the seizure did Favre realize that getting professional help was the only way out.

For the next 2 1/2 months Favre was on a roller coaster, confronting the addiction in sessions with his NFL-assigned counselors in Chicago and New Orleans. Tynes said Favre has beaten himself up emotionally. In one down moment he told her, "I may be a successful football player, but I feel like such a failure. How could I let this happen?"

"He told me he could feel we were disappointed in him," said Chmura on Friday. "He told me if it took not drinking for two years to help beat this, he'd do it. I told him, 'No problem. We'll just drink Coke with our pizza instead of Miller Lite.'"

"Maybe I'll find out in two years I can drink," said Favre, who after he leaves rehab will be subjected to as many as 10 unannounced urine tests a month for drugs and alcohol. "I don't know. But I'll find out. That's what this treatment is for." Tynes, who was prompted to quit drinking as a result of Favre's problems, said that all alcohol will be removed from their Green Bay house. Among other things, that means emptying the rec room refrigerator, which was stocked with only one thing: light beer.

Oddly enough Favre may get help in fighting his addiction from the negotiation of a new contract with Green Bay. His current deal expires after the 1998 season, but the Packers are talking about extending it into the 21st century. The Pack may try to tie a significant bonus clause to a stipulation that Favre, who splits his time between Green Bay and his hometown of Kiln, Miss., make his off-season home in Wisconsin.

NFL player after NFL player last week expressed sympathy for Favre, who was worried he would be cast as a druggie if he stepped forward and admitted his addiction. "I'm not blaming anyone," he said. "It's my fault. The only reason I ever did this was because I had to. Had to. I had to play. Injuries have cost a lot of guys their jobs in this league, and there was no way an injury was ever going to cost me my job. Then it just got out of hand."

Said Arizona Cardinals quarterback Boomer Esiason, "The worst thing in this league is getting an injury tag. I hope this opens the eyes of some players, but I doubt anyone will show the guts Brett showed in standing up there and admitting his problem."

After his news conference Favre spent much of the night on the phone calling stunned friends. Only once in his conversation with SI did his voice dip a few octaves and show how deeply his tough outer shell has been dented. "I'm 26 years old, I just threw 38 touchdown passes in one year, and I'm the NFL MVP," he said. "People look at me and say, 'I'd love to be that guy.' But if they knew what it took to be that guy, they wouldn't love to be him, I can guarantee you that. I'm entering a treatment center tomorrow. Would they love that?"

Counselors denied Favre's request to delay reporting to rehab so he could host the first Brett Favre Celebrity Golf Tournament in Gulfport, Miss. The event went on without him last Friday and Saturday at the Windance Country Club. Tynes was there. As she sat in a golf cart under a shade tree near the 18th green, she talked about why she had hope for Favre. "A couple of years ago Brett told me he wanted to be the best quarterback in the NFL," she said. "He committed himself to it, and he did it. He'll commit himself to this. He knows his career and his life are at stake."

Tynes wiped her eyes. She took a deep breath. She sniffled a few times. "You know," she said, "he's changed already. He talks to me again. He takes Brittany and me out. He pays attention to us. A few days ago he hugged me and he thanked me for everything I've done, and he said some really nice things to me."

She wiped her eyes again. "I said, 'I can't believe it. The old Brett's back!'"

Time will tell. The true test will start in September.

So until someone shows me other wise I am going to stand by what I learned about all of this that he didn't abuse Vicodin with the Falcons or in college and the Falcons and Glanville just didn't like the party animal that was Brett Favre. Glanville in Particular was the problem. And in fact lost a lot of friends and could have lost his NFL career over the whole thing.

spiralism

neilster wrote: »

You are a broncos fan so i will beg to your opinion on this one but apart from Dumervil and Ayers gone and a banged up Clady , Denver are missing 3 more starters on defense ? are they not ...who are the others and is it all on the OLINE?

On top of Ayers and Doom, We're down Vickerson (very solid starting DE/DT), Perrish Cox, Darcel McBath (competes with Hill for starting safety alongside Dawkins) and Wesley Woodyard (backup linebacker and good special teamer). We were also down a starting CB in Goodman up until this week and Dawkins missed the last 2 matches as well.

Basically that meant that against oakland we had 7th rounder sydquan thompson across from champ bailey with UDFA cassius vaughn in the nickel while nate jones (a shi*e cb) was playing safety. meanwhile we were down 3 of our starting front 7 and couldnt stop the run either because of that.

it's still no excuse though but it helps explain things somewhat.

A lot is down to the oline. we can't run at all and our pass protection is inconsistent. having 2 rookies on the OL doesn't help, and especially so when the O Line coach isnt any good

neilster

So until someone shows me other wise I am going to stand by what I learned about all of this that he didn't abuse Vicodin with the Falcons or in college and the Falcons and Glanville just didn't like the party animal that was Brett Favre. Glanville in Particular was the problem. And in fact lost a lot of friends and could have lost his NFL career over the whole thing....[/QUOTE]


very good article , yeah Glanville and Brett just didnt work .....funny how the bum ankle rears its head ...and also that even after being MVP and all the money in the world and several years at the top.....Deanna is still not Mrs Favre....maybe the wild boy was hard to tame (im going to get slated for this ) and im not even going to mention that other Jets female employee cos until there is more detail it looks like a shake-down and as Jason Cole said in an article the Famous NFL Quarterback Monogamous Club is a very very small club

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

I know what scouts look at and I know they include the players personal lives i.e partying etc etc. What is your point with that? It was common knowledge Favre liked to Party in college, in fact he got into trouble a lot during his Freshman and Sophomore years for it. It was obvious Glanville didn't like Favre because of Favre's attitude and lifestyle during his college year. But what I am saying to is on the drugs point, is that from what I have learned and that is me personally is from the media back then and friends and fellow football folk over the years that there was never any solid proof on the Drugs thing. Now if you have any other evidence 100% disputing what I just said as I said I stand corrected and respect your opinion.




To be honest with you we went through Cutler and Orton and the Bears in another thread and I personally don't want to open up that can of worms again. I don't understand why you want to hear my opinion of them anyways. What bearing has that on this discussion. I care less for them and really couldn't bothered getting into another discussion about Cutler and the Bears. Best thing to do is go find that thread if you want to see my opinion on the bears.

That guy last night was right on this ....maybe u should chill out and not find an argument where there isnt any to find ....i am'nt disputing the painkillers in Green Bay thing so chill , you sound just cutting one second and then two lines later mention "respecting an opinion " as if this has died down ...now lets throw a grenade in again ...ditto with the comments and cultler vs orton

the chilled out thing to say would be we covered that already ,

your comment 'I care less for them and really couldn't bothered getting into another discussion about Cutler and the Bears. Best thing to do is go find that thread if you want to see my opinion on the bears.'

this is the Thread: The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter


wont bother you again

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

That guy last night was right on this ....maybe u should chill out and not find an argument where there isnt any to find ....i am'nt disputing the painkillers in Green Bay thing so chill , you sound just cutting one second and then two lines later mention "respecting an opinion " as if this has died down ...now lets throw a grenade in again ...ditto with the comments and cultler vs orton

Chill out? got to love when people say that on the net when a debate is going on.

As for the Favre thing you clearly said and I quote in the context of players leaving the team that drafted them:

neilster wrote: »

as for Brees and Favre they were first round picks and u know that there were pretty special circumstances on those two situations ..namely Rivers and a Vicodin problem

Pretty self explanatory. So now you are backtracking on something YOU brought up. But hey good man I will chill out and leave that one for you. I guess I am only trying to find an argument that isnt there right? :rolleyes:

your comment 'I care less for them and really couldn't bothered getting into another discussion about Cutler and the Bears. Best thing to do is go find that thread if you want to see my opinion on the bears.'

this is the Thread: The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter
wont bother you again

As for this grow up. There was a huge Cutler V Orton thread in the AF section and my feelings on the Bears and Cutler are in the majority of that thread. If you want my opinion on the Bears go there and look. Without looking back through this thread the Cutler and Orton debate never happened in here with regards the Bears. But two threads that definitely do are here:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055703141&

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055528887&

You want my opinion on the Bears you go to the above threads and start there. I couldn't be bothered debating that one again. If that is not to your liking well then there is nothing I can do.

Oh and I thanked you to show you the love

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Chill out? got to love when people say that on the net when a debate is going on.

As for the Favre thing you clearly said and I quote in the context of players leaving the team that drafted them:



Pretty self explanatory. So now you are backtracking on something YOU brought up. But hey good man I will chill out and leave that one for you. I guess I am only trying to find an argument that isnt there right? :rolleyes:




As for this grow up. There was a huge Cutler V Orton thread in the AF section and my feelings on the Bears and Cutler are in the majority of that thread. If you want my opinion on the Bears go there and look. Without looking back through this thread the Cutler and Orton debate never happened in here with regards the Bears. But two threads that definitely do are here:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055703141&

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055528887&

You want my opinion on the Bears you go to the above threads and start there. I couldn't be bothered debating that one again. If that is not to your liking well then there is nothing I can do.

Oh and I thanked you to show you the love

love to hear your views on the Tom Brady & justin Bieber and chill out man

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

love to hear your views on the Tom Brady & justin Bieber and chill out man

So i take it you wont be defending the fact You brought up Favre's addiction in Atlanta then?

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

So i take it you wont be defending the fact You brought up Favre's addiction in Atlanta then?

i think you will find that i qualified it in a post a long ways back that the word "addictions" as opposed to Vicodin addictions might be more appropriate in Atlanta ...Glanville not liking the way Favre conducted himself just wasnt it i think

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

i think you will find that i qualified it in a post a long ways back that the word "addictions" as opposed to Vicodin addictions might be more appropriate in Atlanta ...Glanville not liking the way Favre conducted himself just wasnt it i think

Oh I see so at 8.39 last night you were adamant that it was the Vicodin

neilster wrote: »

You might like to mention Vicodin as a Wisconsin only ill for Favre but it is commonly known that Favre had addiction problems in Atlanta ...because Glanville doesnt want to be quoted as saying it and cos journos dont print it ....doesnt make your version so...as for Glanville he has tried to re-write history ever since Favre .....and i wouldnt quote him on naything Favre related


.....The Sterger issue lately has brought up roundabout mentions of these Georgia problems

Then at lunch time today you covered all bases by saying:

neilster wrote: »

The stuff from the Atlanta days with Favre was a mix of things....generally great college scouting reports before he got there but jocklike stuff late at night , curfews, busts covered up ...not enough to move a great QB down the draft but getting close and then in Atlanta more of the same but awful lot of hard-drinking

again love to hear your take on the Bears

So to say you weren't disputing the painkillers thing it seemed last night you were. See if you stick to one story we could have avoided all of this now couldn't we? Instead you chose to tell me my events were wrong of the Favre Vicodin thing and then you wonder why I am debating with you into the next day.

To be honest I was hoping you would show me something to show I was actually wrong about it as I was a teenager when Favre went from Atlanta to Green Bay so I can only go on memory and what people and the media have told me back then and now. I was hoping for more insight.

Peyton Manning

Archimedes wrote: »

Ah yeah I'm sure, it gave me extra interest in keeping track of the Vikings games so I'm happy enough with that anyway. Tell you what, to make it interesting next week, if the Pats win next week, I get to design a Tom Brady signature you have to use for the rest of the regular season, and if the Vikes win, then you get to design a Brett Favre sig for me. You up for it? :pac::p

Hulk Hands wrote: »

Deal! That will be quite funny, especially as so many of your posts contain the following 3 characters....

Favre

Interception

:D:D

Sorry man, but a deal's a deal. I assume you know how to put this into your sig...

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

Oh I see so at 8.39 last night you were adamant that it was the Vicodin



Then at lunch time today you covered all bases by saying:



So to say you weren't disputing the painkillers thing it seemed last night you were. See if you stick to one story we could have avoided all of this now couldn't we? Instead you chose to tell me my events were wrong of the Favre Vicodin thing and then you wonder why I am debating with you into the next day.

To be honest I was hoping you would show me something to show I was actually wrong about it as I was a teenager when Favre went from Atlanta to Green Bay so I can only go on memory and what people and the media have told me back then and now. I was hoping for more insight.

Due to the rate of activity on this thread decreasing inversely proportional to the increase in your posts yesterday maybe we should move on but just let me answer these one by one

- I didnt have a post at 18.39 ..it was 17.05 and two at 23.33 so maybe you made a typo

this is my statement "You might like to mention Vicodin as a Wisconsin only ill for Favre but it is commonly known that Favre had addiction problems in Atlanta ...because Glanville doesnt want to be quoted "

not Vicodin problems ...addiction problems i am saying that people might like to make addiction and favre as starting in wisconsin..i wouldnt ...im not talking vicodin addiction

...he has compulsive personality ...a born winner but the shrinks would have a field day

so that is end of that really

one last thing want to call you out on your reply on the Bills previously to another poster

This season and in Camp the Bills have worked with Fitzpatrick and he has gotten to know the WR a lot better. Also if you read through the reports for the Bills camp it was suggested many times the Fitzpatrick should have started this season without question."

these are the stats for the reciever corps and tight end grouping

Evans - 286 yrds 6 games WR1 7th season
Donald Jones - 0 yds WR3 rookie
Roscoe Parrish - 274 yds 6 games WR2 6th season
Steve Johnson - 374 yds 6 games WR4 2nd yr
J Stupar = 7yds TE 2nd yr
D Martin - TE2 2 yds 9 yr veteran

Fitzy took no primary offence snaps this camp cos he was QB3 on the depth chart coming into camp and leaving it . This means that he did not take any reps with Evans , Parrish or Stupar . He would have had 50% of the snaps with the 2nd offence grouping sharing the load with Brohm . So he would have seen some snaps with Johnson , Jones and Martin but again cos of the nature of a camp and how rookies have to make every rep count and emerge later on , Johnson would have been emerging later in camp thereby negating the impact of these reps

So where exactly was this great chance to achieve chemistry in camp. You gave this as a reason for an advance by RFitz but surely the 4 games on-the-job is where it has been achieved and this reason is very debatable if not bogus so maybe we should move away from the pharmalogical to the logical?

tallaghtoutlaws

neilster wrote: »

where it has been achieved and this reason is very debatable if not bogus so maybe we should move away from the pharmalogical to the logical?

I did have a reply all lined up for you until I got to the end of your post and I fook it not worth the effort. Seems you are just looking for an argument now at this point. Quite ironic really. Oh and I thought you said you were done replying to me? :rolleyes:

Chucky the tree

Moss trying his best to make himself feel all loved again in Minnesota...

FOXBOROUGH, Mass. -- The moment Randy Moss announced to a gang of reporters in the locker room that he planned to speak at the podium, a buzz began to circulate that something wild was about to happen.

Moss didn't disappointment.

During a rambling 5-minute monologue shortly after the Minnesota Vikings' 28-18 loss to his old team, the enigmatic receiver announced he wouldn't answer another question from a reporter this season, implied that coaches didn't heed his game-planning advice and all but begged the New England Patriots to re-sign him in the offseason.

Moss finished with one catch for 8 yards in his first game at Gillette Stadium since the Patriots traded him for a third-round draft pick on Oct. 6. He officially was targeted twice, although Brett Favre simply was throwing the other ball out of the end zone.

The Patriots made sure to limit his impact, playing safety Brandon Meriweather deep over the top on Moss' side of the field on almost every snap. And the ploy worked, not only shutting down Moss but frustrating him enough that he strode to the podium and unleashed the following:

"Well, I'm going to go ahead and start this thing off. I'm going to go ahead and say this. I feel like I said something a couple of weeks ago. Look, I got fined 25,000 dollars for not talking to you all, and me personally, I really don't care. But at the same time, I do ... answer questions throughout the week, and for the league to fine me 25,000 dollars -- I'm not going to answer any more questions for the rest of this year. If it's going to be an interview, I'm going to conduct it. So, I'll answer my own questions, ask myself the questions and then give you all the answers. So, from here on out, I'm not answering any more questions for the rest of this season.

"Enough said of that. Now we get to the game. (deep breath) Trying, trying, trying to ... ah, let me hold it down. All right. I really haven't had a chance to really talk to the guys, so this was no disrespect to the Minnesota Vikings and their organization. The captains -- (Vince) Wilfork, Tommy Boy (Brady), (Jerod) Mayo. Am I forgetting somebody? Kevin Faulk. Man, I miss them guys, man. I miss the team. It was hard for me to come here and play. Been an up-and-down rollercoaster emotionally all week. And then to be able to come in here and see those guys running plays that I know what they're doing, and the success they had on the field, the running game -- so, I kind of know what kind of feeling they have in their locker room, man, and I just want to be able to tell the guys that I miss the hell out of them. Every last helmet in that locker room, man.

"I mean, Deion Branch came up to me after the game, and I've never really had a chance to meet Deion Branch, but it was definitely a pleasure to meet him. Coach(Bill) Belichick, he gave me an opportunity to be a part of something special, and that's something I really take to heart. I actually salute Coach Belichick and his team for the success they've had before me, during me and after me. So, I'm actually stuck for words, just because the fact that -- man, this is just a lot of memories here.

"To the New England Patriots fans, that ovation at the end of the game -- that really felt heartwarming. I think I actually shedded a tear for that. But like I said, man, it's been an emotional rollercoaster this whole week. I tried to prepare. Tried to talk to the players and coaches about how this game was going to be played and a couple tendencies here, couple tendencies here. The bad part about it -- you have six days to prepare for a team, and on the seventh day, that Sunday, meaning today, I guess they come over to me and say, 'Dag, Moss, you was right about a couple plays and a couple schemes they were going to run.' It hurts as a player that you put a lot of hard work in all week, and toward the end of the week, Sunday, when you get on the field, that's when they acknowledge about the hard work you put in throughout the week. That's actually a disappointment.

"I can't really say enough about this team, this organization. I met with Ms. Kraft before the game, because I really didn't have a chance to talk to her before I left, and I just thanked Ms. Kraft for the opportunity to let me be a part of something special. The New England Patriots has always been a special organization and I've always watched from afar, and when I got drafted by Minnesota (in 1998), and I think I said this a couple weeks ago, I felt obligated to try to bring a Super Bowl to Minnesota. And this season's still not over.

"Do I know what next season and the future's going to bring? No, I do not. But all I can say is, man, it's a lot of work that we leave on the field each day. It's a lot of film study that we leave in that room each day. I know how hard these guys work here in New England, and (all) that I really tried to do is take what the best coach in football history has brought upon me, or the knowledge that he's given me about the game of football, and I tried to just sprinkle it off to the guys the best way I know how.

"So, I'm going to go ahead and end this, this interview. I have my family to see. Definitely down that we lost this game, because I didn't really expect for us to lose this game knowing that we had a few things that we had to clean up. But like I said, they played a good game. I wish we could have had that three at the end of the half. Maybe could have been different, maybe not. ...

"I don't know how many more times I'm going to be up here in New England, but I'm going to leave the New England Patriots, Coach Belichick, man, with a salute, man. I love you guys, I miss you, I'm out."

neilster

tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »

I did have a reply all lined up for you until I got to the end of your post and I fook it not worth the effort. Seems you are just looking for an argument now at this point. Quite ironic really. Oh and I thought you said you were done replying to me? :rolleyes:

I think you are just tired of all that highlighting you do ....awful tiring ...dont worry ...i take it as a compliment ...if you had any ammo you'd be firing

Couldnt resist like Tebow for McDaniels ...you are a project ...to get you all chilled out

Peyton Manning

Great to hear from Moss, kind of puts all those people who thought there was a falling out to shame.

Chucky the tree

Archimedes wrote: »

Great to hear from Moss, kind of puts all those people who thought there was a falling out to shame.

Does it? I mean you still have to ask yourself why they got rid of him if everything was rosey in the garden. I wouldn't be surprised if he throw his toys out with Bill and now obviously hugely regrets it. Obviously a long shot, but it could be his way to mend some bridges in an attempt to go back to the Pats next year.

Syferus

Archimedes wrote: »

Great to hear from Moss, kind of puts all those people who thought there was a falling out to shame.

I think no one can deny the fact Moss was seriously disconerted by the Patriots intimating they wouldn't be offering him a new contract, at least not one when he wanted it nor to a value he'd placed on himself. There was some professional friction there regardless of how many nice words either side says. I'd also think he's wishing he'd tried harder to play out his contract in NE given rather than going back home to Minnesota. Moss desperately wants a ring and the Patriots certainly look the better bet to make the business end of the season.

'Enigmatic' is the nice way of saying his ego means he needs lead wieghts to not float into space.

eagle eye

neilster wrote: »

I think you are just tired of all that highlighting you do ....awful tiring ...dont worry ...i take it as a compliment ...if you had any ammo you'd be firing

Couldnt resist like Tebow for McDaniels ...you are a project ...to get you all chilled out

Have you provided any links to back up what you say about Favre in Atlanta? Because I'm looking at what you are saying and I think you are making it up as you go along.

On Fitzpatrick, while I don't think he is gonna do it long term he is doing it right now and until such time as he falters there is no use continuing this. Its just going round in circles now.

eagle eye

Syferus wrote: »

I think no one can deny the fact Moss was miffed about the Patriots intimating they wouldn't be offering him a new contract, at least not one when he wanted it or to a value he'd be happy with. There was some professional friction there regardless of how many nice words either side says. I'd also think he's wishing he'd tried harder to play out his contract in NE given rather than going back hoem to Minnesota. Moss desperately wants a ring and the Patriots certainly look the better bet to make the business end of the season.

'Enigmatic' is the nice way of saying his ego means he needs lead wieghts to not float into space.

From what Phil Simms said tonight it sounded like Moss had nothing to do with the trade at all. Simms said that when he asked him about it a couple of weeks back that Moss said he kinda smelled it coming which would suggest that he didn't look to be traded at all.

Syferus

eagle eye wrote: »

From what Phil Simms said tonight it sounded like Moss had nothing to do with the trade at all. Simms said that when he asked him about it a couple of weeks back that Moss said he kinda smelled it coming which would suggest that he didn't look to be traded at all.

Yeah, it'd appear the idea of a trade was engineered by the Patriots rather than by Moss who I'd assume didn't expect them to see much value in trading him mid-season. Who knows what'll happen next season, but engimatic Randy will surely keep everyone needing to fill column space entertained in the off-season.

Juwwi

Lads what is a buy week?

is it just a week off and how many do u have in a season?

thanks

Peyton Manning

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Does it? I mean you still have to ask yourself why they got rid of him if everything was rosey in the garden. I wouldn't be surprised if he throw his toys out with Bill and now obviously hugely regrets it. Obviously a long shot, but it could be his way to mend some bridges in an attempt to go back to the Pats next year.

Well people were believing reports that Moss ignored Belichick on the flight home from Miami. Belichick called it BS, and Moss has pretty much done the same with the kind words he had for his old stomping ground. Don't believe everything you read on ESPN.

Syferus

robbie1977 wrote: »

Lads what is a buy week?

is it just a week off and how many do u have in a season?

thanks

Each team has one week of the 17 weeks of the regular season off, a 'bye' week. Last week there were four teams off, this week there's six.

Peyton Manning

Edit: Never mind, post was deleted