The Weird, Wacky and Awesome World of the NFL - General Banter thread

rockonollie

I'm pretty sure it's only 4

Bears, Lions, Dolphins, Ravens

Paully D

Interesting read on the Seahawks defense with the suggestion that they get away with a lot of fouling and have the mantra of ''the refs will throw one flag but not ten.'' Mike Pereria also comments

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303754404579310500005285822

On Saturday, the New Orleans Saints take their flashy passing offense up to dreaded Seattle. We wish them the best of luck with that.

The Seattle Seahawks—the favorites to make the Super Bowl out of the NFC—employ an exasperating defensive game plan: They blitz rarely and drop an army of defenders into pass coverage. And those defenders mug, obstruct and foul opposing receivers on practically every play.

Quietly, the Seahawks have achieved a 13-3 record and home-field advantage throughout the NFC playoffs by exploiting a loophole: NFL referees are reluctant to throw endless flags for pass interference and defensive holding, even if defenses deserve them.

"They look at it and say, 'We may get called for one but not 10,'" said Mike Pereira, a former NFL vice president of officiating who is now a Fox analyst.

League insiders say this divisional-round matchup between the Seahawks and Saints, the NFC's top passing offense, may be Seattle's rule-bending masterpiece.

"They just seem to not care about the rules," said New York Giants wide receiver Louis Murphy, whose team was routed 23-0 by Seattle this season.

The Seahawks' success is widely attributed to the outstanding play of quarterback Russell Wilson and the earsplitting din of CenturyLink Field, their home stadium. Seattle's backbone remains its defense, which led the NFL this season in points allowed and yards allowed (the latter by far). The strategic idea behind that defense is uncommonly aggressive pass coverage.

The Seahawks had the most pass-interference penalties in the league this season—13, or nearly one per game. Defensive pass interference, a spot foul that comes with an automatic first down, is called when a defender impedes a receiver while the ball is in the air. If the ball isn't airborne, grabbing a receiver more than five yards downfield merits a defensive-holding penalty. The Seahawks have 10 of those this season.

There is a certain brilliance to this approach: Since 2001, nine teams have committed 20 or more of these penalties (including this season's Seahawks). None of them had a losing record, and most of them won big.

So many pass-interference plays meant that many more of them went uncalled, choking the life out of opposing offenses in a pass-dependent league—a big advantage for Seattle's physical brand of defense, led by hulking cornerbacks such as 6-foot-3 star Richard Sherman.

The Seahawks didn't respond to requests for comment, but defensive coordinator Dan Quinn said earlier this season that the Seattle coaches educate their players on what type of interference plays are being called around the league.

"We challenge and we play at the line and we like that style," he said.

Expect the no-calls to get worse in the playoffs. This season, NFL officials called 12.2 penalties a game, but in last week's wild-card round, they called 7.8. There has been a 41% drop in postseason penalties since the 2008 playoffs, while in the regular season, penalties are up 8.9% in that time.

Pereira said aggressive pass-coverage teams like Seattle "test" referees early in the game with a few potentially obvious pass-interference infractions. "They want to see what kind of tone the officials are going to set," he said, adding that he expects to see a couple of penalties called but also the usual brand of Seahawks grabbing.

Game-film analysis reveals plenty of instances in which more penalties could have been called. Facing a third-and-10 on the first possession of their Week 5 matchup with Seattle, the Indianapolis Colts called for a pass to star receiver Reggie Wayne. As soon as the ball was snapped, Wayne was engulfed in a bear hug by Seahawks cornerback Brandon Browner, who proceeded to grab the Colts receiver by his shoulder pads, spin him around and force Andrew Luck's pass to fall incomplete.

The Seahawks' defense adopted a similar strategy early in a Week 8 victory over the St. Louis Rams. On their opening drive, the Rams faced a third-and-6 from their own 38. Rams receiver Tavon Austin ran a short curl route and was immediately clobbered by Seahawks safety Earl Thomas. There was only one problem: The ball hadn't even left the quarterback's hand. Kellen Clemens threw the pass anyway, Austin's arms were pinned to his sides and the Rams were forced to punt.

Former Seahawks quarterback Brock Huard, now a radio host for ESPN Radio in Seattle, said the contact between receivers and the Seahawks' defensive backs forces offenses to change their entire game plan. For instance, basic routes like the skinny post, on which a receiver bounces slightly toward the middle of the field (in the direction of the goal post), must be scrapped because receivers can't accelerate fast enough after contact.

Even if the receivers do get to full speed, the long arms of defensive backs such as Sherman simply poke the ball away if a pass is anywhere near them. That goes for "vertical" routes, too, the straight-ahead patterns that are a favorite of the Saints, the Seahawks' opponent Saturday.

Former Seahawks quarterback Warren Moon said the only way to combat the grabby defensive backs is by running plenty of slant-and-go routes and other patterns that involve receivers making cuts. The idea is to get the defense's big cornerbacks on the move and hamper their ability to get their hands on a receiver.

Waiting for the officials to save you isn't a strategy. "If you think they're going to be called and expect that to be the solution to the problem, you're going to be sadly mistaken," said former Giants offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride, who said the Seahawks' persistent interference happens on nearly every play. "They've perfected the art."

Something worth keeping an eye on against the Saints.

davyjose

rockonollie wrote: »

I'm pretty sure it's only 4

Bears, Lions, Dolphins, Ravens

Jags?

Syferus

davyjose wrote: »

Jags?

Garrard made the Pro Bowl in 2009.

davyjose

Paully D wrote: »

Interesting read on the Seahawks defense with the suggestion that they get away with a lot of fouling and have the mantra of ''the refs will throw one flag but not ten.'' Mike Pereria also comments

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303754404579310500005285822



Something worth keeping an eye on against the Saints.

Really can't blame them if the refs are letting them away with it.

Kev8360

Syferus wrote: »

Garrard made the Pro Bowl in 2009.

Redskins haven't had a Pro-Bowl QB in the 2000's yet

rockonollie

Kev8360 wrote: »

Redskins haven't had a Pro-Bowl QB in the 2000's yet

RG3 last year

vetinari

Reads like sour grapes. It's already a pass happy league as it is!

Paully D wrote: »

Interesting read on the Seahawks defense with the suggestion that they get away with a lot of fouling and have the mantra of ''the refs will throw one flag but not ten.'' Mike Pereria also comments

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303754404579310500005285822



Something worth keeping an eye on against the Saints.

raze_them_all_

how is it sour grapes? It is true, anyone can see they are a very physical D.

spiralism

Since realignment five teams have played a divisional rival for a third time that season in the playoffs in a rubber match (San Diego @ Denver will, of course, be the 6th such matchup). All previous rubber match winners made the Super Bowl.

10 Packers: Bears x 3 (2-1 Packers that season) - Won Superbowl 45
10 Steelers: Ravens x 3 (3-0 Steelers)- Lost Superbowl 45
08 Steelers: Ravens x 3 (3-0 Steelers)- Won Superbowl 43
07 Giants: Dallas x 3 (2-1 Dallas)- Won Superbowl 42
05 Steelers: Bengals x 3 (2-1 Steelers)- Won Superbowl 40

Pre alignment it goes back quite some way too, though with less divisions it was far more likely to meet a divisional rival in the playoffs. 5 most recent examples there:

00 Ravens : Titans x 3 (2-1 Ravens) - Won Superbowl 35
99 Titans: Jags x 3 (3-0 Titans) (only team to beat Jacksonville that year, notably) - Lost Superbowl 34
98 Falcons: 49ers x 3 (2-1 Falcons) - Lost Superbowl 33
97 Broncos: Chiefs x 3 (2-1 Broncos)- Won Superbowl 32
97 Packers: Tampa x 3 (3-0 Packers) - Lost Superbowl 32

rockonollie

Chicago Bears: ----
Arizona Cardinals: Kurt Warner 2008
Green Bay Packers: Brett Favre 2001-2003, 2007, Aaron Rodgers 2009, 2011-2012
New York Giants: Eli Manning 2008, 2011-2012
Detroit Lions: ---
Washington Redskins: Robert Griffin III 2012
Pittsburgh Steelers: Kordell Stewart 2001, Ben Roethlisberger 2007, 2011
Philadelphia Eagles: Donovan McNabb 2000-2004, 2009, Michael Vick 2010
St. Louis Rams: Kurt Warner 2000-2001, Marc Bulger 2003, 2006
San Francisco 49ers: Jeff Garcia 2000-2002
Cleveland Browns: Derek Anderson 2007
Indianapolis Colts: Peyton Manning 2000, 2003-2010, Andrew Luck 2012
Dallas Cowboys: Tony Romo 2006-2007, 2009
Oakland Raiders: Rich Gannon 2000-2002
New England Patriots: Tom Brady 2001, 2004-2005, 2007, 2009-2013
Tennessee Titans: Steve McNair 2000, 2003, 2005, Steve Young 2006, 2009, Kerry Collins 2008
Denver Broncos: Brian Griese 2000, Jay Cutler 2008, Peyton Manning 2012-2013
San Diego Chargers: Drew Brees 2004, Phillip Rivers 2006, 2009-2011, 2013
New York Jets: Brett Favre 2008
Kansas City Chiefs: Elvis Grbac 2000, Trent Green 2003, 2005, Matt Cassel 2010
Buffalo Bills: Drew Bledsoe 2002
Minnesota Vikings: Daunte Culpepper 2000, 2004, Brett Favre 2009
Miami Dolphins: ----
Atlanta Falcons: Michael Vick 2002, 2004-2005, Matt Ryan 2010, 2012
New Orleans Saints: Drew Brees 2006, 2008-2013
Cincinnati Bengals: Carson Palmer 2005-2006, Andy Dalton 2012
Seattle Seahawks: Matt Hasselbeck 2003, 2005, 2007, Russell Wilson 2012, 2013
Tampa Bay Buccaneers: Brad Johnson 2002, Jeff Garcia 2007
Jacksonville Jaguars: David Garrard 2009
Carolina Panthers: Jake Delhomme 2005, Cam Newton 2011, 2013
Baltimore Ravens: ----
Houston Texans: Matt Schaub 2009, 2012

Realt Dearg Sec

Billy86 wrote: »

Lacy was backup on the All Pro 2nd team - so after McCoy, Charles and Peterson he was indeed fourth best.

Can anybody find any stats whatsoever that would justify lacy going all pro ahead of Matt forte? I haven't seen any. Terrible decision.

Langdon Alger

I didn't realise Derrick Coleman the Seahawks fullback was deaf

Billy86

That's absolutely amazing.

raze_them_all_

Billy86 wrote: »

That's absolutely amazing.

it's really not tbh once he has hearing with the hearing aids, a cousin of mine is deaf and plays gaa. I know it's not professional, but it can be done easily enough

Billy86

raze_them_all_ wrote: »

it's really not tbh once he has hearing with the hearing aids, a cousin of mine is deaf and plays gaa. I know it's not professional, but it can be done easily enough

I suppose, I'm just thinking in terms of the higher impact nature of American football, and the need to hear audibles, snap counts etc (I think they hinted at that by him watching for the snap count) - being a spit second behind the pace can be crucial after all, and Coleman's pretty damn solid at getting to his blocks. I've got a blind sister so I reckon I was partly looking at it through that guise, which would be much more limiting.

It's obviously pretty clumsy at times but kind of remarkable how good some blind teams are at football, also. It mightn't look like much, but just try to get from your bed, to dressed (including getting the clothes out of the wardrobe), through the door, down the stairs, into the kitchen and to make a cup of coffee.

rockonollie

rockonollie wrote: »

Chicago Bears: ----

Green Bay Packers: Brett Favre 2001-2003, 2007, Aaron Rodgers 2009, 2011-2012
New York Jets: Brett Favre 2008
Minnesota Vikings: Daunte Culpepper 2000, 2004, Brett Favre 2009

Bit of an achievement for Favre to make the pro-bowl 3 consecutive years with 3 different teams.......will take a bit of research to see if that's ever happened before (good thing i have lots of downtime at work)

Billy86

rockonollie wrote: »

Bit of an achievement for Favre to make the pro-bowl 3 consecutive years with 3 different teams.......will take a bit of research to see if that's ever happened before (good thing i have lots of downtime at work)

Favre didn't really deserve the one in New York though - voting used to eb from weeks 8 - 15 if I recall, and he fell off badly after having a very good start to the year - finished up with just 6.7 YPA and as many TDs as INT's (22 each), plus an 81.0 QBR. That's why I don't mind them changing the Pro Bowl at all - it had become a farce based on little more than name power (like in football who Casillas was shortlisted for some world player of the year award despite playing less than a half dozen games for Madrid in the 12 months prior).

Deion Sanders achieved it with Atlanta (1991/92), Dallas (1993) and San Francisco (1994). He was also first team All Pro in those four years (as well as 1991) - and in 1992 was first team All Pro for BOTH CB and KR.

Also not in consecutive years, but Terrell Owens was named first team All Pro with three separate sides (SF; 2000, 01, 02, 03; PHI 2004; DAL 2007) - which is still pretty impressive, as it's a much more credible award than the Pro Bowl.

rockonollie

Billy86 wrote: »

if I recall, and he fell off badly after having a very good start to the year

He fell off badly when winter arrived in New York.....shoulder locked up.

I recall his last game as a Jet, walking off the field holding his arm after a feeble attempt to tackle a Dolphins D-lineman on the goal-line he had just thrown an interception to.....came back out for the second half but arm was obviously dead.

That was a great day for the Dolphins, win in New York in week 17 gave the dolphins the AFC east and put the Patriots out of the playoffs (only time in last 10 years they missed the playoffs)

davyjose

rockonollie wrote: »

He fell off badly when winter arrived in New York.....shoulder locked up.

Nope. It was a torn bicep and had nothing to do with the weather. Northern Wisconsin winters make New York winters look like Hawaii.

rockonollie

davyjose wrote: »

Nope. It was a torn bicep and had nothing to do with the weather. Northern Wisconsin winters make New York winters look like Hawaii.

Yes....a torn bicep tendon that he played with all season, but the cold weather aggrevated it late in the season

Two Girls One Klopp

I'd actually forgotten Favre, the Jets were my 'fifth' team. Lions have had no pro bowl QB since 1972!!!

Billy86

I'm surprised Scott Mitchell didn't make it in 1995 - 4,300+ yards, 32 TDs and 12 INTs in a 10-6 season when those numbers were muhc harder to come by . Ahead of him were *Aikman (3,304 with only 16 TDs and 7 INTs - went 12-4 on a much more talented team), Steve Young (3,200, 20 & 11 - missed 5 games, went 8-3) and Warren Moon (4,220, 34 & 12, went 8-8).

That said, Brett Favre was voted MVP that year (4,413yds, 38 and 13, 11-5 record) and -here's a surprise- Erik Kramer of The Bears (!?) went for 3,838, 29 TDs to 10 INTs and a 9-7 record. The Vikings' Warren Moon went 4,228, 33 and 14, and an 8-8 record... the NFC North had NO teams below .500, and FOUR of the top seven QBRs that season. Not only that but the only team of the four without a 1,000 yard rusher was Minnesota... because Robert Smith missed 7 games (his 632yds extrapolate out to 1,123 yards over 16 games, and his backups got 700+ in his absence). All four teams were in the top 9 for offensive yards, yards per play, and the top 8 for points scored... that must have been one of the most insane divisional seasons ever!

Paully D

Paully D wrote: »

Interesting read on the Seahawks defense with the suggestion that they get away with a lot of fouling and have the mantra of ''the refs will throw one flag but not ten.'' Mike Pereria also comments

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303754404579310500005285822

Something worth keeping an eye on against the Saints.

They were at it all night tonight. I'd imagine it will gain more scrutiny during the week and they will be called a bit more often next week.

Paully D

Peyton may face a decision on whether to retire this offseason dependent on an examination on his neck, according to Mortensen of ESPN:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24407299/report-peyton-mannings-nfl-future-hinges-on-offseason-neck-exam

helimachoptor

Must have had it under his bed...
http://www.myfoxphilly.com/story/24424746/eagles-star-desean-jackson-victim

adrian522

I was going to post this in the 49ers thread but thought it would be better here.


Essentially it is a pastor who is a 49er fan. He races through the service in 1 minute in order to see the game. Pretty funny stuff, including "Kaepernicking"

Paully D

adrian522 wrote: »

I was going to post this in the 49ers thread but thought it would be better here.


Essentially it is a pastor who is a 49er fan. He races through the service in 1 minute in order to see the game. Pretty funny stuff, including "Kaepernicking"

Reminded me of this :pac:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-ZEVBHXBew

TO.

Pro Bowl has just become a bigger joke if Sanders and Rice actually suit up:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/01/13/deion-sanders-says-hes-playing-in-the-pro-bowl/

DeionSandersVerified account ‏@DeionSanders

Ladies and Gentlemen I am officially announcing "I WILL SUIT UP IN HAWAII" Please let @JerryRice know that a real captain leads by example!

Son Of A Vidic

So instead of improving the Pro bowl, it has now turned into a platform for ego.