[Article] Bus Eireann to start axing routes in New Year

Cookie_Monster

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BUS EIREANN is expected to start axing and reducing services on 99 routes in weeks.

Sources last night revealed the company's €30m cost-recovery plan is likely to be implemented in the New Year after the Labour Court largely backed its proposals.

The court recommended some changes to the State bus company's plan in a document that has just been released.

A total of 222 drivers will lose their jobs, but in a major coup for the unions this will be on a voluntary rather than a compulsory basis.

In addition, the court recommended that the company dropped proposed cuts in workers' shift and rota rates.

However, it backed the company's plan to take 150 vehicles out of service -- the move which will deliver the largest savings.

Earlier this year the Irish Independent revealed Bus Eireann planned to scrap routes around the country on a phased basis.

Perilous

Among the changes were the dropping of city services in Limerick, Cork and Waterford after 7pm and Athlone and Navan town services.

If SIPTU and the NBRU ballot in favour of the court's recommendation, the service cuts are likely to forge ahead after Christmas.

The Labour Court said Bus Eireann was in a "perilous" financial position and there was an "urgent" need to get the target savings.

It said that "radical cost saving measures" were necessary to restore the viability of the business and maintain jobs.

It urged the parties to make an early decision on its recommendation and to implement the terms without delay.

Bus Eireann announced its cost-cutting plan in January, which included a total of 320 job losses from the 2,700 work-force and taking 150 vehicles out of its fleet of 1,300 buses.

Talks are continuing with unions over the remaining redundancy proposals.

It is estimated that the company has been losing €500,000 a week since it announced its cost-saving plan at the start of the year.

The stand out part of all this for me is the axing of after 7pm routes in the cities... madness, cut them back substancially if need be but to remove them all together is such a backwards step for public transport

Edit: on the bold bit, if it is that bad and needs to be done so quick why have they faffed around for month and months after the initial plan and press release

KC61

My understanding (and this was from months back) was that it was planned to combine routes after 7pm in the provincial cities rather than dropping them completely.

Cutting them totally would be madness.

T Corolla

I would have thought that they would be merging offpeak services that has low loading.The tickets prices are far too high The train is winning by a long stretch with the 10 euro day return fares offpeak. I had an idea was to merge the offpeak Sligo and Ballina buses at Longford and transfer passengers along the rural stops of the N4 onto the commuter bus(115) making the intercity bus non stop to Dublin from Longford and letting the commuter bus use the N4-R148 for the rural passengers. I am shocked that the Intercity bus has to make stops in small villages along the way while there was a bus travelling along the same route 30mins later. The journey time from Dublin to Sligo is 4 hrs while the train is 3hrs. I am sure a small change like that would make a big difference to the running costs per year

Judgement Day

They could start by reducing services that compete directly with the railway. 20 services each way between Dublin and Rosslare each way is insanity and totally undermines Bus Eireann's sister company Irish Rail. Who pays for this waste - the taxpayer!

Cookie_Monster

Judgement Day wrote: »

They could start by reducing services that compete directly with the railway. 20 services each way between Dublin and Rosslare each way is insanity and totally undermines Bus Eireann's sister company Irish Rail. Who pays for this waste - the taxpayer!

But is the bus not cheaper, faster and generally nicer than those smelly old 2900s

Judgement Day

Cheaper yes, faster sometimes and, at last, we now have 22000s on some Dublin/Rosslare services. As operated by CIE the Irish railway system is unsustainable and NO case can be made for its continued retention outside of the Greater Dublin Area.

Euro_Kraut

Judgement Day wrote: »

They could start by reducing services that compete directly with the railway. 20 services each way between Dublin and Rosslare each way is insanity and totally undermines Bus Eireann's sister company Irish Rail. Who pays for this waste - the taxpayer!

God no. That last thing we need to do is give either company a monopoly on a route.

Cookie_Monster

Judgement Day wrote: »

Cheaper yes, faster sometimes and, at last, we now have 22000s on some Dublin/Rosslare services. As operated by CIE the Irish railway system is unsustainable and NO case can be made for its continued retention outside of the Greater Dublin Area.

cork cobh should be al-right

incidentaly. i think that was the last time I was on a proper loco hauled train many years ago. Battered old coaches (last of the cravens?) and a filthy 141, pissing rain from cobh to fota:)

Judgement Day

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

God no. That last thing we need to do is give either company a monopoly on a route.

So we should go on squandering very limited resources on having two CIE companies competing with each other - while there are NO funds for innoculations for Cervical Cancer Innoculations, Special Needs Assistants etc.etc.etc......This is the economics of the madhouse and will have the IMF running the country. :mad::mad::mad:

Judgement Day

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

cork cobh should be al-right

incidentaly. i think that was the last time I was on a proper loco hauled train many years ago. Battered old coaches (last of the cravens?) and a filthy 141, pissing rain from cobh to fota:)

Don't get me wrong - I love trains (especially Cravens!!! my hole) - but I have no time for CIE or the Dept of Transport. Get rid of them along with the Senate, at least half of the TDs, the army (as presently constituted) and that would produce some serious savings. Sorry for digressing it must be the pressure of Christmas making me finally crack.

KC61

Presonally I think that people deserve the choice. For example, the rail replacement 33X has been a resounding success and I would hate to be the person that tells the passengers in Skerries, Rush and Lusk that their new express bus is being cancelled given numbers are doing well and that they have to go back to the trains.

The Rosslare bus 002 provides a direct connection to the Airport, serves areas not serviced by the train and is also proving to be a success.

Both can co-exist.

Judgement Day

KC61 - sorry to be blunt but what part of the word bankruptcy do you not understand? That's where we're at - we couldn't afford CIE when the Celtic Tiger was still alive and we certainly can't now.

KC61

Please do not insult my intelligence - I am fully aware of the financial positiion.

However I understand the fact that people are using the 33X services in strong numbers and that they are therefore paying their way.

I certainly think that in the case of Rosslare that if anything should go it is the railway, and not the bus service.

It is all about running a frequent quality product and that is what Bus Eireann is delivering.

We are seeing the effects of cost-cutting already. Shorter trains, fewer trains on some routes, uneconomic bus routes finally cancelled in Dublin.

BigMoose

As someone who lives on the Rosslare route (Wicklow) and who works in Dublin and who is a massive rail fan, the rail line is absolutely useless south of the Dart. There are so few trains and a total lack of options for going and coming back in a day it's just not worth even trying. The ticket prices double in between Greystones and Kilcoole. Plus the fact you could probably run faster than the train round bits of Wicklow. Where as the 133 and the 002 run as often as you could want so you can be sure of firstly getting somewhere on time and having a hope of getting home again the same day if your meeting over runs by 5 mins... It's so annoying to live within a couple of miles of the station yet either have to drive to Bray/Greystones to get a Dart or get the bus (or sod it and drive the whole way). If only one were to stay it's obvious it wouldn't be the rail even though that updsets me to say!

Euro_Kraut

Judgement Day wrote: »

So we should go on squandering very limited resources on having two CIE companies competing with each other - while there are NO funds for innoculations for Cervical Cancer Innoculations, Special Needs Assistants etc.etc.etc......This is the economics of the madhouse and will have the IMF running the country. :mad::mad::mad:

Some you think state monoplies would be a good idea? The Galway-Dublin route for example is served by train and 3 bus companies. There clearly is a market for both train users and bus users. Shutting down profitable routes just because there is a simular product being offered by another semi state company is the 'economics of the madhouse'. What you expect to happen to rail fares if competing bus companies were not allowed to service a route? What would you say to people who wanted to get to Dublin from Galway after 6.15 in the evening? What would you say to people who want to travel from Galway to Moate?

By the way the IMF are not coming. They have said that today. I suppose you know better though.

bmaxi

BigMoose wrote: »

As someone who lives on the Rosslare route (Wicklow) and who works in Dublin and who is a massive rail fan, the rail line is absolutely useless south of the Dart. There are so few trains and a total lack of options for going and coming back in a day it's just not worth even trying. The ticket prices double in between Greystones and Kilcoole. Plus the fact you could probably run faster than the train round bits of Wicklow. Where as the 133 and the 002 run as often as you could want so you can be sure of firstly getting somewhere on time and having a hope of getting home again the same day if your meeting over runs by 5 mins... It's so annoying to live within a couple of miles of the station yet either have to drive to Bray/Greystones to get a Dart or get the bus (or sod it and drive the whole way). If only one were to stay it's obvious it wouldn't be the rail even though that updsets me to say!

I have to agree. I live near Gorey and would also prefer, if possible, to travel by rail but it's just not a practical option.
On the journey to Dublin the bus, once it leaves Arklow is, for the most part, no longer constrained by a schedule and can often complete the journey in 1½ hours. This, coupled with an houly service makes it a very attractive alternative and I notice more and more people, with whom I travelled by train, are now on the bus.
The problems faced by the South East commuter line, i.e. Dart schedules, unmanned crossings etc. have been aired elsewhere on this forum but the bottom line is, if it can't compete it can't survive and that is the sad reality.

dowlingm

There may be a perception that CIE is acting like Aer Rianta here, imposing savage cuts on the provinces to keep Dublin running. They should not be permitted to stop services after 7pm without a full explanation to the City Councils concerned.

Judgement Day

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

Some you think state monoplies would be a good idea? The Galway-Dublin route for example is served by train and 3 bus companies. There clearly is a market for both train users and bus users. Shutting down profitable routes just because there is a simular product being offered by another semi state company is the 'economics of the madhouse'. What you expect to happen to rail fares if competing bus companies were not allowed to service a route? What would you say to people who wanted to get to Dublin from Galway after 6.15 in the evening? What would you say to people who want to travel from Galway to Moate?

By the way the IMF are not coming. They have said that today. I suppose you know better though.

Smartness uncalled for as I have never pretended to have any insider knowledge about the IMF - where did you get you your info from - wikipedia?

Hungerford

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

What you expect to happen to rail fares if competing bus companies were not allowed to service a route?

They'd remain the same - they are set by the government. The discounted offers may be another matter though...

richardjjd

Judgement Day wrote: »

Smartness uncalled for as I have never pretended to have any insider knowledge about the IMF - where did you get you your info from - wikipedia?

Yesterday on newstalk, as reported by RTE

Judgement Day

richardjjd wrote: »

Yesterday on newstalk, as reported by RTE

Thanks for the link as I hadn't heard that. However, I wouldn't have any great faith in what someone from the IMF might tell the media as things change so rapidly - e.g. AIB don't need anymore money from taxpayer one day and a few weeks later needing millions more. Who do you believe? Anyway it does not take away from my point about the ultimate cost of wasteful competition be it two CIE companies fighting with each other for business or letting uncontrolled competition from the private sector enter the market. At the end of the day it is people in need who suffer when the purse strings are tightened.

foggy_lad

bus eireann is completely to blame for their own poor monetary position if my latest journey from dublin to carlow is anything to go by.

I travelled on some clapped out coach on hire to bus eireann that did not have air conditioning or even air vents or individual seat lights and as the normal running lights were broken the main coach lights were left on for the whole journey. The only cold fresh air came when the driver opened his window to try to demist the windscreen. The seats were very uncomfortable for a 90minute journey and today it took over two and half hours to get to carlow so i shudder to think what condition the poor unfortunates going on to waterford will be in on arrival,

when i got to carlow i had a migraine and cramps from the seating position as the seat cushions provided no support and coupled with the poor amount of legroom for most passengers would only add to any risk of deep vein thrombosis!

The bus stank of old stale cigarette smoke and the light switches (for lights that did not work) were covered in brown tar like grime from years of people smoking. The ashtrays were mostly missing and many of the armrests were damaged and some had metal rods with sharp edges protruding from the ends.

The head liner was shabby and torn in several places and there was damage to what looked like an old possibly the original air conditioning unit. This bus was clean and got us to carlow despite the awful traffic but just like where trains used to be old often late and without proper facilities and people switched to using the busses, people will find an alternative to bus eireann's clapped out coaches and that for me will be to walk to georges quay and get the rapid express coach to carlow, modern and comfortable warm with air conditioning. And more services daily that clapped out coaches!

As long as bus eireann consider clapped out coaches like what i was in today as suitable people will vote with their feet!

Also concerning this coach as far as i can remember this same bus was highlighted on the rte radio liveline program earlier in the year when bus eireann gave an undertaking not to use this particular coach again until it had been brought up to a certain standard. Am open to correction on this.