Socail Welfare Budget Cut Protest

tudlytops

masteroftherealm wrote: »

No if you earned a decent wage its one of the lowest payments in the EU

It's enough to live on, and that's all benefits should be. People should have saved for a rainy day, they should have saved for what they wanted not borrow and gone on holidays only if they could afford it not just so they could say they'be been here or there and that they had a better car then their neighbour

masteroftherealm

tudlytops wrote: »

It's enough to live on, and that's all benefits should be. People should have saved for a rainy day, they should have saved for what they wanted not borrow and gone on holidays only if they could afford it not just so they could say they'be been here or there and that they had a better car then their neighbour

One minute its generous one minute its only enough to live on. Make up your mind man,

tudlytops

masteroftherealm wrote: »

Please quantify your statements, generous in relation to what?
A Chinese worker on 100 dollars a year??

Or to the rest of the Eu where it is not necessarily generous depending on your previous earinings.

Again for instance Portugal min wages is 500 euro a month, how much do you think the welfare is?

They have no social housing, and don't get me started on health care there and rent's are quite high, in parts being as high as Dublin.

as for the "A Chinese worker on 100 dollars a year??" you have to consider how much he pays for, rent, food and clothing, not just how much he makes.

As i said before, go check how much they get, all benefits that one can claim, how much they pay for rent, food, clothing then come back and say that they are better of.

Maebh

tudlytops wrote: »

If there aren't any jobs for what you are qualified, then you can't do better, the only thing you can do is your best until things get better.

I don't know why people are making so much noise, recessions is nothing new, they happen and people and countries recover.

I'm damned if I'm going to hang around for this country to "recover". We've swung too far into insanity for that to happen any time soon.

There are other options available to our glorious leaders, they just don't want to consider them...

gcgirl

tudlytops wrote: »

It's enough to live on, and that's all benefits should be. People should have saved for a rainy day, they should have saved for what they wanted not borrow and gone on holidays only if they could afford it not just so they could say they'be been here or there and that they had a better car then their neighbour

but the thing is easy credit and all that nobody saved everything was put on the credit card because they thought it was never gonna end!

I have said since 2005 the arse was gonna fall through this country !

masteroftherealm

tudlytops wrote: »

Again for instance Portugal min wages is 500 euro a month, how much do you think the welfare is?

They have no social housing, and don't get me started on health care there and rent's are quite high, in parts being as high as Dublin.

as for the "A Chinese worker on 100 dollars a year??" you have to consider how much he pays for, rent, food and clothing, not just how much he makes.

As i said before, go check how much they get, all benefits that one can claim, how much they pay for rent, food, clothing then come back and say that they are better of.

And as I said before not everyone earns minimum wage. So your argument is again null.

Scofflaw

Just a reminder to keep it civil, and refrain from personalising the discussion.

moderately,
Scofflaw

tudlytops

masteroftherealm wrote: »

One minute its generous one minute its only enough to live on. Make up your mind man,

yes enough to live on, pay your bills, feed your belly, etc, i would say that is generous, in a lot of countries is berelly enough to buy food.

What do you people want to be able to be on benefits and still have the same standard of live you had while working, if that ware the case then no one would work, it's bad enough already that so many show to stay on welfare.

Why do you think people stay on welfare, because the benefits are bad, no because they are good.

Just drive by the council estates, look at the cars, the SKY dish and the kiddies toys outside, the bikes, go-Karts and that's from the out side, try going inside.

tudlytops

masteroftherealm wrote: »

And as I said before not everyone earns minimum wage. So your argument is again null.

again even the ones on high wages only get the 80% benefit for a limited time and there is a cap.

Ireland could do that if they had not allowed people to stay unemployed forever.

masteroftherealm

tudlytops wrote: »

yes enough to live on, pay your bills, feed your belly, etc, i would say that is generous, in a lot of countries is berelly enough to buy food.

What do you people want to be able to be on benefits and still have the same standard of live you had while working, if that ware the case then no one would work, it's bad enough already that so many show to stay on welfare.

Why do you think people stay on welfare, because the benefits are bad, no because they are good.

Just drive by the council estates, look at the cars, the SKY dish and the kiddies toys outside, the bikes, go-Karts and that's from the out side, try going inside.

Well I grew up in a corpo estate in Ballybrack, Ive seen crippling poverty, drug addiction, loan sharks, dealers are the ones in the Mercs mate. So please dont attempt to lecture me on corpo estates.

Show me an example of an EU state that the social welfare payment to someone previously earning the average industrial wage of Ireland would be left with hardly enough to get food. Hard figures and sources please

masteroftherealm

tudlytops wrote: »

again even the ones on high wages only get the 80% benefit for a limited time and there is a cap.

Ireland could do that if they had not allowed people to stay unemployed forever.

Agreed but we are talking about welfare payments not welfare abuse.

Maebh

tudlytops wrote: »

yes enough to live on, pay your bills, feed your belly, etc, i would say that is generous, in a lot of countries is berelly enough to buy food.

What do you people want to be able to be on benefits and still have the same standard of live you had while working, if that ware the case then no one would work, it's bad enough already that so many show to stay on welfare.

Why do you think people stay on welfare, because the benefits are bad, no because they are good.

Just drive by the council estates, look at the cars, the SKY dish and the kiddies toys outside, the bikes, go-Karts and that's from the out side, try going inside.

And again, not everyone gets the "generous" extra allowances. So some people have indeed found it hard to buy sufficient food, and clothes are a freaking luxury if you're on SW.

People stay on welfare because of a little thing called "poverty traps", which are not, as people believe in this country, caused by high welfare, but by low minimum wages. And by low, I don't mean in comparison to other countries, I mean in actual terms of what you can get for a full week's work.

I would like it if the poor were not targeted by the rich. I would like it if society had any collective empathy or at least enough wit to recognise social injustice when they see it.

gcgirl

tudlytops wrote: »

yes enough to live on, pay your bills, feed your belly, etc, i would say that is generous, in a lot of countries is berelly enough to buy food.

What do you people want to be able to be on benefits and still have the same standard of live you had while working, if that ware the case then no one would work, it's bad enough already that so many show to stay on welfare.

Why do you think people stay on welfare, because the benefits are bad, no because they are good.

Just drive by the council estates, look at the cars, the SKY dish and the kiddies toys outside, the bikes, go-Karts and that's from the out side, try going inside.

Go karts if i had my way i would bloody ban them
Sky dishes i have a sky dish but only Free to view channels

lmimmfn

On top of cutting welfare by x% they should give some of the dole as food only vouchers, prevents shopping up north, less hard cash should be what they should be looking at.

c montgomery

I think the dole is enough to live on no problem.

Let me elaborate

I am working at the moment and earn just under the average industrial wage. If you take away the amount of money i spend on petrol to get to work and the 30 euro i spend on my friday nite pints i live very happly on much less than 100 euro.
I shop in lidl and spend about 60 euro on groceries. I make my lunch for mork at home and make all my dinners at home. I might get the odd take away but this would only add about 10 euro to my food budget.
Bills on average are 20 euro a week.

My other outgoings are my rent and car loan.
If i was on the dole i would get rent allowance to cover the rent and would sell the car, buying another one when i got another job.

So YES, i think the dole is too much and that it is possible to live on much less than 204 euro. In fact i think about 160euro would be about right.

masteroftherealm

c montgomery wrote: »

I think the dole is enough to live on no problem.

Let me elaborate

I am working at the moment and earn just under the average industrial wage. If you take away the amount of money i spend on petrol to get to work and the 30 euro i spend on my friday nite pints i live very happly on much less than 100 euro.
I shop in lidl and spend about 60 euro on groceries. I make my lunch for mork at home and make all my dinners at home. I might get the odd take away but this would only add about 10 euro to my food budget.
Bills on average are 20 euro a week.

My other outgoings are my rent and car loan.
If i was on the dole i would get rent allowance to cover the rent and would sell the car, buying another one when i got another job.

So YES, i think the dole is too much and that it is possible to live on much less than 204 euro. In fact i think about 160euro would be about right.

Wow your bills are incredibly low.
Not everyone is entitled to rent supplement, and you cant live in rural ireland without a car which is taxed insured and filled with diesel now and again.

ntlbell

masteroftherealm wrote: »

Wow your bills are incredibly low.
Not everyone is entitled to rent supplement, and you cant live in rural ireland without a car which is taxed insured and filled with diesel now and again.

if you're renting one can move tho?

once your in rental accomidation which is under the threshold there should be no reason you wouldn't be entilted to it. (open to correction)

lmimmfn

masteroftherealm wrote: »

Wow your bills are incredibly low.
Not everyone is entitled to rent supplement, and you cant live in rural ireland without a car which is taxed insured and filled with diesel now and again.

I know loads on the dole in rural ireland who manage perfectly without a car.

If i take out my work costs( 50-60euro petrol per week to commute and 30 euro for lunch food ) and rent, i spend approx 150 a week so i dont see how 204 euro isint possible.

masteroftherealm

1. Thresholds are not commensurate with rents in certain areas outside of Dublin.
2. No I am on a lease. and anyway living anywhere outside of Dublin would still require a car as public transport doesnt exist to get to job interviews etc

masteroftherealm

lmimmfn wrote: »

I know loads on the dole in rural ireland who manage perfectly without a car.

Im sorry Im calling you on that. Its impossible to live in rural Ireland wihtout access to transport.

Maebh

lmimmfn wrote: »

I know loads on the dole in rural ireland who manage perfectly without a car.

If i take out my work costs( 50-60euro petrol per week to commute and 30 euro for lunch food ) and rent, i spend approx 150 a week so i dont see how 204 euro isint possible.

You just said 100 euro a week.

But anyway, in order to get work you need to be able to get to the place of work, yes?

Thus, a car is needed because, oh would you look at that, not everywhere has a workable public transport system in place.

There are so many ups and downs, ins and outs, so many grey areas of which people are unaware. So many real life situations that people do not take into account when they say "cut the dole, it's too high".

ntlbell

masteroftherealm wrote: »

1. Thresholds are not commensurate with rents in certain areas outside of Dublin.
2. No I am on a lease. and anyway living anywhere outside of Dublin would still require a car as public transport doesnt exist to get to job interviews etc

it really amazes me the way someone in an instane can find a stumbling block to just about every single resoloution to a problem.

fascianting.

the thresholds are different for different areas outside of dublin.

strangley rents in those areas seem to less than dublin. magic?

Most landlords are resonable, what they understand is lease or no lease, if the tenant can no longer pay the rent, they would prefer to get someone in who can, this usually happens by picking up the blower and having a conversation.

the other benifit of renting is you're not obliged to live outside dublin you can, wait for it....live in dublin too!

I also see these strange busses leaving and coming into dublin every day, so people do manage to use public transport outside of it.

isn't it mad ted!

masteroftherealm

ntlbell wrote: »

it really amazes me the way someone in an instane can find a stumbling block to just about every single resoloution to a problem.

fascianting.

the thresholds are different for different areas outside of dublin.

strangley rents in those areas seem to less than dublin. magic?

Most landlords are resonable, what they understand is lease or no lease, if the tenant can no longer pay the rent, they would prefer to get someone in who can, this usually happens by picking up the blower and having a conversation.

the other benifit of renting is you're not obliged to live outside dublin you can, wait for it....live in dublin too!

I also see these strange busses leaving and coming into dublin every day, so people do manage to use public transport outside of it.

isn't it mad ted!

Yes try living out here mate.
No my landlord will not release me from my lease. As is his right.

No there is no public transport where I live. Solve that problem for me?

Yes rents are lower but the rent allowance rates are crippilingly low in places such as Mayo so that the average rent is well above that of the rent allowance threshold.

Lemondrop kid

ntlbell wrote: »

it really amazes me the way someone in an instane can find a stumbling block to just about every single resoloution to a problem.

fascianting.

Isn't it though?
the thresholds are different for different areas outside of dublin.

strangley rents in those areas seem to less than dublin. magic?

Most landlords are resonable,no doubting that what they understand is lease or no lease, if the tenant can no longer pay the rent, they would prefer to get someone in who can they do, don't they, this usually happens by picking up the blower and having a conversation.

the other benifit of renting is you're not obliged to live outside dublin you can, wait for it....live in dublin too!

I also see these strange busses with strangeress peopleleaving and coming into dublin every day, so people do manage to use public transport outside of it.

isn't it mad ted!

Tis

ntlbell

masteroftherealm wrote: »

Yes try living out here mate.
No my landlord will not release me from my lease. As is his right.

No there is no public transport where I live. Solve that problem for me?

Yes rents are lower but the rent allowance rates are crippilingly low in places such as Mayo so that the average rent is well above that of the rent allowance threshold.

Depending on the type of lease you should be able to give some form of notice period you can ceck online depending on how long you have lived here and the months left, look into it.

You can also get out of it by finding a replacement.

You tell him you can't pay anymore, you'll stay there all right but he won't get any rent. he has a number of options, try and bring to court, for breach of contract where you prove to the judge you can't afford it and show letters you have sent to the landlord, what do you think can happen realistically? throw you into the joy? the landlord faces missing months rent, solicitor fee's etc etc, it's not going to happen, get some back bone.

then move to dublin.

ta da!

masteroftherealm

ntlbell wrote: »

Depending on the type of lease you should be able to give some form of notice period you can ceck online depending on how long you have lived here and the months left, look into it.

You can also get out of it by finding a replacement.

You tell him you can't pay anymore, you'll stay there all right but he won't get any rent. he has a number of options, try and bring to court, for breach of contract where you prove to the judge you can't afford it and show letters you have sent to the landlord, what do you think can happen realistically? throw you into the joy? the landlord faces missing months rent, solicitor fee's etc etc, it's not going to happen, get some back bone.

then move to dublin.

ta da!

I never said I couldn't afford it, I'm living out of savings until I can finalise my emigration.
I was merely pointing out that not everyone qualifies for all of the addon benefits.

ntlbell

masteroftherealm

The Feeling is mutual

tudlytops

ntlbell wrote: »

My feelings exactly lol

Lunar_Wire

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

I think many of us could equally sit at home and have a modest & full life, but we would not feel comfortable having other people pay for us.
If you can support yourself, independently, then knock yourself out.

Well, it seems many chose to have a gorging lifestyle revolving around living in debt. The gains where illusionary for most. People on long term social welfare have chosen to contribute to society in a different way. I understand you probably won't agree with that but it is the reality of the situation. We are portrayed constantly as 'sitting at home' all the time, but we do contribute in a valuable way to society. They include things like the arts and volunteer-ism. Just look at the Galway Arts Festival, which has large contributions of time from people on the dole.

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

But if you are claiming social welfare, because you are choosing not to work, do you honestly believe you have any moral ground to argue when it is being reduced, because those of us who are taxed to pay for your lifestyle no longer can afford to do so?

If you read my original post you'll see that my gripe is mainly that this government is implementing the cuts and not that I'm being cut. As I'm educated and can budget (obviously better than the government) this cut won't really effect me, but I know of people who don't have their **** together, and they will suffer.
When the government say, "fairness is the cornerstone of our society" and then proceed to cut from the poor, I have a problem.
Both the government and the opposition are paid from the public purse and do a woeful job. It would be cheaper to have them on the dole then leading the country into debt. There is no doubt that I'm in the minority, but I didn't vote for this government.
Not only that, but I think the way we live is absurd. Others ignored the problems while they were being created. As a nation we live in a totally unsustainable way, because of this we a likely to all have a massive unimaginable change in everyone's lifestyle. For example, what if oil runs out? It is a possible scenario, but how prepared are we? How important will my profession of software development be then?