firearm refusal

EPD

This is the firsr time for me to post on Boards
I got my refusal notice for my 357 revolver what am I suppose to do with it now
The gun shops don’t want to take it in, do I hand it into the Guards and if so what
will happen to it, will it be destroyed or will it be stored.
Has anyone got the answer?
EPD.:mad::mad::mad:

LB6

Sorry to hear your news. If you go to this web-site:-

http://www.nasrpc.ie/

You will see that they are looking for scans of all the refusals - I'm sure they should be able to advise you further.

rrpc

Surrender of a firearm and/or ammunition is covered by section 6 of the firearms act:

(d) if the person does not, within three months after the delivery of the
firearm and ammunition (if any) to the Superintendent, arrange for its or
their disposal in accordance with the provisions of this Act, inform the
Superintendent of the arrangements and carry out the arrangements, the
Superintendent may send to the person by post to his last known address a
notice informing him that unless arrangements of the kind aforesaid are
made, communicated to the Superintendent and carried out within one
month after the date on which the notice is sent, the firearm and
ammunition (if any) will be sold or destroyed,

So yes, they can sell or destroy it. Get it into a dealers as fast as possible. As soon as you are refused you have a firearm without a certificate.

foxshooter243

EPD wrote: »

This is the firsr time for me to post on Boards
I got my refusal notice for my 357 revolver what am I suppose to do with it now
The gun shops don’t want to take it in, do I hand it into the Guards and if so what
will happen to it, will it be destroyed or will it be stored.
Has anyone got the answer?
EPD.:mad::mad::mad:

I would be trying a northern dealer at this stage for a sale:)

Hill Man

If your original License was issued after 19th November 2008 you might have difficulty getting it reissued. If you had the license before 19th November you might have a problem with your target club. None of the clubs were authorised under the new legislation. The majority of clubs have upgraded their premises and will soon be authorised. I would suggest that you leave your revolver in a gun dealers, find out exactly why you have been refused and re apply. If you are a fit person to have a firearm, if you can establish a good reason for requiring the firearm and are a member of an authorised club you might get your revolver license.

Good Luck

rrpc

Hill Man wrote: »

If your original License was issued after 19th November 2008 you might have difficulty getting it reissued. If you had the license before 19th November you might have a problem with your target club. None of the clubs were authorised under the new legislation. The majority of clubs have upgraded their premises and will soon be authorised. I would suggest that you leave your revolver in a gun dealers, find out exactly why you have been refused and re apply. If you are a fit person to have a firearm, if you can establish a good reason for requiring the firearm and are a member of an authorised club you might get your revolver license.

Good Luck

He has already been refused, it's irrelevant at this stage as to whether he has a pre 19/11 licence or not (except in the case he wishes to appeal the refusal).

Clubs can and are being authorised. Ranges will not be certified until the Ranges SI is commenced (sometime in the first quarter of 2010). This does not stop a club being authorised and having a pulse ID for their members to use on their applications.

Sparks

rrpc wrote: »

He has already been refused, it's irrelevant at this stage as to whether he has a pre 19/11 licence or not (except in the case he wishes to appeal the refusal).

I don't think that's quite right rrpc - the Misc.Provisions Act says:

3D.—(1) As and from the date of commencement of this section, no application for a firearm certificate in respect of a short firearm shall be considered by an issuing person other than for—
...
(c) a short firearm for which the applicant for the firearm certificate held a firearm certificate on or before 19 November 2008.

By my reading of that, if Person A had a certificate for Pistol B before Nov19 2008, and subsequently was refused that cert, put the pistol in storage for a decade and then came back and wanted to re-apply, there's nothing in there that says they couldn't.

It'd only be if it was anyone other than Person A was applying to licence anything other than Pistol B, that that section would prohibit it.

happyjack

EPD wrote: »

This is the firsr time for me to post on Boards
I got my refusal notice for my 357 revolver what am I suppose to do with it now
The gun shops don’t want to take it in, do I hand it into the Guards and if so what
will happen to it, will it be destroyed or will it be stored.
Has anyone got the answer?
EPD.:mad::mad::mad:

I got two refusals also. i'm appealing through my local district court. Might I ask why you bought the revolver, what did you use it for?

The reason I ask is that why you needed it would reflect on any chance of appealing his refusal.

Best of luck.

HJ

chem

Even our locals seen this comming:rolleyes:

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/breaking-news/uk-ireland/justice-minister-ahern-to-outlaw-all-handguns-14100409.html

EPD

happyjack wrote: »

I got two refusals also. i'm appealing through my local district court. Might I ask why you bought the revolver, what did you use it for?

The reason I ask is that why you needed it would reflect on any chance of appealing his refusal.

Best of luck.

HJ

Hi Happy jack.
First of i would like to thank everyone who has replied to my post so fast.
In answer to your question as to why i bought the revolver and what i used it for, I shoot hand guns when i was a kid back in the 70s before they were taken in by O Mally,and there were released a few years back i jumped at the chance at getting back in to the sport.Personally i prefer revolvers to semi-auto and i found the 357 was a very good target gun
I have used the 357 in many competitions witch ive either won or have placed,I was told that the 357 firearm is Military Style Firearm and is not designed for the purposes witch i have stated,but they had no problem
in granting me my cert for my p22.I haven't been able to get it into a gun shop for storage and i don't like the idea of handing it in to the guards for destruction,and maybe some time down the road its all changed and my revolver is been used to make tin-cans im sure im not the only guy in this situation.
Regards
EPD.

Bananaman

Contact your club - see what they have to say on the matter

Contact NASRPC - they are the NGB for centrefire Pistol Shooting - either directly or through your club - avail of their advice.

Do not be rushed into a decision until you are clear as to what your options ARE - rather than what you have heard.

B'Man

rrpc

Sparks wrote: »

I don't think that's quite right rrpc - the Misc.Provisions Act says:

I should have been more specific . For the purposes of what he does now, it's irrelevant if it's a pre or post 19/11 cert. There are two choices: hand it up and let it be destroyed in the fullness of time or put it in storage.

By my reading of that, if Person A had a certificate for Pistol B before Nov19 2008, and subsequently was refused that cert, put the pistol in storage for a decade and then came back and wanted to re-apply, there's nothing in there that says they couldn't.

That's quite possible and why I would advise storage rather than handing up.

Rovi

Are the gun dealers you've been trying to put the gun into storage with, 'Restricted' gun dealers?
Ordinary gun dealers can't take in or otherwise handle Restricted firearms such as yours.

Bear in mind too, that gun dealers are very much down in the doldrums at the moment, what with the changes in legislation practically stopping the trade in firearms for a good part of the year and a huge upsurge in people looking to 'dispose' of firearms they're unwilling to licence under the new regime, to say noting of the general economic downturn.
Gun dealerships aren't charities, and have ongoing costs to cover no matter what is or isn't selling, so at least offer to pay a fee of some sort for the storage of your firearm; that might ease the problem of getting someone to take it in.

Grizzly 45

Charities they mightnt be...But certainly in some cases Robbing Besterds might apply:mad:50 Euros per month for storage is way out.Compared to 50 Euros per YEAR!!!! in Germany,France,the UK and NI.600 Euros per year is almost the equivlent of an eight gun 3 year liscense in the ROI.That sort of cash would get you NI club membership,travel, accomadation and proably a weekend a month shooting in NI.
Or almost a weeks shooting of pistols,accomadation,nosh and better weather in Spain..For TWO!!!And they are surprised then that busisness is bad???It's bad enough [being treated badly] by your own Govt.But when your own are profiteering from it...:mad::mad:

Rovi

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Charities they mightnt be...But certainly in some cases Robbing Besterds might apply:mad:50 Euros per month for storage is way out.

:eek:
That's outrageous!

Are there really dealers out there looking for that sort of money to store a firearm?
(DON'T NAME ANYONE!)

With the current carry on over pistol licences, you'd think it'd be worth a dealer's while to offer storage at a reasonable rate while the court cases get sorted out.

Grizzly 45

Rovi wrote: »

:eek:
That's outrageous!

Are there really dealers out there looking for that sort of money to store a firearm?
(DON'T NAME ANYONE!)

With the current carry on over pistol licences, you'd think it'd be worth a dealer's while to offer storage at a reasonable rate while the court cases get sorted out.

Gospel Truth.I could name THREE dealers[sofar] in the Mid West who are literally profiteering from this.And provide the written proof from one unfortunate enough to have to pay this to one of them!!:mad:

Also,one other point I might as well raise here.Our clubs and ranges.We fork out enough dosh per annum to shoot there.WHEN we have firearms to do so!As we cant shoot on them now since we are in limbo with the run out extensions,which technically makes us unliscensed.Wouldnt it be a nice gesture of the clubs to say.OK you cant shoot at the moment,but until you are legally sorted out we will freeze your membership dues,until you are cleared up legally??That would be a nice gesture too.:(

knockon

I handed my 2 Sig's into a Dealer in Mallow (Mr. P.H.) this morning. €2.50 a week for each pistol which I think is a fair price.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

That would be a nice gesture too.:(

It would be... though the question does come up as to who pays the thousand euro for the Club Authorisation, the upcoming thousand euro for the Range Licence and the thousands more needed on some ranges to bring them up to the Range SI standards, and the few hundred euro you might need in some clubs to bring in attendance tracking systems if they go down that route like Courtlough, Fermoy and Midlands did.

Not to mention ongoing costs like heating and electricity bills and the like.

Not saying that some club fees aren't a bit OTT, but there are real costs for clubs and there's been more than a few new outlays demanded of some of late...

Grizzly 45

Sparks,the clubs already HAVE our money..Annual membership...??? Already paid in advance for somthing we cant use.So the costs arguement wont wash.The money is already in the clubs pocket.All I am saying is;if I cant use the facilities thru no fault of my own,should a club keep charging members or using their monies as if they were there using the facilities.It's not out of choice that we are not using the facilities,we cant by law!!It cant be that much of a problem to freeze somones paid membership,until they appear again with the right documentation to legally allow them to shoot??

Grizzly 45

knockon wrote: »

I handed my 2 Sig's into a Dealer in Mallow (Mr. P.H.) this morning. €2.50 a week for each pistol which I think is a fair price.

260 euros per annum????? Better than most around ,but INMHO it should be a flat fee of 80 euros per year across the boards.Anyone charging over that is a profiteer!!!:(

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

It cant be that much of a problem to freeze somones paid membership,until they appear again with the right documentation to legally allow them to shoot??

You'd think. Then you'd check the Clubs SI and note that they are legally required to charge an annual fee. And if they're getting work done to the range to pass the Range Licence inspections, and having to pay for the Club Authorisation, well, I could see how some clubs could run into problems. I'm not saying there aren't clubs out there who're taking the mickey with this, just that you shouldn't tar every club with the same brush because the law's happily dumping on them as well as the "ordinary shooters" (and I put that in quotes, because we don't have clubs run by "special shooters", just shooters who didn't step out of the way fast enough last time someone looked for volunteers).

Grizzly 45

Sparks,you are not reading me here...I'm not saying the clubs cant or shouldnt charge or whatever or not do any work.They can do this as they already have the money to do so from the annual membership fees.

What I am saying is; Simply say.OK Grizz,until your situation is cleared up on wether you have a handgun/rifle/shotgun liscense or not.We will suspend your membership on this date,until you are all nice and legal again,and come back with the paperwork.You used up four months of your membership this year,and we will CREDIT you the eight you have paid for when you come back...
Not too much a problem I wouldnt think..

Sparks

Okay, with you now Grizzly. I thought you meant that they'd let you continue to come down, use club rifles and so forth, but not charge you membership fees (which would be daft). Mind you, I don't know if the Clubs SI would let them do that - they might have to say "you have 4 months credit, but you're not a member of the club again until you get your licence".

Grizzly 45

That would be fine too Sparks.Anything just to show that there isnt a just for profit attitude out there from those who should be with us,not making coinage on misery.

happyjack

Theres an appeal to the Supreme court coming up in January, about a month away and if the NARGC win the case we all get our pistols back, so hang on in there. Until then I'd advice appealing through your district court his refusal, otherwise after 30 days your out in the cold, ask for a long date till after the new case law comes in. Fair play to you for entering comps and using the gun, I was refused a renewal on my Colt Python and CZ 85b,
Python is a real classic, really liked using that gun in WA1500ppc, off a bench at 25 yards I could get 5 rounds into an inch using wad-cutters, and the guns 28 years old, belonged to a RUC detective for years as his carry home target gun. I like revolvers myself, I offered to have one chamber blocked up in order to get my renewal but he still refused. I wish you luck, it must be tuff thinking of losing your pistol shooting a second time round.

All the best,

HJ:)

Sparks

happyjack wrote: »

Theres an appeal to the Supreme court coming up in January, about a month away and if the NARGC win the case we all get our pistols back

Er, what case? The NASRPC case in cork can't go direct from District to Supreme courts, the NARGC case that led to the Charleton judgement could be appealed to the Supreme court but it wouldn't do any good (winning a case taken under the law that was there prior to the 2006 CJA is not going to affect a case taken today, two Firearms Acts later), and we've heard nothing about a constitutional challange to the Misc.Bill at all.

Until then I'd advice appealing through your district court his refusal, otherwise after 30 days your out in the cold

He's really not if his licence predates Nov 19 2008; and given the economic times, he may not be able to go through an appeals process right now. But so long as the pistol goes into safe storage, he may be able to get it licenced again, even after being refused now.

raptorman

About a reason to own a firearm of a certain type, shouldn't it be enough to say, "because I like it"
I'd love to have a Colt Python for no other reason than the look and handling of it and to own a premium revolver.

Sparks

raptorman wrote: »

About a reason to own a firearm of a certain type, shouldn't it be enough to say, "because I like it"

Short answer, No.
Look, you might be a sane enough person, who'd only use the thing in a safe way in a safe place and harm noone - but do you really want anyone to get one just because they like it?

I'm all for the minimal amount of regulation, but there needs to be some (even if "some" means somewhere around 2% of what we have now).

It wasn't me!

raptorman wrote: »

About a reason to own a firearm of a certain type, shouldn't it be enough to say, "because I like it"
I'd love to have a Colt Python for no other reason than the look and handling of it and to own a premium revolver.

That's one point of view alright. Doesn't dovetail well with our firearms laws, however. Basically you're looking to have a right to have guns for no reason other than that you want guns, and I couldn't say I'd be particularly in favour of that. Here, you apply to have a particular gun for a particular purpose. If you want a large calibre revolver, then you should be involved in sports which use them. The current laws mean however that you will not get it, one way or another.

raptorman

I think any sane individual should be allowed own whatever type of firearm they wish.
I also think one should have a psychologists exam and pass a firearms course of some kind. I certain level of IQ wouldnt go astray either.

raptorman

It wasn't me! wrote: »

That's one point of view alright. Doesn't dovetail well with our firearms laws, however. Basically you're looking to have a right to have guns for no reason other than that you want guns, and I couldn't say I'd be particularly in favour of that. Here, you apply to have a particular gun for a particular purpose. If you want a large calibre revolver, then you should be involved in sports which use them. The current laws mean however that you will not get it, one way or another.

I started of with a .22 CZ and a few tin cans. Purely for the fun of it. Surely someone can own a handgun because they like shooting it? Doesnt seem unreasonable to me.