My outrage at some of the Private Sector

balrog

So who has really cut their prices? Oh yea the cost of goods has come down, but services for such things doctors, dentists, IT and lawyers have not come down. The only ones I can see are building professionals and the car industry. Are these guys real or what I guess the ERSI are right when they say there is no real wage cut in the private sector?
I own a small construction firm.

frman

balrog wrote: »

I guess the ERSI are right when they say there is no real wage cut in the private sector?

Linky please ?

balrog

John Fitzgearld of the ERSI said it today on newstalk. Will try put it up if they podcast it. I cant see any changes anyway, maybe I am wrong if I go into any of these guys their rates have not dropped

highgiant1985

balrog wrote: »

So who has really cut their prices? Oh yea the cost of goods has come down, but services for such things doctors, dentists, IT and lawyers have not come down. The only ones I can see are building professionals and the car industry. Are these guys real or what I guess the ERSI are right when they say there is no real wage cut in the private sector?
I own a small construction firm.

Lots of people have been fired/made redundant instead. It doesn't count as a wage drop in the statistics though. Public Sector workers are less likely to be let go other than contract/temps.

I know plenty of people who've been put on 3 day weeks or have had pay freezes/cuts up to 40% in one persons case.

imme

I went into your post Balrog and the term 'Private Sector' didn't jump out at me. I read it as Public Sector, because there is a lot of outrage at the Public Sector on here of late. I have never heard or experienced a Doctor or Dentist lowering their fees in Ireland. Never Ever. The Law Society report regularly that there are solicitors in financial trouble (not M Lynn). I've never heard of a solicitor lowering their fess.

frman

balrog wrote: »

John Fitzgearld of the ERSI said it today on newstalk. Will try put it up if they podcast it. I cant see any changes anyway, maybe I am wrong if I go into any of these guys their rates have not dropped

It seems John Fitzgerald was expressing an opinion based on the fact that there are no official records kept relating to private sector pay reductions.


Here is the journo piece from Claire Byrne who actually interviewed him.


http://www.herald.ie/opinion/no-evidence-of-pay-cuts-in-the-private-sector-what-rubbish-1903631.html


Here is the important bit to note.

"What is astonishing is that there is no official record of the impact of these changes. That is why John Fitzgerald says that there is no evidence of real pain the in private sector; if it is not in the numbers, it doesn't exist."



There are no official records kept in relation to my trips to the toilet but I can guarantee you that I do go. John Fitzgerald would beg to differ with me though. :rolleyes:

balrog

I am talking about the professions that have not dropped there price. We all know people have lost there jobs and they are private sector workers. Now finally the public are having there wages cut. But what about the guys who are vital such as doc and other professionals not cutting their cost.

imme

Is anyone aware of a Doctor, Dentist, Solicitor who has dropped their fees?????

frman

balrog wrote: »

I am talking about the professions that have not dropped there price. We all know people have lost there jobs and they are private sector workers. Now finally the public are having there wages cut. But what about the guys who are vital such as doc and other professionals not cutting their cost.

Have you shopped around ?

Have you asked your doctor if he is reducing his charges?
Have you told him that you will move if he/she doesn't ?
Have you gone to other doctors and said "listen, my doctor is charging me 60quid a pop, how much do you charge ? If he says 60, tell him to politely p1ss off and move on to the next doctor.
It is not the responsibility of professionals to look after your finances.
Move to a cheaper alternative, this is the only way that reductions ill take place.

Seth Brundle

balrog wrote: »

So who has really cut their prices?

The government cut our prices for us when we tender for any public service contracts.
We also made the decision to reduce our costs thereby allowing us to become even more competitive in our pricing for all jobs.

balrog wrote: »

Oh yea the cost of goods has come down, but services for such things doctors, dentists, IT and lawyers have not come down. The only ones I can see are building professionals and the car industry.

Who else have you looked at?
You may be right in saying that doctors, etc. haven't reduced their costs but you can't therefore apply a blanket over the entire private sector for this. Have you spoken with your doctor over their costs?

balrog wrote: »

Are these guys real or what I guess the ERSI are right when they say there is no real wage cut in the private sector?
I own a small construction firm.

Are you talking about private sector prices or private sector workers taking a pay decrease?
I took a 7% cut earlier this year (and obviously no pay increase and I also have to fund my own pension). I did this along with my colleagues so that my company would be able to ride out the storm.
We did not rip people off during the good times and we are still getting repeat business from people now.
As for the ESRI, pppffffffffffffffttttttttttttt!

balrog

Not always possible frman. These guys aswell as accountants and IT etc are still taking the the same prices. Clarie burn good call on that one. I have not seen a change nd most of the people i have talked to have not.

Tabnabs

imme wrote: »

Is anyone aware of a Doctor, Dentist, Solicitor who has dropped their fees?????

Yeah, quite a few solicitors have dropped their fees regarding conveyancing. Shop around and there are "bargains" to be had.

frman

balrog wrote: »

Not always possible frman. These guys aswell as accountants and IT etc are still taking the the same prices. Clarie burn good call on that one. I have not seen a change nd most of the people i have talked to have not.

If we are not willing to express our dissatisfaction with our feet, there is no way professionals will voluntarily reduce fees. They are a business afterall, and if the public keep paying the charges that are being asked, they won't change them.

OldJay

frman wrote: »

"There is no evidence of real pain the in private sector; if it is not in the numbers, it doesn't exist."

What utter twaddle.
Aside from the job security issue, paying own pension contributions, receiving same impact from social sector, there are many out there who have been affected by what has taken place over the past 14 months without a benchmark to be seen.
You don't need a ring-bound report or website of tallies to even get a hint of this. Just ask someone you know. Anyone you know.

frman

Justind wrote: »

What utter twaddle.
Aside from the job security issue, paying own pension contributions, receiving same impact from social sector, there are many out there who have been affected by what has taken place over the past 14 months without a benchmark to be seen.
You don't need a ring-bound report or website of tallies to even get a hint of this. Just ask someone you know. Anyone you know.

I agree, Fitzgerald is talking out of his A-hole.

thirtythirty

balrog wrote: »

Are these guys real or what I guess the ERSI are right when they say there is no real wage cut in the private sector?

I can list of 5 or 6 firms that a number of friends of mine are in who have had anything between 12 and 20% pay cuts.

I can also list 15 or so people off the top of my head who lost their job entirely, and i know there's defo more if i put some though into it.

Mr public sector may have taken a hit in salary yes, but he has never had to endure being told to sit at his desk that he has worked at for years and to wait. If he recieves a phone call he is to immediately gather his things and go to floor x. Goodbye life, hello dole. And no that is not just one of those stories, i know 2 people in 2 different companies that had that done to them.

You don't see any of them throwing their rattles out of the pram though.

ednwireland

imme wrote: »

Is anyone aware of a Doctor, Dentist, Solicitor who has dropped their fees?????

doctors and dentists hmm private sector ? maybe but a gov. controlled Private business, solicitors no idea but i do know of accountants who have dropped their fees and had to lay off staf because they have less work due to closing businesses

Dublin_Gunner

frman wrote: »

... John Fitzgerald says that there is no evidence of real pain the in private sector; if it is not in the numbers, it doesn't exist."

Lengthening doles queue's should be all the evidence he needs TBH.

mickoneill30

balrog wrote: »

Not always possible frman. These guys aswell as accountants and IT etc are still taking the the same prices.

I've no idea about accountants but I work in IT in the private sector and frequently have to purchase goods and services from IT consultants.
The prices have come way down from a year and a half ago which is handy as the amount of money we have to spend has gone way down too (20% of my dept was let go at the start of this year along with the rest of the company and I've had a pay cut).

Vegeta

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Lengthening doles queue's should be all the evidence he needs TBH.

Exactly what I was thinking

GSF

imme wrote: »

Is anyone aware of a Doctor, Dentist, Solicitor who has dropped their fees?????

Solicitors for house conveyancing (what little of it is going on) have cut fees. but you often need to negotiate up front. If you dont haggle you wont get lower fees in general from professionals. The rate advertised is not always the rate they will settle for.

heavyballs

Justind wrote: »

What utter twaddle.
Aside from the job security issue, paying own pension contributions, receiving same impact from social sector, there are many out there who have been affected by what has taken place over the past 14 months without a benchmark to be seen.
You don't need a ring-bound report or website of tallies to even get a hint of this. Just ask someone you know. Anyone you know.

+1 well said
if we the private sector have not felt the pain why was the tax take so low over the past 2 years,don't tell me it was all the people made redundent,that wouldn't ad up
now they need to increase productivity in the ps just like we have in my line of work,longer hours for less pay but we just get on with it(that's not to say some ps workers arn't up to their eyeballs in work like the nurses)

irish_bob

ive seen little evidence that the likes of GP,s have dropped thier charges , in fact , my own GP has raised his prescription ( non consulation ) fees by 5 euro

gp,s , dentists etc operate in more or less a regulated closed shop enviroment , liberalisaton is long over due but i wouldnt hold my breath , the doctor fraternity is the biggest clique in irish society

moceri

Ok so you are unhappy about some of the Prices you are being charged. You at least have a choice. Shop around if you are unhappy with your Doctor, Dentist or Lawyer. I was unhappy with prices being charged by a Dentist so I chose to have treatment at the Dental Hospital at a fraction of the cost. I simply couldn't afford the extortionate prices being charged.

jimmycrackcorm

Solicitors have been heavily hit by job losses due the dependancy on conveyancing and have cut fees. I asked a couple of solicitors about how things were going and they have had to get very competitivie about getting business. Architect fees have come down also as they have been hit (almost 50% job cuts).

As for doctors and Dentist - why would they cut their fees when the waiting rooms are full to capacity with GMS patients?

seclachi

balrog wrote: »

So who has really cut their prices? Oh yea the cost of goods has come down, but services for such things doctors, dentists, IT and lawyers have not come down. The only ones I can see are building professionals and the car industry. Are these guys real or what I guess the ERSI are right when they say there is no real wage cut in the private sector?
I own a small construction firm.

Pile of old cobbles, I know plenty of IT professionals who have taken pay cuts, in many cases simply because there was a recession on. Its the same with lawyers, many involved in property got screwed.

Doctors are a bit different, they have a captive audience so they can just keep riding people.

nesf

frman wrote: »

I agree, Fitzgerald is talking out of his A-hole.

I think his point was that if there was official statistics for this then we wouldn't have different groups trying to claim that there aren't wage cuts/hour's lost/whatever going on in the private sector. David Beggs trotted out the 70% haven't taken a pay cut line after the Budget, even though there is no real conclusive evidence out there of how many have!

If there are no official statistics for something they might as well not have happened for all the impact it will make in the national debate. Imagine if we had statistics clearly showing the decline in private sector wages, this would make it far easier to argue for public sector wage reductions but all we have are average hourly earnings which tell you nothing because you can fire some people, leave everyone else on the same wages and the average wage will go up if the people fired earned less than the average!

Warfi

This thread being anti private sector, I'm surprised to see it hasn't been locked or merged with another thread!

nesf

Warfi wrote: »

This thread being anti private sector, I'm surprised to see it hasn't been locked or merged with another thread!

Why would it be? It's not like there's a large glut of anti-private sector threads for it to be added to. Versus public sector bashing which seems to have turned into a national pastime these past few weeks.