Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

BoatMad

Muckyboots wrote: »

Traffic backed up right back to Oranmore from level crossing today. Maldron Hotel roundabout became totally clogged and traffic started backing up on all directions as the level crossing barriers came down on the N18. And then she passed. One engine and one carriage plodding in to Galway from Ennis. WRC in full swing on a Friday evening in August. Eight happy passengers, scores of pissed off drivers ...and a few near misses.

there are no engines pulling passenger carriages in service on IE anymore , they are all railcars

Stephen15

BoatMad wrote: »

there are no engines pulling passenger carriages in service on IE anymore , they are all railcars

Dublin to Belfast and Dublin to Cork are still loco hauled mind they're push pull.

BoatMad

Stephen15 wrote: »

Dublin to Belfast and Dublin to Cork are still loco hauled mind they're push pull.

Push pull isn't really conventionally loco hauled, in any event all passagner services on the wrc are rail cars

L1011

BoatMad wrote: »

Push pull isn't really conventionally loco hauled

Except for half the time, when it is.

We don't have anything like the APT-E with the loco in the middle and twin control cars.

eastwest

BoatMad wrote: »

Push pull isn't really conventionally loco hauled, in any event all passagner services on the wrc are rail cars

Any two of them equals a bendy bus, albeit one that doesn't go anywhere near where it's needed.

BoatMad

eastwest wrote: »

Any two of them equals a bendy bus, albeit one that doesn't go anywhere near where it's needed.

oh IE is a mess, but thats got nothing to do with the WRC

eastwest

BoatMad wrote: »

oh IE is a mess, but thats got nothing to do with the WRC

Except in so far as it points to the root of the problem, that the use of a disused rail alignment that is in the wrong place to create a transport solution in the general region was never going to work. A bendy bus on the other hand, could have run in dedicated bus lanes and would still have enough empty seats to keep the rail lobby happy.

Carawaystick

eastwest wrote: »

Except in so far as it points to the root of the problem, that the use of a disused rail alignment that is in the wrong place to create a transport solution in the general region was never going to work. A bendy bus on the other hand, could have run in dedicated bus lanes and would still have enough empty seats to keep the rail lobby happy.

The Coach services which will run on the new Motorway will probably have too many seats occupied to have the gricers happy

Are west on track looking to get the line from Loughrea opened again? or even from Pat MacDonagh's plaza up to the mainline?

hytrogen

Carawaystick wrote:

Are west on track looking to get the line from Loughrea opened again? or even from Pat MacDonagh's plaza up to the mainline?

I'm sure locals at Attymon jcn would love to get to Loughrea for the shops and not by driving or walking

TCDStudent1

eastwest wrote: »

What I meant was that WOT should have campaigned for this option instead of the old, twisting route, if they were taking a long-term view. Then if the demographic ever changed to justify a business case for rail, the route would then have been there.
That would have put long-term planning ahead of vanity though; it would be hard for a few of them to let go of the idea of riding a train in their lifetimes. After all, Canon Horan got to fly on a plane out of Knock!
Now they have neither, and the recent decision by Mayo Council has blocked the route for a long time for rail or any other use. The 'rail cruising' business that is about to get a lease on the track might be very expensive (if not impossible) to buy out if they ever want to put a railway there; they'd have been better off with a greenway. Unless of course they know well that there are not likely to be trains on the route this century.
I was surprised at the lack of objection by WOT to the rail cruising proposal; there wasn't a peep out of them, even though it poses a much greater threat to rail than a cycleway if it is successful.

What is rail cruising???

Ste.phen

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

What is rail cruising???

I wasn't aware there was a proposal for it here, but there's at least one company worldwide doing it: http://www.railcruising.com/

Short version: small cars with wheels compatible with the track gauge, and you drive on a tour along the rail line - presumably they can use rails otherwise unsuitable for actual trains because of the much lower weight and speeds

L1011

Bit awkward on single tracks - need to basically have periods of uni-directional flow and ensure everyone is off before going again. Not practical to have passing loops and the associated control.

Ste.phen

I think they have people leave in groups from a particular spot in the morning and turn around at a designated spot for that reason (though i only spent a few mins on their site so could be wrong)

mayo.mick

Ste.phen wrote: »

I wasn't aware there was a proposal for it here, but there's at least one company worldwide doing it: http://www.railcruising.com/

Short version: small cars with wheels compatible with the track gauge, and you drive on a tour along the rail line - presumably they can use rails otherwise unsuitable for actual trains because of the much lower weight and speeds

Anyone with their own bikes or legs can't use it. If you want to use it ya'll have to stump up for it. Admittedly not as costly as the *Irish Orient Express* at €3,000 a head, but will still cost you....

RailCruising Price

Adult

$76.00 per adult

Adults
4 or more adults booked
$68.00 per adult
Senior
65 years +
$64.00 per senior

Children
6 - 16 years
$38.00 per child
Infants
0 - 5yrs
Free

Family
2 adults and up to 3 children
$190.00 per family

Group Booking
Please contact us for group pricing
Contact Us

http://www.railcruising.com/site/webpages/general/pricing

savagethegoat

they used to do this on the Talyllyn Railway in the 1950s....hire parties slate wagons and attach them to the service train up the hill and let them make their own way home in the evening

Best leave this scheme the fifties where it belongs

Carawaystick

The rsc would have a conniption
They won't let BnM run the bog train any more

Muckyboots

savagethegoat wrote: »

they used to do this on the Talyllyn Railway in the 1950s....hire parties slate wagons and attach them to the service train up the hill and let them make their own way home in the evening

Best leave this scheme the fifties where it belongs

I love it when this thread starts talking trains. Really ! The longer this discussion goes on the more a Greenway/Heritage Rail Trail becomes the most obvious solution.

Del.Monte

Carawaystick wrote: »

The rsc would have a conniption
They won't let BnM run the bog train any more

What this then?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bwsnm-gWhHE

Del.Monte

Ste.phen wrote: »

I wasn't aware there was a proposal for it here, but there's at least one company worldwide doing it: http://www.railcruising.com/

Short version: small cars with wheels compatible with the track gauge, and you drive on a tour along the rail line - presumably they can use rails otherwise unsuitable for actual trains because of the much lower weight and speeds

Innovative so can't even be considered in Ireland.

hytrogen

savagethegoat wrote:

they used to do this on the Talyllyn Railway in the 1950s....hire parties slate wagons and attach them to the service train up the hill and let them make their own way home in the evening

I took a trip when I was down in Cairns, Queensland up to Kuranda through the rain forest with a Cable car through the forest canopy back down, it was the most incredible experience on a train, not to mention the breathtaking views and historic commentary along the route. We Definitely need more of this here, it would be a fantastic tourist opportunity to capitalise on towards the western frontier

savagethegoat wrote:

Best leave this scheme the fifties where it belongs

No way, sure look at the new oriental express now established here, it's a fantastic tourist and revenue opportunity for everyone involved, particularly rural towns that are / were connected by the rail network with significant history and culture!

hytrogen

Del.Monte wrote:

What this then?

Absolutely fantastic is what it is!! Great idea and I love the interior of that Cranog-style hut too!

Markcheese

Okay, rail cruising not a terrible idea, b
But, limited number of punters, kind of expensive, not that flexible... (if one car stops everyone stops),probably expensive enough to set up..
Sure bikes ,and even those 4 wheel,4 seater electric bike things on a greenway would be more cost effective and practical

Carawaystick

Del.Monte wrote: »

What this then?

Not the bog train I had in mind
http://www.familyfun.ie/clonmacnoise-and-west-offaly-railway/

eastwest

In this instance, it is simply a project put into the mix to stop greenway development on the disused line. While it might get off the ground with heavy injections of Leader or similar funding, it won't attract sufficient high-spending customers to make it work, in my view.
While the pro-rail lobby may think they have pulled a fast one in having this project added to the mix, they didn't really think it through. While a greenway can be easily relocated in the event of a railway ever being built on the route of the closed line, it wouldn't be too easy to move a business with a lease on a railway, a lease they will have to have if they want to get finance for the project.
The timing of this proposal has them holding their noses in Mayo, apparently, as it appeared from almost nowhere at about the same time as three hundred members of the public made submissions to the county development plan in support of a greenway on the route. The rail cruising proposal appears to have been an alternative to show that the council wasn't just letting the railway route go to absolute dereliction, and a thin excuse to ignore the clamour from the pro-tourism lobby.
It seems to have been ill-considered, though.

schemingbohemia

Rail Cruising depends on there being a rail line in the first place - not an alignment which is all there is at the moment. Pure Stalking Horse rubbish.

hytrogen

eastwest wrote:

While the pro-rail lobby may think they have pulled a fast one in having this project added to the mix, they didn't really think it through. While a greenway can be easily relocated in the event of a railway ever being built on the route of the closed line, it wouldn't be too easy to move a business with a lease on a railway, a lease they will have to have if they want to get finance for the project.

It wasn't about pulling a "fast one" it is about being progressive and utilizing assets and in turn justifying the asset upkeep which IR have been slacking on the past decades.
Same as when the canals closed to commercial traffic when the rail network was setup alongside them, it's progress, little did they realise then that a good upkeep would been beneficial to touristic traffic along the waterways. Pre-tiger boom the government saw this and acted to get the OPW & WI to reestablish the derelict routes. This brought millions back into the country in terms of tourism, population to depopulating townships and villages as well as the revenues generated as a result. What is most significant is we've seen the benefits of investment during boom times and how resilient it remained during the recent recession.

what_traffic

http://www.wexfordpeople.ie/news/greenway-route-coming-down-the-track-for-county-35004804.html

Rosslare to Waterford Rail line is only out of use for five years and talks of converting it into a Greenway already.

eastwest

hytrogen wrote: »

It wasn't about pulling a "fast one" it is about being progressive and utilizing assets and in turn justifying the asset upkeep which IR have been slacking on the past decades.
Same as when the canals closed to commercial traffic when the rail network was setup alongside them, it's progress, little did they realise then that a good upkeep would been beneficial to touristic traffic along the waterways. Pre-tiger boom the government saw this and acted to get the OPW & WI to reestablish the derelict routes. This brought millions back into the country in terms of tourism, population to depopulating townships and villages as well as the revenues generated as a result. What is most significant is we've seen the benefits of investment during boom times and how resilient it remained during the recent recession.

Waterways Ireland quickly realised that investment in the waterways themselves per se wasn't enough, that the banks and towpaths were the real assets. They have been involved (and are still involved) in developing greenways on canal.banks.
Sometimes, what's important is the linear strip of land and not what's on it, as in the case of the rotting and overgrown railway that runs from athenry to Collooney.
As for investments made in the boom years and whether they are delivering revenues now, not all of them are. The wrc from ennis to athenry was not only a poor investment that hasn't delivered, it was described as one of the top ten wastes of funding in a report a few years back.
There isn't a politician alive who actually believes that a government will repeat this mistake, but that's not what is at issue. The most important thing that can happen to this asset, if you're a politician, is that nothing happens. Hence the blocking tactic of the ridiculous rail-cruising proposal, a proposal designed among other things to keep local people from using or enjoying a publicly owned asset by pricing them out of it, even if that means that it also blocks any chance of a railway being built in the future.

end of the road

Carawaystick wrote: »

Not the bog train I had in mind
http://www.familyfun.ie/clonmacnoise-and-west-offaly-railway/

it's closure wasn't anything to do with the RSE though. the tours were getting in the way of operations. a shame it has gone.

BoatMad

what_traffic wrote: »

http://www.wexfordpeople.ie/news/greenway-route-coming-down-the-track-for-county-35004804.html

Rosslare to Waterford Rail line is only out of use for five years and talks of converting it into a Greenway already.

Madness, this is a strategic cross country route and needs to be maintained as a railway