Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

eastwest

Isambard wrote: »

if they were in control wouldn't they be doing something about the land-grabbers who have appropriated the track bed in several places.?

One of the problems faced by Irish Rail is that they don't have any budget stream for maintaining unused or closed lines. That's one of the attractions of greenways for them; the alignment is maintained by the county councils under their permissive access agreement.

end of the road

eastwest wrote: »

One of the problems faced by Irish Rail is that they don't have any budget stream for maintaining unused or closed lines. That's one of the attractions of greenways for them; the alignment is maintained by the county councils under their permissive access agreement.

the same county councils who themselves probably don't have that much money? also, it only takes a couple of lads to walk the line to check for obstructions and a lad with a digger to remove if there are any. you wouldn't need a huge maintenence team to deal with the land grabbers.

eastwest

end of the road wrote: »

the same county councils who themselves probably don't have that much money? also, it only takes a couple of lads to walk the line to check for obstructions and a lad with a digger to remove if there are any. you wouldn't need a huge maintenence team to deal with the land grabbers.

It's not that simple unfortunately. If you work in a large organisation you can't spend any money unless there is a budget stream to draw on. Unless you want to get fired, you can't just ring up 'a lad with a digger' and ask him to do anything, and he won't get paid in any case.

5rtytry56

eastwest wrote: »

, you can't just ring up 'a lad with a digger' and ask him to do anything, and he won't get paid in any case.

the poor fella would'nt know how to put his digger on the special wheels to run on the tracks either.

Muckyboots

Taytosnax wrote: »

There are proposals to route an alternative Greenway through Tuam avoiding the railway line but that isn't good enough for the Greenway campaigners.

The so called alternative route was a deflection tactic and every one Tuam knows this was the case. The local papers have well and truely outed this one. The alternative route was drawn up without consultation with any of the land owners, involved CPO's, country roads and boreens and avoided Tuam rather than going through it. Even the TD who commissioned it has distanced himself from it now. Let's move on from that unfortunate debacle.

ClovenHoof

Taytosnax wrote: »

There is a wider debate outside in the world beyond boards and that is what sort of future we should plan for over the next 40 years for Ireland. Do we continue to grow and grow Dublin to the extent that the West becomes little more than a hinterland with some tourism facilities to allow recreation time for those living in the overcrowded east and continue with the policy of managed decline for the West?

A counterweight? You do realise that without Dublin being in competition with Frankfurt, Zurich, Oslo and so on that there would be no economic investment in the West of any kind as there would be no money coming into the country.

Taytosnax wrote: »

Or do we take the step of identifying a city to develop into a serious counterweight to Dublin.

and pray tell what role does a wibbly wobbly railway single track connecting Collooney to Athenry and Athenry to Limerick have to do with developing urban Ireland? Which I am all in favour of by the way.

None at all. Also tourism is one of the largest growing and profitable industries on earth.

If the West became a conurburation of cities your tourism would die.

On the plus side you would then have one more thing to whing about I guess.

ClovenHoof

eastwest wrote: »

vested interests, ranging from councillors who are making a lot of money from membership of the inter county railway committee,

The truth at last.

Essentially a type of gombeen mafia, that is pissing themselves laughing everytime a British trainspotter shares their press releases so they can continue to get all expenses paid weekend trips to five star resort hotels to talk absolute bollox.

Muckyboots

Taytosnax wrote: »

Muckyboots talks about how he prefers express buses to trains.

He deliberately chooses buses in order to further undermine Irish Rail.

eastwest

At least the cows will be safe in their beds soon.

Limerick to Ennis train line reopens after injured cow is removed http://jrnl.ie/3578203

devnull

This is an absloute final warning

See the following thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=104492193&postcount=7949

If the behaviour does not improve from all parties not only will bans be handed out but the thread will be closed permenantly.

Do not reply to this post.

- Moderator

Taytosnax

ClovenHoof wrote: »

The truth at last.

Essentially a type of gombeen mafia, that is pissing themselves laughing everytime a British trainspotter shares their press releases so they can continue to get all expenses paid weekend trips to five star resort hotels to talk absolute bollox.

Where, who? Some proof and a link would be helpful.

Hotblack Desiato

Consonata wrote: »

If Heavy Rail was dying, you wouldn't still have profitable lines such as Cork,Sligo and Belfast.

WRC was a bad idea, implemented at a horrible time, but it is not indicative of how well rail is doing elsewhere.

It was another poster's assertion that [heavy] rail is dying.

I'd have to admit it's not exactly in the rudest of health. The motorway programme was always going to present a serious challenge to IE and they are left with an overpriced product with little or no speed advantage over road in many cases. Heavy investment in high speed rail, if it ever happens at all, will be restricted to the Cork - Dublin - Belfast corridor. But it probably won't happen, and heavy rail will eventually be allowed to wither on the vine.

westtip

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Heavy investment in high speed rail, if it ever happens at all, will be restricted to the Cork - Dublin - Belfast corridor. ].

That it is it in nutshell as it is the only rail route listed in the European TEN-T Transport plan approved in November 2013 for any kind of funding on the island of Ireland. Of course this is well known to everyone who takes even a vague interest in this subject, and is the nettle that needs to be grasped by all. It is the real reason why the dream in some peoples minds of the Western Rail Corridor phase 2 3 or 4 came to an end in November 2013; that is now four years ago and yet still we hear about this nonsense from one of the local TDs in Tuam. He just doesn't grasp the reality of the situation. Pity, but there you have it.

westtip

Taytosnax wrote: »

You are claiming that Shane Ross has committed to stopping your Greenway proposals. Have you got a link to back that claim up?

Can't get a link to the article in todays Sunday Independent, Page six (photo attached) This is something Shane Ross should be held accountable for, will he though? I doubt it. BTW the little slip into the programme for Government by the Galway East TD about nothing happening on the closed railway line that will prevent a railway from re-opening was put in to stop the greenway from happening. Shane Ross has already committed to stopping the Greenway by going along with that nonsense, and is simply falling in line with the wishes of his "colleague" in the Independent Alliance. Of course a greenway won't stop the railway from happening, the lack of resources and need for the railway have already guaranteed that. In fact a greenway will of course protect the route in public ownership.

What this news report shows is the aforementioned TD will do is talk this farce up as the start of phase one of the railway being built, and try to sell it as a positive story for the region, of course its nothing of the kind. What he has forced Shane Ross to do is waste €70,000 of our money on a few architectural drawings for a bridge that won't be built. This is a deliberate and avoidable waste of taxpayers money. It's tantamount to criminal waste but will anything be done about it. I doubt it.

eastwest

westtip wrote: »

Can't get a link to the article in todays Sunday Independent, Page six (photo attached) This is something Shane Ross should be held accountable for, will he though? I doubt it. BTW the little slip into the programme for Government by the Galway East TD about nothing happening on the closed railway line that will prevent a railway from re-opening was put in to stop the greenway from happening. Shane Ross has already committed to stopping the Greenway by going along with that nonsense, and is simply falling in line with the wishes of his "colleague" in the Independent Alliance. Of course a greenway won't stop the railway from happening, the lack of resources and need for the railway have already guaranteed that. In fact a greenway will of course protect the route in public ownership.

What this news report shows is the aforementioned TD will do is talk this farce up as the start of phase one of the railway being built, and try to sell it as a positive story for the region, of course its nothing of the kind. What he has forced Shane Ross to do is waste €70,000 of our money on a few architectural drawings for a bridge that won't be built. This is a deliberate and avoidable waste of taxpayers money. It's tantamount to criminal waste but will anything be done about it. I doubt it.

By any standards, that's a very cynical abuse of tax euros, but if they get away with this stunt I'd wager that a bridge might be funded as part of Sean Canney's election campaign.
It's unheard of for something like this to be done in the absence of a plan for a railway; there should be an approved project, backed by a feasibility study before committing funds like this. If a council official pulled a stunt like this he'd be out of a job. The Minister has let the job go to his head, thinking that he can spend money without any kind of standards. Bizarre!

monument

Another moderator note:

There's some claims that some posters are protected but all of posters listed as protected all have recent warning or infractions and some have recent bans and may be close to further bans. As per usual, the facts show that we moderate both sides.

Both sides on this argument need to grow up -- stop the name calling, stop the back seat moderating and, when caught breaking the rules, stop pointing finger pointing at others.

Everybody should be able to make your points without name calling etc. If you can't, you're not welcome here.

-- moderator

westtip

Press release From: The Western Rail Trail campaign
September 3rd 2017 for immediate release

• Waste of taxpayers’ money by Minister of Transport exposed in national media
• Minister Ross approves funding for design and planning of bridge on a closed railway line with little hope of re-opening
• €70,000 to plan a bridge that will probably never carry a train

A spokesman for the Western Rail Trail Campaign – a community-based group campaigning to preserve the alignment of the closed rail line from Athenry to Sligo by utilising the route for tourism and leisure as a greenway until such time as a railway may be possible, today said the revelation in the national press today that Minister of Transport Shane Ross has signed off on funding for the design and planning of a bridge on the closed railway from Athenry to Collooney is little short of a disgrace.

A report in today’s Sunday Independent (September 3rd) has revealed that the Minister has approved spending €70,000 of tax payers money on the design and planning for a bridge on a railway that is unlikely to ever be built.

‘It is quite astonishing the Minister thinks he can just waste our money like this’ said Brendan Quinn of the Western Rail Trail. ‘We received an email from the Minister on 24th August stating he had “approved Transport Infrastructure Ireland to undertake planning and design work this year in relation to a replacement bridge at Ballyglunin”

Quinn added: ‘I could not believe a Minister would approve funding for such work when there are absolutely no plans to re-open the railway line, and when the current Taoiseach and Minister of Finance whilst Ministers of Transport are both on record as saying the Western Rail Corridor will not be extended.’

Mr Quinn went on to say that ‘it is highly irregular for any public official to spend money on a project that does not exist, and there is no pending project to rebuild this disused railway’. He added that

‘the excuse that this spending was incurred as part of an agreement in the programme for government is simply not true. The removal of the original bridge to create an access road for the M17 motorway has in no way prevented a railway being rebuilt in the future, and this stunt by the Minister smacks of populist nonsense.’

The Western Rail Trail campaign which wants to see the route developed as a greenway to protect the route in public ownership until such time as a railway might be possible have asked the Minister of Finance to step in and make sure no more tax payers money is wasted on drawing up plans for bridges on closed railways that are not going to be re-opened.

ENDS: body text 397 words


Find us on Facebook: sligomayogreenwaycampaign

 
Email sent on August 24th from Minister of Transport Shane Ross to Brendan Quinn is reproduced below:

Our Ref: SR/17/18118
Dear Brendan
Thank you for your correspondence of 14th July 2017, forwarded to me by the Taoiseach’s Office, in connection with a the railway bridge at Ballyglunin.
On foot of the provision in the Programme for Government that no measures will be taken to prevent the future reactivation of the Athenry to Claremorris corridor for rail use, I have approved Transport Infrastructure Ireland undertaking planning and design work this year in relation to a replacement bridge at this location.


With best wishes,


Shane Ross
Minister for Transport Tourism and Sport

Banjoxed

westtip wrote: »

Press release From: The Western Rail Trail campaign
September 3rd 2017 for immediate release

• Waste of taxpayers’ money by Minister of Transport exposed in national media
• Minister Ross approves funding for design and planning of bridge on a closed railway line with little hope of re-opening
• €70,000 to plan a bridge that will probably never carry a train

A spokesman for the Western Rail Trail Campaign – a community-based group campaigning to preserve the alignment of the closed rail line from Athenry to Sligo by utilising the route for tourism and leisure as a greenway until such time as a railway may be possible, today said the revelation in the national press today that Minister of Transport Shane Ross has signed off on funding for the design and planning of a bridge on the closed railway from Athenry to Collooney is little short of a disgrace.

A report in today’s Sunday Independent (September 3rd) has revealed that the Minister has approved spending €70,000 of tax payers money on the design and planning for a bridge on a railway that is unlikely to ever be built.

‘It is quite astonishing the Minister thinks he can just waste our money like this’ said Brendan Quinn of the Western Rail Trail. ‘We received an email from the Minister on 24th August stating he had “approved Transport Infrastructure Ireland to undertake planning and design work this year in relation to a replacement bridge at Ballyglunin”

Quinn added: ‘I could not believe a Minister would approve funding for such work when there are absolutely no plans to re-open the railway line, and when the current Taoiseach and Minister of Finance whilst Ministers of Transport are both on record as saying the Western Rail Corridor will not be extended.’

Mr Quinn went on to say that ‘it is highly irregular for any public official to spend money on a project that does not exist, and there is no pending project to rebuild this disused railway’. He added that

‘the excuse that this spending was incurred as part of an agreement in the programme for government is simply not true. The removal of the original bridge to create an access road for the M17 motorway has in no way prevented a railway being rebuilt in the future, and this stunt by the Minister smacks of populist nonsense.’

The Western Rail Trail campaign which wants to see the route developed as a greenway to protect the route in public ownership until such time as a railway might be possible have asked the Minister of Finance to step in and make sure no more tax payers money is wasted on drawing up plans for bridges on closed railways that are not going to be re-opened.

ENDS: body text 397 words


Find us on Facebook: sligomayogreenwaycampaign

 
Email sent on August 24th from Minister of Transport Shane Ross to Brendan Quinn is reproduced below:

Our Ref: SR/17/18118
Dear Brendan
Thank you for your correspondence of 14th July 2017, forwarded to me by the Taoiseach’s Office, in connection with a the railway bridge at Ballyglunin.
On foot of the provision in the Programme for Government that no measures will be taken to prevent the future reactivation of the Athenry to Claremorris corridor for rail use, I have approved Transport Infrastructure Ireland undertaking planning and design work this year in relation to a replacement bridge at this location.


With best wishes,


Shane Ross
Minister for Transport Tourism and Sport

Is being spokesman for The Western Trail Campaign a paying job for Mr Quinn? For all the effort he puts into it, he should be paid for it by someone.

eastwest

Banjoxed wrote: »

Is being spokesman for The Western Trail Campaign a paying job for Mr Quinn? For all the effort he puts into it, he should be paid for it by someone.

When the trail is finally approved, we'll take up.a collection for him!
Won't be long now...

westtip

Banjoxed wrote: »

Is being spokesman for The Western Trail Campaign a paying job for Mr Quinn? For all the effort he puts into it, he should be paid for it by someone.

I wish.

ClovenHoof

I recall a WRC obsessive claiming that Obama would help build it when he was elected. Serious. They are like Flat Earthers.

monument

Flat Earther wrote: »

The Greenway campaigners are bullies and trouble makers. Here is proof.

Banned -- just registered with that user name and you have the cheak to report others for trolling and claim people are bullies with nothing to back it up!

-- moderator

McAlban

westtip wrote: »

Press release From: The Western Rail Trail campaign
September 3rd 2017 for immediate release

• Waste of taxpayers’ money by Minister of Transport exposed in national media
• Minister Ross approves funding for design and planning of bridge on a closed railway line with little hope of re-opening
• €70,000 to plan a bridge that will probably never carry a train

A spokesman for the Western Rail Trail Campaign – a community-based group campaigning to preserve the alignment of the closed rail line from Athenry to Sligo by utilising the route for tourism and leisure as a greenway until such time as a railway may be possible, today said the revelation in the national press today that Minister of Transport Shane Ross has signed off on funding for the design and planning of a bridge on the closed railway from Athenry to Collooney is little short of a disgrace.

A report in today’s Sunday Independent (September 3rd) has revealed that the Minister has approved spending €70,000 of tax payers money on the design and planning for a bridge on a railway that is unlikely to ever be built.

‘It is quite astonishing the Minister thinks he can just waste our money like this’ said Brendan Quinn of the Western Rail Trail. ‘We received an email from the Minister on 24th August stating he had “approved Transport Infrastructure Ireland to undertake planning and design work this year in relation to a replacement bridge at Ballyglunin”

Quinn added: ‘I could not believe a Minister would approve funding for such work when there are absolutely no plans to re-open the railway line, and when the current Taoiseach and Minister of Finance whilst Ministers of Transport are both on record as saying the Western Rail Corridor will not be extended.’

Mr Quinn went on to say that ‘it is highly irregular for any public official to spend money on a project that does not exist, and there is no pending project to rebuild this disused railway’. He added that

‘the excuse that this spending was incurred as part of an agreement in the programme for government is simply not true. The removal of the original bridge to create an access road for the M17 motorway has in no way prevented a railway being rebuilt in the future, and this stunt by the Minister smacks of populist nonsense.’

The Western Rail Trail campaign which wants to see the route developed as a greenway to protect the route in public ownership until such time as a railway might be possible have asked the Minister of Finance to step in and make sure no more tax payers money is wasted on drawing up plans for bridges on closed railways that are not going to be re-opened.

ENDS: body text 397 words


Find us on Facebook: sligomayogreenwaycampaign

Some amount of rhetoric in there... and being fully aware of my own (Due to rushed typing in between more important things)... Not a lot of grammar or punctuation either, It reads like an NBRU release.

Was there an agreement by the NRA to restore the bridge? if this "waste (of) our money" was such an issue then why not complain about the millions spent on the bridge over the alignment on the Tuam Bypass?

eastwest

McAlban wrote: »

Some amount of rhetoric in there... and being fully aware of my own (Due to rushed typing in between more important things)... Not a lot of grammar or punctuation either, It reads like an NBRU release.

Was there an agreement by the NRA to restore the bridge? if this "waste (of) our money" was such an issue then why not complain about the millions spent on the bridge over the alignment on the Tuam Bypass?

There never was an agreement to restore the bridge in the absence of a plan for a railway.
The agreement made in the negotiations for government stated that nothing would be done to preclude the reopening of a railway on the route. Ross has apparently relied on this to justify his spending of the 70k on planning a bridge to nowhere, but he is way out of order.
Removing the old bridge to allow the building of the access road to the motorway can in no way be said to stop a railway being built; the air space over the access road is still in control of the state and a bridge can be built when and if a railway is approved.
It is unprecedented for anyone to jump the gun and incur this kind of costs on a project that hasn't yet been approved, and it has clearly been done to make it look like a train is coming, when the official government position is that it isn't.
This is 'parish pumpery' at its worst, wasting a significant wad of our hard earned taxes just to make a TD look good, with no real purpose other than that. Anywhere else, both the TD and Minister would be gone, but not here.
This is one of the most disrespectful examples of giving two fingers to struggling taxpayers that I have seen in years. It is an absolute disgrace, pure and simple.

McAlban

eastwest wrote: »

This is one of the most disrespectful examples of giving two fingers to struggling taxpayers that I have seen in years. It is an absolute disgrace, pure and simple.

Really in this forum? With millions spent on redesigning a perfectly good Metro? millions of taxpayers money going to Aecom for Old Rope? That's just one example. I think it's a bit over the top, 70k is a drop in the bucket, it's what two TD's pay in Income tax a year, or not far north of a train drivers salary. Needless rhetoric and appealing to populist notion that our tax is always squandered.

eastwest

McAlban wrote: »

Really in this forum? With millions spent on redesigning a perfectly good Metro? millions of taxpayers money going to Aecom for Old Rope? That's just one example. I think it's a bit over the top, 70k is a drop in the bucket, it's what two TD's pay in Income tax a year, or not far north of a train drivers salary. Needless rhetoric and appealing to populist notion that our tax is always squandered.

That's the problem though, thinking that 70k is just a drop in the bucket. It's a lot of money in any normal person's language. More importantly it has been spent in a cynical manner by a minister who knows full.well that he is throwing it out the window just to garner a colleague a few votes. It was also spent on an element of a project that not only hasn't been approved but hasn't even been proposed. There is no project on the table but Ross spends the money anyway.
If we are at the stage where politicians can do stuff like this without sanction, we're in real trouble. Across the water, they'd be gone.

westtip

McAlban wrote: »

Really in this forum? With millions spent on redesigning a perfectly good Metro? millions of taxpayers money going to Aecom for Old Rope? That's just one example. I think it's a bit over the top, 70k is a drop in the bucket, it's what two TD's pay in Income tax a year, or not far north of a train drivers salary. Needless rhetoric and appealing to populist notion that our tax is always squandered.

It's not about the 70K it is about the fact the Minister knowingly approved the work in the full knowledge that the railway is not going to be restored. As Minister of Transport I am sure he is well acquainted with the facts surrounding the so called Western Rail Corridor.

Waste is waste even if it is "only" 70.000. Sligo Greenway co-op are going to have to fund a feasibility study out of their own pocket for the Sligo section of the Western Rail Trail, the department could have paid for this study instead of wasting money on architectural engineering drawings on plans for a bridge that quite simply is never going to be built on a project that has a snowflakes chance in hell of getting approval and more to the point funding.

When will people finally accept the Western Rail Corridor is a dead duck?

Sorry to be rhetorical but this is probably the answer to my own question, sad but probably true.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9uHhLe6WE0

McAlban

eastwest wrote: »

That's the problem though, thinking that 70k is just a drop in the bucket. It's a lot of money in any normal person's language. More importantly it has been spent in a cynical manner by a minister who knows full.well that he is throwing it out the window just to garner a colleague a few votes.

70k is a large amount of money to a lot of people, but in the grand scheme of things for infrastructure of all types, it's not a lot of money.

westtip wrote: »

It's not about the 70K it is about the fact the Minister knowingly approved the work in the full knowledge that the railway is not going to be restored. As Minister of Transport I am sure he is well acquainted with the facts surrounding the so called Western Rail Corridor.

Waste is waste even if it is "only" 70.000. Sligo Greenway co-op are going to have to fund a feasibility study out of their own pocket for the Sligo section of the Western Rail Trail, the department could have paid for this study instead of wasting money on architectural engineering drawings on plans for a bridge that quite simply is never going to be built on a project that has a snowflakes chance in hell of getting approval and more to the point funding.

When will people finally accept the Western Rail Corridor is a dead duck?

When are you going to accept that the WRT is about as alive as the WRC? Constant propaganda pieces from Sligo Greenway Co-Op or WOT aren't going to change that, It's why other projects are getting funded by councils and yours is not.

eastwest

McAlban wrote: »

70k is a large amount of money to a lot of people, but in the grand scheme of things for infrastructure of all types, it's not a lot of money.



When are you going to accept that the WRT is about as alive as the WRC? Constant propaganda pieces from Sligo Greenway Co-Op or WOT aren't going to change that, It's why other projects are getting funded by councils and yours is not.

The Sligo Greenway Co-op project is being funded by sligo county council, in partnership with the Co-op.

eastwest

McAlban wrote: »

70k is a large amount of money to a lot of people, but in the grand scheme of things for infrastructure of all types, it's not a lot of money.

Relating this to the scale of costs involved in infrastructure projects is missing the point.
It is unprecedented for anyone in the public service to spend money on any element of a project that not only hasn't been defined and agreed, but that isn't even on the table.
There is no project to build a railway, yet Ross has spent seventy grand on a project that only exists in the head of his colleague.
He can't do that; there is something he's forgetting, and it's called governance. He's not running a private company, he's a public servant and there are rules.