Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

westtip

eastwest wrote: »

Are you suggesting that Sean Canney has it wrong?

Sean "anyone but Canney" Canney has delivered for Claremorris as the people of Tuam now know!

whisky_galore

end of the road wrote: »

the rural crime argument isn't an argument that can be simply dismissed. a greenway can be a perfect opportunity for criminals to commit crime on nearby farmers and other residents and then get away quite easily. now it's not a reason that greenways should never happen, but the argument is valid and it cannot and should not be dismissed.

LoL, maybe like Fr Ted, they should 'take in the roads' as lots of criminals use the road and motorway network to access homes and farms.

A few months ago, I tried out a greenway, probably better described as a 'forest trail' around Tinahely (old Shillelagh branch)
Just a trail hacked out from the overgrown trackbed, no surfacing apart from some gravel/old ballast, bikes are banned (although I did see one lycra-clad chancer:rolleyes:) as are unleashed dogs. The landowners have allowed the trail to be put in place provided people don't bring unleashed dogs, the permission can be taken away at any time.

Thought it was a refreshing change from the overdone and overfenced Waterford greenway with families with strollers, kiddiwinks on tricycles and Tour De France wannabes jostling for space. Plus it leaves a decent corridor for wildlife as only a portion of the trackbed has been cleared sensitively, much more wild flowers/plants/fungi than a 'developed' greenway. Would like to see more of these.

Muckyboots

hytrogen wrote: »

Probably now recognised as too septic and volitile an area to go near politically. I'd say f people eased their opinions and venom spitting there would be better progress made by now...

How does one ease an opinion? Accept a compromise? One must be proffered or dialogue entered first. Hon Sec WOT with this suggestion or post on their FB page and see how it goes down.

Del.Monte

@ eotr

While CIE/IE never operated the Galway/Clifden branch they did own Clifden railway station until its sale in 1998 to businessman John Sweeney who now operates the Clifden Station House Hotel on the site. The ownership of the site passed from the MGWR to the GSR IN 1925 and subsequently to CIE in 1945 - chances are that they still also own huge chunks of the worthless trackbed too. I know for a fact that they (CIE) still own a large part of the Cavan & Leitrim trackbed.

Quackster

end of the road wrote: »

maybe 1 or 2 but not most. the mallow to waterford line is rather a sceenic route. the wrc isn't.

I'm afraid you have an extremely blinkered idea of what constitutes scenery!

westtip

end of the road wrote: »

maybe 1 or 2 but not most. the mallow to waterford line is rather a sceenic route. the wrc isn't.

Ah the old not scenic enough for a greenway argument, this old chestnut first came from our dear friends in Claremorris, West on Track, who in a submission to Mayo county council in 2014 on the Mayo county plan said this of the idea to a greenway on the closed railway from Claremorris to Collooney:

9.7 West on Track State
It is stated that comparing the Claremorris-Collooney rail line to the Great Western Greenway is disingenuous as the latter is built along the route of a railway that was formally abandoned before its removal in 1937 and runs through some of the most magnificent scenery in Co. Mayo whereas
there is no comparable scenery along the Claremorris-Collooney route which remains a rail line in the possession of the state.

You can go find this on the Mayo coco website dig deep into all the submissions on the county plan. It was one of the best motivators for the Sligo Greenway Co-op to be formed when they heard the WOT representative from Claremorris telling them that the Sligo section of the closed railway had no scenery. In fact if West on Track read this thread I have been meaning to thank them for making such a disingenuous comment! They motivated the greenway movement even more! In response to the comment this was made in a counter submission:

Response: Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, clearly this disparaging comment about the quality of the scenery on the route is at best ignored. Clearly West on Track have no appreciation of the honest open country side the route travels through with lovely views of the Ox mountains, Nephin, or Croagh Patrick in the distance. Nor does West on Track appreciate the numerous businesses and hostelries on the route that simply want to welcome the tired hungry tourists off their bikes and into their businesses to enjoy some West of Ireland hospitality. It is a pity West on Track cannot see the beauty of their own county.

Not scenic enough for tourists!!! Go take a look!

westtip

Press release From: The Western Rail Trail campaign
October 12th 2017 for immediate release: 394 words (main body text)

• Greenway campaign welcomes €30 million for Greenways in Ireland from Minister Shane Ross
• Campaign calls on Minister of Finance and An Taoiseach to reconfirm support they gave to the Western Rail Trail when they were Ministers of Transport
• Greenway a perfect match for Apple “Modern, Green, Carbon friendly, a perfect match for Apple.”

A spokesman for the Western Rail Trail Campaign – a community-based group campaigning to preserve the alignment of the closed rail line from Athenry to Collooney by utilising the route for tourism and leisure as a greenway until such time as a railway may be possible, has welcomed the post budget announcement from Transport Tourism and Sport Minister Shane Ross that €30 million has been allocated for the development of Greenways in Ireland.

“This is really good news for the Western Rail Trail which will be a cost effective project as the land for the 100 km greenway is already in State ownership through Irish Rail.” said Brendan Quinn of the Greenway campaign. “There are no complicated questions about rights of way or potential hold ups. This is a simple shovel ready project that could deliver over 100 km of greenway connecting Sligo with Athenry and with the Dublin Galway Greenway, the Great Western Greenway and provide a local green commuter route to Apple at Athenry.”

In his post budget briefing on October 11th, Minister Ross outlined projects that will be funded by the Department of Transport. The only major rail project mentioned was the Dublin Metro North due to start construction in 2021.

A spokesperson of the Western Rail Trail campaign said, “There was no mention of further extending the Western Rail Corridor in Mr Ross’s post budget briefing. This is consistent with Ministers Ross’s predecessors, Paschal Donohoe and Leo Varadkar who both stated whilst in office at Transport that there are no plans to extend the Western Rail Corridor” the spokesperson added; “Paschal Donohoe and Leo Varadkar were very positive about the idea of using the closed railway from Athenry to Sligo as a greenway when they were in Transport; we have no reason to believe the Minister of Finance and An Taoiseach have changed their thinking. The time has come for the two most senior Government Ministers to say it as it is.”

The campaign has also welcomed the news about Apple finally getting the go ahead today. The Western Rail Trail section from Athenry to Tuam would be a boost for green commuters to the new Apple Data centre. “It is exactly the kind of infrastructure Apple will be looking for to make the area an attractive place to attract employees; modern, green, and carbon friendly, a perfect match for Apple” said Quinn.


ENDS: body text 394 words

Contacts:
Find us on Facebook: sligomayogreenwaycampaign

hytrogen

eastwest wrote:

I'm amused at the often repeated wot assertion that there is 'no scenery' along the western rail trail. This myth originated from people who have a naive view of what constitutes 'scenery' --- usually mountains and the sea with a few lakes thrown in. On truth, most people derive pleasure from a view of unspoiled countryside, wild bogland, forests, streams and meadows, with the absence of ugly ribbon development that is seen along main roads. The 'no scenery' people need to get out of their cars more and open their eyes. As for rural crime, most reasonable people would agree that it is usually car based, so your concerns would be better addressed to the councils and the NRA ..

Look at the CSO statistics on crimes around Athlone and particularly geographically estates nearest to the Athlone-Mullingar line / now greenway since it was established. Risen

MayoForSam

hytrogen wrote: »

Look at the CSO statistics on crimes around Athlone and particularly geographically estates nearest to the Athlone-Mullingar line / now greenway since it was established. Risen

However, no recent crimewave out Mulranny direction from what I've heard :rolleyes:.

Muckyboots

Are passenger numbers falling much on at Athenry- Gort- Ennis stations since the M17 opened?

westtip

Muckyboots wrote: »

Are passenger numbers falling much on at Athenry- Gort- Ennis stations since the M17 opened?

Can they fall any lower?......It may depend on what the xpress bus routes do if they decide to use the motorway and then the bus lanes into city centre they may well take time off the journey time which my guess is will hit the through traffic on Limerick - Galway railway route. But of course if west on track are to be believed (not something that is advisable) it is standing room only on the trains!

eastwest

hytrogen wrote: »

Look at the CSO statistics on crimes around Athlone and particularly geographically estates nearest to the Athlone-Mullingar line / now greenway since it was established. Risen

Indeed, and look at rainfall levels too, rising measurably since the cursed greenway opened.
And global warming. Don't forget global warming.

whisky_galore

MayoForSam wrote: »

However, no recent crimewave out Mulranny direction from what I've heard :rolleyes:.

Maybe there's nothing to rob out there, apart from sheep...:pac:

whisky_galore

westtip wrote: »

A spokesman for the Western Rail Trail Campaign – a community-based group campaigning to preserve the alignment of the closed rail line from Athenry to Collooney by utilising the route for tourism and leisure as a greenway until such time as a railway may be possible, has welcomed the post budget announcement from Transport Tourism and Sport Minister Shane Ross that €30 million has been allocated for the development of Greenways in Ireland.

Would they really step away from it if a railway was found to be viable? :cool:

Would they care to sign off on that?

Muckyboots

whisky_galore wrote: »

Would they really step away from it if a railway was found to be viable? :cool:

Unless they want to get mowed over by a train, they will.


Would they care to sign off on that? It's a proper lease agreement- so yes they will be signing off on that.

Keep up !

schemingbohemia

hytrogen wrote: »

Look at the CSO statistics on crimes around Athlone and particularly geographically estates nearest to the Athlone-Mullingar line / now greenway since it was established. Risen

Risen more than in comparison with national figures? Other areas of Athlone?
The CSO has stopped reporting on crime statistics recently due to the unreliability of Garda data, so not sure how old those figures were/are.

schemingbohemia

Any chance of a linky for the CSO stats?

whisky_galore

Muckyboots wrote: »

Unless they want to get mowed over by a train, they will.


Would they care to sign off on that? It's a proper lease agreement- so yes they will be signing off on that.

Keep up !

Cue the howls from the sunday strollers and bicyclists if 'their' path is taken off them. Ringing up TDs etc.

monument

hytrogen wrote: »

Look at the CSO statistics on crimes around Athlone and particularly geographically estates nearest to the Athlone-Mullingar line / now greenway since it was established. Risen

I’d that’s not a joke: You’re going to have to provide links to the CSO stats or a newspaper article on that before posting again.

— moderator

eastwest

whisky_galore wrote: »

Would they really step away from it if a railway was found to be viable? :cool:

Would they care to sign off on that?

That question pretty much answers the argument.
The question of the viability of the wrc has been well established already. 44 euro per passenger journey is the figure I believe, if you ignore capital costs.
Hardly a business case!

westtip

Slowly but surely the message will get through by Western Economic Corridor they mean a motorway running from Cork to Letterkenny...

http://galwaybayfm.ie/taoiseach-confirms-cork-galway-motorway-plan/

Del.Monte

westtip wrote: »

Slowly but surely the message will get through by Western Economic Corridor they mean a motorway running from Cork to Letterkenny...

http://galwaybayfm.ie/taoiseach-confirms-cork-galway-motorway-plan/

Why stop there - surely extensions to Burtonport and Carndonagh should be included.

westtip

Del.Monte wrote: »

Why stop there - surely extensions to Burtonport and Carndonagh should be included.

but surely you want the branchline to Burtonport re-opened so Thomas can have a branch line all to himself?

eastwest

whisky_galore wrote: »

Cue the howls from the sunday strollers and bicyclists if 'their' path is taken off them. Ringing up TDs etc.

The despised tourists, non car using walkers and nasty families on bikes wouldn't have 'their path taken off them'. Any railway project would have to include the construction of a greenway, not least to generate economic activity to subsidise the trainspotters' fantasy vanity project.

end of the road

westtip wrote: »

Slowly but surely the message will get through by Western Economic Corridor they mean a motorway running from Cork to Letterkenny...

http://galwaybayfm.ie/taoiseach-confirms-cork-galway-motorway-plan/

no . they mean nothing of the sort. a motorway to letterkenny is not a priority.

eastwest wrote: »

The despised tourists, non car using walkers and nasty families on bikes wouldn't have 'their path taken off them'. Any railway project would have to include the construction of a greenway, not least to generate economic activity to subsidise the trainspotters' fantasy vanity project.

that would put extra expence on to the railway project.

whisky_galore

eastwest wrote: »

That question pretty much answers the argument.
The question of the viability of the wrc has been well established already. 44 euro per passenger journey is the figure I believe, if you ignore capital costs.
Hardly a business case!

In the future, not now, obvs....

westtip

end of the road wrote: »

no . they mean nothing of the sort. a motorway to letterkenny is not a priority.
.

You are probably right, nor is a railway to Sligo from Athenry, but we all know that. Re the motorway to Letterkenny, in truth a good wide road the standard of the Bundoran bypass would suffice from Sligo north, I think the NRA have stopped building the single carriage with hard shoulder type trunk road, so I guess DC similar to the N4 Roosky bypass.

It would be hard to justify in terms of traffic numbers, and is not a national priority but it would be the final jigsaw in the national road network to have a decent quality seamless DC from Cork to Letterkenny.

Muckyboots

whisky_galore wrote: »

In the future, not now, obvs....

Ah...the future. Forgot about that.
Ironic though that often the most vitriolic opposition to Greenways comes from rail nostalgics. Not referring to anyone currently on this thread, of course. The spotters tend to blow themselves out quite quickly.

monument

Claude Wilton wrote: »

Probably because you and westtip inexhaustibly stick to this thread. That isn't a criticism, but most other people have other things to do than to argue the toss here.

You're well aware of the rules of boards.ie and the C&T charter. Play the ball and not the man, and the topic isn't about posters or what things you or other do.

If you don't want to get involved with the thread (or "argue the toss here"), then don't post. It's that simple.

-- moderator

eastwest

end of the road wrote: »

no . they mean nothing of the sort. a motorway to letterkenny is not a priority.




that would put extra expence on to the railway project.

Very little in the context of a major engineering project, and much of it would just consist of tidying up the access tracks for the rail job plus a few lightweight bridges. Any cost would be more than offset by the savings in not having to buy back sections of land from squatters.