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GhostBusters 2016 **SPOILERS FROM POST 1751 ONWARD**
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Enjoyed this more than I thought I would, better than I expected but probably a 6/10.
Leslie Jones was decent enough in the film after all the shîte given out about her character following the first trailer. I seem to be in the minority but I absolutely hated Kate McKinnon's "wacky" character, just seemed very forced and irritating.
Biggest problem lastnight was the painful audience in cineworld, clapping and wooping at minor bits, pockets of people actually guffawing at every single joke. There were actual screams at some of the cameos, what is wrong with people :pac:
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Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,441 CMod ✭✭✭✭
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For me, McKinnon was the star because she had an unhinged energy that was lacking from the film otherwise. Given that even Melissa McCarthy is playing it reserved here, McKinnon's quirks and eccentricities stood out in a good way. There was a pleasantly oddball edge to her performance, and found her unreserved glee in her sadistic (well, sadistic towards malevolent spirits) homemade instruments one of the most enjoyable comedic throughlines in the film - culminating, of course, in her lovely little action setpiece
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Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,441 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Join Date:Posts: 28152
For example, people will claim that The Force Awakens or Fury Road are "Feminist Movies" and I don't really get it to be honest. You could switch the genders of the Rey and Furiosa characters and nothing about the movies would change at all. Those movies don't really have a strong message about equality and they don't really do much to challenge gender stereotypes beyond "here is a strong woman doing awesome things". How can people claim they are feminist movies?
Actually, if you changed the Furiosa character in Mad Max, along with the majority of the female cast, you would be left with a very different film The narrative is about a group of women escaping from being enslaved by a man solely for their beauty and child-bearing capacity, and beyond that are purely disposable objects (see, for example, when Joe manages to recapture a 'damaged' Splendid). The film ends with a group of freshly liberated women returning to their original site of oppression and literally rising to a newly-gained position of power. I can honestly say I have never seen much more overtly feminist imagery in mainstream blockbuster cinema than the final sequence of Fury Road. None of this is to say it couldn't have gone quite a bit further with its feminist themes, or necessarily belongs alongside the great feminist artworks. Heck, it's written and directed by men which is a point well worth noting (not that men can't be feminists, of course) 
But for a major Hollywood blockbuster it's notable nonetheless!
Force Awakens, on the other hand, I'd be reluctant to hold up as a feminist work and instead one that just is happy to celebrate the diversity and range of its fictional universe (which just happens to include a new female hero). Fury Road, though, has its feminist credentials baked into its very visual and narrative DNA 0 -
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johnny_ultimate wrote: »For me, McKinnon was the star because she had an unhinged energy that was lacking from the film otherwise. Given that even Melissa McCarthy is playing it reserved here, McKinnon's quirks and eccentricities stood out in a good way. There was a pleasantly oddball edge to her performance, and found her unreserved glee in her sadistic (well, sadistic towards malevolent spirits) homemade instruments one of the most enjoyable comedic throughlines in the film - culminating, of course, in her lovely little action setpiece
In a way I agree with everything you said, I follow her week-to-week most of the year on SNL (where she is regularly the funniest person on it) and I expected her to be funnier in Ghostbusters. Now, I'm not necessarily saying it's her fault. In a way she wasn't given a huge amount of funny dialogue, but you've made a really good point there, the performance shouldn't be overlooked and I probably undersold her in my earlier review.0 -
johnny_ultimate wrote: »Actually, if you changed the Furiosa character in Mad Max, along with the majority of the female cast, you would be left with a very different film The narrative is about a group of women escaping from being enslaved by a man solely for their beauty and child-bearing capacity, and beyond that are purely disposable objects (see, for example, when Joe manages to recapture a 'damaged' Splendid). The film ends with a group of freshly liberated women returning to their original site of oppression and literally rising to a newly-gained position of power. I can honestly say I have never seen much more overtly feminist imagery in mainstream blockbuster cinema than the final sequence of Fury Road. None of this is to say it couldn't have gone quite a bit further with its feminist themes, or necessarily belongs alongside the great feminist artworks. Heck, it's written and directed by men which is a point well worth noting (not that men can't be feminists, of course) But for a major Hollywood blockbuster it's notable nonetheless!
Force Awakens, on the other hand, I'd be reluctant to hold up as a feminist work and instead one that just is happy to celebrate the diversity and range of its fictional universe (which just happens to include a new female hero). Fury Road, though, has its feminist credentials baked into its very visual and narrative DNA
Nah, I disagree.
Sure, from your subjective point of view, you can say that this is a Feminist movie.
For me it's just a dumb action movie. Beautiful, immersive and exciting but still pretty shallow.
Objectively though? I can't see how it's obviously feminist.
My issue really is with a movie being claimed by ideological groups as one of their own when it really isn't.
I'm actually not even really sure if good art should be pushing an ideology at all or if it's a good idea to look for confirmation of your ideology in artworks.
I suppose art can also be propaganda?0 -
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im kinda baffled at McKinnons character being so marmite.
particularly after years of "the big bang theory" holtzman to me clearly suffers from some form of socio/personality disorder. a sheldon cooper with tech skills if you will, only she actually WANTS friends.
hence that somewhat awkward, but characteristically real , toast from her at the end.
i thought she and her enthusiam was the best thing in this.
i dont know the comedian from eve so if its how she normally does stuff fair enought, but it looked to me like she was channeling that for inspiration.
the stuff that actually bothers me more about the film now is how things pan out that in hindsight dont make alot of sense (or none at all )
patty for instance. when did she join the ghostbusters ?
she's this films version of winston- the working prole that balances out the academic leads- but winston was hired by the ghostbusters in the original when business got too much for them to handle by themselves . patty is a client, and last i checked one that didnt pay em.
in fact i cant think of ANYONE actually hiring the ghostbusters in this to bust ghosts ! they just turn up when randomers call em for no apparent fee. how are they paying for all this stuff ?
also theres an awfull lot of jokes in this that stem from the "controversey". one or two i can understand but it seem like half the script at times. it makes you wonder just how much of this was done on the fly.
like i said before stuff like this doesnt usually occur to me as were talking about a popcorn movie, but it just stands out more now considering the films backdrop.0 -
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Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,441 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Join Date:Posts: 28152
I'm actually not even really sure if good art should be pushing an ideology at all or if it's a good idea to look for confirmation of your ideology in artworks.
I suppose art can also be propaganda?
Come now, that's a preposterous statement Of course art can and should be ideological, in fact there's a strong argument to be made that art is inherently ideological (ignoring a political or social context can actually be a very strong ideological act in and of itself). Should the great Iranian filmmakers stop making films that critique their society and regime, often at great personal cost, just because somebody may not agree with their viewpoint? Of course not.
And of course it's not just about looking to reaffirm one's own belief systems (although naturally you'll drift towards works you find some meaning and connection with). I adore some clearly religious works such as Passion of Joan of Arc and Tree of Life despite being a staunch atheist. And I can appreciate the incredible form and expression of Soy Cuba despite it very obviously being a communist propaganda piece
But yeah, I think this is a conversation that's moving well away from Ghostbusters, and will let people get back to discussing that now!0 -
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