Parents association organised swimming lessons

mrhappy42

Hi,

As part of the school the parents association arrange swimming lessons in the local pool.

Ages 6 to 12. Classes are per age range so about 10 kids a lessons. After the swimming lessons the kids go and change. Most of the parents picking up the kids happen to be mothers and the boys tend to get changed unsupervised.

Now the principal has stated a parent must be in the changing room, ideally two. As no fathers are available the boys might now end up with no swimming lessons....

Ideas....

M

ash23

mrhappy42 wrote: »

Hi,

As part of the school the parents association arrange swimming lessons in the local pool.

Ages 6 to 12. Classes are per age range so about 10 kids a lessons. After the swimming lessons the kids go and change. Most of the parents picking up the kids happen to be mothers and the boys tend to get changed unsupervised.

Now the principal has stated a parent must be in the changing room, ideally two. As no fathers are available the boys might now end up with no swimming lessons....

Ideas....

M

There must be some stay at dads. Would have thought it was fairly common these days? Or at least some dads who are on flexi hours or rreduced hours.
All you can do is send a letter out asking that some dads step up and volunteer or basically the boys won't be able to go swimming anymore. If the mums can do it then then the dads should be able to aswell.
Or maybe try a different pool where there are unisex changing rooms if there's one nearby?

Ickle Magoo

There must be some Dad's available to help out. I'm sure if you put out the message that a male supervisor is required or lessons for the boys may have to stop, some volunteers will step forward.

Nevyn

Why can't the kids all be in the one dressing room together?
Often young boys go in with thier mam and sisters into the 'ladies' changing rooms until they are old enough to be in the mens.

If the pool is booked out for lessons for the school then there should not be a problem with booking out one of the dresing rooms.

Ickle Magoo

Thaedydal wrote: »

Why can't the kids all be in the one dressing room together?
Often young boys go in with thier mam and sisters into the 'ladies' changing rooms until they are old enough to be in the mens.

If the pool is booked out for lessons for the school then there should not be a problem with booking out one of the dresing rooms.

That would certainly work with the younger kids, I think they may run into issues when it came to the 10+ yr olds. I've heard women complaining about young sons in the ladies changing rooms (where else is he supposed to go?!), can you imagine the reaction to their 12yr old daughter sharing a communal dressing room with her male class mates.

I guess it depends on the facilities too...would one set leaving the pool earlier so the same parents can look after them in the one changing room work?

Victor

I did swimming from about age8-11. I didn't want to go in sixth class becaus eht eclass bully was going.

What are the fears? Messing around? Bullying? insecurity? Molestation? I realise it would cost, but can the pool delegate a lifeguard?

What are the child protection rules around this?

eviltwin

I've got to be honest folks I'd be much happier having a woman in the changing room with my son rather than a man. Sexist? Perhaps but I wouldn't be happy with a stranger male, even if he was a parent of a classmate, being there while my son gets changed

smelltheglove

eviltwin wrote: »

I've got to be honest folks I'd be much happier having a woman in the changing room with my son rather than a man. Sexist? Perhaps but I wouldn't be happy with a stranger male, even if he was a parent of a classmate, being there while my son gets changed

I was going to say, I'd say most parents would be happy enough if another mother was supervising the boys.

PullOutMethod

eviltwin wrote: »

I've got to be honest folks I'd be much happier having a woman in the changing room with my son rather than a man. Sexist? Perhaps but I wouldn't be happy with a stranger male, even if he was a parent of a classmate, being there while my son gets changed

Ironically that attitude is precisely the reason you won't get male volunteers - most blokes are terrified of being accused of being child abusers.
The same reason there are so few male child care workers and male teachers to young primary schoolchildren in this country.

dee1dee2

4 lessons through our local school parents must have garda clearence to enter dressing rooms to dress their own children i think its a little crazy. can c the point a little but still think its a bit ott

eviltwin

PullOutMethod wrote: »

Ironically that attitude is precisely the reason you won't get male volunteers - most blokes are terrified of being accused of being child abusers.
The same reason there are so few male child care workers and male teachers to young primary schoolchildren in this country.

I did say I was being sexist :rolleyes:

Seriously though, yes its a very biased attitude and we all know women can be as bad but I just wouldnt be prepared to take the risk where my child is concerned.

I put the same question to my husband incidentally to see if he would feel any different being a man and he was the same. Woman no problem, a man no way

BostonB

I'd have to same as bias as the rest of ye. I wonder how they deal with it in other cultures? Some of which have mixed changing rooms etc. I guess one problem is the facilities. Many years ago you used to have individual changing cublicals. Which solved this problem. National Aquatic center has this design. I realise this doesn't help as your stuck with your own facilities. Any kids class I've been to some mums go into the mens with the boys. Because usually theres no adults getting changed at the same time.

ash23

BostonB wrote: »

I'd have to same as bias as the rest of ye. I wonder how they deal with it in other cultures? Some of which have mixed changing rooms etc. I guess one problem is the facilities. Many years ago you used to have individual changing cublicals. Which solved this problem. National Aquatic center has this design. I realise this doesn't help as your stuck with your own facilities. Any kids class I've been to some mums go into the mens with the boys. Because usually theres no adults getting changed at the same time.

Our local pool has unisex showers which are in full view of the pool so the idea is you shower in your swim wear.
There are no communal changing areas, all cubicles.
Separate toilets for girls and boys but other than that, everyone is in together. Think it's the way forward tbh.

OP, If you post what sort of facilities the local pool has, someone may be able to come up with an idea. Are there any cubicles at all? Is it only the school using the pool at the time etc?

cruizer101

I can't imagine you will get any Dad to do it on his own, nor would I advise you to have one, so will definitly need two. This is not only for kids safety but also for parent, if some kids decide to lie and say he did something this is there word against his, another adult is required.

Also at 12 years old some of the boys may well not be too happy about changing in front of women which is perfectly understandable.

Are the lessons during school time?

Is there any male teachers in school, you could approach and ask them to help out?

Lastly I just like to say what a shame it is that these measures need to be taken these days but sadly it is necessary, hope you get sorted and can keep up the swimming lessons it really is a skill everyone sholud have, I wish all schools did it.

Victor

eviltwin wrote: »

I've got to be honest folks I'd be much happier having a woman in the changing room with my son rather than a man. Sexist? Perhaps but I wouldn't be happy with a stranger male, even if he was a parent of a classmate, being there while my son gets changed

Sexist, but also blind. Not all abusers are men and a naked child is quiet easy to intimidate.

Abuse isn't only about anal rape. Just because women don't have penises doesn't mean they can't embarrass, bully, molest or otherwise abuse a child.

eviltwin

Victor wrote: »

Sexist, but also blind. Not all abusers are men and a naked child is quiet easy to intimidate.

Abuse isn't only about anal rape. Just because women don't have penises doesn't mean they can't embarrass, bully, molest or otherwise abuse a child.

I'm well aware men arent the only ones who abuse kids, I'm not saying women are 100% safe but the stats speak for themselves and speaking as a mother here I would have my concerns if it were my son.

I have unfortunately had direct experience of having a member of my own family outed as a paedophile and its often a case that they volunteer for things like this just so they can be around children...the person in my case didnt actually abuse anyone but simply being around kids in various states of undress was enough for them. I just wouldnt take a chance with my own children.

LegacyUser

if theres noone else using the changing rooms it should be no problem to have a mother supervising the boys changing room. thats how it used to work in my school.

for the 10-12 yearolds, do they really need such supervision to shower and get changed? perhaps a head in the door every few minutes to tell them to hurry up and check they wernt messing would be enough and wouldnt cause embarrasment for the boys.

or like someone suggested, finding two fathers/ male lifeguards/ older brothers.

jenzz

Our school does the same thing - swimming lessons. The dept edu guidlines were all posted out to us from the school. From what I remember but correct me if im wrong was boys 1 room, girls 1 room. 1 teacher & 1 parent volunteer per room ( these are all ladies in our case as likewise no daddys would volunteer) 2 parent volunteers to view the swimming pool while they swimming & the 2 sna's stay in the changing room to guard belongings.

Im involved in other areas of school so I dont attend. But i was a little bit surprised at a mum one day. She approached me quite worried.. I hope you dont mind I had to help xxxxxx get dressed today. I thanked her & joked about the drama madame has getting changed. But I got the impression she thought I was about to give out to her for assisting my little one. I was very grateful she bothered to help considering they have 40 kids with them. Maybe dads are afraid to volunteer in case a parent would make a snide remark.

Johnny Giles

idears wrote: »

if theres noone else using the changing rooms it should be no problem to have a mother supervising the boys changing room. thats how it used to work in my school.

for the 10-12 yearolds, do they really need such supervision to shower and get changed? perhaps a head in the door every few minutes to tell them to hurry up and check they wernt messing would be enough and wouldnt cause embarrasment for the boys.

or like someone suggested, finding two fathers/ male lifeguards/ older brothers.

You can't have someone sticking their head in either. They might see gentalia. i think it would be innapropriate. These kids are 11-12. Pubic hair and the like. You should not have someone taking a peak at them.

Johnny Giles

Ickle Magoo wrote: »

I've heard women complaining about young sons in the ladies changing rooms

I doubt the sons were complaining. They must have got an eyeful all the same. Depends on their age. Are they old enough to notice a vagina. It's all to do with age really. I don't think it's really necessary to bring aclass swimmimg anyway.

It's good to know how to swim but maybe the parents could organise it themselves outside school hours.

SerialComplaint

Some good suggestions already on this thread. There is also the issue of the power of the principal in relation to Parents Association activities. This is not a school activity, so the school is not responsible. The PA is responsible. I think it is important to draw this line in the sand, while reaching a negotiated solution.

Certainly, any parent would need to have Garda clearance before taking on a role like this.

Johnny Giles

eviltwin wrote: »

I've got to be honest folks I'd be much happier having a woman in the changing room with my son rather than a man. Sexist? Perhaps but I wouldn't be happy with a stranger male, even if he was a parent of a classmate, being there while my son gets changed

Sexist? Certainly. How can you say that.

Women can abuse as well you know. It isn't just men. Just because they don't have a phalis to be shoving up an orifice. They could use any instrument - vibrators, even their own fingers. How would you feel if a parent of a child in your sons class was abusing him with her hands?

Women may come across all innocent but I wouldn't be trusting any foreign people - either male or female. Women may use the child to satisfy the urge as often as the man does. You would let a strange woman look at your child naked - Frailty, Thy Name Is Woman.

Johnny Giles

dee1dee2 wrote: »

4 lessons through our local school parents must have garda clearence to enter dressing rooms to dress their own children i think its a little crazy. can c the point a little but still think its a bit ott

This makes sense. You can't have other people staring at children other than those of their own creation.

Johnny Giles

cruizer101 wrote: »

Also at 12 years old some of the boys may well not be too happy about changing in front of women which is perfectly understandable.

Some might relish the oportunity - again, to satisfy the urge. I can understand the threat they have to the females in their changing room though.

axel rose

Am I the only person that thinks thats its completely inappropiate to expect a naked female be watched by a 12 year old boy? Its not all about the children you know. Why should any user of a public pool be forced to show their naked body to an emerging teenager? Young child yes.....10years and upwards- no.

I left a well known gym for the same reason.

I suggest that the group try and get fathers involved or find a pool with more family friendly changing facilities.

hunnymonster

Victor wrote: »

What are the child protection rules around this?

People working with kids (coaching sports) should do the child protection/code of ethics courses. These are organised by the local sports partnerships. Most of it is basic common sense but it does formalise what is appropriate and what is not.

smelltheglove wrote: »

I was going to say, I'd say most parents would be happy enough if another mother was supervising the boys.

I wouldn't, and I hate getting changed myself when other mothers take their pubescent boys into the women's changing rooms.. Most gyms I'm involved with ask children over 7 to use the gender appropiate changing rooms. They might not dress themselves perfectly but they get the job done, you can always re-tie ties etc outside. The only problem with groups that the OP is talking about is that messing will invariably break out so it's more about discipline than actual help with the practicalities.

idears wrote: »

or like someone suggested, finding two fathers/ male lifeguards/ older brothers.

The lifeguards and swim teachers should all have the appropriate training in dealing with children so they can pop their head around the door (in groups of 2 minimum). This might increase the cost of the lessons though as obviously if they have to supervise changing, they can't be lifeguarding or teaching another class.