Are FIAT's really that bad

dubbeat

Hey,

I'm considering buying a used fiat punto. Its a 96 I think?

I've heard of FIATS getting a lot of stick and name calling and things like Fix It Again Tomorrow.

I'm just wondering are they really that bad?

I dont need an amazing car. I just want something thats not too expensive and that I can rely on not to cost me a load of money down the line

Thanks!

CONM

There much better than they used to be, they now even come with a 5 year warranty

bazz26

Expect this thread to decend into chaos. Most Alfa Romeo/Fiat threads do.

EPM

Half the reason was people bought them on scrappage schemes that couldn't afford them. Then they didnt service them and problems started. A 96 Punto would be right bang in the middle of that period. If you're buying something like that I'd look more at a Starlet or Micra as they were usually better looked after.

daca88

i had an 02 reg punto, never had a problem with it. it was an excellent little car!

oisin_t

oh god! 96 punto is not a good car. head gaskets start to go at about 50k miles. fiats arent bad per se, just dont get a punto becasue they are bad. you would be alot safer with a opel corsa or a fiesta if your looking for something of a similar age/milage.

E39MSport

EPM wrote: »

Half the reason was people bought them on scrappage schemes that couldn't afford them. Then they didnt service them and problems started. A 96 Punto would be right bang in the middle of that period. If you're buying something like that I'd look more at a Starlet or Micra as they were usually better looked after.

Thats some serious generalisation there !

I would attribute a starlets and a micras longevity to better build quality and durability.

EPM

E39MSport wrote: »

Thats some serious generalisation there !

I would attribute a starlets and a micras longevity to better build quality and durability.

It's not too far from what happened though in many cases.

The Micra and Starlet of course are better screwed together and engineered, but a well looked after Punto will keep going with the best of them. The problem is trying to find one

furtzy

Had both a 96 Punto and a 97 Bravo. Both bought new. The Punto gave a lot of trouble. No engine problems though mostly electrics, suspension and trim all down to very bad build quality. The Bravo was fine and never gave a days hassle in the 18 months I owned it. For the year and price range you are looking at I would avoid the Punto due to the build quality issues i had.

Would look at the Starlet/Micra types as well

oisin_t

LIGHTNING wrote: »

I was trying to guess how long it would take before somebody brought up head gaskets. I have a 00 mk2 punto and its a great little car, you can pick up a mk2 which are a lot nicer than the mk1 for about a 900-1000euro.

lol... well the newer you get the better they get (newest ones are act a great little car! esp the fiat 500!) although to be fair, a head gasket fix on a mk1 punto or even a mk2 is €300, whereas a corsa or a fiesta would be a good bit more. overall though i think 96 is too old for a car like a punto.

cpu-dude

dubbeat wrote: »

Hey,

I'm considering buying a used fiat punto. Its a 96 I think?

I've heard of FIATS getting a lot of stick and name calling and things like Fix It Again Tomorrow.

I'm just wondering are they really that bad?

I dont need an amazing car. I just want something thats not too expensive and that I can rely on not to cost me a load of money down the line

Thanks!

I wondered the same too but they really aren't, you just need to make sure you get a MK2 version because the MK1 is only a 2 Star car while the MK4 is a 4 Star. The MK starts in the year 1999 up until 2003. The comparision below...

MK1

MK2

I bought one not too recently and posted a thread and got excellent feedback on how the drive, handle, parts and repairs as well as common problems / solutions etc. Check it out below:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055692509

Wossack

gf's had a 03 mk2 for a few years now, and no real issues

/edit a pre facelifted mk2

cantdecide

Low mileage is key. Use your spidey senses to determine whether the seller gave a fcuk about minding it or not and buy one for almost nothing. You can't go wrong if you're paying mid to high €000s. Very reasonable to fix if you spare yourself the swooning. WATCH THE TEMP NEEDLE and don't be mean with the servicing, paying special attention to cooling system.

There are worse cars.

Run_to_da_hills

daca88 wrote: »

i had an 02 reg punto, never had a problem with it. it was an excellent little car!

I hope you keep a block of wood in the car

Head gaskets tend to implode after 60K :eek:

I wouldn't drive anywhere in a Fiat without a mobile phone.

Brother has two, Stylo and Escudo. Both have given endless electrical problems.

alias no.9

A '96 punto is worth next to nothing. The fact that it is still on the road is probably a testiment to it being one of the good ones for the simple reason that it would almost be an economic writeoff if it got a puncture. Any car that age will suffer much more from neglect or abuse than any inherrent design issues, when buying cars that old you're buying what you see in front of you not a brand, image or reputation.

bladespin

Had a Punto for years, great car, loads of fun to drive and cheap to run, never had a problem with it either, TBH I think there's a snobbery thing goes on about them, most opinions you hear have no experience of the cars just hearsay.

I've an Alfa now and it's going just fine (fingers crossed).

(CH3)2CHOH

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I hope you keep a block of wood in the car

Head gaskets tend to implode after 60K :eek:

I wouldn't drive anywhere in a Fiat without a mobile phone.

Brother has two, Stylo and Escudo. Both have given endless electrical problems.

Get one of the newer MK2 Puntos with the 16v engine and the head gasket problem is history.

We've had a 1.2 16v Stilo for 6 years and its a cracking little run around. Never spent a penny on it except for servicing.

unkel

EPM wrote: »

It's not too far from what happened though in many cases.

+1

Non-servicing of cars is still rife in this country. I know a lady who buys a brand new car every 3 years. She never has her car serviced. God help the second and subsequent owners...

no1beemerfan

unkel wrote: »

Non-servicing of cars is still rife in this country....

I've an uncle who thinks nothing of 30,000 miles between servicing :eek:

Back OT...as stated above if its a car of that age the make/model won't have that much impact on it. The fact its still on the road says something.

If you do decide to buy it, buy it with your eyes wide open and expect you'll have to sort some issues on it....its a 14 year old car afterall.

oisin_t

cantdecide wrote: »

Low mileage is key. Use your spidey senses to determine whether the seller gave a fcuk about minding it or not and buy one for almost nothing. You can't go wrong if you're paying mid to high €000s. Very reasonable to fix if you spare yourself the swooning. WATCH THE TEMP NEEDLE and don't be mean with the servicing, paying special attention to cooling system.

There are worse cars.

couldnt agree more!

i think though that unless you are the car free or for like 100e..then you should have a look at another model car

fonecrusher1

unkel wrote: »

+1

Non-servicing of cars is still rife in this country. I know a lady who buys a brand new car every 3 years. She never has her car serviced. God help the second and subsequent owners...

I bought a 1997 civic off my brother in law 2 years ago. I asked him when he last got it serviced he shrugged his shoulders & said he never bothered, the owner before him was the last person to change the oil/filters etc etc!!! He originally bought the car in 2001!:D
Thing is you wouldnt have known by driving the car that it had been so badly neglected.
Poor thing.

Some people just dont want to know whats under the bonnet. Get into car, drive car, get out of car. Thats it.

zilog_jones

cantdecide wrote: »

Low mileage is key. Use your spidey senses to determine whether the seller gave a fcuk about minding it or not and buy one for almost nothing.

For a car of this age mileage is meaningless IMO. A low mileage car can still be neglected, and considering there's a possible 13 years of neglect here it can be in pretty bad shape regardless.

As others have said the Mk. 2 is a much better car (class-leading when launched in 1999) and can be had much cheaper than its competition thanks to the lack of brand snobbery compared to the likes of VW and Toyota.

Run_to_da_hills wrote:

Brother has two, Stylo and Escudo. Both have given endless electrical problems.

Erm, an Escudo is a Suzuki...

unkel

fonecrusher1 wrote: »

I bought a 1997 civic off my brother in law 2 years ago. I asked him when he last got it serviced he shrugged his shoulders & said he never bothered, the owner before him was the last person to change the oil/filters etc etc!!! He originally bought the car in 2001!:D

The difference is that in a Honda you might get away with it. In a Punto you won't

BTW you knew the car wasn't serviced in 4 years and you still bought the car :eek:

fonecrusher1

unkel wrote: »

The difference is that in a Honda you might get away with it. In a Punto you won't Good point.

BTW you knew the car wasn't serviced in 4 years and you still bought the car :eek:

Yup thats right. I'l tell you why, i took her for a good long test drive, listened out for anything irregular, put the foot down to see if there was any hesitation then took the car to a mechanic mate & he said go for it!
I changed what was left of the oil the next day & changed the filters. Sold it on to a friend a few months later & its still going strong.
Honda's are unbelievable.

galwaytt

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I hope you keep a block of wood in the car

Head gaskets tend to implode after 60K :eek:

I wouldn't drive anywhere in a Fiat without a mobile phone.

Brother has two, Stylo and Escudo. Both have given endless electrical problems.

tut tut, such negativity ! :rolleyes:

...for, when your (whatever brand) car fails, and you call the AA - HERE ....you might want to look at the badge on the front..........ahem.........why surely not a SCUDO ?

...tum te tum...

Danuogma

Fiats are grand cars, look after them and they will look after you. I have owned several. I drive a Toyota now but I wouldn't hesitate to buy another Fiat. In fact I would buy one sooner than I would buy a VW - another maker with a reputation it doesn't deserve, I have heard many a horror story about them.

L1011

Modern ones are absolutely grand.

But a 1996 one isn't as good, and its also 12 years old - no 12 year old budget priced car is going to be in great nick; and as has been said, the scrappage scheme plus the £99 a week deal Fiat did for the 55S Punto meant that a lot of people who could not afford proper maintainence bought them; as well as a lot of people who learnt to drive in them. Wouldn't expect the gearbox to be in any usable condition after that for starters!

fonecrusher1

Danuogma wrote: »

Fiats are grand cars, look after them and they will look after you. I have owned several. I drive a Toyota now but I wouldn't hesitate to buy another Fiat. In fact I would buy one sooner than I would buy a VW - another maker with a reputation it doesn't deserve, I have heard many a horror story about them.

I have to agree with you there.
VW have been far from faultless in the last 10 years & anyone whos into cars knows that there not bulletproof like they used to be up until around the late nineties.
The same could be said for Mercedes.

Mr Benevolent

As mentioned above AVOID THE MK1!

fonecrusher1

Have to say the current Punto is lovely looking little car. Anybody know what their like for reliability?

EPM

fonecrusher1 wrote: »

Have to say the current Punto is lovely looking little car. Anybody know what their like for reliability?

Read a thing in Autoexpress a few weeks back. They dismantled a 3 year old diesel one with 60k miles on it and it was all pretty good. Any faults they had in the 3 years were very minor

cantdecide

Danuogma wrote: »

....I would buy one sooner than I would buy a VW - another maker with a reputation it doesn't deserve, I have heard many a horror story about them.

Beautifully engineered, solid, tough, well built etc. etc. are the things you'll hear about VW and that's cos they are. Not many will tell you that they have bullet proof reliability. This is because they haven't. It is a seperate matter, really.

Anyone who buys a VW on the basis they have bulletproof reliability, hasn't done their homework. A decent proportion will be disappointed. Most people who end up with VWs have done their homework and will buy the VW anyway because they can differentiate between a good car and a bad car. Reliability, by most people's definition, isn't reasonable and it isn't everything.

E39MSport

unkel wrote: »

+1

Non-servicing of cars is still rife in this country. I know a lady who buys a brand new car every 3 years. She never has her car serviced. God help the second and subsequent owners...

Yeah, but EPM's point was that 96 Fiats are poorly serviced and same era starlets and micras are relatively well looked after, hence the difference in reliability.

I find that hard to stomach. I would love to see proof on that one. Very interesting if true.

However, that aside, I have heard loads of bad things about older puntos, some first hand, but have driven 2 starlets (95/97) and they are excellent. I currently own a 97 and swear by it.

E39MSport

MYOB wrote: »

Modern ones are absolutely grand.

But a 1996 one isn't as good, and its also 12 years old - no 12 year old budget priced car is going to be in great nick; and as has been said, the scrappage scheme plus the £99 a week deal Fiat did for the 55S Punto meant that a lot of people who could not afford proper maintainence bought them; as well as a lot of people who learnt to drive in them. Wouldn't expect the gearbox to be in any usable condition after that for starters!

Thats still over 400 squids per month for a Fiat which is not cheap in 96. Has anyone got stats for this with particular focus on subsequent poor service history. This would be some lesson for some present day dealers throwing cars away and the possible knock on effect on reputation.

neilthefunkeone

Mate has a mk1, '96 i think.. has had it over 2 years now.. No problems until recently, failed NCT on ball joints.. but thats general wear.. And thats all it failed on.. Has been looked after, thats all!!!

dubbeat

Well I went and bought the punto.
I needed a car in a hurry because my old one died an untimely death and the price was right.

The punto deffinately does seem like a chaeply make car. My last car was a honda civic and compared to that the fiat feels like a lunch box with wheels.

If your stuck for a car like I was and only have 500 quid then this is a good car. I'm deffinately gonna get a honda again sometime in the future but this will keep me going nicely.

EPM

E39MSport wrote: »

Yeah, but EPM's point was that 96 Fiats are poorly serviced and same era starlets and micras are relatively well looked after, hence the difference in reliability.

That wasn't exactly what I said though. I said that a Micra or Starlet would be a better bet at that age (they are better built and engineered in the first place) as they tended to be better looked after. They weren't bought in the same way many Punto's were bought (on a cheap by the week scrappage) in the mid-90's. In fairness, FIAT pinned a lot of sales on this.

I know of one person in particular that bought one this way and never even opened the bonnet. Hence the car barely made it to the end of the finance term. The Jap cars were more expensive to buy and usually sold to people that had a bit more money to look after them etc. Thats not to say they were all looked after well but you get my point.

I'm not having a go at people that bought them in this way if thats what you're hinting at either.

E39MSport

EPM wrote: »

That wasn't exactly what I said though. I said that a Micra or Starlet would be a better bet at that age (they are better built and engineered in the first place) as they tended to be better looked after. They weren't bought in the same way many Punto's were bought (on a cheap by the week scrappage) in the mid-90's. In fairness, FIAT pinned a lot of sales on this.

I know of one person in particular that bought one this way and never even opened the bonnet. Hence the car barely made it to the end of the finance term. The Jap cars were more expensive to buy and usually sold to people that had a bit more money to look after them etc. Thats not to say they were all looked after well but you get my point.

I'm not having a go at people that bought them in this way if thats what you're hinting at either.

Furry smurf. Thought we had stumbled across something for the CSO people ...