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Despite Lisbon fireworks EU ministers still negotiate in shadows

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  • 16-12-2009 5:10pm
    #1
    rumour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 836 ✭✭✭


    Private talks followed involving the British, the Swedes and Charlie McCreevy, outgoing internal markets commissioner and chief sponsor of the Commission’s regulatory reform package. With French and German representatives intermittently called into the room, other ministers and their entourages were left to themselves.


    [URL]http:////www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2009/1208/1224260296405.html[/URL]

    It is great that Charlie McCreevy got into the room, soon the Irish will never be privy to these discussions. Welcome to Ireland 2009, a province of the EU controlled by France, Germany and the UK.

    Is this the Europe we voted for?

    Perhaps it is?

    Your comments please.


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    #2
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    rumour wrote: »
    Private talks followed involving the British, the Swedes and Charlie McCreevy, outgoing internal markets commissioner and chief sponsor of the Commission’s regulatory reform package. With French and German representatives intermittently called into the room, other ministers and their entourages were left to themselves.


    [URL]http:////www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2009/1208/1224260296405.html[/URL]

    It is great that Charlie McCreevy got into the room, soon the Irish will never be privy to these discussions. Welcome to Ireland 2009, a province of the EU controlled by France, Germany and the UK.

    Is this the Europe we voted for?

    Perhaps it is?

    Your comments please.

    Predictable, regrettably.

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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    #3
    rumour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 836 ✭✭✭rumour


    I could read this two ways.......

    A. Predictable behaviour by the Germans and French and the EU generally.

    B. Predictable post by Rumour

    I wonder which answer you are communicating. lol. I do try and follow what is going on!!


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    #4
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    rumour wrote: »
    I could read this two ways.......

    A. Predictable behaviour by the Germans and French and the EU generally.

    B. Predictable post by Rumour

    I wonder which answer you are communicating. lol. I do try and follow what is going on!!

    Well spotted! It could, of course, be both...

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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    #5
    greendom
    Registered Users Posts: 16,382 ✭✭✭✭greendom


    rumour wrote: »
    Private talks followed involving the British, the Swedes and Charlie McCreevy, outgoing internal markets commissioner and chief sponsor of the Commission’s regulatory reform package. With French and German representatives intermittently called into the room, other ministers and their entourages were left to themselves.


    [URL]http:////www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2009/1208/1224260296405.html[/URL]

    It is great that Charlie McCreevy got into the room, soon the Irish will never be privy to these discussions. Welcome to Ireland 2009, a province of the EU controlled by France, Germany and the UK.

    Is this the Europe we voted for?

    Perhaps it is?

    Your comments please.

    And how do you plan to stop people from speaking to each other ?

    The transparency comes when the whole EU council of ministers meets - you're never going to stop bilateral chats are you?

    Bit of a non-story I'm afraid.


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    #6
    rumour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 836 ✭✭✭rumour


    greendom wrote: »
    And how do you plan to stop people from speaking to each other ?

    The transparency comes when the whole EU council of ministers meets - you're never going to stop bilateral chats are you?

    Bit of a non-story I'm afraid.

    Oh dear, future regulation of financial services a bit of a non story. Please don't come out crying in a few years saying nobody told me.


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    #7
    greendom
    Registered Users Posts: 16,382 ✭✭✭✭greendom


    rumour wrote: »
    Oh dear, future regulation of financial services a bit of a non story. Please don't come out crying in a few years saying nobody told me.

    But the crunch meeting with all 27 heads will be in public - move along now no story here. What would you do - have all European ministers wired so that all their conversations are in public?


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    #8
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    rumour wrote: »
    Oh dear, future regulation of financial services a bit of a non story. Please don't come out crying in a few years saying nobody told me.

    More that prior to Lisbon they didn't have to do anything in public. So it's a bit much to claim that Lisbon has somehow led to less transparency - which does make it a bit of a non-story.

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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    #9
    rumour
    Closed Accounts Posts: 836 ✭✭✭rumour


    Scofflaw wrote: »
    More that prior to Lisbon they didn't have to do anything in public. So it's a bit much to claim that Lisbon has somehow led to less transparency - which does make it a bit of a non-story.

    cordially,
    Scofflaw

    Happy New Year.. can we banish the word Lisbon from anything other than maps or portugese conversations.
    The EU is now what it is, post its project to constitutionalise its existance, I am concerned that deals are being done that could effect Ireland behind closed doors.
    The answer that sure how are we going to stop this, and sure its better than before are completely lame. How are we using this new treaty and its benefits to be at the heart of Europe? We were told it would be so. Even if it does not give the promised benefits what the hell are we doing about this. This is the most important thing the EU are at currently. Ultimately it could lead to the complete demise of Irish banking. (given our current ability to stick to the rules)

    The phrase 'move along no story here' is much more than lame its a statement by someone possibly a complete idiot who has not understood anything that has happened in world economics in the last year.


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    #10
    bijapos
    Registered Users Posts: 3,003 ✭✭✭bijapos


    I am concerned that deals are being done that could effect Ireland behind closed doors.

    Deals always have been done behind closed doors and always will be, be it on an EU level, Government level, County Council or whatever. It's called lobbying. I never put any weight on the idea of council of ministers meeting being held in public, most of the bargaining is done well in advance in corridors, offices, bars, cafes and hotels of Brussels and beyond. Anyone whoever thought we were suddenly going to see some great openness in council debates has very little idea of how politics really works.

    For a better understanding of how this all works have a closer look at exactly how your local County Council reaches its decisions.


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    #11
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    rumour wrote: »
    Happy New Year.. can we banish the word Lisbon from anything other than maps or portugese conversations.

    At whatever point people stop making spurious claims of how the EU is different after Lisbon, sure.
    rumour wrote: »
    The EU is now what it is, post its project to constitutionalise its existance, I am concerned that deals are being done that could effect Ireland behind closed doors.

    Were you not concerned before?
    rumour wrote: »
    The answer that sure how are we going to stop this, and sure its better than before are completely lame. How are we using this new treaty and its benefits to be at the heart of Europe? We were told it would be so. Even if it does not give the promised benefits what the hell are we doing about this. This is the most important thing the EU are at currently. Ultimately it could lead to the complete demise of Irish banking. (given our current ability to stick to the rules)

    Good thing the Irish government is behind those closed doors, then.
    rumour wrote: »
    The phrase 'move along no story here' is much more than lame its a statement by someone possibly a complete idiot who has not understood anything that has happened in world economics in the last year.

    It's a non-story in respect of some change you imagine to have taken place as a result of Lisbon. Before Lisbon, the matter of banking regulation would have been discussed entirely behind closed doors - after Lisbon, the matter of banking regulation is being discussed almost entirely behind closed doors. Banking regulation is hardly a non-story itself, but trying to link it the Treaty That Shall Not Be Named is farcical - and something you're trying quite hard to pull off.

    If you'd like to discuss banking regulation at the EU level, that's splendid, but you're not actually discussing that - you're talking about Lisbon, and about how the EU is a naughty thing, and until you can get off that particular bicycle, you're not offering a discussion, just requesting confirmation of your particular stance on the EU.

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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