Chinese Cars due here in 2011

Darsad

http://www.just-auto.com/article.aspx?id=102557

Looks like the first european spec Chinese cars made by Great Wall will be offered here from 2011 should be interesting to see how they will be perceived or sell in this tough market .

galwaytt

Well, I have personal experience of imported Chinese vehicles, and I can say this with confidence: the european motor industry, nay, the world motor industry, has absolutely nothing to fear, but fear itself.

Why anyone would inflict sub-Datsun 120Y quality upon themselves in this day and age, escapes me.......

ismynametoolong

Not too sure I agree with your datsun comparison , just look at any gadgets or mobiles we all have they are made in China .If as stated these cars are EU type approved and NCAP crash tested I would imagine they will give good value for money .

Saab Ed

I too have felt the quality or lack of in Chinese cars. Like everything else they'll probably catch up over time but its gonna take a long long time. The early jap cars to arrive here had the good grace to be screwed together well, not a feature of their Chinese counterparts. Until you've seen it first had you just cant imagine how badly executed the designs are and just how poor the fit and finish is. Im talking shocking. Remember can you think of a single Chinese product sold here today that you'd view as or recomend as a quality product......Didnt think so. The only Chinese products sold here that are any good are Western products manufactured in China. Chinese stuff really is sh!te. The other thing is they are gonna face copyright issues once they start selling that sh!te outside of China. Most of their designs are rip-offs of European or Japanese designs.

Seth Brundle

Mechanics must be hapy with this news!

maidhc

I don't know. I'm typing this on a chinese laptop made by a Taiwanese company. The same company, Acer, recently overtook Dell to become the worlds second largest PC manufacturer.

The automotive industry in china is probably well behind the computer industry, but I wouldn't doubt their ability to compete in a short time frame.

Run_to_da_hills

kbannon wrote: »

Mechanics must be hapy with this news!

I don't think so, If they are anything like their scooters or knock off Honda Gen sets any competent mechanic won't touch them with a barge pole. I would guess the majority of them will go straight into Hammond Lane when they break down.

Supercell

As someone that has been to China several times and visited all over, one thing is universally true..quality control is pretty much non existent in China.
The only two things I would recommend that are made in China are the food..and the ladies - I'm marrying one! The rest..well you get what you pay for.

I wouldnt take one if it was offered to me for free - a death trap is a death trap at any price, and if it doesnt kill you stone dead, your wallet will be on life support soon enough.

Zonda999

Have heard a lot how bad these chinese cars are but never been in one of the things, would like to see a comparison between one of them and an octavia(:pac:), for example. Are we talking about as bad as daewoo were when they came over 10 years ago now, or worse again? :eek:

Anyone have any idea how cheap they'll actually be?

Saab Ed

Zonda999 wrote: »

. Are we talking about as bad as daewoo were when they came over 10 years ago now, or worse again? :eek:

Worse.....and alot worse at that. Im not saying this for a reaction here , they really are that bad.

Zonda999

Good lord, i genuinely cant wait to try one of these yokes out, the question is though, would your average paddy car buyer be able to see how bad they are!

Saab Ed

Well its mad stuff thats wrong with them really. Some examples that I can remember was like selecting netural in a Landwind jeep of some sort. Neutral stretched from somehwhere in the passengers seat to my knee on the other side, a good foot or so of movement. At the Paris motorshow in 2006 the show preped cars were starting to fall apart and paint was peeling from both the interior and exterior Also in that same car when you put the wiper stalk to the fast position it was almost facing straight up. Mad. Another car I got into the mould for the switches was so poor that hard plastic edges were left on them and Im not joking when I say if you grabbed it hard enough it would cut you. The seven seater of some sort was the funniest. No matter how hard we tried we just couldnt get the 2 rear most seats to fold flat into the under floor compartment thet were supposed to fold into. In the end one just got kinda wedged and wouldnt move at all no matter what we did. Another Chinese brand on another stand the cars were so poor they were all locked. There were no Chinese cars at the 2008 show I wonder why

Pdfile

Darsad wrote: »

http://www.just-auto.com/article.aspx?id=102557

Looks like the first european spec Chinese cars made by Great Wall will be offered here from 2011 should be interesting to see how they will be perceived or sell in this tough market .

china has all the money in the world yet they produce this rubbish ??

weeder

like RTDH said, look up reviews for chinese motorcycles and you will see the kinda ****e thats coming out of there.

Mr Benevolent

So starting an independant garage that specialises in Chinese cars would be a good idea, right?

Muckie

Didnt some Chinese company do a Ferrari copy last year.
Ferrari's for all :P

cascade35

Pdfile wrote: »

china has all the money in the world yet they produce this rubbish ??


and i was raised always to beware the sneaky asain.... me arse. :rolleyes:

I read somewhere that a lot of recycling (plastics,Cans etc) is sent to china from other countries.
Could they be making the cars from our coke bottles and beer cans. Just think when you finish your slab of beer over the christmas someone could be driving it next year.

AugustusMaximus

maidhc wrote: »

I don't know. I'm typing this on a chinese laptop made by a Taiwanese company. The same company, Acer, recently overtook Dell to become the worlds second largest PC manufacturer.

The automotive industry in china is probably well behind the computer industry, but I wouldn't doubt their ability to compete in a short time frame.

You're mixing up Apples and Oranges.

Taiwan has been producing good consumer products for years.

Mainland China has not.

maidhc

AugustusMaximus wrote: »

You're mixing up Apples and Oranges.

Taiwan has been producing good consumer products for years.

Mainland China has not.

Well all the manufacturing is done on the mainland.

Give them a chance!

Mailman

http://www.carspyshots.net/showthread.php?t=18030

Shoddy Yaris rip-off with a better interior.

Cionád

Hopefully Great Wall MC cars are safer than the JMC Landwind: (There are some Landwinds in Europe!)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZWy_fASSiQ

BlackWizard

Confab wrote: »

So starting an independant garage that specialises in Chinese cars would be a good idea, right?

I'll give you a hand with that. We can call it A1 Breakers :cool:

colm_mcm

Great Wall also do this, which is very Toyota bB looking.


Amazing that Great Wall never built a car till 2006.

Saab Ed

colm_mcm wrote: »

Great Wall also do this, which is very Toyota bB looking.


Amazing that Great Wall never built a car till 2006.

Apple didnt make phones till a couple of years ago but they still didnt come up with this.....

alias no.9

Saab Ed wrote: »

Apple didnt make phones till a couple of years ago but they still didnt come up with this.....

Good point but Apple outsource the manufacturing of the iPOD and iPhone, guess where they're made?;)

Gregor Samsa

iPhones are assembled in China. All the major components are actually made in Taiwan, Singapore, the US, Germany and South Korea by established manufactures. And obviously they are designed and made to the specifications and Quality Assurance requirements by a US company that has been designing higher-end electronic devices for over 25 years.

http://www.allroadsleadtochina.com/2007/08/15/iphone-made-in-shenzhen/

I think the issue people have with Chinese cars is that they are being designed (and supplied with components) by companies that don't have any great experience or legacy in the field. Other products at least have the outside influence of US/European/Japanese companies regarding quality. China, being a relatively closed market until now, does not. And it also has a poor reputation for industrial regulation (recent scandals include baby formula contaminated with melamine, lead paint on Mattel toys, etc).

Run_to_da_hills

alias no.9 wrote: »

Good point but Apple outsource the manufacturing of the iPOD and iPhone, guess where they're made?;)

Theres a big difference between something that is western owned and manufactured in China under strict QC.

BTW the Chinese have the I Phone 3G cloned and poor suckers on Fleabay are falling for them.

Could you imagine if the chinese made a knock off of a Fiat. :eek:

Yellowblackbird

maidhc wrote: »

I don't know. I'm typing this on a chinese laptop made by a Taiwanese company.

Taiwanese make the plastic case, within which sits Intel board and processor, ATI graphics card, Western Digital hard disk drive and Microsoft software etc.

Cionád

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Could you imagine if the chinese made a knock off of a Fiat. :eek:

They have. Saab Ed posted it above...

zilog_jones

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Could you imagine if the chinese made a knock off of a Fiat. :eek:

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSHKG603420080724
It's as if some Fiats are actually good cars worth knocking off...

Alanstrainor

They must have a check list of how to make a European car look Chinese.

Add more chrome (Check)
Tint the windows (Check)
Bubble head lamps (Check)

zilog_jones

Yellowblackbird wrote: »

Taiwanese make the plastic case, within which sits Intel board...

Incorrect, Intel do not make laptop motherboards. It's probably made in China for Foxconn, Quanta or some other Taiwanese company. Graphics boards are made in China too, ATI and Nvidia would only make the GPU wafers.

Cionád

zilog_jones wrote: »

It's as if some Fiats are actually good cars worth knocking off...

The Fiat Panda certainly is anyway. Fantastic budget car.

galwaytt

ismynametoolong wrote: »

Not too sure I agree with your datsun comparison , just look at any gadgets or mobiles we all have they are made in China .If as stated these cars are EU type approved and NCAP crash tested I would imagine they will give good value for money .

....ah, grasshopper, but they can only ASPIRE to the quality of the 120Y. At least they only rusted. In between terminal tinworm, they ran just fine.

The chinese stuff does neither.......I agree with so much of what SaabEd said, that'd I'd just double the length of the thread....

They can make individual parts fine: lights. glass. What they can't do is join them up.

Nor things like.....door seals. Makes the worst homemade kit car doors, here, look like teutonic nirvana.......

colm_mcm

I reckon in 10 years time they'll be where the Koreans are now - i.e not too bad.

Most major manufacturers are setting up shop in China.

Zonda999

colm_mcm wrote: »

That is appaling copying alright, they'd never get away with that if they tryed to import to Europe

colm_mcm wrote: »

I reckon in 10 years time they'll be where the Koreans are now - i.e not too bad.

Most major manufacturers are setting up shop in China.

They'll be a while catching up on German or Japanese standards then!

colm_mcm

I don't think even the Chinese aspire to German "standards"

that car isn't the only Chinese Toyota ripoff:

Actually looks better than the Rav4 - meet the UFO.

Saab Ed

http://www.automotoportal.com/article/chinese-rip-offs-of-western-automakers

http://www.theage.com.au/executive-style/motors/china-rolls-out-a-rollsroyce-ripoff-20090518-bahv.html

Some of the best worst....

THEDONWALDO

hot news...audi have a plant in china, and india. they are after all, the emerging and growing economies in our world

Seth Brundle

...and what?
When China mass produces cheap plastic crap and sends them over here, the Irish car buying public will go mad for them. We always have gone for cheapness and always will!

alias no.9

phutyle wrote: »

iPhones are assembled in China. All the major components are actually made in Taiwan, Singapore, the US, Germany and South Korea by established manufactures. And obviously they are designed and made to the specifications and Quality Assurance requirements by a US company that has been designing higher-end electronic devices for over 25 years.

http://www.allroadsleadtochina.com/2007/08/15/iphone-made-in-shenzhen/

I think the issue people have with Chinese cars is that they are being designed (and supplied with components) by companies that don't have any great experience or legacy in the field. Other products at least have the outside influence of US/European/Japanese companies regarding quality. China, being a relatively closed market until now, does not. And it also has a poor reputation for industrial regulation (recent scandals include baby formula contaminated with melamine, lead paint on Mattel toys, etc).

The experience they need to bring their products up to par with the rest of the world can be bought, if they want to. The question is whether they want to concentrate on being the major players in their own growing automotive market or minor players in a struggling worldwide market. I think they'll concentrate on the domestic front for a while yet, working through development cycles, building their competancy, with a few random products being shipped to the west to test the waters but any serious launch is some way off.

Edit: It would seem that the purchase of experience has begun

Quint

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I don't think so, If they are anything like their scooters or knock off Honda Gen sets any competent mechanic won't touch them with a barge pole. I would guess the majority of them will go straight into Hammond Lane when they break down.

+1, the Chinese bikes and scooters are terrible. Working on them is a nightmare, the plastic fairing is such bad quality all the bits that interlink to hold it in place snap off. In fact working on them would make you cry! Even filling the oil is a disaster on some of them. And if they do make it look nice and shiny, the engine is unbelievable bad quality.
The rip off gennies, quads and lawnmowers are terrible. Usually branded as a honda, and sold by certain people at markets as real hondas. In reality, i could make a better engine with old bean cans in my shed.
I'm sure the cars would be better, but I'd imagine even Renaults would put them to shame.

colm_mcm

Reminds of when a mate went to the launch of the Tata TL pickup. he cut his hand on the bottom of the door handle!

maninasia

Yellowblackbird wrote: »

Taiwanese make the plastic case, within which sits Intel board and processor, ATI graphics card, Western Digital hard disk drive and Microsoft software etc.

Taiwanese make a LOT more than plastic cases. Most of the computer chips used worldwide are made in Taiwan, as are most of the motherboards (made in Taiwan and China). The components such as camera lens, LEDS, monitors are also mostly made in Taiwan.
China will probably succeed with electric cars in worldwide markets, this is where it has good capabilities.

Most (all?) international car companies have manufacturing facilities in China churning out millions of cars a year, almost same or same quality as Europe. It's obvious the Chinese will leverage off this expertise to put together fairly decent cars in the next few years. And before people mock China too much how many cars are made in Ireland or even UK these days. You are all buying foreign made stuff and increasingly most of it is made in Asia..if it's so bad why buy it?

There's a lot of mocking but whats made in Ireland?

mondeo

I say bring on this cheapness and see what class of driver they attract. I'd be amused to see these Chinese yokes on the rd and read all the test reports on them. People who just want dirt cheap transport will probably buy them.

maninasia

And what's wrong with that, and how does cheapness of a car equal 'class of driver'. Most of those expensive cars on the road were bought on borrowed money. Last of the Celtic tigerites...

ArphaRima

Having just come back from China I can say that no Chinese person wants a Chinese car. Sure they dont mind a chinese manufactured VW, BMW, GM etc, but really they aspire to a european-made european car, or (god help them) an American-made American car.

Nobody is more aware of the poor quality of Chinese cars than the Chinese.

maninasia

Agreed, but they can't afford like most of the world or even many people in Ireland for that matter. Aspiring is one thing, being able to is another. We all want what we want!

Since all the major companies have plants there it is not a huge price differential for some made in China 'European' branded cars and some are seen as almost Chinese brands by this stage i.e. volkswagen. Many European brands are being bought out by the Chinese now too!

A lot of people want to buy Japanese and Korean cars too.