Israel admits organs theft

AARRRGH

The Saint wrote: »

I don't think you should be stating who should or should not be posting on thesse threads. While the accusation of antisemitism is pointless and detrimental to the arguement. Anyway, him being Jewish (if he indeed is) should have no bearing on whether he should post and argue in these threads.

But he keeps ruining them and is constantly insulting/slandering people.

BlaasForRafa

AARRRGH wrote: »

But he keeps ruining them and is constantly insulting/slandering people.

If it is indeed slander then he leaves himself open to legal action. However I'm not a legal expert so I can't say whether or not it is, if he is slandering then I'm sure a mod will have a word with him to tone it down.

wes

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

Where exactly did I defend it hmmm?

Where did I say you defended it?

All, I said was that you offered no condemnation and instead decided to go after other posters, and then you were immediately shown to be wrong in your ridiculous criticism in that regard. Its a tactic used again and again on these thread, accuse people of not caring about some other issue, that if the accuser really cared about they would have started a thread on it. Unfortunately for you, I did post in those threads, so it make your criticism in this instance null and void.

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

The practice was wrong but this thread seems to be about using a relatively minor occurance to go on and on about the palestinian occupation. I do think its pretty rich that the focus goes (as per usual) on the palestinians rather than on Israeli civilians or IDF personnel.

Well, considering that the Palestinians are being occupied by Israel, and there general treatment of Palestinians, and there denials to similar claims made in a Swedish newspaper and the all the trouble the Israeli's kicked up with the Swedish government, tends to make there treatment of Palestinains just a bit more nasty imho. I would not call this minor either btw.

However, plenty of people here have condemned the practice regardless of the victims, but yes I am focusing on the Palestinian vicitms, mainly due to the Israel previous vigourous denials on other similar claims made in the past.

Still, I am not surprised that once again, you are trying to make this about other posters, as opposed to the topic at hand.

Overheal

wes wrote: »

That didn't take long. First everyone is a hypocrite and now people are Anti-Semites. I wonder what accusation you will come up with next?



Condemning the state of Israel is perfectly reasonable (as would condemnation of any other state doing anything similar) and no one here has condemned every single last Israeli as you insinuate, with your predictable accusation of Anti-semitism.

Even the post you quote specifically condemns the "country" and not every single Israeli or Jew, so you are once again reaching here, just like your accusations of hypocrisy, this one, once again falls flat on its face.

You have to remember what you are typing [and this is directed at everyone so read on]. When I refer to the Palestinian People, PLO, or the Ruling Party and Military Arm, Hamas, I use those terms. When I hear people say Israelis I think the Israeli People. Nobody so far as mentioned the IDF.

Its the same way people spout of Ah Those Bleedin Yanks when The US Military does something. You'll forgive me if I dont blur the people and the government and the military of a country into one single entity when its relevant to the discussion. Such as its relevant to this topic. The IDF harvested these organs yes? Its not as if a mob of citizens went and scoured the battlefield for fresh eyeballs. And when you condemn "the Israelis" for stealing eyes and skin and kidneys, for some reason that instills an image of the hissing Jews from Passion of the Christ [worse: as they were depicted in South Park], which is very self-misleading for me. I'd prefer you told it like it was: the IDF and the Israeli ruling body authorized and carried out the harvesting. I sincerely doubt the Israeli People were complacent in this (Dont even get me started on the Kosher thing)

wes

Overheal wrote: »

You have to remember what you are typing. When I refer to the Palestinian People, PLO, or the Ruling Party and Military Arm, Hamas, I use those terms.

Yes, and I would refer to Palestine, if the Palestinians had a state, but due to them not having a state, I tend to refer to the various groups involved.

Btw, if I were to use criticism of the US, I would refer to the US and not the "US government" generally and I haven't had any complaints from anyone. Many people do the same all the time. I think most people can pick up on context.

Overheal wrote: »

When I hear people say Israelis I think the Israeli People. Nobody so far as mentioned the IDF.

I don't think anyone has used the term Israeli's and have only mentioned the country. I may be wrong in that, but in the specific post I was replying to we were talking about the term "Israel" specifically, and it was the term used.

Overheal

wes wrote: »

Yes, and I would refer to Palestine, if the Palestinians had a state, but due to them not having a state, I tend to refer to the various groups involved.

Btw, if I were to use criticism of the US, I would refer to the US and not the "US government" generally and I haven't had any complaints from anyone. Many people do the same all the time. I think most people can pick up on context.

I don't think anyone has used the term Israeli's and have only mentioned the country. I may be wrong in that, but in the specific post I was replying to we were talking about the term "Israel" specifically, and it was the term used.

Well you see, a lot of people (and a lot - being an offended party Im quite attuned to it) will use the term Americans or Yanks to refer to The United States and the actions of the political entity known as The United States but when you read Americans you think Joe Six Pack made the call to torture detainees etc. when its not the case. I for one, never got asked for any input on the torture thing, yet by extenstion (Those ****ing Americans) often end up at the pointed end of the stick.

So spare me the Boo Hoo Palestinian no State BS. Thats all it is. Bull****. And frankly, thats irrelevant to the topic anyway so why bring it up? All Im saying is I'd rather you referred to the IDF and Israel. Not that anyone is bold enough to actually jump the gun and call them The Jews on this forum. But I can tell some of you would like to.

TMoreno

Overheal wrote: »

Well you see, a lot of people (and a lot - being an offended party Im quite attuned to it) will use the term Americans or Yanks to refer to The United States and the actions of the political entity known as The United States but when you read Americans you think Joe Six Pack made the call to torture detainees etc. when its not the case. I for one, never got asked for any input on the torture thing, yet by extenstion (Those ****ing Americans) often end up at the pointed end of the stick.

So spare me the Boo Hoo Palestinian no State BS. Thats all it is. Bull****. And frankly, thats irrelevant to the topic anyway so why bring it up? All Im saying is I'd rather you referred to the IDF and Israel. Not that anyone is bold enough to actually jump the gun and call them The Jews on this forum. But I can tell some of you would like to.

Being called antisemitic is not important you can go ahead I don't care. What's really weird is how you can defend those criminals just because they are Jewish. What would you do if some people stole the organs of a member of your family?

Ping Chow Chi

Overheal wrote: »

And when you condemn "the Israelis" for stealing eyes and skin and kidneys, for some reason that instills an image of the hissing Jews from Passion of the Christ

Then thats your problem of your preconceptions surely.

The Saint

TMoreno wrote: »

Being called antisemitic is not important you can go ahead I don't care. What's really weird is how you can defend those criminals just because they are Jewish. What would you do if some people stole the organs of a member of your family?

Well I'd imagine there is also plenty of pissed off Jewish Israelis whose family members had their organs harvested too.

Overheal

TMoreno wrote: »

Being called antisemitic is not important you can go ahead I don't care. What's really weird is how you can defend those criminals just because they are Jewish. What would you do if some people stole the organs of a member of your family?

They could be Nazis.

Okay? Lets call them Nazis. The Israeli people are Nazis for the purposes of this analogy.

But the Nazi citizens (in fact, isnt this ture of the actual nazis and the Auswitchz thing? Anyway) These Jew-Nazis, they were not complacent or Aware of this Organ Harvesting that was carried out by their government and military.

So No, I don't condemn the Israeli people because the IDF harvested organs from IDF and Palestinian combat casualties. I do however condemn Israel because it was complacent, and it was probably an IDF officer that cooked up the idea.

Ping Chow Chi wrote: »

Then thats your problem of your preconceptions surely.

Mmm Yes. But my personal Bobby's World imagery aside theres still a lot of implication here that the Isreali's were complacent in the harvesting of their family member's organs. Which is frankly absurd.

The Saint

Overheal wrote: »

They could be Nazis.

Okay? Lets call them Nazis. The Israeli people are Nazis.

But the Nazi citizens (in fact, isnt this ture of the actual nazis and the Auswitchz thing? Anyway) These Jew-Nazis, they were not complacent or Aware of this Organ Harvesting that was carried out by their government and military.

So No, I don't condemn the Israeli people because the IDF harvested organs from IDF and Palestinian combat casualties. I do however condemn Israel because it was complacent, and it was probably an IDF officer that cooked up the idea.
Mmm Yes. But my personal Bobby's World imagery aside theres still a lot of implication here that the Isreali's were complacent in the harvesting of their family member's organs. Which is frankly absurd.

Mmmmkay. This thread is getting weirder and weirder and more and more off topic. Next we'll be talking about Jew gold.

Overheal

The Saint wrote: »

Mmmmkay. This thread is getting weirder and weirder and more and more off topic. Next we'll be talking about Jew gold.

Absurdity begets Absurdity.

Im just pontificating that Im not defending them because they're jewish. Im defending them because they're innocent.

And Im an Atheist... I knew that was going to be someone's next question.

Well I'd imagine there is also plenty of pissed off Jewish Israelis whose family members had their organs harvested too.

QFT

TMoreno

Overheal wrote: »

They could be Nazis.

Okay? Lets call them Nazis. The Israeli people are Nazis.

But the Nazi citizens (in fact, isnt this ture of the actual nazis and the Auswitchz thing? Anyway) These Jew-Nazis, they were not complacent or Aware of this Organ Harvesting that was carried out by their government and military.

So No, I don't condemn the Israeli people because the IDF harvested organs from IDF and Palestinian combat casualties. I do however condemn Israel because it was complacent, and it was probably an IDF officer that cooked up the idea.

You do not answer to my question. What would you do if somebody stole the organs of a member of your family? If you would not say anything because you would not like to be called an Antisemite just say so.
Nazi? what that is it mean? what that is have to do with the present issue? Why do you have to bring up World War II? How can you justify that kind of criminal actions?

wes

Overheal wrote: »

Well you see, a lot of people (and a lot - being an offended party Im quite attuned to it) will use the term Americans or Yanks to refer to The United States and the actions of the political entity known as The United States but when you read Americans you think Joe Six Pack made the call to torture detainees etc. when its not the case. I for one, never got asked for any input on the torture thing, yet by extenstion (Those ****ing Americans) often end up at the pointed end of the stick.

Fair enough, but it is a common way to refer to countries nonetheless, and you know isn't used just in relation to Israel.

Overheal wrote: »

So spare me the Boo Hoo Palestinian no State BS. Thats all it is. Bull****. And frankly, thats irrelevant to the topic anyway so why bring it up?

Your right it is irrelevant. You know like this entire discussion we are having right now is irrelevant.

Overheal wrote: »

All Im saying is I'd rather you referred to the IDF and Israel. Not that anyone is bold enough to actually jump the gun and call them The Jews on this forum. But I can tell some of you would like to.

You would have a point if using the term American's, Israeli's etc wasn't done commonly in other threads, and you know wasn't done commonly with other countries as well. The term Palestinians is also used often in these threads as well btw, I have used that term several times also. I am actually being consistent with the language I use.

The Saint

Here's an idea. How about we actually discuss the topic at hand rather than bickering about anti-semitism and semantics now that some have sucessfully derailed the thread.

Overheal

TMoreno wrote: »

You do not answer to my question. What would you do if somebody stole the organs of a member of your family? If you would not say anything because you would not like to be called an Antisemite just say so.
Nazi? what that is it mean? what that is have to do with the present issue? Why do you have to bring up World War II? How can you justify that kind of criminal actions?

You havent read my post then. When did I ever defend them because they were Jewish? I defend the Israeli people because they are Innocent in the case of these Harvested Organs, and they are as much a victim of the Harvesting as the Palestinians.

wes

Overheal wrote: »

They could be Nazis.

Okay? Lets call them Nazis. The Israeli people are Nazis for the purposes of this analogy.

But the Nazi citizens (in fact, isnt this ture of the actual nazis and the Auswitchz thing? Anyway) These Jew-Nazis, they were not complacent or Aware of this Organ Harvesting that was carried out by their government and
military.

You always seem to be the first person to bring up the Nazi's on these threads. Despite the fact that no one else has mentioned them. Seriously you being rather absurd here.

Overheal wrote: »

Mmm Yes. But my personal Bobby's World imagery aside theres still a lot of implication here that the Isreali's were complacent in the harvesting of their family member's organs. Which is frankly absurd.

I agree it is absurd, especially as no one here accused Israeli's of being complacent with there families organs being stolen. Again, your the only one talking about this.

sceptre

Right, well this has degenerated into something stupid on all sides. You can all take collective blame for off-topic narkiness, personalising the argument and recent posting in a manner that falls below the standard expected.

Also take note that none of you get to tell other people that they shouldn't be posting on particular threads. At best, that's my job.

Locked in preference to flinging around infractions and/or temp bans like cheap confetti. Pretty much all of you should know better. Potentially interesting discussion spoiled by the all-too-typical stupidity.