New terms of use feedback

Darragh

Okay folks, if we changed the text to something like this (I'm not saying it will be the exact text because I haven't run it by the legal advisors yet):

You are solely responsible for your conduct and any Material that you submit, post, and/or display on Boards.ie.

You agree not to post Material contrary to these Terms of Use. We may, but are not obliged to, remove or limit access to Material from any user which breaches these Terms of Use.

By posting any Material - including creative writing pieces, photographs or graphics on or through Boards.ie, you grant us a limited license to use, modify, publicly perform, publicly display, reproduce, and distribute such Materials in connection with Boards.ie, solely for the purpose of providing, displaying, distributing and promoting the Boards.ie forum to which such Content was submitted, or, in the case of photos or graphics, solely for the purpose for which such photo or graphic was submitted to Boards.ie.

We do not claim ownership of photos that you choose to post to or link to on Boards.ie. Boards.ie Ltd neither has nor wants any ownership of your photos.

Furthermore you grant us a similar perpetual, irrevocable and fully sub-licensable license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, publicly perform and publicly display Content other than photos and graphics (in whole or in part) and to incorporate such Content into other works in any format or medium now known or later developed.

The license you grant to us is non-exclusive, royalty free and fully paid, sub licensable, and worldwide.

You are responsible for making sure that you have all rights to what you post, including the rights necessary for you to grant the foregoing licenses to same.

You represent and warrant that: (i) you own the Material posted by you or otherwise have the right to grant the license set forth in this section, and (ii) the posting of the Material does not violate the privacy rights, publicity rights, copyrights, contract rights or any other rights of any person.

You agree to waive any moral rights in your Material for the purposes of its posting on Boards.ie for the intended pupose of providing the Boards.ie service and the purposes specified above.

You agree to pay for all royalties, fees, and any other monies owing any person by reason of any Material posted by you to or through Boards.ie.

You agree that your Material displayed on Boards.ie may continue to appear on Boards.ie, even after you have terminated your user privileges or have had your user privileges terminated by Boards.ie.

Because community standards vary and individuals sometimes choose not to comply with our policies and guidelines, in the process of using Boards.ie, you may be exposed to content that you find offensive or objectionable. You can report such content to us using the Report Post feature.

We cannot guarantee that other users will not use the ideas and information that you share. Therefore, if you have an idea or information that you would like to keep confidential and/or don't want others to use, you must not post it on Boards.ie. We are not responsible for a user's misuse or misappropriation of any content or information you post on the Site.


7.1 Submissions to Boards.ie about Boards.ie

This term is specifically regarding your feedback, suggestions or contributions to Boards.ie about our products, services or website.

You do not have to submit anything to us as feedback or suggestions for Boards.ie, but if you do you acknowledge and agree that any questions, comments, suggestions, ideas, feedback, or any other submissions to us which may improve the products, services, or offerings provided by Boards.ie shall become our sole property unless otherwise agreed by us.

By making a submission to us about the Boards.ie service, either through email to us, via our Feedback, Helpdesk or Site Development forums, you grant a nonexclusive, irrevocable, worldwide, perpetual, unlimited, assignable, sublicenseable, fully paid up and royalty free right to us to copy, prepare derivative works from, improve, distribute, publish, remove, retain, add, and use and commercialise, in any way now known or in the future discovered, anything that you submit to us, without any further consent, notice and/or compensation to you or to any third parties.

At all stages we shall make every attempt to contact and communicate with you about your idea either on thread, via PM or email but in the unlikely event we cannot contact you, we reserve the right to exercise this term.

If you do not want to grant us the rights set out above, please do not make submissions about the Boards.ie service to us.

This term is not intended to apply to photographs, creative writing or similar. Boards.ie Ltd does not claim ownership of photos that you choose to post to or link to on Boards.ie. Boards.ie Ltd neither has nor wants any ownership of your work.

In this respect, for photographs or other creative or copyrighted work created by or owned by you, you retain full ownership of same. For the purposes of providing the Boards.ie service, we require you grant us a non-exclusive, royalty free and fully paid, sub licensable, and worldwide license to use, modify, publicly perform, publicly display, reproduce, and distribute such Materials in connection with Boards.ie, solely for the purpose of providing, displaying, distributing and promoting the Boards.ie forum to which such Content was submitted, or, in the case of photos or graphics, solely for the purpose for which such photo or graphic was submitted to Boards.ie.

Furthermore you grant us a similar perpetual, irrevocable and fully sub-licensable license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, publicly perform and publicly display Content other than photos and graphics (in whole or in part) and to incorporate such Content into other works in any format or medium now known or later developed.

from this:

You are solely responsible for your conduct and any Material that you submit, post, and/or display on Boards.ie. You agree not to post Material contrary to these Terms of Use. We may, but are not obliged to, remove or limit access to Material from any user which breaches these Terms of Use.
By posting any Material on or through Boards.ie, you grant us a limited license to use, modify, publicly perform, publicly display, reproduce, and distribute such Materials in connection with Boards.ie or the promotion thereof.

The license you grant to us is non-exclusive, royalty free and fully paid, sub licensable, and worldwide.

You are responsible for making sure that you have all rights to what you post, including the rights necessary for you to grant the foregoing licenses to same.

You represent and warrant that: (i) you own the Material posted by you or otherwise have the right to grant the license set forth in this section, and (ii) the posting of the Material does not violate the privacy rights, publicity rights, copyrights, contract rights or any other rights of any person.

You agree to waive any moral rights in your Material for the purposes of its posting on Boards.ie and the purposes specified above.

You agree to pay for all royalties, fees, and any other monies owing any person by reason of any Material posted by you to or through Boards.ie.

You agree that your Material displayed on Boards.ie may continue to appear on Boards.ie, even after you have terminated your user privileges or have had your user privileges terminated by Boards.ie.

Because community standards vary and individuals sometimes choose not to comply with our policies and guidelines, in the process of using Boards.ie, you may be exposed to content that you find offensive or objectionable. You can report such content to us using the Report Post feature.

We cannot guarantee that other users will not use the ideas and information that you share. Therefore, if you have an idea or information that you would like to keep confidential and/or don't want others to use, you must not post it on Boards.ie. We are not responsible for a user's misuse or misappropriation of any content or information you post on the Site.


7.1 Submissions to Boards.ie

You do not have to submit anything to us, but if you do you acknowledge and agree that any questions, comments, suggestions, ideas, feedback, or any other submissions to us which may improve our products, services, or offerings shall become our sole property unless otherwise agreed by us.
By making a submission to us, you grant a nonexclusive, irrevocable, worldwide, perpetual, unlimited, assignable, sublicenseable, fully paid up and royalty free right to us to copy, prepare derivative works from, improve, distribute, publish, remove, retain, add, and use and commercialise, in any way now known or in the future discovered, anything that you submit to us, without any further consent, notice and/or compensation to you or to any third parties.

If you do not want to grant us the rights set out above, please do not make submissions to us.

How would that be?

pixbyjohn

Looks good to me and hopefully your legal team find it acceptable too.

Covey

Darragh wrote: »

How would that be?

A huge improvement.

However, I do still have an issue with the word " irrevocable " and the following ;

"You agree that your Material displayed on Boards.ie may continue to appear on Boards.ie, even after you have terminated your user privileges or have had your user privileges terminated by Boards.ie."

I strongly feel that one should have the ability to delete at any stage images posted for whatever reason.

This would be essential for instance where the image was sold with an exclusive license.

Paulw

Furthermore you grant us a similar perpetual, irrevocable and fully sub-licensable license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify, adapt, publish, translate, publicly perform and publicly display Content other than photos and graphics (in whole or in part) and to incorporate such Content into other works in any format or medium now known or later developed.

What about adding - "as long as you are a member of boards.ie" (or whatever term you use) I understand that if someone is banned, etc, they no longer have the rights to anything, but if they (not sure how) decide to leave boards.ie and want to delete their profile, etc, then they should have the right to also remove their posts/images.

The "irrevocable" bit is a concern still there.

The license you grant to us is non-exclusive, royalty free and fully paid, sub licensable, and worldwide.

Not sure I agree with the sub license clause at all.



Thanks for the clarification point at the start of 7.1. That makes more sense, and is logical.

I do believe that these proposals are much more acceptable, to me at least.

PopeBuckfastXVI

Hotlink your images from flickr or pix, then even if you terminate your boards account you can delete the original and *poof* it's gone from boards.

Boards have no more right to download an image from flickr for their own use than I do by pointing my firefox directly there.

I would imagine the reason for keeping content is for continuity of threads, if someone left or deleted their account and removed all their posts then threads would be left full of holes and make no sense to anyone reading them in the future.

joeKel73

Thanks PCPhoto for the heads up over on the Photo Challenge thread, I was about to upload a few shots from today! I'll not be posting any images until this gets cleared up and I see the professionals in the forum start posting photos again.

Darragh

Covey wrote: »

Really Boards need to decide whether they want a photography forum or not.

I'm going to start this response to all the issues here with just this quote.

Of course we want a photography forum. Really, as I've said before, this was a first draft and any omissions I'll take full responsibility for. In fact, the whole of 7.1 was meant to read "submissions to Boards.ie about Boards.ie" - with over 1250 public forums I honstly just didn't take into account the use of photographs or examples of creative writing.

That's why I opened it up to Feedback on the 16 December, they were put live on the 23 - an awful time to do, considering we were going on holidays - so but we had to get it done. They had - in a very early format - been with the Admins since August and with the Moderators since December 14 - it's been a collaborative process with a lot of input, and yes, we've missed things.

However, we wrote them to make sure that we could continue to provide you with this service - there was no devious attempt to sell your stuff, despite what those who have been banned from Feedback and the "Oh, I'm a regular lurker, I don't interact in here, but isn't this AWFUL?" brigade might tell you. Genuine concerns by people who interact in and contribute to this forum were raised and we are doing our best to act on those, to everyone's benefit.

Regarding the use of the words "irrevocable" and the deletion of posts - I'll raise this as well with the guys here and we'll come back to you on it.

I would imagine the reason for keeping content is for continuity of threads, if someone left or deleted their account and removed all their posts then threads would be left full of holes and make no sense to anyone reading them in the future.

That's exactly it, with the added "It's the internet - be careful what you put up here, because it could be here forever". People need to take responsibility for what they write and what they post.

However, if someone comes to us and asks us to make an edit to a thread and it won't disrupt the flow, I see no reason that we wouldn't fulfil this request.

Thank you all for your continued input.

Darragh

Qwikpix

Paulw wrote: »

I think section 7.1 is the biggest concern -

By making a submission to us, you grant a nonexclusive, irrevocable, worldwide, perpetual, unlimited, assignable, sublicenseable, fully paid up and royalty free right to us to copy, prepare derivative works from, improve, distribute, publish, remove, retain, add, and use and commercialise, in any way now known or in the future discovered, anything that you submit to us, without any further consent, notice and/or compensation to you or to any third parties.

I will state my interest here in that I am a lawyer. I have just seen the new terms of use and my comment is confined to the above extract which was quoted by another poster.

Just imagine for a moment that boards.ie is just like a public notice board that one sees in many supermarkets. Now, if I pin one of my photographs to this board I am doing so to inform and/or interest other people who also use this notice board to display their photographs and/or comments.

So why then, would I want to give the owners of the supermarket a "nonexclusive licence" to do this, that and the other with my photographs, including a permission to "improve" them?

Now, "improve" is a subjective term as beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So what to me might be a dreadful alteration to my photograph might be an "improvement" in the view of the supermarket owners. If in the future I happen to disagree with an "improvement" made to one of my photographs, my remedy would be to issue proceedings against the supermarket owners. A discussion of the form of the proceedings required would be superfluous here, but suffice it to say that litigation would be both time consuming and very expensive.

Such a clause may not be enforceable in respect of material submitted by a minor (i.e. under 18 years of age). While such a term of use is in force I will not be submitting any of my photographs to boards.ie. The views of other users and lawyers may differ!

GavinZac

Qwikpix wrote: »

So why then, would I want to give the owners of the supermarket a "nonexclusive licence" to do this

because the board can't operate without this license. If the supermarket make money from the board (perhaps with sponsorship), they don't want people suing them for a piece of the profit just because something they put on the board is their own copyright.

that and the other with my photographs, including a permission to "improve" them?

The random photo thread has an 800 pixel height and width maximum. If a piece of software (it exists) was implemented to enforce this as standard by resizing larger images, there is a threat that you could sue them for creating derivitive works.

Covey

Qwikpix wrote: »

Paulw wrote: »

I think section 7.1 is the biggest concern -

By making a submission to us, you grant a nonexclusive, irrevocable, worldwide, perpetual, unlimited, assignable, sublicenseable, fully paid up and royalty free right to us to copy, prepare derivative works from, improve, distribute, publish, remove, retain, add, and use and commercialise, in any way now known or in the future discovered, anything that you submit to us, without any further consent, notice and/or compensation to you or to any third parties.

I will state my interest here in that I am a lawyer. I have just seen the new terms of use and my comment is confined to the above extract which was quoted by another poster.

Just imagine for a moment that boards.ie is just like a public notice board that one sees in many supermarkets. Now, if I pin one of my photographs to this board I am doing so to inform and/or interest other people who also use this notice board to display their photographs and/or comments.

So why then, would I want to give the owners of the supermarket a "nonexclusive licence" to do this, that and the other with my photographs, including a permission to "improve" them?

Now, "improve" is a subjective term as beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So what to me might be a dreadful alteration to my photograph might be an "improvement" in the view of the supermarket owners. If in the future I happen to disagree with an "improvement" made to one of my photographs, my remedy would be to issue proceedings against the supermarket owners. A discussion of the form of the proceedings required would be superfluous here, but suffice it to say that litigation would be both time consuming and very expensive.

Such a clause may not be enforceable in respect of material submitted by a minor (i.e. under 18 years of age). While such a term of use is in force I will not be submitting any of my photographs to boards.ie. The views of other users and lawyers may differ!

In fairness I think Darragh took on board (no pun intended !) what was said and his amended text, excepts at all levels photos and graphics and now refers only to text (if accepted by the legal eagles), as I read it.

There remains just the issue of removing your photos as you wish, which in fairness also he's looking into.

KarmaGarda

Edit: Actually, scratch that. I misread the TOU.

swingking

I have taken legal advice on this issue (from my gf, who is a trainee solicitor )



and for the moment being as such until the issue has been clarified by the legal team, I will not be uploading any more photos to boards.

Chorcai

Darragh wrote: »

Feedback and the "Oh, I'm a regular lurker, I don't interact in here, but isn't this AWFUL?" brigade might tell you. Genuine concerns by people who interact in and contribute to this forum were raised and we are doing our best to act on those, to everyone's benefit.

Can I ask a quick question as a concern, if I post a picture here and lets say, the boards.ie marketing dept like the image, and use it for whatever use. Am I right in saying that I can't do anything about it ? And does this apply to past images I've posted ? What so wrong with giving someone a kick back for using one their images ?

Is it that boards want a ton of free stuff ?

I think to be fair if boards liked an image I posted came to me asked to use it I would just end up giving it to them and be happy with my name in a corner.

Paulw

Chorcai wrote: »

Can I ask a quick question as a concern, if I post a picture here and lets say, the boards.ie marketing dept like the image, and use it for whatever use. Am I right in saying that I can't do anything about it ? And does this apply to past images I've posted ? What so wrong with giving someone a kick back for using one their images ?

I think the new proposal quoted by Darragh says that boards.ie can only use what is posted to promote the section of boards it was posted to.

Post:
By posting any Material - including creative writing pieces, photographs or graphics on or through Boards.ie, you grant us a limited license to use, modify, publicly perform, publicly display, reproduce, and distribute such Materials in connection with Boards.ie, solely for the purpose of providing, displaying, distributing and promoting the Boards.ie forum to which such Content was submitted, or, in the case of photos or graphics, solely for the purpose for which such photo or graphic was submitted to Boards.ie.

They can't use it to promote boards.ie but can use it to promote boards.ie photography section.

Legally, I doubt they can make the new TOS retrospective and apply them to content posted prior to the TOS coming in to effect.

Chorcai wrote: »

I think to be fair if boards liked an image I posted came to me asked to use it I would just end up giving it to them and be happy with my name in a corner.

Not everyone would be of that same view, especially those who try to make money from their photography. My view - if it's good enough to publish, it's good enough to pay for, no matter who wants to use the image.

CabanSail

Chorcai wrote: »

Can I ask a quick question as a concern, if I post a picture here and lets say, the boards.ie marketing dept like the image, and use it for whatever use. Am I right in saying that I can't do anything about it ? And does this apply to past images I've posted ? What so wrong with giving someone a kick back for using one their images ?

That is the concern that some have with the way the text was written. I think that most know that is not the way Boards.ie operate. The problem that is being addressed is that these things can change & if the management change in the future then they could start to mine the resources as per those terms. This is why we are working with the Managers here to get the wording correct. The balance has to be acheived where Boards.ie legally have control over the contents of their website while not infringing on the rights of users who also have rights to control their work. This can be tricky to get right.

Chorcai wrote: »

Is it that boards want a ton of free stuff ?

No. Darragh has laid that one to rest a long time ago & I take his word on that. As said above we have to make sure the Mr Corporate in a Grey Suit doesn't do it in the future.

I would like to thank Darragh for consulting with the users to get this right. It is good to see that the Admin are seeking our input & treating it seriously. I also appreciate the thought that many here are putting into their suggestions for the changes & doing so in a positive way.

Chorcai

Paulw wrote: »

Not everyone would be of that same view, especially those who try to make money from their photography. My view - if it's good enough to publish, it's good enough to pay for, no matter who wants to use the image.

I was just saying from my view, I'd be happy with that but I see where your coming from Paul.

homer simpson

Chorcai wrote: »

And does this apply to past images I've posted ? What so wrong with giving someone a kick back for using one their images ?

I wouldn't think so because when we signed up we didn't aggree to let them use our photos then so i wouldn't think they could if they did i'd imagine if they were challanged legally they would lose.

Darragh

Chorcai wrote: »

Can I ask a quick question as a concern, if I post a picture here and lets say, the boards.ie marketing dept like the image, and use it for whatever use. Am I right in saying that I can't do anything about it ? And does this apply to past images I've posted ? What so wrong with giving someone a kick back for using one their images ?

Is it that boards want a ton of free stuff ?

I think to be fair if boards liked an image I posted came to me asked to use it I would just end up giving it to them and be happy with my name in a corner.

Heya

This is a tricky one to answer properly and legally, because I know people will point to the TOU and say "Aha, but it doesn't SAY that"

if I post a picture here and lets say, the boards.ie marketing dept like the image, and use it for whatever use. Am I right in saying that I can't do anything about it ? And does this apply to past images I've posted ? What so wrong with giving someone a kick back for using one their images ?

Is it that boards want a ton of free stuff ?

Okay, so we don't have a Marketing Department - just Dav and me. Now, let's say I wanted your photo specifically for the blog - I'd ask you. If I want it for a presentation - I'll ask you. If I want it for anything other than what it's meant for, I'll ask you.

Where I don't feel I have to ask you is where I'm taking a screenshot of a page on Boards.ie for a presentation and your photo just happens to be on it, as posted, with others. Is that fair enough? Or would you prefer me to do that? Equally, if I was doing a blog post about what's on the photography forum - for example, here - http://blog.boards.ie/2009/07/17/thread-the-boards-3-round-up/ - I might not ask you, but I will link to the original thread in the forum and state your username. Again, if you don't want me to do that, tell me.

Can you do anything about it, if I use it without your permission? Yes. You can ask me not to do it again. You can tell other people I did it. You can stop posting here. You can cause a fuss about it. All of those things are damaging to Boards.ie Ltd. If people don't trust us, they won't use us. What good would that be?

We of course want to credit our contributors - on a commercial basis we can point to people and say "these people are on our forums, look how good they are!" - that looks better for us too!

So, the new TOU only apply to images you posted after December 23. We will also, once the new terms as above go live, seek to retrosepectively enforce those. We want your work to be yours, and your rights to be protected as much as possible.

So, say I leave Boards.ie and someone else comes in, not knowing the history and doesn't feel they should ask and does it? Go ballistic. Basically you should think - if I don't like it, they shouldn't like it. Now, as I said, if someone can give me text for the TOU that we can include that says "we will not use your photos etc etc" then great - I'm open to that. But I don't know how that text should be phrased or what it should say - do you?

Happy to clarify any further queries you have.

Darragh

Covey

Darragh wrote: »

Heya



We will also, once the new terms as above go live, seek to retrosepectively enforce those.

That sentence alone has convinced me never to post a photo here again.

When the next TOU's say " We can resell your photos" for example I presume that will also be retrospective.

I'm afraid you've lost me on this one.

Paulw

Wow.

I must say, I was never aware of blogs.boards.ie. I'm wondering if your use of images there, taken from boards.ie forum is not already a breach of copyright, since the image is being used in a blog without the expressed permission of the copyright owner?

What you posted isn't a screenshot, it's a data grab from the forum.

I would have expected that blogs.boards.ie is separate from www.boards.ie forum?

PopeBuckfastXVI

Paulw wrote: »

Wow.

I must say, I was never aware of blogs.boards.ie. I'm wondering if your use of images there, taken from boards.ie forum is not already a breach of copyright, since the image is being used in a blog without the expressed permission of the copyright owner?

What you posted isn't a screenshot, it's a data grab from the forum.

I would have expected that blogs.boards.ie is separate from www.boards.ie forum?

Actually it's probably worse than that, the images appear to have been downloaded from pix.ie and uploaded to the boards blog server, without permissions of the copyright owners.

Taking the second photo, the one on the blog is
http://blog.boards.ie/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/D12BCDE60E9044E9A4DFC2E71141C42C.jpg

And the original is
http://photos3.pix.ie/D1/2B/D12BCDE60E9044E9A4DFC2E71141C42C-800.jpg

Which means someone downloaded it from pix.ie, resized it, renamed it and uploaded it to the boards blog server.

DK32

To save me reading through the last 9 pages, anyone feel like providing a summary of what changes have been made and how this affects photogs posting images on this forum.

Paulw

Darragh wrote: »

So, the new TOU only apply to images you posted after December 23. We will also, once the new terms as above go live, seek to retrosepectively enforce those. We want your work to be yours, and your rights to be protected as much as possible.

My understanding is that legally you cannot do that. You cannot make a new condition retrospective without explicitely stating that you wish it, and also giving the user the option to decline and have their works removed. I'll try and dig out the case law for this, but there certainly is case law for it.

From that statement, I certainly won't be posting any more photos on boards.ie and will also consider removing any image links from previous posts.

PopeBuckfastXVI

I should say also however, my above post is moot, if the permissions of the copyright owners were given prior to uploading the images to the boards servers.

Covey

Paulw wrote: »

From that statement, I certainly won't be posting any more photos on boards.ie and will also consider removing any image links from previous posts.

Apparantly you can't do that :eek:

Paulw

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

I should say also however, my above post is moot, if the permissions of the copyright owners were given prior to uploading the images to the boards servers.

In most cases, (looking at source code) the images weren't uploaded to boards.ie but were linked to from pix.ie or flickr. So, in that case, permission was not given to use the images anywhere other than boards.ie forum.

Covey wrote: »

Apparantly you can't do that :eek:

Watch me !!! I certainly can, since the images aren't hosted on boards.ie, if I remove them at source (flickr, pix.ie, my website) then they become lost links of boards.ie and you get a "file not found" error.

Covey

Paulw wrote: »

Watch me !!! I certainly can, since the images aren't hosted on boards.ie, if I remove them at source (flickr, pix.ie, my website) then they become lost links of boards.ie and you get a "file not found" error.

Ah sure, but you can't remove the image link in Boards. Thats a right pain in the arse deleting photos from a source that presumably you don't have any problem with and comments or whatever are lost as well. I'm not liking this at all.

PopeBuckfastXVI

The problem here is that, under both the new and old T&C's someone is not understanding that wrapping IMG tags around a link does not confer any ownership of the content at the other end of that link.

Any more than me pointing out that my website is www.hughwphamill.com confers any rights over the content at that website.

Boards.ie can reproduce that text as much as they like, but they cannot start downloading and reusing content from that website.

Wrapping IMG tags around something doesn't change this.

I'd like this clarified asap, we're into a completely different world now than just talking about content which is uploaded to a boards server by the user. Boards.ie cannot grant itself permissions over content at the end of a link.

Covey

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

The problem here is that, under both the new and old T&C's someone is not understanding that wrapping IMG tags around a link does not confer any ownership of the content at the other end of that link.

Any more than me pointing out that my website is www.hughwphamill.com confers any rights over the content at that website.

Boards.ie can reproduce that text as much as they like, but they cannot start downloading and reusing content from that website.

Wrapping IMG tags around something doesn't change this.

I'd like this clarified asap, we're into a completely different world now than just talking about content which is uploaded to a boards server by the user. Boards.ie cannot grant itself permissions over content at the end of a link.

Your missing the point Hugh.

The image stays on Boards (albeit through a link) and you have no control over that except deleting it at source which you may not wish to do.

PopeBuckfastXVI

Covey wrote: »

Your missing the point Hugh.

The image stays on Boards (albeit through a link) and you have no control over that except deleting it at source which you may not wish to do.

That's always been the case though, and isn't changing, I'm not overly concerned by that though, any more than not being able to go back and edit text in a post I made years ago. If you link to content you don't want shared then break the link.

I can't think of any reason you'd want to leave your image publicly available, but not linked through boards.ie, there is no implicit permission over content at the end of a link granted by posting that link. However, someone on the boards blog, likely through ignorance, seems to think there is.

Darragh

You do realise that we've changed nothing technically? You are able and unable to do exactly the same thing with your posts and on this forum today as you were a month ago?

Darragh

Re Boards blog comment Hugh, I don't get you. If you don't want your image on the Boards blog, ask for it to be removed. Simple as that.

Covey

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

If you link to content you don't want shared then break the link.

I can't think of any reason you'd want to leave your image publicly available, but not linked through boards.ie

The issue is you can't break the link except at source. I can think of many reasons why I would like leave an image available elsewhere and not linked through Boards, one of which is a change in the TOU's that I'm not happy with.

Paulw

Darragh wrote: »

You do realise that we've changed nothing technically? You are able and unable to do exactly the same thing with your posts and on this forum today as you were a month ago?

I think (hope) everyone is aware of that.

It's more the usage of images, and the new proposed TOS, etc.

The blogs bit is really surprising, and I was unaware that my images may be displayed there, without my expressed permission, which is a breach of my copyright on my images (same with everyone else's images, except if they're marked as CC).

Covey

Darragh wrote: »

You do realise that we've changed nothing technically? You are able and unable to do exactly the same thing with your posts and on this forum today as you were a month ago?

True, except now we're made aware of certian things that some of us weren't before.

PopeBuckfastXVI

Darragh wrote: »

Re Boards blog comment Hugh, I don't get you. If you don't want your image on the Boards blog, ask for it to be removed. Simple as that.

Hi Darragh,

Personally speaking I'd be only delighted if someone deemed an image of mine good enough to appear on a blog, and then asked permission to use it. This is not the same as downloading a picture from a 3rd party location, say pix.ie or flickr.com and uploading it to the boards blog server, without seeking permission from the copyright owner.

Can't you see the difference?

Paulw

Darragh wrote: »

Re Boards blog comment Hugh, I don't get you. If you don't want your image on the Boards blog, ask for it to be removed. Simple as that.

People shouldn't have to ask. Use of it there without the expressed permission of the copyright owner is already a breach of copyright.

Darragh

Covey wrote: »

True, except now we're made aware of certian things that some of us weren't before.

Like what?

DK32

Daragh,

Under the new terms, does it really only apply to images that I upload directly to boards servers directly? By this I mean, if I link from flickr or whatever source to share an image with people, I retain copyright of that image?

Confused.com

Covey

Daragh,

Well, I for one wasn't aware that you couldn't delete you image/image link and also that my image could be used on a blog

Darragh

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Hi Darragh,

Personally speaking I'd be only delighted if someone deemed an image of mine good enough to appear on a blog, and then asked permission to use it. This is not the same as downloading a picture from a 3rd party location, say pix.ie or flickr.com and uploading it to the boards blog server, without seeking permission from the copyright owner.

Can't you see the difference?

Yes of course. Sorry, I thought I'd covered this. If we want to use your image on the blog, we'll ask you and attribute it. If you say no, then ok. If, then, at a later date, you want it taken down for whatever reason, just ask and we'll do that.

.Longshanks.

DK32 wrote: »

Daragh,

Under the new terms, does it really only apply to images that I upload directly to boards servers directly? By this I mean, if I link from flickr or whatever source to share an image with people, I retain copyright of that image?

Confused.com

^ This needs to be clarified....crystal clear

Darragh

Covey wrote: »

Daragh,

Well, I for one wasn't aware that you couldn't delete you image/image link and also that my image could be used on a blog

Have you ever had to delete an image? And is the blog thing - given we will ask permission - a big problem for you?

PopeBuckfastXVI

Darragh wrote: »

Yes of course. Sorry, I thought I'd covered this. If we want to use your image on the blog, we'll ask you and attribute it. If you say no, then ok. If, then, at a later date, you want it taken down for whatever reason, just ask and we'll do that.

Thanks Darragh,

That's perfect!

Darragh

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

I should say also however, my above post is moot, if the permissions of the copyright owners were given prior to uploading the images to the boards servers.

IIRC, I had asked and gotten permission.

Darragh

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Thanks Darragh,

That's perfect!

Ok now how canI make everyone else agree to that?

Covey

Darragh wrote: »

Have you ever had to delete an image? And is the blog thing - given we will ask permission - a big problem for you?

No, I've never had to delete an image ...... until now.

No the blog isn't a big issue as long as permission is requested. Like others though, I got the impression from previous posts this wasn't always the case.

Nisio

I didn't know that boards would download a file from a 3rd party website that was linked to on boards , resize it and rehost it on the blogs.boards.ie.

I think I've picked that up right?

DaireQuinlan

Paulw wrote: »

People shouldn't have to ask. Use of it there without the expressed permission of the copyright owner is already a breach of copyright.

welll, Actually, in terms of that pix.ie link at the very least, I think people obviously haven't read their pix.ie terms and conditions properly ...

pix.ie T&C wrote:

You acknowledge and agree that any Content contained in public postings, including any galleries that are not designated as private, will be accessible to the public and could be accessed, indexed, archived, linked to and republished by others including, without limitation, appearing on other web sites and in search engine results. Therefore, Pixie advise you to be careful about the nature of the Content you post. Pixie provides many security options and settings for your Content and Pixie strongly advises you to familiarise yourself with these features. Pixie will not be responsible or liable for any third party access to or use of the Content you post.

PopeBuckfastXVI

Darragh wrote: »

Ok now how canI make everyone else agree to that?

I think the confusion may have arisen from this (my bolding):

Darragh wrote: »

Where I don't feel I have to ask you is where I'm taking a screenshot of a page on Boards.ie for a presentation and your photo just happens to be on it, as posted, with others. Is that fair enough? Or would you prefer me to do that? Equally, if I was doing a blog post about what's on the photography forum - for example, here - http://blog.boards.ie/2009/07/17/thread-the-boards-3-round-up/ - I might not ask you, but I will link to the original thread in the forum and state your username. Again, if you don't want me to do that, tell me.

Darragh

If you ask for permission on a case by case basis, I don't think anyone has a problem with that.