Ennis Assault Victim Dies

xmcp

drunken_munky52 wrote: »

Stating the obvious wont change anything. I am agreed with you in principle, that violent offenders need to be tackled earlier. I don't think that throwing them in prison for another few years teaches them anything, in fact you will agree, it makes inherently violent people even more unstable. Prison is societies way of painting over a problem > a quick fix solution. Would it not make more sense to diagnose violent offenders with having a mental illness, therefore they can be treated in some way > we can learn from this and teach kids in school in ways not to end up like this. The vicious cycle needs to be broken somewhere.

No, I've no interest in trying to rehabilitate them, I think you're wasting your time with the majority. They should be doing 40 year stretches so they've no chance to commit more crimes.

drunken_munky52

xmcp wrote: »

No, I've no interest in trying to rehabilitate them, I think you're wasting your time with the majority. They should be doing 40 year stretches so they've no chance to commit more crimes.

And you are equally wasting your time going on witch hunt.

Sure, they deserve this, I am all for these guys doing serious time. Justice and punishment should be swift and hard. Its inevitable that another grand spirit like Mr Casey's will leave us some day in the same circumstances. What measures is society putting in place to try and prevent this? Increasing punitive measures does not stop the evil from occurring. We owe it to every victim of violence to not let it happen again.

maiden

I had a friend who was murdered down O'Hallorans lane a few years ago,

I had a friend who murdered a fella in the hostel a few years ago.

And these are the facts:
the two that were arrested for killing that poor lad from Lissycasey, will do a few years in prison and will come out and walk around the streets like nothing happened and drink every night of the week. And that lad will still be dead. Simple as

And to the fella who robbed my sons and their friend up town yesterday, heard you got a beating boo hoo

irishvamp90

RIP
This is an example of the scum that are taking over small town ireland

irishvamp90

maiden wrote: »

I had a friend who was murdered down O'Hallorans lane a few years ago,

I had a friend who murdered a fella in the hostel a few years ago.

And these are the facts:
the two that were arrested for killing that poor lad from Lissycasey, will do a few years in prison and will come out and walk around the streets like nothing happened and drink every night of the week. And that lad will still be dead. Simple as

And to the fella who robbed my sons and their friend up town yesterday, heard you got a beating boo hoo

Your friend murdered some one???whats your view on that?

pappyodaniel

A lot of posters here saying where were the Gardai? Why weren't they in the right place at the right time?

I remember a thread a few months back where some of these same posters had negative opinions on the introduction of new CCTV cameras in Ennis Town Centre.

I drive a taxi and it's getting more and more noticeable that Ennis is getting rougher and rougher. What's the problem with having CCTV in flashpoints of town centres?

drunken_munky52

maiden wrote: »

I had a friend who murdered a fella in the hostel a few years ago.

Yes, I remember this and so does RTE, even after 10 years:

http://www.rte.ie/news/1999/0727/ennis.html

I think the accused in the St Stephans night incident was acquainted with Mr Eric Considine of Stone Court. I might say there was a link between your victim friend Mr Micky Shannon to this circle of associates.

Clareman

CCTV is good and bad, but it clearly isn't a good enough deterant for some people, in Ennis 20 odd years ago, people were killing each other in bars (Banner Arms), then they were chasing each other around the town to beat each other to death during the day (O'Halloran's lane), to bashing each other's heads in with fire extinguishers (hostel), to stabbing each other outside chippers (Supermacs), to beating random people to death in the middle of town (latest).

The above are just a snapshot of some of the violent murders that have happened in town that come to my mind, I don't think the guards could have done anything about 3 of the 5 "crimes" (Banner, O'Halloran's and hostel) but they could have definitely have done something about the other 2 by just have a presence on the street, how many other "crimes" have they prevented by making people think twice about doing anything out of the way? That can't be calculated, but by having a presence on a Saturday night for a few hours in a few hotshots (as mentioned in previous posts) could definitely help out.

Insulting_Bitch

I have to have to add my two cents.

Firstly, I am from Lissycasey and know the victim quiet well. This is just to clear up any smart ass ideas that I am not from Dublin, just live there so I am not some Jackeen sticking my oar in.

Secondly, several months back I started a thread on this forum about the sh*t going on in Ennis and several people jumped on it defending the town, saying it was not getting worse.

What happened Stephen's night was an unprovoked attack, from what I know, ~2 against one before midnight that left someone dead. It was not a simple fight. This is the second time in three years that someone has been needlessly killed in the town centre.

IS THIS PROOF ENOUGH? Or how many other attacks are needed for people to wake up and realise that the town is the being overrun by scumbags?

BLITZ_Molloy

Everybody is disgusted by this but as Clareman says people with a longer memory will remember numerous murders and serious assaults were going on in the 80's and 90's also. It's important to maintain some perspective.

CCTV hasn't impressed me all that much. They've blanketed most of the UK in them and there's no improvement. Custy's put a brand new one up and they still couldn't make out how the culprit was a couple of days later despite him standing right in front of it. They seem largely ineffective to me.

In fairness I usually see two or four Gardai between the Queens and Supermacs on patrol every Saturday night. I don't think adding in another two would have saved the guys life. If numerous criminal convictions aren't enough to discourage someone then cameras and Gardai aren't going to help either.

Clareman

Well said Insulting, I mean Bitch, I mean, nevermind, well said

drunken_munky52

Clareman wrote: »

Well said Insulting, I mean Bitch, I mean, nevermind, well said

Only 35 posts and has to be based in Dublin? Strange how she always posts only when bad news happens in Ennis... maybe there's an insulting bitch in all of us! I wonder whos alter ego she is.

drunken_munky52

BLITZ_Molloy wrote: »

CCTV hasn't impressed me all that much.

They will never be a sufficent deterant. There is a new CCTV camera literally 10 feet away from where the attack happened, so its obvious the attackers either forgot the camera was there or just couldn't give a damm... the latter may be more true

asmobhosca

drunken_munky52 wrote: »

They will never be a sufficent deterant. There is a new CCTV camera literally 10 feet away from where the attack happened, so its obvious the attackers either forgot the camera was there or just couldn't give a damm... the latter may be more true

I've actually been in the CCTV control room in ennis (a guard friend brought me in for a look), and I have to say its seriously impressive. They have a wall of screens with each camera in town on its own screen. The operator even showed me the zoom capability of the camera's, (they could literally count the change in your hand).
If these camera's can make a major evidential difference in a case like the one were discussing here then, its hard to make a decent case against them as an extra tool for the gardai. Although I know rtdh has a different view, i really dont care if theyre watching me, I have nothing to hide.

maiden

"our friend murdered some one???whats your view on that? "

My view on that is, someone is dead who shouldnt be, no one deserves to die at the hands of another!

"I think the accused in the St Stephans night incident was acquainted with Mr Eric Considine of Stone Court. I might say there was a link between your victim friend Mr Micky Shannon to this circle of associates."

Yes you are right

Bring on more CCTV if it can keep my teens safe, im all for it!

BLITZ_Molloy

Will they keep your teens safe though? Of course not. The town really needs to look into other ways of tackling this problem instead of throwing huge money at cameras, that only cover a small area, and don't act as a deterant.

People with this many convictions should be on some sort of probationary scheme where they can't drink and have a curfew. Why not GPS tag them so you know if they're violating their probation? If you're going to go violating peoples privacy let them do it to criminals first before sticking cameras on every lamp post and getting us to carry ID cards or whatever is next. Whenever people say "If you've got nothing to hide, then.." I worry. Your identity and personal details are valuable. Valuable information can be stolen and used against you. Public services do not have a good track record when it comes to keeping our information secure.

California's 3 strike rule is making it bankrupt. They've got a massive prison population and they cost the state a fortune. There's a reason Ireland has a revolving door prison system because we don't want to pay to keep people in prison for long sentences.

Akrasia

drunken_munky52 wrote: »

Yes, I am familiar with the accused. Had an unfortunate run in with him and his friends at Clare Abbey several years ago.

You are entitled to call him as you please, for whatever practical purpose this serves, I do not know, other than blowing off some mental steam. All I know is that society allowed this risky case to fester for years until he finally commited capital crime. Where were you shouting "scumbag" then? Did you ever think the accused was a serious risk? If so, why didnt you do something about it?

We hear a lot about 'long term economic value' from the government when they want to give billions of tax payers money to bankers and developers, but nothing about long term value when they're cutting back on community development projects and social work budgets.

Now we have one innocent man tragically dead, and we're going to have two people in jail for the next 10 years minimum at a cost to the state of millions of euros. How much would it have cost to have proper early intervention to try and prevent these people from turning into 'scumbags' in the first place?

I think laws should be introduced to make parents legally responsible for crimes committed by their children up to a certain age (14?) with the only mitigating factors being if the children were being influenced by a criminal gang against the control of the parent (defence only applicable if the parent makes genuine efforts to extricate the child from the gang through state criminal and social services) in which case that criminal gang would be legally responsible for the actions of the child.

If the parents are sent to jail for criminal neglect of their children, there should be appropriate services available to the children in fostor care to help them re-integrate into civilised society (education, counselling health, special needs assistance if they have learning disabilities etc)

Instead of cutting back social services now, and storing up massive problems for the future, we should be investing in the 'long term economic value' of the youngest most vulnerable children in the state, and then maybe future families won't have the knock on the door from a Garda delivering the news that haunts the nightmares of every decent family.

Run_to_da_hills

Passed by the shrine on the Height today. Touching.

piggyback

I hope that all in Ennis will come out now and ask where the Cops were ?

It has gone far enough to think that on one of the busiest night of the year that there was not one Cop stationed in the town centre is shocking,


The (acting) Supt Intd should go right now,

Claregirl

Most townies woud not associate the height with being a dangerous place at 11.30 p.m. it's a well lit busy area. The main focus of the gardai tends to be around throwing out time from the queens.

The only people responsible for the murder on Stephens Night were the two dangerous b*stards who beat an innocent man to death.

Their family have instilled fear, loathing and disgust in any decent member of society for years. Is it nature or nurture - hard to know but i do know that no amount of money or "intervention" would make any difference.

Prison is not just about punishment it is also about protecting the community. No one should spend a single day in prison for non payment of a fine or outstanding debt. Until the whole justice system is overhauled and the protection of decent law abiding citizens is brought to the fore these cases will continue to become depressingly regular.

Run_to_da_hills

piggyback wrote: »

I hope that all in Ennis will come out now and ask where the Cops were ?

It has gone far enough to think that on one of the busiest night of the year that there was not one Cop stationed in the town centre is shocking,


The (acting) Supt Intd should go right now,

TBH just before midnight is not really a time when one would expect too much trouble at the height, most of this would start after the Queens finish and would be outside the fast food joints.

The Gardai can't be everywhere at once.

The ones that should go should be the judges that constantly release these scumbags through the revolving door prison system with lenient sentences. Hopefully this time round they will be locked up for good.

maiden wrote: »

Bring on more CCTV if it can keep my teens safe, I'm all for it!

That guy was murdered in the catchment area of one of the most sophisticated Garda CCTC cameras in the country. CCTV did absolutly nothing to stop these scumbags from carrying out this evil act.

The only benefit that these cameras would have on this incident would be for compiling evidence and that is if they were panned, tilted and zoomed in at the incident.

Mad jesty

My prayers are with the victim and his family RIP