I need encouragement!

nbrome

This is my first post on here.
I started learning Irish on my own a few months back and I need encouragement!
Although my parents were Irish, I grew up near Liverpool, so I've not been used to hearing Irish. Further disadvantages are:
I live in Italy and I live in a very small house with my husband and two grown sons. So what? you might say. Well, it means I don't have much time or space to listen to the cds which are absolutely essential (Irish pronunciation having nothing to do with spelling, as I've found out).
I'm using Micheal o Siadhail's book, by the way, it is supposed to be one of the best methods. The pages fall out immediately, but, hey, I'm serious about this business and so that's not a problem.
It's just that sometimes, when I let a week or so go by (like Christmas), I find myself looking at the book and kind of sidling past guiltily.
I need words of encouragement!
Happy New Year to you all.

Aard

It's hard to encourage something we don't know! Where are you in your studies atm? Just beginning, or would you be able to hold a simple conversation? There's an Irish-language forum on boards here (http://boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=904) if you want to have a stab at speaking as Gaeilge. There's other boards out there too, although I don't frequent them myself. I think "Daltaí" is meant to be good. Good luck!

nbrome

Sorry, I thought I WAS in the Irish language forum. Thanks for pointing that out. Whoever would have thought to look under the LONELY HEARTS!
However, I'm just beginning and that's too much for me right now.

Aard

nbrome wrote: »

Sorry, I thought I WAS in the Irish language forum.

Afaict, this forum here is for discussing the language, whereas the one I linked to above is for discussions in the language.


How are you finding the learning? Anything particularly difficult yet?

nbrome

Aard wrote: »

How are you finding the learning? Anything particularly difficult yet?

Ha! That's one of the best lines this year!
The enormous difficulty for me is that what you see on paper bears no ressemblance to what you say!
I've studied several languages and managed to get by. I'm really stumped because I can't find a way of learning the vocabulary. I mean, I can listen and memorise some words but not more than a few at a time. As I understand it, once you learn the pronunciation rules it's all fairly simple, they tend to follow these rules. I'm afraid I'm still at this stage, though.

Krusader

Irish pronounciation is quite regular, when you get the hang of them broad and slender consonents you'll be flying
Learning Irish is a great book, I have it myself,
I'd recommend getting a grammar book also, and don't be afraid to ask questions here

Aard

Like Crosáidí said above, Irish pronunciation is quite regular. I can spell better in Irish than in any other language; once you learn the rules, it's easy. It's just unusual - you basically have to "unlearn" everything from other languages that use the roman alphabet. Considering that there are 30+ consonants* and regular lenition/eclipsis rules**, it's actually quite clever.


* Yes, really, there are! I'm surprised at the number of people who don't realise that the 'b' in "buí" and the 'b' in "bí" are 2 different consonants. Most people think that it's the vowels that are different, whereas they're both actually pronounced the same.

** Consider Welsh, which also has these features. Imo, Irish's system is more elegant, as it leads to less confusion.

nbrome

Yes, it's that unlearning which is the key, probably.
I've always been good at learning vocab lists and this got me off to a good start with other languages. It's hard to memorise words when you have to keep looking back at the pronunciation.
I've started again with the book ( I had only gone about 8 chapters anyway). One thing I've decided to do is not to look at the phonetic spellings next to the word but to listen to them all on cd while I look at the Irish words. Does anyone else find those phonetics distracting?
I've got the CBS new grammar and I've ordered a workbook I saw mentioned on here. Ha! Maybe I should stop looking at forums and just get down to it.

pog it

Hiya nbrome! Always great to hear another learner is on board! I use those books you have mentioned and the CB new grammar is fantastic for a quick summary of things alright and O'Siadhail's Learning Irish has been one of my biggest help..

Thing is though, I would say that O'Siadhail is actually meant for people who have prior knowledge of Irish.. so say someone like me who did Irish all through school would be an example of people whose level of Irish is at what this book is geared for.
So maybe you could put aside a timeline of say a month to prep yourself before you go back into O'Siadhail? Buntús cainte is regularly recommended here, and I flicked through them in the bookshop one day and they looked really good for a beginner who is serious about learning Irish! They are really cheap and there is a short series of them I think.

You can worry about the Grammar book a bit further down, to be honest in my own experience I have used a few grammar books to come to terms with certain issues.. sadly there is no single easy to follow grammar book that covers everything! Fair enough I suppose.

But the rewards will come at you for everything you learn.. you may become obsessive about Irish like I did, and honestly I think it is one of the best and rewarding things I ever did. And the beauty in the end will be that you find that the learning is in a sense never ending, even when over the basic! That was a daunting thing for me at the start, as I thought I was always asking questions and learning new basic things, but it does all come together!

Listening to the radio will be one of the best helps if you can access it online, even couple of hours a week!

Good luck!

nbrome

Thanks for those warm words, pog it. I'm looking into those books and cds. Do you think I'll get confused with pronunciation, though? I wonder how much of it is different from Connemara dialect.

Aard

If you're worried about confusion with pronunciation, then I'd advise you to avoid Ulster Irish to begin with. Connemara and Munster would seem to be more accessible to the beginner, as well as there not being too much of a difference between their pronunciation (when compared with Ulster).


Listening to the radio online is a great help. Even just 30 minutes a day can do wonders!

craoltoir

You will hear all three main dialects on Raidió na Gaeltachta www.rte.ie/rnag

Also see www.abair.ie (supplied by Trinity College) where you can type text and hear it spoken (in Ulster Irish!)

pog it

I do know what you mean about getting mixed up with pronunciation when you're listening to different dialects and I think the idea you have is good if you are sticking to one dialect from the beginning.

Are you certain you want to learn Conamara dialect? It's the one I lean towards as well as it was my favourite after Mayo dialect.. but sadly there was so little tuition and resources for Mayo dialect which is essentially a mix of Ulster and Conamara that I am going to go as far as I can with Conamara and then move things around to adapt to Mayo dialect-- that is a long term goal of my own.

But how about you just focus on learning to write and read in Irish first, ignoring the cds if it confuses you, yet all the time listening to Conamara dialect only to absorb the sounds (on radio or wherever), and then launch into O'Siadhail manned with your knowledge of basic Irish writing and reading and ready for learning to speak it.

nbrome

Thanks for all your help. I really appreciate all your comments.
I listened to something on the radio link above for 5 whole minutes and heard about 5 "freisin"s! That has to be the friendliest word in the language. Maybe today I'll get an "agus" or two.

Aard

OP, that's the way to do it! Today you'll understand the one word, tomorrow two. Before you know it, it'll be the one word you don't understand! Slow and steady.